There has been a lot of back-and-forth on one of the boards I moderate over VIPs vs non-VIPs and whethere people should pay for this site.
My opinion is this - if you are not willing to contribute to this community, I don't care how many private email addresses you post, how many ISO's you post, how many 411s - I will not help you. I support this community with my time, I was a paid member for years before I took a moderator's slot. If you are too cheap or too broke or just too contrary to contribute, then fuck ya - you're a lurker, glean what you can and piss off. If it were up to me I'd have TER differentiate between paid VIPs and those who get it by posting reviews - because I'd be loathe to help them out either given the number of fake reviews posted just to avoid paying a pittance to support the site. Hell, I'd limit the freeloaders to the general board and not allow them to post on the local boards - there is too much good info posted here for the likes of them.

This board has saved me thousands of dollars over the years by helping me avoid B&S, robs, fake pics, whales disguised as minnows, poor service etc - it is a private, for-profit corporation and deserves to make that profit. It does not owe the lurkers a thing.

Of course, that is just my opinion. What do you all think?

1 yr of ter VIP $180
2 hours with your ATF $800
a trip to greece $200

Knowing your gonna get exactly what you want and paid for, priceless
Doc

To add to insult.

If the free loaders do not or for any reason do not get their questions answered.

THEY JUST GO WRITE A FAKE REVIEW!! And it takes the providers weeks, now months to get a blatantly fake review removed. All because some asshat cannot fork over $20.00?

Or............

Hey some guys will not pay for membership and have never paid, instead they rely on the free VIP given for writing reviews.....they will pop into chat all pissy because their review has not posted , they have to wait on their 14 days, and they start asking all sorts of questions....in chat.

I vote non paying members NOT be allowed in any of the chat rooms either. NONE OF THE CHATS! and no messenger access....and great idea Puckerdoodle on the not allowing them access to anything except THIS BOARD.

Look at the threads below.....see all the posts on which prepaid card works this week vs. what worked last week?

Make it easier to pay anonymously - many of us can afford the price of admission but not the price of getting caught.  Mailing a money order to the Netherlands and waiting six weeks (or more) is not an option.  By the way, is that a USD money order, an international money order, will a USPS money order suffice?

Sorry, but you asked.

Puck, if it were up to me, I would do away with reviews for a VIP membership.  20 bucks is noting.  Either you pay it to get the full review or you don't.

Bond

I agree with you, and found the suggestion, from another person, about the need to make it easier to pay membership more discretely helpful. The TER membership, for serious hobbyists, is priceless; at least that's been my experience.

And understand the concept behind vip vs non vip?

*taking a deep breath as i prepare to shoot myself in the foot*

Okay, from my standpoint..i see it as this.
if someone is not willing to pay the measly 20 bucks a month for VIP membership...then he is going to scoff at any rate higher than 200 bucks. He is going to try to "wrangle" a 350 or 400 dollar lady down to what he thinks he should pay. Does this make sense to anyone? i am trying to say, in a polite way..that he is a cheap bastard looking to get the fuck and suck..however he can. he doesnt want to take the time to research and make a sensible choice meaning..he is not truly interested in seeing quality ladies. If this is the case, i can point him in the direction of another site that caters to this mindframe..and I do.

VIP membership has its perks. You get to truly research a lady's reviews and see what she is about. If you dont like what you see, you move on to the next. Time consuming, yes. but worth it.

I am willing to be half of the complaints about providers are from gents who didnt take the time to pay their measly 20 bucks and do the proper research.

For ladies..VIP membership has its benefits as well. Its another screening method, i think. We can tell a LOT about a gent based on his reviews. However, this brings up the topic of fake reviews. I am with Puck on this matter. Just because you post 2 reviews does NOT mean you get access to this community. If you want VIP..pay for it. There has been an incredible amount of fake reviews lately...and not just from newbies. Its also from those who's VIP status is about to expire...and instead of paying the 20 bucks.

so, as i am done shooting both feet off now, i shall hobble to my corner and observe this thread as it blows the hell up.

you deadbeat member VIP or otherwise sponge off the system of reviews, yet provide no reviews for your fellow hobbyists. That just totally sucks and always has.

Okay, okay go ahead with your BS story of the need for privacy and discretion. Please, if you were serious about hobbying, you'd learn all the tricks to protect that privacy, and contribute to this community by posting a review, so others may learn from them.

DO NOT BE A FREAKING SPONGE BOB

I have easily purchased VIP anonymously for a year now. So, this is no longer a valid excuse. Just visit the newbie board and type in "gift card". Everything you need to know is there.

Xoxo.

There are many who contribute to this site without writing reviews. They are still an asset, given they pay for VIP and offer advice to the newbies, etc.

However, those who do not give back to TER through writing reviews *OR* paying for VIP should sit on the sidelines, as they are NOT an asset to the community.

Xoxo.

BUT........
and I agree.....but:

The review process needs to be re-evaluated.

As far as specific deets go a checklist should suffice and the reviewer should then be allowed to espouse as they wish.

The constraints are a bit draconian yet one dimensional. It makes it easy to write a hack review that way.

Listing a menu of acronyms can and seems to suffice for a detailed review.

I think you'd have more member participation and legitimate reviews if the mechanism were more flexible to accomodate how folks like to express their experience.

The numerical rating a reviewer provides should be an anonymous process as well and not discreetly tied to the review. This way the info will be more accurate versus skewed because of whatever bias.

If they want to help newbies an contribute to the communities via the many regional and other discussion boards, great.

But no access to reviews unless they are going to contribute themselves. Let me just say, since it appears we have no disagreement, and in advance of the onslaught of dudes with no reviews and their lame excuses....

DON'T BE A FREAKING SPONGE BOB

I'll show you mine if you show me yours. Reviews that is.

...long as they pay for VIP.

