TER General Board

Your hobby is her business
Pampam 19 Reviews 2000 reads
posted
1 / 46

It's happened too many times to me already. Had an ATF. Trying to get her to have more OTC time becomes like pulling teeth.
Even after years of seeing her and many times more than most other providers.

Then she starts talking about other TER guys, what they do for her etc. Then a "part time" bf who buys her a new car,
gives her paintings he "did himself" showing me me this big blobs of something hanging on her wall.

Then totally ignores my emails asking if we can finally have some OTC time. On attempts before, she would say she had family time even though her kids are grown, albeit young adults who still need to see her. Then some other time (p4p time always) she says her "part time bf" took her out, or they went on vacation. So I'm guessing now, I'm a nobody to her and just an ATM.

So best to realize when one is in that kind of situation as a TER client and move on immediately. Being a nobody while she says her "family time" really probably means some of that time is with her new "part time" bf.

I hate when that happens. And I'm stupid to have repeated that often on my own budget with those ladies/girls who just really thought me of just an ATM except for their SO bf or whatever such they will drop everything at their beck and call

Sooo...YouWanna 840 reads
posted
2 / 46

What you're really stupid for is expecting any amount of OTC time and getting a shitty attitude about it.  

This is our job. You want "more" OTC time? You gotta be kidding me! If she gives you any at all, she's nicer than she needs to be, and you need to stfu and appreciate it. Just because its off the clock, or outside of the hotel room, doesn't mean that she's not still at work.  

And seriously, you sound like fucking work. That's the ONLY reason any of us would repeatedly and casually bring up our bfs.

case321 31 Reviews 679 reads
posted
3 / 46

No shit Sherlock. We are all walking ATM machines. Ya know the guy where I buy my ammo from is a great guy. Probally consider a friend but if I ask for a free box of 30-06 Hornadys he's gonna tell me to go to hell. Look dude sometimes ya click with a gal and you'll get OTC time without even asking. That's the best but if ya have to ask her for it then it ain't gonna happen, ya just look like a douche. 99% of appointments that's what it is a job or a buisness transaction. Ya take you're car to the shop it's a big deal to you it's you're car but the mechanic thinks its just another damn car he has to fix. Same deal you're just another dick to bang.  

Sorry to put it like that but that's the reality. Don't go into this looking for "connections" or OTC buddies or you'll be sadly disappointed. That being said it is not impossible, but don't ask and don't expect it all the time. Some special friendships can be forged in a client/provider relationship but at the end of the day it's still a client/provider relationship. Trust me if she wants to hang out OTC she will let you know and you'll have a good idea it's coming. When after a first date you're driving home going "what the hell just happened" and I'm not talking about just amazing sex, but an almost too real emotional chemistry thing and a second and third date go the same way and the conversation flows naturally , then you've got something. But unless that happens rare as it may be then yeah man, we are walking Atm's. But that's the nature of the beast and really the way it should be, hot time hopefully she gets a little something out of it besides the donation and she forgets ya untill ya call again. Heck it's perfect. If you're looking for a OTC buddy my best advice is don't. Ya may stumble across one but ya can't be looking for her she has to find you. And yes they are there but few and far between.

Tufu 2 Reviews 694 reads
posted
4 / 46

If you want OTC time with someone, don't want it. I know it sounds like a Zen koan, but for me, if it happens, it is great--if not, that's fine. There are so many women out there! If you find a great provider who likes you enough to see you after the session, do it--otherwise just enjoy the time you paid for. I know of two women I spent time with after session, and it was great. Nothing was forced, they just suggested it, and it was great. I still have very fond memories of my times with them. It took me a long time to learn this lesson, and I had to learn it the hard way. Find another. Someday, if you are unlucky, you might find a provider who is obsessed with you, and you'll hate it!

tg_baby 573 reads
posted
5 / 46

I think you are expecting too much from her...I don't blame you for your disappointment, but to castigate her isn't quite fair. Why are you looking for friendship in all the wrong places? Answer that question honestly, or else you'll be in the same predicament with your next provider.

Please realize that she probably has 1000 other clients asking her for the same thing. Can she go out to dinner with this one, a baseball game with that one, a trip to the museum with this one. This client she was supposed to see for an hour is asking her to sleep over, this one wants to go out for post-session drinks. This one is calling her at all times of day. This one wants her to be a pen pal. And she's really hungry, but the guy she's with right now (supposed to be an hour) simply won't let her out the door!! When is she supposed to live her life? You can literally work 54 hours per day at this job, if you let clients walk all over you. She has to draw the line somewhere, and as long as she has kept the terms she was contracted for, and kept you happy, then her obligation is over.

