I used to require deposits on traveling tours. If the client/friend had a good refrence from a provider I knew of, I would not require it and it has worked well for me. Even with deposits some guys No Show. This happened to me in Chicago and I offered him another time slot and he cancelled that too. So on my second trip to Chicago I emailed him well in advance and gave him the choice of when he wanted to see me and he never got back to me. Maybe he got the "married guilties" or decided I was not the one he wanted. I do require a deposit on 3 hours or more because that is alot of time that could be wasted on a No Show. I offer a refund if anything goes wrong on my part(sick,dog died etc...) If I was not to return the money the client could massacre me on all the provider boards (plus Im an honest girl). If a client No Shows I pretty much have to take it. Only give deposits to well known providers after a few emails and calls so you can feel good about it and not worry about getting ripped off. If not, always have a good refrence from a well known provider you have seen so she can assure that your a good fella. Just my 2cents xoxo Devin Taylor
Seems to be a new trend. I have trouble enough with the idea of deposits. Unless the provider is very well known, I will not do a deposit. A nonrefundable deposit is just ridiculous.
If the lady doesn't show, does she keep the deposit??
Personally I'll never find out. I DO understand the ladies side of the issue, but I guess that's perhaps one of the risks of doing business if it were to be looked at in a clinical & non-emotional (ie: non-personal) view. Of course I'm not talking about a fly-her-out-to-see-you-extended-stay...just the typical 1-2-3hr arrangement. And no...it's not that I don't trust ANYONE--it's just that I don't trust everyone, particularly when I don't know anything about them. If I had trustworthy references, it could be a different story---but sans that, I'll pass & leave the time slot open for someone else to enjoy.
just curious...
It probably wouldn't make me change my mind even if she had a good reputation...the exception would be if someone that I know also knows her. I consider personal endorsements from my friends to be of greater importance than reviews by guys I don't know. Not mentioned yet is what degree of personal communication has taken place. Is it just filling out an appoinment request form...or has there been some time spent actually talking on the phone? I'd also be more inclined IF I were to make an exception, to do so if I've had some actual conversation & gotten good vibes from it.
But another thing that hasn't yet been mentioned in this thread so far is HOW MUCH the deposit is. That could also be a factor in this discussion. For some guys if she wants only a token amount they might go for it where they would balk at 50% of the fee as a deposit. Let's face it, while if everything works out as expected it makes no difference one way other the other. But what if she somehow defaults? I'm sure a certain percentage of the time even the "refundable" deposits aren't refunded. I don't mean to sound overly cynical, but I think that is reality.
Of course I very seldom see touring ladies as I happen to prefer outcall dates for a variety of reasons, but those few times I have...deposits weren't even asked for & certainly weren't required.
I agree; many times the deposits are not refunded and the hobbyist really doesn't have any recourse. What are you going to do sue the escort? As to your exception if someone you know also knows her then there probably is no need for the deposit. The reference from the fellow hobbyist should suffice. I have said it so many times but NEVER give a deposit!
I can totally see your reason for hesitating but if a girl is traveling to another city, she can lose a lot of money waiting for a no-show. What if a provider were to ask for a small token sum say $50 to weed out those with no intention of showing. Would you be willing to pre-pay $50. to show you are sincere?
While the $50 is certainly more reasonable than some ads I've where they want 50%. And I've stated before that going to incall would be very rare for me, & then only under the criteria that I mentioned earlier.
There might have been a time when I first started in this hobby that I would've sprung for the $50, but not anymore. Here is what I would do today.
I look at it this way---A deposit only off-sets the loss of income in the event of a no-show. Fair enough. Now if she needs the deposit $ from guys to buy her ticket, then the whole situation would be far too edgy for me. But let's leave that out of the mix. Whether or not it a deposit proves the guy is not LE is perhaps arguable. What else should she be concerned with? Tell me if I miss something...that he will not attempt to cheat her, that he isn't abusive, that he won't insist on services that she is uncomfortable with, that he isn't an alcoholic, not drug-addicted, & maybe that he simply won't gross her out. The $50 certainly wouldn't assure her of any of these things, or anything else that I might have omitted. Even 100% deposit would only avoid the cheat factor, none of the rest I've listed.
I have been a TER member for well over 2yrs. I'm probably relative visible as all of my posts & reviews have been under the greywolf handle. I would be willing to give her contact information on several ladies...all with TER reviews...that would vouch for my honesty & all those things that a deposit can't assure.
If that isn't enough for her, I'd simply pass...with no hard feelings about it at all---she's as entitled to her choices as I am to mine.