Honestly the whole writing of reviews is not for everyone. Some people like to be discreet. So if they pay for VIP, they should be able to access reviews even if they do not write reviews. That was the disagreement, but everything else makes sense.

Especially since some of the reviewers don't even pay for their membership. There really is no comparing a gentleman who is here on his own dime vs. one that is here based on a review.

Xoxo.

Why do DC & I have to get them?  I say we limit them to the Minnesota board!  j/k

Personally, I don't know or care if someone is a VIP member.  I am (obviously), and have been for almost 6 years.  I see the value in it, but didn't when I first got here.  Limiting access too much prevents the potential customer from finding the value; hence membership falls.  Without new members, the site will eventually fail.

That would help put a stop to fake reviews.  

Also, as much as I agree with your philosophy, what about the flip side?  

There are many gents who are VIP members that choose not to write reviews for a variety of reasons.  IMHO I think that stinks.  They get all the benefits of TER without putting anything other than a few bucks into it.  They count on the rest of the gents who are good enough to write reviews.

This board saved you thousands of dollars because of the reviews written.  Were it not for reviews, you're pretty much going in blind.

As far as fake reviews go, I have received 3.  I worked with TER Admin to have them removed.  They were good reviews too.  All 3 were high scores.  But, that doesn't matter.  We need the ladies to be diligent about checking their profile to weed out the fakes.

There is a lot more to delve into here.  Good post.  

Besides, with all that 'Minnesota Nice' we wouldn't get a good cross section, would we?

I don't know if they're VIP either til they start whinging about not being able to read PMs and asking people to email recommendations to them.

I've got a few recommendations

All access to TER should be paid VIP, hobbyist & providers alike.

No free Vip for reviews.

No access to the boards unless a hobbyist contributes 1 review every 6 months & provider recieves 2 reviews every 6 months.
Lurkers can still lurk on the board, just can't post, can read reviews w/their paid Vip.

Simple.

I have the unfortunate luck of having two reviews on another site...and oh lord. if all of you think TER is too stringent, outdated as far as the review process...oh brother. TER is a haven compared to this other site. The fact that they allow comments to be made on a review..has me PUKING. I gave up the fight to have those reviews removed...but I was able to make it so no one was allowed to post comments and have discussions ON MY REVIEW THREAD. if they want to talk about it, they can do it backchannel.


pm me and i will point you to this other site. Talk about a hot mess.

I like how reviews are done on here..the only thing is...(preparing to shoot myself in the shoulders, as I already shot myself in the feet earlier in this thread)...

I understand the need for acronyms. I really do. However, there are times they dont fully exrress what a provider is all about. However, most guys done want to read a long drawn out review..hence the use of acronyms. Okay, I get that. Sigh.

As far as numbers tied to the review..i dont see why not. It gives a more rounded view of the provider.

Once again, just my thoughts!!
*dragging myself back to the corner to sit and observe how this thread will fare*

Okay, if someone wants to "check out this site" before committig to the measly 20 bucks a month then they get a 30 day trial access for like, 15 bucks. After the thirty days...

their access is restricted. That way, you still get your new members...and they get to decide if the 20 bucks a month is worth it. If they decide its not worth it, then they dont waste the time of those who are serious about this hobby.

And no, their membership is NOT extended if they submit 2 reviews.

now, i could be a real ass and say they HAVE to contribute..by posting reviews, posting on their regional boards and the GD board. But..there would be a huge opposition to that, i am sure.

with the attitude toward those who maintain VIP by writing reviews.

I have a year of VIP 'Saved Up'. From submitting 60 "real" reviews since April of 2008

Now if TER required that I pay $20 annually I'd still contribute the reviews....

However I make a more important contribution than the twenty bucks would be by continuing to post reviews, and to be ready to help out with newbie questions, appropriate 411 questions and etc.

There are plenty of guys who pony up but do not see providers frequently enough to keep VIP by reviews only.

As with any other organisation or club, there are many ways to participate and to make a contribution......

as for me if I have any prejudice it is more against the guys who do not contribute reviews....

Look, this whole thing will never change it is what it is and the sponge bobs of the world will always sponge off others.

Discrete? I already gave a shot at that. It is just plain BS. It is those same dudes with zero reviews who want all manner of credibility.

Enough already, people know how I feel about Sponge Bobs.

If you plan on catching fish you better have some bait on your hook otherwise the fish will swim and nibble a little and pass you by. If a newbie comes to this site and finds nothing do you think he's going to stay.

I know many have argued with the change in showing numbers with reviews but let me say that was the best pussy bait around. Just because you get a fish on your hook doesn't mean your going to reel him in each and every time but if you interest him enough and give a little tease your chances are so much better. Many newbies come back often as a free member until they finally get to read the juicy details. Once they do most are hooked.

I'm a VIP member here on TER and have since I found my 3 reviews. It was a learning experience for me and i'm a woman who has been around longer than I want to admit. There is great value in the $20 a month you spend for us ladies and wouldn't be without it but I wouldn't have known that if I didn't have time to find my way around TER.

My panties are down to my knees and my cute little ass is puckered up just waiting for a lashing. Please be kind and gentle with each and every lick.

Kisses Haley

Ok, you were right on until you said...

"No access to the boards unless a hobbyist contributes 1 review every 6 months & provider recieves 2 reviews every 6 months."

TER has some valued members who pay for VIP, but do not write reviews. TER would lose good members if it were mandatory that they submit reviews. This isn't a good idea. Sorry, Gator.

Likewise, I would stop paying for VIP simply on principle if it were mandatory that I receive 2 reviews every six months. I don't actively seek out reviews and many of my clients don't write them, so it would be a hassle in my mind. This should not be mandatory.

Your other points are on point, though.

...for a free VIP membership the real sponges. To each their own.

And it is about discretion.

I have several friends who pay for VIP and spend thousands of dollars a year on TER ladies. They monetarily support the TER community even if they don't write all about how their date sucked them off the night before. Some people don't get off on that or simply want to keep some parts of their sex life PRIVATE.