While it's nice to think that a friendship would develop, that's one thing you can never demand or force. She doesn't owe you OTC time. You can play by her terms, or not see her anymore, and it sounds that the latter option is where you're headed. You want justification for your resentment, but I really can't give it to you. I don't really blame her for making excuses...there's nothing in it for her, so why should she feel pressured to spend hours upon hours, unpaid, with someone whose company she obviously doesn't enjoy?  

I tend to look more favorably upon OTC when it is not expected/demanded of me. Also when it's not excessive and the guy makes an effort to meet me halfway so it's beneficial for us both...that's just respectful. Would you work for $10/hr, triple overtime, even if  your boss was really nice? It might sound harsh, but she's your provider, not your BFF and she never advertised as a BFF!!!  

I've seen my hairdresser for years, and don't expect freebies from her...nor would I ever ask her to hang out with me after work, or call or text her, etc.

-- Modified on 10/27/2013 8:20:56 PM

ROGM 787 reads
posted
6 / 46

She might be on Top of her Game right now. But eventually these Girls won't be getting as many Clients as they used to when they were Young and Hot Looking. She'll be calling you late one night saying she has no Money or a place to stay and if you can see her and help her out. Then you'll have your Sweet Revenge. Hookers are a Dime a Dozen. But where can a Hooker go to get her Youth and Looks back?

89Springer 731 reads
posted
7 / 46

Before being critical of anything you said in your post, let me say that I think her mentioning other guys and her boyfriend is really rude. I'm a newbie at this, but that just seems unprofessional. Guys don't want to hear about other guys a girl (pro or civvie) is seeing. She should know that.

As for your lack of OTC time, it seems obvious that she has no interest in seeing you beyond the time you pay for. I don't think there's any rule that says after X number of dollars you get Y amount of free time.  

It sounds like her mention of other guys bothers you. That to me would be enough reason to move on. If the next provider gives you OTC time, that's great, but don't expect it. Especially if you're a wrinkled old guy like me. ;)

Sooo...YouWanna 733 reads
posted
9 / 46

What a stupid ass post.

There are so many fish in the sea that some will actually pay for it.  

So many in fact, that look at how many hookers there are!

Old ones too, still making more than you.

Sooo...YouWanna 614 reads
posted
10 / 46

Or, she lives in a complete and utter hole, and this was her first experience ever interacting with a man. Which I highly doubt.  

We bring up boyfriends because we don't want to hear another word about it. Some of us even *make them up*. That is how annoying being pressured for OTC time is.  

Know this newbie: if she suddenly only replies to appointment request emails, blathers on about her bf, and starts ignoring your texts, it's because you are annoying the fuck out of her, and are getting ready to be cut from the roster. We have shit to do too, and if you can't get it through your head, you start to become a cost of doing business, rather than a valued client.

Pavliena See my TER Reviews 564 reads
posted
11 / 46

I am new american you know. The one of those who writes for Soros essays " your expierence as new american" should I write about this kind of expierence of american cynism and dis belief in human dignity and calling women lovers who making ends meet with love hookers ? I should apply to Soros as new american with THAT kind of exp what do you think ? May be I will be awarded then grant for the best New American essay? So sad to read all that here. We women here giving you all what we have - ourselves and give you it better then yours SO yet we are hookers. Men men men. Woman is an instrument touch her right she be Stradivary touch her wrong she will poison your life learn about us women we are here to love you. Sorry for misstypos just from cell ph

oralconniseur 10 Reviews 561 reads
posted
12 / 46

just business and nothing more. Providers don't want your heart, they just want your money. If you remmember that you will be just fine. Go find another provider.

Urbanburgher 4 Reviews 536 reads
posted
13 / 46

Now that's a one hell of a friend to have taken the time and effort and (donation) on your behalf....you must have thanked her!