I travel to San Francisco. I pay for my round-trip ticket. I pay for my hotel room (a couple of hundred a night). I book 3 clients per day for 2 days. 2 clients each day don't show. I have turned down other inquiries though expecting these two to show up. The trip ends up costing me money not only in what I put out but also in that I could have stayed home and seen clients.
The $50 token sum is NOT to offset anything. Its to weed out insincere men who never planned on showing in the first place. That IS a big problem for girls. Its annoying when it happens to a girl in her own city but it can really cost a provider when it occurs while she is on tour.
A man who knows he is not going to show is probably not going to spend even $50. And if I were just out to scam men, I don't think I would be doing it on $50 increments and besides its not a lot for a client to take a chance on losing.
I think the $50 booking fee for touring is a good solution.
And I respectfully re-state what I've already said in my earlier posts on this thread. There are many gals, some I've reviewed & other that I haven't, that would vouch for my credibilty. I would think that all things considered, that would be worth more than a lousy $50. The ONLY time I've ever had to cancel a date was when I was in the hospital...& even then, I let her know about it in advance.
I'm not sure what you find unreasonable about my take on the issue, it is only my personal opinion & based upon what I've already mentioned. I AM NOT trying to change the way you think or chose to run your business! I did initially say that I understand where I think the gals would be coming from, but also that it's a business risk...as all business have. I don't believe in explaining my feelings that I was disrepectful in any way shape or form, nor it it my intention that my words will be perceived that way now.
But I think you & I must agree to respectfully agree to disagree, & any further replies in this thread by the two of us to comments made by the other is not going to change either of our minds.
I was trying to work out a fair system taking into account that the clients (not you but others) are at risk for being ripped off and I am at risk when I tour of losing money. I think the $50 prepay is a fair compromise. I personally don't care if you send a $50 payment to anyone or not. This wasn't about you.
I agree with Greywolf in this is a business risk. All businesses have to deal with these risks. Yes, you can try to minimize your risk through the use of deposits. I think you will probably have a bit more success with a small deposit and if it helps, great. However, I still would never give a deposit. I know if I am going to schedule an appointment I will be there and my references would vouch as much. The $50 deposit would be more of a nuisance and I would just look to someone else.
So from what I surmise those who will send deposits will and those who won't, won't so it seems so I might as well stick to the 25% deposit if it isn't going to matter.
Thanks for the feedback!
Talisa
When providers tour a city and have no shows it is not always the hobbyists who are behind the cancellations. It is not unheard of for local providers and their groupies to schedule appointments with the intent to cancel and make the touring escort's trip a disaster. Just one of the many tactics used to get rid of competition. In this case a small deposit would help. However, deposits also do scare away good clients. You should have a sort of "stand by" list when touring a city for cancellations.
Lets keep this simple. You are taking a considerable amount of risk when you send someone that you hardly know a non-refundable deposit.
If there is a no-show, what recourse do you have? None! Also, keep in mind good apples do go bad ... sad, but true! For instance, take Leslie from. http://theeroticreview.com/reviews/show.asp?id=9088
Enough said.
Well, THAT certainly has me convinced...I went from "No way" to "NO F@CKING WAY EVER"
It also makes me think about that thread below with all the "I'm not like those other girls" posts from providers. Seems that a good reputation doesn't mean sh*t, nor does a previous track record.
What it DOES do though is send further messages to those hobbyist who continue to delude themselves in thinking that THEIR ATF really likes them, is their friend, and all that other crap. Note the one review from the guy who said he had seen Leslie a few times before. She didn't care about ripping him off as well.
Its all about money gentlemen, don't BE A FOOL and think otherwise. If you have fun, great, that is what you paid for, but don't ever be foolish enough to let down your guard emotionally or financially.
overnight and then all bets are off.
-- Modified on 7/30/2002 5:14:25 AM
Very true...and more to my point really is that if a person has decided to become an escort anyway, despite knowing all the potential baggage associated with the profession, how likely are they to have drug / bf / financial problems versus a regular sample of civilian ladies?
I know the ladies here hate being painted in broad stereotyping brush strokes, but surely the more rational amongst them will concede that the incidents of such problems are higher amongst ASPs than the general population. Even Talisa, who is a strong advocate for ASP rights to chose, and appears to be very well balanced and in touch with reality, offers that MOST ASPs shouldn't be doing it...that they don't have the proper perspective and / or personality make up to be able to trade "companionship" for money. Given that, imagine how desperate at least SOME percentage of escorts are given that they are engaged in this profession in the first place. Then imagine to what lengths they would go if the source of their desperation became more acute?
Is this the description of ALL escorts. No....I am also willing to concede that Nicole (NOSC) and Lauren (aphroditez) also appear to be well balanced and keeping things in perspective, even as they appear to take a different position than Talisa and dismiss (at least for themselves) the “dangers” of being a provider.
