I'm seriously thinking about closing up shop and not being a provider anymore. I used to be able to keep my chin up no matter what happened, but after seeing so many disrespectful and unkind men, I'm finding myself becoming tired and jaded.
Maybe this is just the natural cycle for a provider. You start out bright eyed and bushy tailed, making tons of money, and meeting some wonderful clients that are better than you ever expected you could find. Then you start to build a name for yourself, raise your prices, and meet a bunch of even better clients. Life feels great. You can't believe how well you actually connect with these people and you're getting paid handsomely for your time.
Yet somewhere along the road, things just started to wear on me more and more. I'm tired of not being treated like a human. I understand that I'm just a prostitute to many of you and that's fine if this is only sex to you. I have no problem with that. But too many men seem to think that because they are paying "good money" they are entitled to treat a girl like shit.
In what other industry would this line of reasoning be tolerated? What other professional do you pay that allows you to behave like this?
Sorry for the rant. Maybe I just either need to hear a pep talk to help me stay in the industry or a bunch of mean assholes to help me leave.
But perhaps you're right that you need a break. Or go UTR and only see guys you already know who treat you the way you want to be treated? Either way, good luck.
1. Make sure that you have an exit plan.
2. Stop looking at this site and other hobby sites otherwise you will be lured back in. This is an addiction for people involved by clients and providers.
It might be a good idea to take a break for a while.
What type of things are these clients doing ?
Give us some examples of what you mean by
1. Unkind
2. Dis-respectful
Are you checking references on all your clients ?
1. I have this covered.
2. This is very good advice. I'm definitely addicted to nearly everything about this line of work.
I think I do need to take a break. Perhaps take Inicky's advice and go UTR and only see my regulars for a bit.
As far as what the bad apples do that I find to be disrespectful, it's really just the standard BS, but for some reason it's been bothering me more lately. Things such as NCNS, way overstaying your time without asking or paying for it (I hate to point out the time and ask men to leave and some men take advantage of this), rude language, and showing up filthy and unshowered.
Maybe I just don't have thick skin the way I used to.
I considered raising my prices to weed out the lower quality clients, but then I wouldn't be a very good value and I'd be concerned that the good clients wouldn't enjoy me as much.
Maybe I should just advertise a really high rate and then when the client shows up I'll tell him the real rate is actually much less, I only advertise high so I can avoid dealing with as many assholes. Of course, this would only last until the first review spoiled the surprise.
Then again, maybe I just woke up on the wrong side of the bed and after I get paid this afternoon I'll be my chipper self again.
1. Make sure that you have an exit plan.
2. Stop looking at this site and other hobby sites otherwise you will be lured back in. This is an addiction for people involved by clients and providers.
It might be a good idea to take a break for a while.
What type of things are these clients doing ?
Give us some examples of what you mean by
1. Unkind
2. Dis-respectful
Are you checking references on all your clients ?
This is where a lot of guys have it wrong....
I brought this up on another post earlier...
Guys think that just because they pay "Good Money" their entitled to run the show and be assholes. Being disrespectful, using rude language (And I'm not talking about your typical dirty talk), showing up filthy and unshowered is unexceptable. I totally agree with you and NO lady should have to put up with that.
Sounds like you've been seeing some real losers lately. Hopefully you get a string of gentlemen for your next clients.
But there is never going to be a way to get them all. Thank god I don't get many
In my line of work (construction) the client drops a bar of soap and then says "Could you do me a favor and bend over and pick that up for me?"
Like an idiot, we do that over and over again.
It does hurt.
But I can see where the hobby can burn a person out.
A break is always the best way to counteract the depression, or find a new career.
First off, sex work is not for everyone. This is no different from any other occupation. The average adult switches occupations (not just jobs or employers, but *occupations*, like giving up accounting and becoming something else) six times between 18 and retirement. There is absolutely no shame in switching careers -- no matter what your career is. Times change, markets change, interests change and sometimes an occupation just gets old and we need something else.
Whatever you decide, make sure it is right for you, and don't consider such decisions to be irrevocable. We are free to try something, not like it or whatever, and go back to what we were doing etc. It's your life.
But now -- some thoughts.
I do not currently hobby, but I hobbied for four years very selectively. Because of my selection criteria, my experiences were pretty good, and I met some sex workers who are pretty extraordinary people and would be extraordinary no matter what they were doing.
I am a very keen observer. There are probably only a couple of providers out there who realize just how keen, because I usually cover up well. It's just my nature because I am always looking for ways to abstract ideas from experiences and test those ideas.