To each their own.

Good discussion.

Xoxo.

And no, a USPS money order is not an option, because they do not offer an international money order for the Netherlands. On more than one occasion, I have bought the card that was recommended, only to find that it was not acceptable for internet purchases, or it was only good for U.S. purchases, or any number of other reasons. Making anonymous payment easier would be a big step in the right direction.

Most of my clients are regulars who don't write reviews or already have and the others don't even know about TER!   TER gentlemen are not the majority of client base guys!!!!

I have ALWAYS paid with a prepaid Visa gift card.  These include Vanilla Visa, Green Dot, account now and a few others.  

Also, I am not understanding what everyone is so worried about.  It's not like staff has access to the records from CCBill.  They are two totally different companies.   CCBill is no different than giving a lady your real information, or a screening service.  So what is the real problem??  Oh it's what Puck said it was.

So again, all of this is irrelevant.  

It really sucks that guys have to make excuses as to why they don't have VIP and instead write fake reviews to obtain it.  It really sucks because our reviews are much like a job resume.  And when someone alters something it fucks it all up and takes us weeks and months to get them removed. We can't just hit backspace and fix the shit and reprint it.

I know there is no real solution for this.  I think if they are going to continue to offer free VIP for reviews though there should be something put into place to verify the reviews.  Like if the guy is non VIP when writing the review, then the lady needs to verify the guy.  ie. reviewer writes review, staff sends lady an automated email that says here are some exerts from a new review.  Can you please confirm you met this person.  DO NOT show her the number scores and try to avoid the negatives of the review if there is any that way she can't say, oh no it's bad I didn't see him.  Wouldn't be hard to set up an automated system like that.

But then we go back to the women who aren't honest and think because they always get 8-9 or 9-9s that they should always get it and then decide to scream fake review when they get a review below their normal marks.  I have yet to receive a fake review in my 6yrs here that was below my normal marks.  All my fakes have been glowing and guys do that in hopes it won't be removed.  

It's a double edge sword.  Men write fake reviews to get free VIP, ladies argue that bad reviews aren't real when I can almost promise most of the ladies screaming fake on bad/semi low reviews aren't fake at all.  So what can staff do??  Limit more stuff so that more guys write fake reviews??  Take away free VIP for fake reviews?  Only offer extended VIP to those who have VIP already?

http://www.gift2go.net/

Now after you register the card, wait about an hour before attempting to purchase anything online or it will say it is declined.

It works. Never fails. This and Visa debit cards from my bank are all I use for online hobby related purchases. You can discreetly register them with a name and address of your choice. It is not rocket science.

Xoxo.

sure, it would cut down on the bs..but then, it would cut down on quality membership as well.

yikes. thats a bit much to sugges i HAVE to get 2 reviews every six months. some guys just dont like writing reviews!

If TER continues with the free VIP then at least verify the guys reviews are legit.  All reviews should be verified.  I like this idea.  What a simple idea that would help keep everyone safer and the reviews honest.

That being said, I still feel we should all have to pay for our VIP Membership.   Just my humble opinion.

By my rules stated above:

Being a paid VIP hobbyist who doesn't write reviews...they can still read reviews and read the board.... same w/paid VIP ladies w/out reviews..... they just can't post on the boards unless they abide the gator rules!

Fuck the sponges!

While it makes a lot of sense for members to be VIP, making it a requirement is a double edged sword.
The non VIP members are already restricted as it is. Restricting their movement any further would probably not be a good idea.

As GTM had already pointed out, it is the review data bank that makes TER the best site out there. By not giving VIP credits for reviews would be like TER shooting themselves in the foot. No doubt there would be a drastic slowdown in review writing.
Although I do have a fair amount of reviews, I am lazy and the VIP days do give me some incentive to spend the half hour+ just to submit a review.

I don't particularly like freeloaders either, and I am not in much of a hurry to help them out. At the same time some of them will eventually come around and contribute.

Lurkers are another story. I would guess that lurkers far outnumber VIP active members. I don't know they are there, and they don't bother me. However, many providers reap the benefit from them.
I would be interested in knowing how many of the 6,400 members on line right now are VIP and only lurk. Probably a much larger percentage then we think.

I am not sure what prompted this post Mr Puck, but it is an interesting discussion.

Now me...not VIP (used to be paid member for a number of years...getting banned and not getting a refund for those days soured me to that a bit...though when my account was reinstated I did get my days left back, but don't think I would have gotten anything had my account not be resurrected).

I do agree paid membership does help make the site money...and selected services for those willing to pay makes sense. Being a free member I don't use the PM system, I don't chat (though I could I don't), I don't use my brilliantly witty aliases...and I could live with not posting on certain boards including the local boards, and I agree that folks that pay with money deserve perks.

When I did have VIP I never read a review unless sent to me as a link because it was funny, or fake or whatever. I signed the posts I made using an alias, and I stayed in the main chat room where non-VIPs could chat, the only perk I ever really used was the PM system and that I used infrequently at best.

I never took intel from the site without giving back...a review telling me what kind of time a guy had with a woman was useless to me, her numbers were useless to me since the service didn't apply and I decide for myself looking at her pics if a lady is a 5 or a 10 or somewhere in between.  The list of services was useless to me I don't need to know if a lady gives a BJ, does Greek, etc. the only category that was ever relatively applicable to me was "more than one girl" and the times guys get that one completely wrong when he chooses "really bi" makes TV psychics look downright reliable.

Now, I am one of those broke asses...damn economy...
but I don't contact ladies wasting their time, I don't contact guys asking for intel, I don't post ISOs. I didn't when I could afford VIP and I don't  now.


