It seems as the economy tanks so do the safeguards in this profession. Because Elliot got arrested  all of a sudden NO one wants to give out info.

Or girls, like one I wrote to today for a reference, cavalierly say, "I don't remember him but since I haven't noted any problems, you should just, go for it."

I'm sorry. In this climate, I'm going to screen more diligently than ever. Will I have less business? Most assuredly. As I've said before, I don't look good in prison orange.

Come on folks. Just because times are tough doesn't mean we need to start compromising our safeguards. If anything, we need to be MORE cautious

I'm willing to listen to alternative ways of doing things. Longer sessions, same donation, whatever. But let's be circumspect and selective while things are tight. Maybe we all hobby less but raise our standards to do so.

Your thoughts please.

Just my two cents worth.

Anneke

I must say that I have moved from Boston and retired. I recently made a decision to return. The big problem I see is that men don't appreciate our ability to protect ourselves and them. This is NOT a one way street. We protect each other. We use to be able to request and ladies give back. I see that no more. It is a damn shame.
The biggiest problem I have seen lately is no one wants to do for the other. Ladies to ladies or to men...to give out general info. We are not asking for your full name, address, children,and a blood sample info here.
I've, personally, always admired you Anneke (we've both been around for awhile), like you will not lower my standards for references. And if a lady who responds that wayof "Sure I think he's cool) I will simply ask for another reference letting the gent know that she felt complelled to diverge from being help in a safe way.
Personally I see there are several ways to go. We could go to bottom feeding CL, where 200 is the right alternitive for some. Or we may carry on the way reputiable women do. Not adjust our rates but offer a longer time. I prefer a gent stay longer for the same time as an hour.
This economy is terrible, however I remeber when ALL of us use to attempta happy medium be it hobbyist or provider to be, it hobbyiest or provider.
I am with Anneke here.
What do you gents see as the solution? Be reasonable with requests.
AngieRenee of Boston

-- Modified on 6/1/2008 8:46:29 PM

Let's talk when I get to Boston. June 5th-9th.

Welcome back.

Kisses,
Anneke

Yes, the economy is in the tank and for some reason there are guys out there who think that the hobby should become a yard sale with no questions asked. Another problem, something that has been building longer, is the fact that many of the "ladies" of Craig's list ARE in fact turning the hobby into said yard sale. The "track" has moved from street corners to the world wide web and the lower end fare has now lumped itself in along with the more legitimate ladies. Honestly I don't know what the solution is other than to stick to your guns and possibly lose some business over it. I'm thinking the guys that you lose to the one-and-done, no screening required CL ladies are not the kind of clients you want anyway.

I still give providers my info.

It's a buyer's market right now. If a guy doesn't want to give anything out, he's going to find takers. For every provider who won't compromise her screening, there's one who will. I sympathize with you. Ride it out.

Any personal info you require.

Even a DNA sample if needed

-- Modified on 6/1/2008 11:02:54 PM

As a client, I get to chose who to contact.  I'll provide information so the lady will feel comfortable dating me.  How else could we relax & have a good time.  
Yes, I'd be concerned if a lady did not screen.  I have advised Fav ladies if I feel something compromises their safety...  I am cautious about what I put in reviews especially location info.  
I am GFE & I prespect & protect the ladies that I luv & luv me.
skb

screening information.

What makes them think that a women who screens is going to use that information against them?

LE doesn't care about screening, they only care that you show up.

For all of us.
Gentlemen who won't provide enough information to be properly screened by the ladies put themselves at risk. IMHO, a reputable, high quality provider will be more discrete with your personal information than your attorney or doctor. But chosing to go "down-market" to someone with less rigorous screening criteria sets a gent up for encounters with LE, Cash & dash, bait and switch or worse.
On the other side of the coin, ladies who relax their screening standards due to the slumping economy set themselves up for untold dangers including LE, rip-offs, violence, etc.
Please folks, stick to your guns and maintain the high standards that are in place for everyone's protection.
We'll all be better off in the long run.

time marches on....

What has happened is that time has moved on... remember just a very few short years ago (less than a decade) when there was virtually no internet hobby - in the form we now know it.  What has happened is that the market has expanded and to becry that is to curse the storm.  The storm is here - so you might as well get use to it... and now you are faced with choices....

You either maintain your own standards (and that goes for the gents as well) or you don't.  For my part, I like the idea of a well reviewed lady (occasionally I will risk it for a new comer) where I know that I will be treated with respect, there will be no "upselling" and no B&S event that drives me crazy!  Some men may not care, this one does.  

To think that our little hobby world is not unnoticed by 1) law enforcement, 2) scumbag pimps 3) lower end providers and 4) the civie world in general is to put ones head into the sand and pretend that things have not changed...  I mean - for god's sake, TER advertises in Penthouse - a pretty much mainstream publication!  

This change was predictable - and it was not a matter of "if" but "when" - the economy is just the catalyst for the change.  What I would suggest is for all to reevaluate how they wish to treat the shift... I for one, don't mind that more lower end gals are going "www" as it decreases the exposure of those legit gals... as if you are LE - and in a target rich environment, you grab the easy pickins rather than sting those who have more intelligence and do their screening homework correctly.....  

but then again, it is a numbers game.... so... change?  Shift? yup - it happens.

I was about to post something like this....

Screening is just one of the many double edged swords in this business..

Guys will not see you when you screen..
Guys will not see you if you don't screen..

Geez make your mind up!!!

Another I have seen go up...
Book and no show/no call...
Then you take to over booking and they all show!!

Next is distance to drive..
A recent post showed you guys will travel to see someone..

Yet I am 25 miles from downtown, 18 from where I am called the most from.. Off a major Hwy and still get "Oh that is too far.."
What is up with that??