Also, I am on very solid personal terms with some providers. Whether I have handled a legal case, helped with a business or whatnot, in many cases -- actually most cases -- I am not in the anonymous zone of hobbyists and therefore am much more intimately familiar with what goes on, and have enough data to compare/contrast actions and consequences.
I say this to let you know I have some background and understanding for what I am about to say, and what might otherwise be deemed baseless assertions.
--- There are providers out there that are only treated even slightly poorly on the most rare of occasions. I am not kidding. Being treated like shit, like a servant or otherwise poorly is NOT an automatic part of being a provider. I was never a high volume hobbyist but I know SEVERAL providers for whom being treated even rudely is rare. So it is entirely possible to be a provider without being treated badly or in an entitled fashion.
--- There is no such thing as a fluke. The fact that the women I am referencing can pull this off is not a mistake, coincidence or a fluke. It is a result of the law of cause and effect. That is to say, something in the way they conduct their business either biases which hobbyists book them, affects how the hobbyists who book them behave, or both.
--- Ergo, those providers are doing something *differently* from you.
Sometimes I am accused of being too subtle. Let me say it this way: Though one should never blame the victim of misbehavior, the fact that you are experiencing such levels of misbehavior points to the fact you are not properly controlling your environment in a way that is consistent with your self interest.
That's fine -- it's not like you can sign up for "Being a sex worker 402: Biasing your client pool for optimum treatment" at the local college. A lot of ladies have learned how to do this the hard way, and some have figured it out almost from the very beginning. And the specific technique that works for one girl won't work for another. There's nothing wrong with you and it is no great moral failing that you haven't yet properly biased your hobby pool.
What IS a failing is to continue the way you have been going. You need to figure out what to do. I guarantee you that if you are observant you will figure out who these girls are who don't have to field abuse -- or if they do, it is extremely rare. Once you figure out who they are, OBSERVE them. Go over their websites. Read every word. Read all their advertisements. Read their reviews.
Pretty soon, some patterns will emerge. Though each implementation of the patterns is unique to the individual provider, you will find you are able to see some commonalities. Here are some basics:
1) These women recognize their own human value. I am NOT talking about the false bravado and the bullshit putting down of hobbyists that I see so many providers do. Nor am I talking about being entitled or "base and spoiled female syndrome." I am talking about the fact they see themselves as good and decent people deserving of good treatment -- not just because they were born with a vagina, but because of their own individual values, achievements, etc. This underlying attitude therefore pervades and biases everything they write or create. They know, in their bones, they don't deserve maltreatment and they will not stand for it.
This is important. Predators can spot a potential victim from far away. And the positive self-love attitude that comes through in these providers puts predators on notice: Move along! No willing victim here! Predators are not interested in a challenge. They want the easiest possible conquest. Changing your attitude can change your life.
2) These women recognize the human value of their clients and potential clients. Once you figure out who they are, when you look at these women's websites, you'll see what I mean.
3) They portray themselves as WHOLE PEOPLE. Look, we know men are visually oriented and this is a visually oriented industry. But if all men needed was an orgasm (the purely physical need), masturbation is a hell of a lot more sensible than all of the logistics involved in seeing a provider. Ergo, whether men will admit it or not, though the specifics of the emotional need are unique to each client, providers are fulfilling an emotional need.
Look at the websites of these women. Read carefully and read between the lines. These women are in some cases utterly brilliant. Notice how, without ever explicitly saying anything about the man's emotional needs (because men would shy away from it) they are nevertheless able to convey exactly the sorts of not-strictly-physical needs they are prepared to meet?
Keep looking, and you will find more. Each woman biases her client pool into areas where she feels most comfortable and competent, etc.
In aggregate, the effect works like this:
Abusive and demeaning clients don't even try to book these women. They are turned off and move on.
Men who DO book these women see them as complete people who could be their sister, cousin, etc. They connect with them in such a way as to feel protective, friendly and maybe even nurturing rather than aggressive.
Finally, as side benefits, these women tend to have very high rates of repeat clients (making them overall less reliant on chance business); and because their clients and potential clients see them as more all-encompassing than merely sex partners, their hourly rates can be higher than they would otherwise be based strictly on location, appearance, etc.
This is all a very nice way of saying: you're doing it wrong. Find some women who are doing it right, pay attention, and tailor it to meet your own needs and you'll be fine.
Good luck!