The thing is, I’m not willing to place MY $$$$ on a deposit at risk assuming I am dealing with someone like Talisa, Nicole, or Lauren. I don’t know WHAT percentage of ASPs are a bit “edgy” ethically (10%?, 20%?, 40%?), but since I am confident that percentage is greater than mankind at large, to me such risks are foolish.
Besides...what are ASPs besides the most underrated actress in the world? You think the appearance of being balanced and grounded is a difficult role to play with the money at stake we are talking about here? Especially when the biggest benefit to a provider is convincing HERSELF that “all is well”?
Another interesting aspect of the escort "Leslie" is the extremely detailed information that she requires in her appointment form. It wouldn't take much of leap to imagine that she may move from "rip-offs" to the more lucrative identity-theft or extortion. They're all criminal activities, aren't they?
-- Modified on 7/30/2002 11:27:39 AM
Non refundable? Some entertainers ask for prepayment in full or a deposit for first timers but those are ones who've been at it a while.
HB
due to cancellations by women clients who do not show due to headaches, cramps, and other "female" problems. We hate to do it but business is business. We now require 10% down but will take a second lien on cars that run and not on blocks.
What about if you're flying them somewhere to meet them? Putting them up in a hotel? Now this is someone you've been with before but you really don't know them. Of course they don't know you either - not really. So would, as an SP - get on a plane (ticket prebought) not knowing if there was anyone really at the other end of the line waiting to pay you for your time and risk?
So how does that normally work out? Do you send half your time/payment to the agency/girl and then hope she shows up on the plane you already booked. Lot of trust for a business built on mistrust.
I sent a deposit, once. It was to Leslie Hills, the good girl gone bad. Plain and simple there is no recourse for you and with these ladies it is typically too much money to risk without getting a return.
From the websites I've seen, most ladies say if they can't make the appointment, they'll keep the deposit and reschedule.
Like anything, you have to take it as a case by case situation. Someone mentioned Diana Of Dallas. She's had a 100% deposit requirement since I've been online. I don't know whether she enforces it strictly, but I have never heard about anyone having a problem with her ripping them off. But thanks to Kama Sutra's research, there is a lady who supposedly rips everyone. I have a deposit policy which I do enforce, but the severity varies depending on where I am going and for how long. But, I will send back a deposit if it is my fault we cannot meet. Deposits are more for if we have to travel to visit you. It usually covers transportation and a night's accomodation in case there is a problem once we get there and we can't get back right away. And of course it really weeds out the talkers and the game players. But it all comes down to how comfortable you feel and What you've heard about the lady.Do your research!
I won't send deposits, let alone a non-refundable deposit. There are no guarantees even if you send a deposit. Scheduling conflicts may result in either one of you from having to back out of the arrangement. Either way, your money is gone. Just my $ .02.
Yes the provider will try to keep it and you really have NO recourse. I ran into this problem with Hannah of Nashville/New Orleans a few years ago. She wouldn't refund the deposit even though she couldn't keep the appointment. I learned my lesson and NEVER give any deposits. Most will waive any deposit and if they don't I say you should just pass. There are plenty of ladies who don't require a deposit, especially in this economy.
-- Modified on 7/30/2002 1:22:59 PM
it's not a trend i've seen.
an established, expensive and highly rated provider i know on the east coast requires a deposit for first timers, but i found that it was not a fixed requirement to schedule with her. at least for me.
short answer: no, don't, hang up.
however hot she is, there are other ladies in the area that are just as hot and don't require a deposit.
If risking losing $50 or $100 is something that will take a bite out of your wallet then you shouldn't be sending them. But for wealthy successful types, that's fingernail money. No biggie to them.
I used to require deposits on traveling tours. If the client/friend had a good refrence from a provider I knew of, I would not require it and it has worked well for me. Even with deposits some guys No Show. This happened to me in Chicago and I offered him another time slot and he cancelled that too. So on my second trip to Chicago I emailed him well in advance and gave him the choice of when he wanted to see me and he never got back to me. Maybe he got the "married guilties" or decided I was not the one he wanted. I do require a deposit on 3 hours or more because that is alot of time that could be wasted on a No Show. I offer a refund if anything goes wrong on my part(sick,dog died etc...) If I was not to return the money the client could massacre me on all the provider boards (plus Im an honest girl). If a client No Shows I pretty much have to take it. Only give deposits to well known providers after a few emails and calls so you can feel good about it and not worry about getting ripped off. If not, always have a good refrence from a well known provider you have seen so she can assure that your a good fella. Just my 2cents xoxo Devin Taylor