An issue that both providers and clients seem to have a problem with in our industry is "SCREENING & REFERENCES".

1. Some gentlemen do not want to give out their REAL personal/work information for screening purposes.

2. Some providers do not want to act as a reference for clients.


That got me to thinking...What could be done to make both sides happy? And I came up with a "Hybrid" of 3 forms of verification that "may" be able to provide a whole "NEW" way to solve or problem.

Please keep in mind that it "is" 2:00AM in the morning where I am (I cant sleep)...so cut me some slack okay? :0)

Okay...

1. I remember seeing a documentary on Hugh Hefner and his Playboy clubs. The members had "keys", and they could not under any circumstances get into the playboy clubs without that "key".

2. I've seen some escort Ad sites that have "VERIFIED" Photos of providers. In other words, the provider had to provide some form of acceptable photo I.D. to get that "Verifcation" stamped on her profile.

3. There is a "reverse directory" database that you can type a phone number into, and it will give you the address that the phone number is linked to. Perhaps we can form a Database for our industry.

What if we combined the three? What if the HOBBYIST had a special "VERIFICATION CARD" that he could present to the provider that had his photo (and general info) on it?

What if the hobbyist could be put on a "database" that the provider can access? When he calls or emails her he can give her his ID number from the database. When the provider hangs up the phone she could go to that database to verify that he is indeed a part of it and an active current member. She could call (or email) him back and set the appointment. Once the gentleman arrives he can show her the "VERIFICATION CARD" instead of his real I.D.

How the gentlemen would get into the "Database" is by provider referal (or TER membership...more on that idea later). The provider can enter him into the database thereby "verifying" that he is a legitimate client (because he actually saw her during an appointment). Once the info is in the database other providers can access it. No other provider (or hobbyist) should be able to modify the profile...just view it for verification.

Perhaps TER could set something like this up. Gentlemen already have to provide credit card information for VIP Membership right? The credit card information has your REAL NAME and home address on it(home address so they know where to mail the bill/statement) right? The gentlemen could then fax a copy of their REAL PHOTO I.D. to TER (I had to fax a copy of my real I.D. to one of the escort ad sites I advertise on) TER could keep that information SECRET to the ladies, but issue the gentlemen a card saying that indeed you are a REAL person and their information is on file. TER would agree to disclose personal information to the ladies ONLY if there is a police report (or something else "official/legal") supporting her need to know this information. Otherwise it would remain a secret. I think it would also be a good idea if the gentleman's "HANDLE" from the boards and a description (Height: 6', Age: 39, Hair Color: blonde...etc) was included on the CARD.

The "CARD" could be very cheaply made....like a laminated work badge or something. The gentleman could pay a small fee for the card. To keep others from making "bogus" cards there could be a hologram or the background or the text color could change every month...only the people who actually have the card would know what color it was supposed to be that month (and TER could mass email the providers as to what color the card should be that month). If the gentleman has an "old" card or the card is somehow incorrect, the lady can decline service to him for that reason.

Okay...so to recap:

1. The provider would put the client into the database (share and share alike ladies)

2. TER (or an independent agency) would verify the client through credit card and faxed Photo I.D. that would remain Secret to "any" provider.

3. The client would be issued a "Verification Card" to show providers when he arrives for the appointment.

Everybody is happy.

A. The provider feels SAFE because she knows that the clients information is on file and he is not LE (because another provider he actually saw put him in the database).

B. The client is happy because he is not putting ANY personal or work informaiton in the hands of the provider...he knows his information is being kept safe and confidential by a third party.

I hope all of that was clear. I need some assistance though...it's hard to see the forrest when all those darn tree's keep getting in the way! lol. Am I losing it or am I onto something?...It's okay if I'm not onto something...I dont know everything...YET. :0)

Feedback, Imput, Questions, Thoughts, Flames welcome.

Sable
xoxo

You may be on to something.  The hologram has been tried on the California Drivers license.  After California spent millions devising this license with the hologram, Ed Bradley from the "60 Minutes" TV show purchased a fake driver's license and social security card on Olivera Street in Los Angeles for $50.  The driver's license was good enough that without verifying the number and encoding on the magnetic strip a cop would not know the difference.

"I think it would also be a good idea if the gentleman's "HANDLE" from the boards and a description (Height: 6', Age: 39, Hair Color: blonde...etc) was included on the CARD."

I was under the impression that the whole point of handles was so guys could post honestly without providers indentifying them? I know in my case there is no mystery to who I am because my email address and handle are the same (I see no need to hide...and having the handle / email address hides my identity adequately from those OUTSIDE the "hobby") and I know some guys hae become LEGENDARY with reviews numbering in the dozens, and apparently are well known to providers, but I still think most casual clients would prefer to not be known by their handle.

Other than that, I think your plan sounds pretty well thought out, especally for 2am...though we need to ABSOLUTLY find something ELSE for you to do when you can't sleep... :^) Maybe I'll email you my phone number...we can just..you know...chat.  :^)

BTW....

"I had to fax a copy of my real I.D. to one of the escort ad sites I advertise on"

You mean there is someplace else besides YOUR webpage where I can gaze upon pictures of your FIONE AZZ and you didn't tell me?  I am hurt...I thought we had developed a "special" relationship....

"SCREENING & REFERENCES" Great Ideal hon

We all know everyone love you here. I am gain for the screening process idea and hope TER look into the idea also.

Another thing is that there are top honest provider here that would give references for clients. Speaking for myself I could create a reference data base on my homepage.