RedheadBombshell See my TER Reviews 575 reads
posted
14 / 46

Posted By: ROGM
She might be on Top of her Game right now. But eventually these Girls won't be getting as many Clients as they used to when they were Young and Hot Looking. She'll be calling you late one night saying she has no Money or a place to stay and if you can see her and help her out. Then you'll have your Sweet Revenge. Hookers are a Dime a Dozen. But where can a Hooker go to get her Youth and Looks back?  
One of the most sinister and disturbing responses I've ever read.  Please help me understand ROGM, why the OP would need or wish to exact vengeance on anyone, let alone someone who doesn't seem to have taken advantage of him.  
  I'm neither "Young or Hot Looking", but I'd sleep in my car, rather than sacrifice my integrity or disrupt anyone's life for a handout.  
  While I empathize with the OP's disappointment, his expectations are unrealistic.  He's fortunate to get a reality check here from the experienced men and women.
  It's not very becoming to stereotype or generalize any segment of the population. Perhaps you were just having a rough day....or perhaps I was. Didn't realize how critical my post sounded til' I just re-read it. My apologies.  
  Sending you the "Luck O' the Irish" :-)  Sshhh! I never joke about Irish luck. Might wanna buy a lottery ticket today, my dear.  
  Heck! Tis' a blessing just BEING Irish!. Why else would 90% of the girls in my family have red hair?  
                                                          The Dez :-)

-- Modified on 10/28/2013 5:53:23 AM

lungman 10 Reviews 665 reads
posted
15 / 46
seduceurwife 522 reads
posted
16 / 46

You need to know what you are getting into.  The arrangements are clear.  She owes you nothing.  Any OTC time should only be initiated by her.  Anything else and you are just a pain in the ass.

hiddenhills 143 Reviews 560 reads
posted
17 / 46

I don't know to many businesses that give away things for free on a regular basis. Yes, every once in awhile you get a freeby, but not on a regular basis.  

Is it possible she views you as being to clingy?

It's happened too many times to me already. Had an ATF. Trying to get her to have more OTC time becomes like pulling teeth.  
 Even after years of seeing her and many times more than most other providers.  
   
 Then she starts talking about other TER guys, what they do for her etc. Then a "part time" bf who buys her a new car,  
 gives her paintings he "did himself" showing me me this big blobs of something hanging on her wall.  
   
 Then totally ignores my emails asking if we can finally have some OTC time. On attempts before, she would say she had family time even though her kids are grown, albeit young adults who still need to see her. Then some other time (p4p time always) she says her "part time bf" took her out, or they went on vacation. So I'm guessing now, I'm a nobody to her and just an ATM.  
   
 So best to realize when one is in that kind of situation as a TER client and move on immediately. Being a nobody while she says her "family time" really probably means some of that time is with her new "part time" bf.  
   
 I hate when that happens. And I'm stupid to have repeated that often on my own budget with those ladies/girls who just really thought me of just an ATM except for their SO bf or whatever such they will drop everything at their beck and call.  
   
 

Pampam 19 Reviews 667 reads
posted
18 / 46

hanks y'all for the comments. Yeah, I know I was asking for it. I'm still new to the ways of "wanting to date a provider" and wanting more "OTC time".  I needed that good beating!

Unless I have enough funds to "buy out" a "provider business" I shouldn't even think about it. More meeting new ones and less repeating

Pampam 19 Reviews 683 reads
posted
19 / 46

dding one more hilarious thing about the situation.

So there I am standing up gawking with my jaw dropped at the massive paintings of blobs on the wall, while the provider is telling me it's her part-time bf's hobby.

Now realizing it's a big fug-y'all by the dude to the rest of her clients. lol

London Rayne See my TER Reviews 670 reads
posted
20 / 46

Her for having the nerve to yap about other clients and her damn BF, and you for putting up with it and expecting OTC time. She is probably doing on purpose to let you know she is not interested by constantly bringing up other guys. Yes, I often did OTC time when I was on tour...a few times at home too, BUT that is because I have no life lol. Well, I didn't until a few weeks ago, that is. I could AFFORD to offer an extra hour or two, because I liked going out and having fun, and I did not have many friends in my area...they were all 2 hours away. Add to that, my rate was always much higher than I needed to begin with, so really...it was not free lol. If I already got 700 for two hours, what's the harm in getting a free meal too? Heh.  

That does not mean EVERY provider, regardless of how much you have invested, will do that same thing. There is nothing wrong with them, just like there was nothing wrong with me. She clearly is not interested in seeing you at all without being compensated, so move on.  

There is only one reason a woman or man will bring up other relationships...to let you know they are not, and never will be with YOU.