"will you come set up an incall near me?"
Yes... Then when I do, well you know what happens here.. NC/NS

Hard enough Guys without your games...

is the information I will give to her. I have always given the ladies my information, and I don't see a reason to stop now. Since I am careful, and do my homework when I choose a lady I want to contact, I've already decided that she is someone I will trust with that information. Then the only question is if I am someone that she will choose to trust. To this point, it has worked very well, so why change? I'm not going to invent a problem that I don't think exists.

-- Modified on 6/2/2008 9:07:00 AM

I agree that this can be a frustrating time. However, lowering your rates to attract these clients who would not be of interest to you anyways is not a good policy. Continue stringent screening and let the bottom feeders stay where they are.

By upholding your standards you can ride this out dignity intact and your regulars and those who have been looking into meeting with you will be more than happy to provide you with the proper donation and screening information required for your time.

Sometimes it can be frustrating but have faith. I would rather see fewer friends any ways and see them for a longer visit. I am very low volume and tend to find that fits my life perfectly. If you enjoy seeing more friends, simply, entice them with something different that doesn't compromise your standards.

For me, I plan on taking a road trip down the east coast this summer and then venturing out west a bit to really break up my summer and the dismal economic outlook.

Life is what you make it, so I am going to take these lemons and add vodka!

I've chosen not to meet with a lady if her screening requirements are too lax. I can see why it would be a problem for a guy to give his info to someone with just a CL ad. I do extensive research using the guidelines often mentioned on the newbie board. After all, I'm still pretty much a nub.

As Mr. Fisher pointed out- it puts them MUCH more at risk if they see women who don't screen.  When I get calls from men who do not want to volunteer information I take the time to explain why it is important and how it protects all parties invovled.

Usually they take a few days to think it over and eventually get back in touch with me.

I have noticed agencies becoming more reference friendly...maybe they are also afraid of being pulled under by LE and want to extend the olive branch to indys like me?

XO
Melanie

Some guys will always try to get away without giving you enough info or screening. That's just how they are and probably always will be. There are still plenty of gents who will give you what you desire. Some ladies will always be blah on giving references and will say anything to get you off their phone anyways. I'm like you, though. I want to screen well and will do it regardless of someone's wishy washy half assed reference. References have never been my means of screening, though, just something nice to get so you know the guy's not an axe murderer, rapist, abuser...

Maybe bc I'm in L.A. (where there are millions of potential men who might want to see me,) I don't feel any effects of a slowed economy. In fact, business has seemed to go up. Then again, I don't see much in the way of decreased spending going on near me as there are new high rises going up, new luxury stores opening all around me, tons of people in the nice restaurants, lots of people in the clubs at night, packed concerts, busy gas stations/ fast food, etc... I just don't feel the effects and don't see them, though I guess they might be more obvious in other areas.

Katie

I'm a relative newbie ... but this was the same approach I took as well. I flirted with the idea of seeing a provider for a long time -- then eventually  found the right one at the right time. Even though she is very private about her identity, she kept a good website, posted a blog, and was willing to exchange some e-mails and IMs -- all of which made me comfortable enough to trust her with MY information.

Haven't regretted it a bit, and I suspect that most of the ladies (at least the ones who hang out in this community) are worthy of the same level of trust. We all have something to lose, so we should watch each other's backs.

You should know better than that...

There are some people who try to say they are so and so top reviewer (but obviously aren't.) Girls who don't probe deeper get busted.

There are also people who like to try and share accounts (yes, we ladies know about it) and try to let their buddies use their handle. This is dangerous to the lady, to the reviewer, and to the community at large. I've heard that a guy let his buddy use his handle and bam... his buddy was an informant (unbeknownst to him) and they both got popped.

There are also LE who try to use these handles and if a girl isn't dilligent in her screening, she will get popped.

It's too risky to take these at face value... to protect oneself, a lady needs to know who she's dealing with and hope to God that it's not somebody who's turned, or an informant, an abusive guy, etc...

TER handles and their reviews can be helpful as part of an overall screening, but should not be the sole means to screen someone.

There's a lot of stress involved for the lady and while it may inconvenience you to have someone check you out, it is ultimately better for the both of you and the community at large.

However, if you want to generalize and scare everyone by saying everyone's had their info outed, pause and remember that this is a GROSS OVERSTATEMENT.

Katie

Edited to also mention that you can't always just take a provider's word for it when LE sets up fake ads and will try to give ref's, girls turn on other girls sometimes after busts and provide ref's for LE, etc...


-- Modified on 6/3/2008 3:41:30 PM

The standard form on rare is a bit of a pain, but the info is essential. I prefer guys email me directly with said info. That said, when I initially started out, many guys would fill out the form despite my explicit request NOT to, to use email only for screening info. And some will not include all the requested info unless they have a clear form/list to fill it into. Ultimately I leave it up to the gent's discretion, but think email is likely better than the site form when possible as long as you are careful to give all the info that is needed/requested. That said, neither have caused major probs as far as I know. I do think it is common courtesy to respond even if you can't take on a new client or book the date, but alas its not a perfect world and this will not likely catch on sadly some just can't or won't make the extra effort so one must only take the risks they are comfortable taking and then accept those consequences.

I do wonder why more in the hobby don't use hushmail, or even better, safe-mail?? I am thinking of the switch...

I have to think that the data from the form goes into a database somewhere, and then is extracted and passed on to the provider. That database must be getting pretty large. Now it takes is a national security letter, and the FBI has all the info.

Ladies who insist on having the form filled out and submitted before they uncover their pictures, for instance, may or may not be real - they may just be another way of adding content to the database. In any event, ladies who insist on knowing my vitals before revealing enough naughty bits to let me know if I want to see them - I recommend giving them a wide berth.

As they say, just because you're paranoid...