This man is speaking the truth.
You don't have to be treated badly and that is not "normal" behavior from clients.
Look out for your own best interests. If that means going up in rates to change your clientele, or telling guys you won't see them again, don't feel bad about it. Just do it. Once you do, it'll be an enormous weight off your shoulders.
Thank you. So eloquently put, johngalthnh.
In this business I've learned to pay very close attention to what is being communicated, both by me and by my potential client. I do not see everyone who wishes to see me, even if they "qualify" in terms of references. I have some (maybe even quirky) little pet peeves that serve as filters. Whatever they are somehow they work for me. It seems as if you've made a study of communication and understand how to use it. I'm just stumbling my way through, learning as I go.
I believe the advice you've given should be taken to heart by all women in my profession. Yes, we ladies do get paid well, but there are a lot of unpaid hours to factor in to that "hourly rate". I'm not complaining, I enjoy the process as well as the result. But it's important to acknowledge the work it takes to stay safe and sane in order to provide and enjoy a bright, intellectually interesting and truly provocative sensual experience with a truly deserving gentle man.
-- Modified on 10/12/2011 11:42:04 AM
I have a sister that has given me a 45 year lesson in how subtle behavior can create the wrong results when dealing with people. The sad part is she doesn't see what the rest of us see and as a result, has never been able to analyze her own behavior and make any adjustments.
And of course, fundamental to all of this is you have to accept the fact that it's your own behavior that creates this situation, and somehow, what you're putting out there is being reflected back at you. People respond to the most subtle cues and almost imperceptible behaviors. In my sister's case, she puts out the victim vibe better than anyone I've ever known. Then when she gets treated accordingly, she gets very angry. Needless to say, she has no friends and has had a very lonely and unhappy life.
Everyone's situation is different, but the basic points that Johngaltnh made are absolutely correct and apply to all of us. Some of us intuitively do the right thing and get the desired results, and others can learn to make improvements with some effort.
But for some it's a constant struggle, and those are the people that usually don't understand the cause/effect relationship johngaltnh mentioned. They invariably are confused as to why these things keep happening to them, why disrespectful (or abusive, or selfish etc.) people keep finding them, and why they get treated poorly while others don't.
Remember, you create the reality you live in, and if it's not the reality you want, only you can change it.
it's time to find a new one! You're always going to find - that in whatever profession you are in, there are people you enjoy being with and those you don't want to be involved with in your working hours of the day. For most of us it is 40 hours a week. If there are more of the bad vibes every day vs the good vibes, it will spill over into your non-working life - kick the dog, yell at the kids or your friends, etc. I tell poeple if you don't like what you are doing, find something that you do like! So....... go find something that you do like and get happy!
But there is nothing wrong with changing your business model. A Fav only provides part-time & has a day job. Another seems to get by on just a few clients & a little home business.
Your happiness is most important. I hope you have an exit plan. Not every lady can do this... and there is nothing wrong in moving on.
Clients have no right to treat you badly. Not me. Not anyone. I have met some fine ladies & all have treated well and I hope I have always treated then the same or better.
I wish you happiness.
H
and it does sound like you need a break. Everyone needs to get away from this sometimes for a while. take a week or 2 and get away from here. Rent a house down south(if you need idea's I can help, I know of a decent one in a kinda run down neighborhood in Tampa area where the rent is under 500wk for 2bedroom) drive there since air travel can be a hassle. Take a break, put yourself together and then come back.
Start reading your guests, I require phone conversation as part of my screening so I know how he talks to a provider. It helps alot because you can hear things in a guys voice that tell you if he is someone you do or do not want to deal with.
Of any accord, take care, be safe and I am so sorry that you are being treated badly. Keep your head up!
Maybe you are the lady I posted this regarding the issue.
Sorry sweetie that you have seen this issue - we are not all this way !
Sometimes you have to sort thru a pile of shit to find what you want and deserve .
http://www.theeroticreview.com/discussion_boards/viewall.asp?MessageID=472976&boardID=12#472976
You must be having a really bad day.. I am sorry..
Life is all about attitude and the compnay you keep..
If you act like you are worthy and respectable people will treat you that way and you will keep company that believes the same things... I am not sure what happend to you today..
What you do does not define who you are or how you are to be treated..
Chin up, shoulders straight, look them in the eyes and determine how they treat you..
You have all the power........ OWN IT!