-- Modified on 10/28/2013 9:44:49 AM

London Rayne See my TER Reviews 704 reads
posted
21 / 46

Yah, I will go with this bwahhahaa. I am being nice today. :)

London Rayne See my TER Reviews 662 reads
posted
22 / 46

Whoa, did someone steal your handle? You were so sweet before, always yacking about "your provider" and how much OTC time you get, and now it's about revenge? So, if your provider all of a sudden says she is done with you, are you going to slash her tires? Yikes!

London Rayne See my TER Reviews 617 reads
posted
23 / 46

That's for NOW, while she's playing him like a fiddle lol. Wait til she wakes up and gets married, and he realizes just what he was...a client and a friend, but not a fkin boyfriend! Wounded and desperate women are the most manipulative of the bunch. You can say I am a bitch, but guess what...you'll never get a sob story from me unless you ask to begin with, and even then, I would not USE a person.

89Springer 570 reads
posted
24 / 46

Thanks for the education. I don't bug providers about anything, and certainly don't expect OTC time, so I'm not sure if the venom was directed at me or the original poster.

Sooo...YouWanna 611 reads
posted
25 / 46

Then you are well on your way to getting some ;-)

The OP, for obvious state reasons, is not, LOL

London Rayne See my TER Reviews 429 reads
posted
26 / 46
Pampam 19 Reviews 520 reads
posted
27 / 46

thanks. I'd "stumbled" on a couple actually. OTC time "suggested" doing things with me outside of the hobby.
2nd or 3rd session was super. Then later on the lady gives some OTC time, but not a full date separate from the session, more like an addon.  

then you find out that ATF is particular very sharing, and many other guys who got along well with her also got a little OTC time or talk about OTC.

Then I would here on PM's,  blah blah, other fans/clients who said they saw my ATF on OTC time , as "friend" time, not related to work time, Had a quite a few pm's like that. "hey , call her up, i'm sure she would like to see you"(yeah, you only get p4p, but i don't , nyah)

A few years later, I found out an ATF provider WAS looking for a SO among her fans. And she eloped the the ter guy and quit the hobby for him.  

Like job application rounds. Maybe I was in the top 50 considered, but didn't make it into the top 20, or  3, etc. then the final.

So I'm never going to believe it doesn't happen. Who do you think providers from 8 to 10 years go dissappeared with?

Right other "lucky" TER guys who won the lady. Or they had the "right stuff" like the world's few astronauts

Pampam 19 Reviews 1204 reads
posted
28 / 46

wow, put it right through the heart. "never be with YOU!"

Nothing wrong with providers you say, nothing wrong with you. But everything wrong about me, or clients in general.

Even the bf who is/was a client. Everything wrong with him, not; after all it's mr. right

Pampam 19 Reviews 481 reads
posted
29 / 46

Thanks I plan to do that. I did mention I was stupid to repeat so many times with her making me feel she would see me OTC eventually. And I also said I didn't see the signs early that I was just an ATM which I should have

Pampam 19 Reviews 810 reads
posted
30 / 46

I know your venom was directed at me.

I'll tell you this. I hadn't seen her in a while (only a couple of months or so) and then she pm's me "you forget about me?"
She liked me to go out with her, take her to dinner, movies etc. Then next thing you know it's stuff I mentioned in the original post. Um yeah, you're going to show me her new car.  

In fact, she noticed I didn't say anything about her new mercedes. She wanted me to see it. I said , nice car, how much? THEN she started talking about her part-time bf

Pampam 19 Reviews 583 reads
posted
31 / 46

I appreciate the comments. There are a lot more details of course.
I realize there's nothing in it for her, because I do realize now she saw me nothing more than an ATM, never a chance  
as a suitor, despite her many behaviors and acting to convince me to keep repeating with her trying to make
me feel like I had bf or OTC chances.

Pampam 19 Reviews 571 reads
posted
32 / 46

Nah, most providers enjoy seeing me. In fact the lady in question in my op, wanted to see me as often as possible.

As I was an easy ATM to her. , get it?

But you're so dumb you didn't even get that part. And all the other fake aliases you have liking your post

London Rayne See my TER Reviews 558 reads
posted
33 / 46

You posted because you're put off that she refuses to see you OTC (or she won't anymore) right? You said she does nothing but yap about what other guys do for her, which is a sure sign of her trying to tell you, that she will never be with you in any context but a paid one. Now, you might still get some OTC time on the day of your visit, but try calling her up and asking for no paid time and see what happens.  