All that said, do free members really contribute nothing?  Do they really take and give nothing back? Maybe not.
TER has advertisers...CityVibe, ErosGuide, Backpage, etc.  Now there was a time when management of TER bragged that the site had a membership of 1.2 million. now, if that follows the way most sites do only 10 - 20%  of those are paid members (I could be wrong on this and it could be more or less...but for the sake of argument let's say 15% paid so about 180,000 paid members.) Now if you figure most of those don't come to the site everyday, but instead only when looking for a lady, and then only looking at the review portions of the site, that effects the reported traffic, pages views etc.

Traffic is generally what sets advertising rates, yesterday TER had an Alexa ranking of 0.013% of global internet users...now if we assume that is paid and non-pain members, and that only 15% are paid members...how much lower would the rankings be if non-paid members were made to feel entirely unwanted?  85% less traffic can make a big difference in ad revenue.  

As for the money from VIP members...let's see 180,000 paid members at say an average of $200 a year (considering price differences for buying yearly, quarterly, monthly), that would be about $36,000,000 a year in revenue...woohoo TER that looks like they should be able squeeze out a meager profit from that. *grin*
...and that doesn't even count ad revenue...which is oddly more helped by the non-paid members than the paid (though I don't know what they charge for ads so I can't say if it really competes or not).

The boards, traffic there is by posts, and not all the "serious hobbyists" post or read posts...most actually don't and spend the majority of their time on the site on the review pages, if in doubt that that tends to be true...look at all the local and national boards and tell me if 180,000 different people post.

Me, I don't really care...I paid for VIP for years and it didn't make or save me a dime...and it isn't making or saving me anything now.
if TER don't want my broke ass posting, someplace else will be glad to let me "terrorise" them...or at least I think so.
...and of course should someday it be that I am no longer a broke ass I'll pay for membership to a site that didn't mind me being around when times were tough.

I review on multiple boards. It's a royal pain-in-the-ass. I also see regulars whom i do NOT review every time. I would much rather pay my way than be 'required' to write reviews for perks.

Don't even get me started on writing an honest review only to have some narcisistic witch HOUND you for weeks. Tasha had a point about how those precious few 'insist' on their REGULAR scores as oppossed to EARNING them.

I agree and if you look I don't post reviews. I've been a member for years and just used the information on here as everyone else does. In the beginning I didn't post reviews because I had hobbied for years before learning of TER and didn't want to look like a newbie. Well years later I still look like a newbie. But now at least I contribute to the boards some. I do not hobby when in a civie relationship, so sometimes I go away for months or a year. Posting a review back in 2004 maybe would give me more credibility but I have had good relationships with hobbiest and providers alike. There must be a better way to flush out fake reviews and maybe only the providers can do that. I think giving "free" VIP when you contribute with reviews is a good incentive and as others have said what would the point of the board be without them. Please just the flaming alone without reviews would drive me away instantly. I pay and I'm fine with that. I don't ask to be unmoderated; if it takes 1-2 hours for what I say to post; fine. Nothing I add is that important. I do enjoy being on here, reading the post and occasionally intermingling.

and less time consuming overall.

because i know!!! I just know...you just stsrted the derailing of the train.

*waiting on the shit to hit the fan*

I am not VIP.

And that has absolutely nothing to do with me being too cheap or too broke.

I paid monthly VIP for quite some time even after I decided the reviews on this site were of little use, or even random interest to me. Any information I need is available to me outside of TER.gasp!

I continued to pay VIP long after that because I felt it was important to contribute to a site dedicated to supporting a positive dialog, and exchange of information regarding p4p and sexualityand I was just trying to, generally, be a good citizen.

But, I changed my mind about that. I find some of the dialog on GD board interestingand the endless train wrecks amusing. I often find the silly squabbles over who is manly and who is not hysterical. But I simply cannot, in good conscious, pay $ to support a site that is so supportive of such abrasive disrespect to women. Call me contrary if you will.

I can stomach (or try to ignore) the repeated denigrating, he-man woman haters crap that a lot of men enjoy spewing on this board. But, Im absolutely not willing to listen to that crap, and PAY for it too.

Masochism is not my thinglol

Yesits an internet board and people can say what they like, and it matters none what *I* think about that. Fair enough. So its a draw.


SoI guess..fuck me. Im a lurker. Ill glean what I can, and then I will piss off

As I am now pissed..and want to make a point. Sit down for this shit kiddies...

So, if I get this straight, there are "lurkers", "leeches" and the like who are actually quite proud of their lurk status.

they are content to glean off the hard work, time and dedication of others...

NOTHING PISSES ME OFF FASTER.

If you truly have nothing to contribute to this site but your self proclaimation of greed, laziness, bitterness or excuses...then i say these are the types that need to get the hell off this site. oh, and to not be a paying member? Even worse. I can tolerate it better if you were a paying member. That is some sort of contribution.

Why be part of something..when you arent a part??

this site is for those serious about the hobby in some way shape and form.

let me guess..you are the ones who like to email a bunch of girls on here..but never see them? I could be wrong, as I dont know you personally.

Excuses piss me off. Its either A or B for me. Either you are a part of this community..or you are not. If you are just here to leech off others...then begone.

I hate freeloaders. Why? Because I am one hard ass working bitch..and i figure, if i am a hard worker and can contribute..why cant others? I am dead ass serious about this industry...and will do everything in my power to give back. Not to just this site..but to the industry. There are other aspects that need to be addressed..and no one wants to address them. Fine. I will be that big mouth.

Begone, I say. Take your simplistic mindset with you.

...concentrate on keeping the members they have.

which would it be if a lady charges $350 and $400 for an hour appointment but uses a free website to get those appointments?  *smirk*

"My opinion is this - if you are not willing to contribute to this community, I don't care how many private email addresses you post, how many ISO's you post, how many 411s - I will not help you. I support this community with my time, I was a paid member for years before I took a moderator's slot. If you are too cheap or too broke or just too contrary to contribute, then fuck ya - you're a lurker, glean what you can and piss off."