Maybe this is just the natural cycle for a provider. You start out bright eyed and bushy tailed, making tons of money, and meeting some wonderful clients that are better than you ever expected you could find. Then you start to build a name for yourself, raise your prices, and meet a bunch of even better clients. Life feels great. You can't believe how well you actually connect with these people and you're getting paid handsomely for your time.
Yet somewhere along the road, things just started to wear on me more and more. I'm tired of not being treated like a human. I understand that I'm just a prostitute to many of you and that's fine if this is only sex to you. I have no problem with that. But too many men seem to think that because they are paying "good money" they are entitled to treat a girl like shit.
In what other industry would this line of reasoning be tolerated? What other professional do you pay that allows you to behave like this?
Sorry for the rant. Maybe I just either need to hear a pep talk to help me stay in the industry or a bunch of mean assholes to help me leave.
It happens in all businesses. People think that just because they are customers/clients or even potential customers that they can treat any employee of the business like shit and they have to smile and kiss their ass.
I have instructed my employees that they don't have to take that from anyone. Their job description does not include taking abuse.
I realise that the situation is different in how you can handle it because of the nature of your business, but don't think that it doesn't happen in other businesses.
But I put up with certain shit to an extent at my job cuz they sign my paycheck, basically.
I won't let anyone shit on me, though, without just cause. I fuck up, I fuck up. I try to rectify it in some way.
As a matter of fact, I'm changing positions there....
I said positions on a fuck-board, snicker-snicker...
...and some of my accounts when I told them said, 'WTF? Now what am I gonna do?'
I took that as a compliment and told them what it was I was going to do was to better their service cuz of my past experiences in other fields. I wouldn't 'be there' every week, but they would know I was behind the scenes, so to speak.
I read the lady's thread, and it's kinda sad. I think she's taking the few fuckheads that make her upset over the multitude of guys that truly appreciate her.
I have a thing I say when I visit one of my accounts and the manager/owner/wtf-ever is being a dick and one or more of his employees notice and ask me why I don't just knock him on his ass. I tell them, 'I have him for 5 minutes. He's gotta live with himself allday.'
Lady. Don't let the fuckheads bring you down. If you truly enjoy what you're doing, just weed them out. There's plenty of ladies here that will be more than happy to talk with you to get you to where you want to be in this thing.
But, if you decide that after all this you should move on,there's no shame in that. YOU gotta do what YOU gotta do to make you happy.
Some men arr assholes X 2 and believe they are gift to the world. There is absolutely no excuse for treating another human being disrespectufully, even if they are homeless and begging on the street. Some doesn't realize it is thin line between having something and being on the street homeless and begging because of their over inflated ego's.
May better screening, another city, etc., are possibilities to consider.
Lately, it seems that the jerks, time wasters and game players are crawling out of the woodwork in droves and the nice guys are far and few between.
I am already on my way out of the business, if all goes well I will be out completely before the end of Feb if not sooner.
I wish you the best of luck regardless of what you decide to do with your life. As others have said you have to do what is right for you and what makes you happy.
If you still have customers and you are thinking about quitting, you maybe setting yourself up for regret later on. Most providers quit because they no longer can attract sufficient number of customers; and I know some of them really wanted to stay in.
I always give lot of respect to providers; providers should also work with customers on how they want to be treated.
Working in jobs like retails, restaurants may not automatically mean earning more respect to women. Also, you have to ask yourself whether you can handle long working hours at low hourly wage anymore.
Cause you ain't gonna find it outside the bubble. You'll find nearly as much dehumanization, rudeness, and bad hygiene: but at a fraction of your old salary. You’ll also likely have to adhere to a much longer, and more structured work schedule based on wants/needs other than your own.
Good luck to ya'
I really appreciate all of the replies. Both the messages of support as well as the constructive criticism.
Ironically, yesterday turned out to be a fantastic day. A very good day in the business with some wonderful gentlemen. Really reminded me why I do this. With the right client it can be incredibly fun and rewarding.
I think I'm just going to start being a lower volume provider. I'm really happy with my current price point and don't want to change it, but I think that I'm going to just start to not see men that I don't get a good feeling from on the phone call.
Thanks again!
One key to lower volume is to live simply, enjoy what you have. One "customer service" orientated luxury business I was a partner it... we competed with a bigger facility accross the street. We did not gross anywhere near what they did (my Dad was friends with the owner there). But the bottom line was we stayed smaller and we took home more than they did! And we knew all our customers... they were a loyal bunch.
It's all about controling costs & living within your means.
I wish you well.
H