You've put up with this for a while, so the question is WHY? You must have thought there was going to be a benefit for doing so? Otherwise, it's pure insanity. Providers who respect their clients as clients do NOT yack about other guys, unless they are just outright ignorant. No, only providers trying to get a message across would do on and on about that many guys, what they do for her, and a part time BF. Even if she dogs these guys out, that's still her way of letting you know, she is still carrying on a thing with them. What does that tell you about her?

London Rayne See my TER Reviews 579 reads
posted
34 / 46

You made it sound like you've been getting OTC time for years, and now all of a sudden it has stopped and you are pissed about it. You said nothing about HER sending you messages out of the blue, her initiating it, etc. or the replies here would have been much different. I am not saying you are lying, but your story sure is a changing. After the post about seeing her new car, sorry, but it sounds like you have feelings for this girl, and they are not mutual. She probably landed a Sugar Daddy and that is why she can't afford time with you unless you're paying. HE is taking her time. Boyfriend my ass lol.

Sooo...YouWanna 545 reads
posted
35 / 46

Well let me clear something else up for ya darlin, we ALL "enjoy" seeing you and want to see you as much as possible, until you turn into a needy PITA that makes even such a simple job unbearable.  

But you're so dumb you still think its cause she's the one with the problem. Just because you are willfully ignorant doesn't mean the rest of us aren't seeing it clearly, even when told from your delusional ass point of view ;-)

Sooo...YouWanna 779 reads
posted
36 / 46

Fucking. Gag. Me.  

We don't want to date you. Ever. Even if you're the worlds greatest guy, we still probably don't want to date you. It is our JOB to make you feel like our bf for an hour. Just like it is your JOB to file papers or check someone's prostate or slap on some braces. You dont bring home work for shits and giggles, neither do we.  

And when we disappear, it's because we have shit going on, not because we have finally achieved our Pretty Woman moment. What a ridiculous thing to say. We get real jobs, real boyfriends, and have real kids.  

You may not realize this, but your expectations are way off. Yes, you are an ATM, if that's the way you feel you need to put it. But we are just a hole, if you insist on debasing it to that kind of terminology. The sooner your realize why we are all here, the sooner you won't have to worry about being so butt hurt over a simple business relationship. So get over it and have fun already!

Sooo...YouWanna 705 reads
posted
37 / 46

Yes, she followed up like any other business person would. Again, readjust your expectations of what is actually going on.

tg_baby 551 reads
posted
38 / 46

I'm sure that people have said that about me...that I was 'acting' to 'make [them] feel like [they] had bf or OTC chances'...but in the few times that's happened, it's all been in their heads. I didn't deserve that condemnation from them. I was always very clear that it was a provider/client thing, albeit a very friendly one. I did enjoy their company, to some extent. But once a client steps over that line, and lets his imagination run wild...you can't put it back inside the cage. She seems to be trying to get you back on course, while still retaining your continued financial support. But it never works out that way.  

You both have responsibility here, IMO. Yea, she could be handling it better. She really shouldn't continue to take your money if she guesses that you feel the way you do. But maybe she's just inexperienced in this kind of thing...the first time it happened to me, I thought the guy would just come to his senses and things would work themselves out. But you also have responsibility...this is a business transaction above all else. Friendships form, sure, but it's always business first. And the surest way to ruin a great provider/client interaction...is to not respect the business side of this...and/or pressure her for a relationship when she doesn't want one. If you don't keep a clear sense of reality you will open yourself up to more situations like this.

I had great chemistry with one of the clients who let his imagination run away with him. If he hadn't lost his head, we might still be enjoying very enjoyable, mutually beneficial sessions today. But, it was not to be...because he had to push. Because he felt the way that you do, and he felt that we either had to 'progress' with our relationship, or move on. I was horrified to hear this, BTW. I did exchange some OTC emails with him and let the clock run over a few times...but still, I had thought it was clear that I just felt fondly for him as a nice client. NEVER as a bf.

If I were her, I'd put you on hiatus, but that's with the benefit of hindsight.  

Mend your broken heart, but don't blame her for your troubles. She's just doing exactly what you paid her for...think about that!

-- Modified on 10/28/2013 2:23:43 PM

Sooo...YouWanna 703 reads
posted
39 / 46

Quit being a baby.