If you want to lurk, fine - but don't be asking contributing members of this community to email you 411 on some provider because you're too cheap to pony up an annual fee equal to half an appointment. Why does everybody have to work so fucking hard to get something for free that someone else worked for or invested in? It's like tapping your neighbor's cable - yes, the cable company makes bank, but you're still a mooch.

Because i really dont want to embarass you on such a public forum.

Okay. you want to go there. Sit down, get your thinking cap on. I will type slowly and use small words so that your little brain can comprehend what i am saying.

Yes, you are calling me out. I am woman enough to hold my own. So, I will answer you.

the answer to your pathetic and thinly veiled attempt at a smart ass crack at me...a smart business woman uses whatever resources available to her in order to build her business. Once she has built her business, then she can make the necessary upgrades and improvements.

I shall now explain why I charge what I do..as you do not have VIP status and can just read my reviews..your loss. Just like I use whatever resources are available to me...you do the same. You dont have access to my reviews, so you take a shot at whatever straw you can grasp..meaning, you have checked out my site (thank you for improving the number of hits my site gets) and based your attack off of what you saw on the site.


Is this about right?? Or have i missed a valid point here? I dont use my site to get appointments..i have other means. The site is just a summary of who I am...

Duh.

You done yet? Or do you want some more?

Isn't going to give them incentive to pay for VIP, all it will do is drive them to the smaller local boards.

Yep, I checked out your site...and?
Yes, I made a smart-assed comment..and?

I would never hit you on your reviews even if I could read them. So, you got that one very, very wrong...but thanks for playing.
I don't care why you charge what you do, and if you had any knowledge of me or my posts back when you think I was a more valid member you would know that.

I have never read reviews (unless pointed to them for a specific reason)...I said that in my post above...you know the train derailing one you wanted popcorn for, so I am not missing anything by not being able to read yours now.

Oh, and my smart-assed crack wasn't veiled at thinly or otherwise...it was pretty blatant.

You haven't embarrassed me yet...but if you would like you can keep trying.

That's a great idea. All the guys that need/want ladies who get reviewed and the ladies that want/need reviews can all be in the same place and be more of a community or more accurately an exclusive club. Those that don't play by the rules do not have access or read only access.

And since this club is only a small percentage of the total community it won't harm those who do not review or don't want to be reviewed.

I mean who needs to hear from those who are not a part of the "club"?

Ah..the two posters above you?

Hey, one of those would be me Not really sure what your problems is.

I do notuh..email a bunch of ladies, and then never call them. How would I email them anyway since I have no access to PM?  Unless you mean I use their contact info off here in order to pester them for no reason.  Thats actually kinda funny. Yeah....not my thing....lol

I have no interest in any regional boards.

There is no information on TER that is useful for ME as far as finding a provider. TER is not THE only source of info out there.

I had no particular interest in reading reviews when I had access to them. Now that I am not VIP, I couldnt see anything useful in reviews even if I wanted to. And, if I wanted to, I would simply renew membership. No biggie either way for me.

Ive never been in chat. I have no interest.

TER doesnt owe me anything, and I certainly do not owe TER anything.

What, exactly, do you feel that I, a non paying member, am taking from you by reading, and occasionally responding to a post on the GD board?

And really, if TER decided to block any/all participation except for paid VIP members? Wouldnt put a hitch in my life one little bit. There are plenty of places on the Inet to waste time.

I am woman enough to stand behind what I say as well. But in this case, I'm not sure there's anything all that important to stand behind.

And think about the pressure guys could assert if they withheld a review in order for you to get access? Wow this could be a determining factor to actually start price fixing. The guys could start wanting deep discounts for those coveted reviews.

So ladies, how low or how far would you go to get your required number of reviews?

sigh. i hope a mod doesnt pull this down. that would be a shame..as I am sure you took a lot of time to think of such a witty...but weak, response.

I use a free web based site to host my site....so?
Yes I am one who charges 350/400 an hour...and?

Sheesh. is that all you have?
Let me know when you are done repeating what I just wrote...and come up with a vaild arguement.

if you did not care as to what my rates were or anything of the sort...why would you even mention it? You could have attacked me another way. You could have attacked what I said in my post...the one about ones who contribute nothing to this site.

The fact that you attacked me as a person..well, that just says a lot. Am I typing too fast for you? Let me know if you are having trouble following what I am saying.

if you had any knowledge of me..lol. You would have never attacked the way you did. That is something I can and will throw back in your face.

Pretty low to call someone out personally. My, shall we say, rant, was targeted at a group of people. Not specifically you.

but you went specifically after me. Tsk Tsk. Okay. Whatever creams your twinkie!!

"There are some guys who support TER through only frequenting TER ladies."
How's that working? I'll tell you, they are reading about you here for freaking free. Give nothing back to this community. So I guess it would be working pretty darn well for you.

"Whether or not they are "lurkers", they spend their thousands of hard earned money solely on TER ladies. They give back through financially supporting us, and in turn we support TER."

How swell, and back to issue of reviews and giving to the community, they give what? Nothing, Nada, Zip. They can afford "thousands" for pussy, but not the price of one session for a whole years VIP status. Simply mindboggling.

Look forget about TER, or the reviews, VIPs or hey even the hobby. There are two kinds of people in the world we live in. Givers and Takers. I choose to be a giver and I like to share with other like minded givers.

Takers kick em to the curb.

Oh, but wait. One of you are not VIP. My bad

PS: You are both on my never ever see list

If this place became VIP only, I'd probably pay the bill just to keep your smart ass posts popping up.

Besides, you're my little sister.  

Because I don't want or expect a free lunch.

has any effect on how fast I read.
Your post doesn't appear letter for letter as you type it...you know that right?

Now, here is the general concept I was going for,
you "ranted" (by calling them names and insulting them...always the best way to help people see your view...wait no it's not) at a group of people for not supporting this site for whatever reason and saying they were proud of it... I drew a correlation to you using a free website as you not supporting (monetarily) your own business.  You said those that get information from this site but do not pay for it are leeches, I drew the correlation to you not paying to have a website but letting others pay you for the service you don't pay to advertise.

Oh, and throw anything you would like at me or back at me...I don't mind; this has clearly upset you so if you need to rail on me to feel better I'm OK with that.

Any marketing dept. that simply believes they have 'peaked' and,as a result,lies DOWN would be negligent in their purpose. Most markets are ever-changing. Thus it is the mission of EVERY marketing dept. to anticipate the direction of those changes. Competition usually drives internal change. Consumer demand drives external emphasis.

I'm sorry you feel TER has peaked. I consider the # of logged-on(regularly)to be moderate at best.

i do type to fast.

psst....i do pay for my site. http://www.wix.com/upgrade/website for more information.

then why didnt you just state your point from the beginning instead of cracking on me? I can respect the point you just made above...its all in the presentation.

Yes, i would have still caught the personal slam against me.

your correlation would be correct..if your assumption were correct..that i do not pay for it.

so, as i do pay for my site, my advertising and contribute to not just this site, but to any site I am on...

I do believe your argument has been thrown out a window. I am not one who tends to throw stones while living in a glass house.

*yawn* I am done now. sigh.

its because i am so darn cute isnt it?

sigh. i am 30 and still considered cute. wtf.

lol.

It looks like I stirred up the pot here.

Sorry ladies, I'm not buying how easy it is to use a prepaid/gift card.  I stand by my prior comments....this and the newbie board are littered with comments on difficult it is to secure a card that works with this site.  Gift2go?  Sure, explain receiving that card in the mail to the wife when it arrives.

No matter, after my days ran out, I manned up and charged a quarterly subscription on a personal visa.  I hope I open the bill before she does.

Have fun debating the fake review issue - I don't, so therefore not my thing.

the most boring fucking place on the net if it was only VIP's participating.

I also disagree that the reviews for membership are automatically false or disingenuous. Sure, fake reviews get through, but this is a self policing community that tends to identify those fake reviews and mark the reviewers.

I lurked for four months.  I wrote my first two reviews to see how it went and to see what VIP would be like.  As soon as I got VIP, I checked out the profiles of several of the providers that I had seen before finding TER and they were dead accurate - good and bad.

I then wrote reviews of at least two of the providers that I saw each month and maintained VIP.  I then used the problem report system and banked over 180 days with valid problem reports.  I was also granted 60 days VIP because the prior Staff used one of my posts in an ad (I only found out the reason later - I did not know at the time why I unexpectedly received 60 days and I wasn't asking LOL).

Basically, I have had VIP for no money since I effectively joined the site.  I consider my reviews, problem reports, and post contribution to be more than fair compensation.  

Would you say that I haven't contributed to the site?  Even before I became a Mod?

This is a community.  All members welcome.  VIP's just get more, and it is worth whatever contribution that is accepted.

In your second reply to me you said:
"...a smart business woman uses whatever resources available to her in order to build her business. Once she has built her business, then she can make the necessary upgrades and improvements."

and now within an hour you pay for your site...congratulations on being able to upgrade in an hours time.

I mean had you paid when I made my first post you would have said that then...had you paid for it.

You personally slammed every single member of this site that doesn't have VIP, and specifically everyone that posted in this thread saying they didn't have VIP, but a sarcastic comment to draw a correlation between free sites for getting appointments and those that you so readily said were "leeches", "freeloaders" and "simple minded" is beyond the pale...anything said to you is an egregious attack against you personally, and must be answered...nice that your concept of civility only applies to what people suggest about you and not what you directly say about others.
I implied something...you claimed it by your response.
You directly insulted a number of people but because it was to a group it is OK.
I made a smart-assed comment but it was to just you so it is a terrible thing...

got it...in your mind insulting a group of people is acceptable... but even implying an insult to you is unforgivable.

I noticed you yawned...so, have a nice rest and pleasant dreams.

Every month I renew my membership the same way.  Greendot.  Sometimes I get all fancy and stuff and use my account now card.

But it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out how to do it.  And complaining that you have to register some of the prepaid debit cards in your name is irrelevant as well.  THEY NEVER SEND SHIT IN THE MAIL.  So again no worries and no excuses

www.greendotonline.com  (These cards can be purchased at walgreens, walmart, CVS, and RadioShake)

www.accountnow.com (These can be ordered online.  You can reload the card with greendot money pak, money gram, and western union)

www.rushcard.com

www.walmartmoneycard.com (Can purchase online or at your local walmart.)

www.vanillavisa.com (can be purchased online or at any store including your local 7-11)

I have used all these cards to purchase membership.  Never had an issue.  So you can't sit here and tell me it takes a genius to figure this out, because I'm blonde and I figured it out dammit

wow. you wont let this up will you? wow. okay then.

but..my site address is actually something different than what is on my review profile. I just havent changed it on my profile.


wow. you wont let up with the attacks, so i can assume you took what i said personally. I can know follow your line of reasoning..a little bit.

okay..lets re wind. read my post again. carefully this time. I said..those who do not contribute anything to this site at all. that is who i was really attacking. Some others read it wrong too..and i told them to go back and re read what I wrote.

Oh, others have called out those who contribute nothing as well.

save your rhetoric tricks for someone easily fooled by word play. I am not one of them.

Do not put words in my mouth. Just dont. I yawned because I was done with this little game.
if you have something further to say to me..PM me.

oh wait. thats right. you cant. all you can do is hurl insults on a public forum. Well, if that is your contribution...

Thanks Mr Phil, you lurves me, you really lurves me.

And, I'm certain TER admin and others are working on ideas regarding how to get the non-vips to take the leap to vip. It reminds me of the 1-800-Dentist commercial. It's a great idea, but if the person doesn't experience a significant degree of need, they will never take the leap.