We don't want to date anyone. Do you have any idea how much dick we get? This is not a dating service, it's a fucking service. It is NOT personal.  

Until, as previously mentioned, you turn into a needy PITA. Then it's all the wrong kinds of personal.  

Do relationships happen? Sure. Just like any other work place. But just like anywhere else, this is the wrong place to look. You are seeing a character. A pretend version of herself. You probably don't want anything to do with the real thing, so just appreciate that you can both pretend for a little while.

Pampam 19 Reviews 499 reads
posted
40 / 46

My OP was a bit rushed. So I glossed over some of the details which I didn' t make too clear.  
But you're getting the story right, now, I had OTC time on the visits(very little time like I said, pulling teeth, maybe a half hour here and there, a little extra time on dinner to hear her spirited political views etc.) , but never on a separate day even for a separate lunch even though she said she could do it sometime earlier on when I had asked occasionally.

Then I emailed her asking about an OTC meetings just for lunch or dinner. And no response for days except seeing her ads refreshed and posted with more available times. Which then soon after, I posted this thread.  

She did finally respond within the last 24 hours. Basically asked if I wanted to see her now. I know the deal now. So I just said will keep in touch. I am not trying to think about it now. Anyways, hope the thread imparted some meaningful discussion if anything.


-- Modified on 10/28/2013 2:34:24 PM

tg_baby 621 reads
posted
42 / 46

Or, she might have just felt put on the spot when you asked her. Maybe it was just easier for her to say yes, and make up the excuse later.  But, she coulda meant it at the time...then things changed (like, that you developed feelings she didn't reciprocate).

OTC is usually before/after a session. What you asked wasn't OTC...it was a free date. It's a huge boundary issue...it's also not respectful of her time...at least when she's with you, you know she's already kinda there and ready to go out, etc...

You do have feelings for her...and you're basically asking her out on a date. I think she's responding very appropriately.  

Yea, she should not have said yes to begin with...but the question really shouldn't have been asked, to begin with.  

I had three clients do this to me this past summer. Not one of them is still on my roster...it's a deal-breaker for me, because if he's asking for a free date, we are not on the same page in SO many ways.

Sooo...YouWanna 555 reads
posted
43 / 46

LOL!! I diiiiied at this part!!

     I really got to thinking… How could I let these guys KNOW how TERRIBLE they are??? Let them know how to FIX themselves to make the experience less terrible for me?

I need to find this woman so we can get trashed together!

I did not attend enough college classes to link the below directly from youtube (and my iPad that my new boyfrann got me is so slow), but it is gold.

Sooo...YouWanna 540 reads
posted
45 / 46

So, she has never given you that much OTC time, and when you whined about it, she did her best to placate you cause you're a regular. But that wasn't good enough? And when you asked about actually going on a date, she declined? And you are.... Surprised? That she doesn't want to spend more time with you?  

You are exactly the kind of drama queen client we fire as soon as we find someone to replace you. You are disrespectful of her time, and you've done a pretty good job of trying to trash her in this thread. Everyone can see what's actually going on, but you still tried. That is completely inappropriate. Book more time, or accept any little OTC time she gives you of her own free will. It is not a hard concept. We do not owe you jack shit but what you have paid for.  

She tried to be nice and professional, and you chose to escalate it way beyond where it was ever indicated that it would go, and beyond any kind of professional or even friendly boundary. When you start basically demanding OTC time, you instantly become an asshole in our mind and will never get it unless begrudgingly. She probably doesn't look at you like an ATM, but she probably DOES look at you like a borderline stalker.  

What is the matter with you that you cannot accept that she treated you like a good client, until you stopped behaving like one?

case321 31 Reviews 820 reads
posted
46 / 46

I think we are in opposite ends here. Not looking to gain a SO out of this. Maybe you are not my place to say right or wrong. And it may happen for some. All I have experienced is pretty cool actual non hobby friendships coming out of this. Keep the sessions buisness even if an hour date turns into 3 or 4 9 times out of 10 ya meet. And communication between the two of ya when no date scheduled. In my mind that's better than an SO great sex actual fun conversation and genuine good times. Kind of like a fwb but a bit diffrent. Just saying if ya don't take things too seriously or come across as clingy it can be very rewarding. Good luck to ya hope ya find whatever it is you're looking for here.

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