TER grants 2 VIP days for each approved problem report. It's EASY as shit to accrue a LOT of problem report day in the bank if you are SMART.

I got most of my VIP time free that way & so did DC.

Then again, most of you are not smart !!!  LOL

Bad Fuckin Santa

never see list...
but do you have a sister?
or hot Mom?
a wife you need distracted for a few hours?

about leeches and lurkers is in some part aimed at me

Im only saying that based on a post below that was pulled as part of your squabble with WT, in which you specifically mention the 2 post above you as being the source of your ranting pissed-offness. Well, one of those 2 posts above you would be me. Yep.

Now, If  Im  offbase on who youre calling names? As rosanna rosannadanna would say: nevermind.

But if I am one of the non VIP members who you are calling a leech,  and a free loader, with a simplistic mindset, with nothing to contribute except self proclaimed greed, laziness, bitterness or excuses...yadda

Ehem.

I do notuh.email a bunch of ladies, and then never call them. How would I email them anyway since I have no access to PM?  Unless you mean I use their contact info off here in order to pester them for no reason.  Thats actually kinda funny. But no. I do not do that.

I have no interest in any regional boards. And, even if I did, I cant imagine of what use anything I read on a regional board would be to ME. Im not, somehow, getting all kinds of free intel without paying.

I do not gain any information from TER as far as who I might hire as a provider. TER is not THE only source of info. Local (not TER) info is much more useful, again, for ME.  

I had no particular interest in reading reviews when I had access to them. Now that I am not VIP, I couldnt see anything useful in reviews even if I wanted to. And, if I wanted to, I would simply renew membership. No biggie either way for me.

Ive never been in chat. I have no interest.

My reason for no longer paying VIP is a very valid reason for ME, not simply an excuse. And, its not important to me in the least that you, or anyone else approve of that reason.


And finally: really no need for all the name-calling.

Mostly I pay for VIP. The review bonus is a trivial supplement but important to incentivize reviews.

I am not keen on fielding 411s or ISOs for folks with no reviews and who provide no useful information. TER and services like it deserve to make a profit on the services and information offered. Fake reviews need to be rooted out and their authors penalized. I am also not particularly fond of subsidizing eternal newbies. I can see some trial period, perhaps.

but take and take and take that piss me off. that is what MY definition of a lurker and leech is.

someone who takes and takes..but doesnt give.

i can only speak for myself. How others define a lurker and leech is up to them..

if this is not you...then its not you. if you arent taking and not giving back..then why even respond to my rant? I am simply curious..really.

your reasons are your own..i cant fault you for that!!

perhaps i did not phrase my rant correctly.

sigh. i will post the interpretation in a minute.

Yes there should be support,  either reviews, or posts for Vip status.

However in the Case of TER if they want money they better be able to take it when offered.
Not all of us can afford to have a charge show up on our personal cards. And with the MO I have heard a lot about "missing" MO's so until they accept all forms of payment they are on thin Ice.

You know...if you tell me, then I can do a problem report and get a couple free days VIP.  

In your post that was pulled: you specifically mention the 2 post above you as being the source of your rant.

My post is above yours.


You can go back to fighting with WT now.

Just get it overwith and pay the $180 for the whole year. You're going to do it anyway, and you save money in the long run.

Shit, it's done and you don't have to worry about it until admin sends you a nice email saying your membership is coming due next year.

And these fuckers writing fake reviews to get VIP. Don't be such a slimy shit! Eventually you'll get caught, and I hope they ban your ass because of it!

I've said it before and I'll say it again. I agree there should be a system put inplace whereas the provider can verify if infact the date actually happened. Can't be that hard. I know some of these ladies are wizzes on the computer, they walk me thru shit all the time, and I'm positive would be more than happy to get this going.

I could care less about the free days I accrue. This is a community, and I figure I'm doing my *civic duty* by writing accurate reviews and posting regularly.

Fuck, the cheap-ass, irresponsible liars can have my free days if it keeps them honest and makes them appreciate what this is all about and not abuse it.

And before some wise-ass pops off about *me* being irresponsible and abusive, I'm here for my amusement. Not your's. I gladly pay my dues. Even spent a month in *time-out*, meaning no posting priviledges, because of my shenanigans. Did the crime, did the time.

I find this site to be highly informative as well as entertaining. Met a lot of awesome people, and hopefully will continue to do so if they let me.

Pull your head out of your ass and figure how you can get the most out of this experience the right way.

Fuck, if some people put as much energy into doing it the right way instead of working around it, they'd be better hobbyists because of it.

Can't appreciate something if it comes too easy.

Just me I guess....

send me an email. lol. hell, you gave me a run for my money...i like that!!

my email addy can be found on my provider profile.

Freeloaders?....lurkers?....last time I checked...my money spends and if you have no intersest in it...so be it...I'll just shuffle on down the road...and spare myself the insipid lectures

JohnGalt didn't say that nobody should have a free lunch. He said that he didn't believe that he should have a free lunch. To each his, own, eh?

I pay for my priviledge because this site has given enough to me that I feel that it's well worth supporting - so I guess I don't think I need a free lunch either.

This place introduced me to the hobby (thank you, Google, err.... and Gina ) and I feel it's right to pay for value received.

And it certainly isn't a turn on. For many of us, it's a pain in the ass.  I'd prefer not to do them, and when I don't do them for a while, I happily pay for my VIP access.

I do reviews because this site has been a gold mine for me. I went from not knowing who would show up at my door and whether she would pull the "touching is illegal" act, to have a great time with a beautiful woman nearly every session.

This is why I do reviews.  To help others benefit in the same way that I have.

Case in point: my last approved review was in March 2008 (one unapproved one from June of that year). I'm pretty sure I haven't paid for VIP in years- the only reason I have it now is it comes as part of being a moderator. To be honest, I haven't really NEEDED access to review scores for years.

Apparently I wasted my time promoting and organizing meet and greets in Vegas when I SHOULD have been handing over more cash to TER- that's what really makes me of value to the community.

Uh, OK.

(I can think of some additional examples just from a few users...)

Anyways, you might reflect on why Facebook and Myspace don't charge... and why AOL and MSN do, and which ones are growing, which ones are shrinking away into nothing. If TER wants to turn into a pay-for-play only site, they'll hand their market share to competitors who DO figure out how to give users free (to the user) and low-cost (to the competitor) access, with ways of giving users added premium features with extra cash. Their current model is not a bad model for TER, actually- some basic stuff for free to get you hooked, some extra things to make it cool if you are willing to pay more.

between reading the boards, engaging in discussions etc - and posting your email addy and asking for 411 on providers to avoid paying for the ability to read reviews.

Somehow I don;t think the latter was your MO.

I rely on BOTH for my business. Many of my massage clients found me from being discussed on the public boards. Most massage-only gents aren't VIPers.

If they are respectful, have the proper donation, and allow me to screen them, I could care less whether they were a paying VIP member or not.

-- Modified on 1/20/2010 1:53:05 PM

For some odd reason I feel the need to speak my piece.  

Most importantly, I agree with Puck.

It has never been my intention to gain VIP access via posting a review or two.  That to me doesn't make much sense and it isn't fair.  I mean, I'm only going to be seeing one of these girls once every few months maybe, so it'll take longer to get the access, and it wouldn't last as long as I'd potentially need it.  I plan on paying for a membership, but first I need to start over with my (bad) spending habits.

I can't speak for others, but I posted a private e-mail addy because A)it was suggested to me B)seemed like a good idea and C)would keep my other inbox(es) free(er).  I have no marriage and thus no real life to ruin by the discovery that I see the occasional provider.  *gasp!*  "He's single, in his mid-20's and he pays for the company of women!  OH NO!"  

Lurking?  Okay maybe you have me there.  Maybe.  I don't go looking for juicy details that can be obtained through membership.  I scour threads so I can learn how to do things better.  Sometimes I have to go back to the n00b board to check acronyms!!  But checking threads and posts for details I'll someday be able to read, isn't fair to anyone if I'm not paying for it already.

Business is business and I'm not one to fuck around with the order of things in any way.  I myself try to be an orderly person.  We owe the founders of this site a lot and we owe the ladies a lot, too.  In many many MANY cases, IMO, we owe them tons more than we could ever donate either to them personally or to this site.

-- Modified on 1/20/2010 3:24:18 PM

I suggested the email not so you could get the lowdown on ladies without doing your homesick first.  In fact, for a newbie, I have seen just the opposite from you.  You do your research and you participate in board discussion, both here and on our MN board, plus you have just posted your first review.  By participating, you are not a lurker and cannot be considered in the same group  as the non-vip lurker freeloader types who do none of the things that I have listed here.

Hugs, Belinda

this is YOUR opinion, other than that, it does not mean much.

I was in the hobby long before this site existed and would still be in it if this site disapeared completely.  I am curious, is it the fact that you are a Mod that makes you feel like God or the fact that you paid a subscription price?  If you NEED this site to be safe, you should get the fuck out of hobbying all together before you get caught, if getting caught matters.

Bad mouthing the board you moderate behind here shows a lot about your character,and it is not pretty.

If you want to pay to see the reviews, hurray for you.  If you want to pay to see the performance numbers, again hurray for you.  Fact; right on the front page it states that the content found within is for FANTASY.  It makes me wonder why so many people get their undies in a bind when reviews and numbers are not accurate.

Many people, paid or not have complained about getting reviews posted, not enough detail, too short, not enough posting history and the like.  This site and the people taht run it are not perfect in any way, so what!

The site has NO prerequisits of having to be a paid member, the site OFFERS Vip for reviews, last I checked it is a REVIEW site.  IF YOU don't like the site rules and parameters, wtf are YOU here?

You don't want lurkers here
You don't want VIP for reviews
you want to be part owner

Feel free to hit the suggestions tab and share it with those that actually give a damn and can make it happen.

Other than that, this post is no more valueable to those that come here looking to get laid than the trite posts you were complaining about and thinking about where you farted this one out!

Whew!  Now that I got the animated version out there.

Puck, just skip over the ISO posts and read the ones you are interested in!  BTW, it is the VIP members here that make problems for the ladies by handing out review information.  If they are not able to kiss and keep secrets, they should NOT be allowed to keep VIP status!  What do you think of them apples!  Give a kid keys to the candy store and he hands the candy out to all his friends!  They just can not help themselves.  Whether people are VIP or not is not the issue, nobody should be giving out information on a public forum that can be damaging.  Agreed?  This site should be able to function and everyone get the needed information via the ladies websites and ads. When I read a ladies webpage or ad, I already know by how it is written if she is my kind of lady.  That and 10 minutes on the phone or 2-3 email responses. $$$ for the hour(s) is all you really need, all the services are not offered to everyone regardless, that depends on the clients respect, hygine and personality(oh, and in some cases SIZE does matter).

provider reviews are at the sole discretion of the clients.  They can't be forced to write one just because YOU think all providers "should" have 2 per 6 months. These kind of performance reviews are NOT mandatory.

After 3 months as a provider, I have ONE review - and it isn't even on TER.  Would you bar me if I got another and that second one wasn't on TER either?

So, I ask now: what do you propose to do about THOSE scenarios even if your idea were to be taken seriously?  

Are you going to threaten my clients that I can't be on TER anymore if they choose not to write a review? Like they're going to care more? Rather the opposite I would think.

Do you intend to dismiss my posts or bar me from making them despite the fact that I pay for VIP, but don't have YOUR minimum review contribution?

You might want to review your idea again! It isn't one of your better ones.