WWW.performanceperfe.com (which is under construction at the moment because of ftp error) Add my client screen name only by their choice  where anyone could go to my Client VERIFICATION rating page and see a 1,2,3,4,5 star. *  ** *** ***** ******  beside there name.

Nothing else need to be verified. The client will approve of me giving additional references info if requested by a provider.  

Whenever someone ask me for a reference I will email the client and verify first before I send out any info on that client.  Which is usually a short brief statement saying-Yes he was a client of mines and followed through as planned?  Nothing else. Also email the provider/client with the same email sent to both.







-- Modified on 4/21/2002 8:33:11 AM

Yes, we "have" developed a special relationship (you know I want you!) :0) The other place I advertise is www.eros-lasvegas.com. :0)~  I'm sure the folks on the board are thinking to themselves..."Geesh, get a room already!" LOL! My email is on my website...I'd love to hear from you!

You said: I was under the impression that the whole point of handles was so guys could post honestly without providers indentifying them? I know in my case there is no mystery to who I am because my email address and handle are the same (I see no need to hide...and having the handle / email address hides my identity adequately from those OUTSIDE the "hobby") and I know some guys hae become LEGENDARY with reviews numbering in the dozens, and apparently are well known to providers, but I still think most casual clients would prefer to not be known by their handle.

Good point...you are right. The whole point is for the client's information to remain anonymous to the provider, but be on file with a trusted third party.




-- Modified on 4/21/2002 10:30:05 AM

Hello Sweetie! :0)

You said: We all know everyone love you here.
Answer: LOVE YOU TOO! I like to read your posts! :0)

You said: Speaking for myself I could create a reference data base on my homepage.

Answer: The whole point is to take the screening and verification duties "out of the providers hands" and give it to a trusted third party.

A lot of gentleman are having trouble with providers who are misuing their personal information...you are right, there are many HONEST providers who would never do this, but unfortunately there are DISHONEST providers who are F**ing it up for everybody.

I think the gentleman (and ladies) would be more comfortable if the info was in the hands of a trusted third party.

Also you spoke of a client rating. I dont think the clients necessarily need to be "rated", just verified. The point of having a "Provider" enter him into the database is the same as having a provider give him a reference...if he saw her and had a "full" appointment chances are REAL GOOD he is not LE (or a psycho...he did not beat her up, rape or rob her...he probably wont do it to others, and if he does beat her up, rape or rob her the girl can get his info (but only in an emergency) and pursue him legally for whatever it is he did.

ps. You have a new website coming out? COOL! I cant wait to see it! :0)

Check out RS2000's web site.
http://www.roomservice2000.com/welcome.htm

They run a tight ship from my experience.  They charge the hobbyist 50.00 (lifetime) for reference verification.

I don't work for RS2000 by the way, just passing on info.

Hugs Misty

-- Modified on 4/21/2002 10:21:14 AM

LOL I had one here actually call the client after I called for a reference.  How tacky  LOL.  When I tried to explain that wasn't cool, of course she was offended, but c'mon.... This is a hobby right?  

New girls tend to get a big head when they enter this realm (understandable) we all get to be "flavor of the month" LOL. It takes time for new ladies to understand there's are tons of different experiences out there and everyone is special in their own right.  

This is also why I prefer to call an agency or an experienced provider for references.  

Regarding a database that providers have access to.  A friend of mine stopped putting her clients into a database such as this when she found out one of the providers was using it for marketing purposes LOL.  It only takes one bad egg to ruin good intentions.

Regarding:  ...a database that providers have access to.  A friend of mine stopped putting her clients into a database such as this when she found out one of the providers was using it for marketing purposes LOL.  

Answer: The database would ONLY have the gentleman's "User ID" number (No name, phone number or email address)...The girls will just be looking up the number...providers couldnt contact the guy to try to drum up business. That is the whole purpose of putting the information in the hands of a trusted third party. And like you said: When I tried to explain that wasn't cool, of course she was offended, but c'mon.... This is a hobby right?  

Yup! :0)

ps.

1. ONLY the ladies would have access to the database, so guys couldnt skim the board, pick a User ID number and pretend to be that person. They would "HAVE" to have a user ID to know the number.

Also you could "change up" the numbers so that they couldnt be figured out. An example would be: Credit Cards are probably fairly easy to fake...they "start with a certain amount of numbers"....and are 16 numbers long...a patient person can play with the numbers until they get a "valid" one. Also, one of the few smart things that the Vital Statistics Office and the DMV (in every state) did CORRECTLY was have DIFFERENT Birth Certificates and Drivers Licenses/State ID's for every State.  One of the reasons a Birth Certificate or Driver's License from a State "other" than the one you live in is a little harder to fake is that you have to actually know what that Birth Certificate or ID looks like. That is why I am violently oppossed to a "National ID". If the National ID is going to be uniform for every State, then the "forgers" are going to have a field day. Think about it, Forgers would only have ONE ID to forge (and they would know what it looks like becasue they would own one no matter what State they lived in)...counterfeit National ID's would be on the market inside of a month.

We would "Change Up" up the Numbers (i.e: New York would have 8 numbers and two letters, Dallas would have three letters and 16 numbers, etc) you would have to actually have seen a card for that state to know what the numbers look like (and make the ID Numbers not so obvious)e.g: California would be: BF0028374665-219 Instead of CA0028374665-219)  

2. The "Verifcation Card" would have their photo on it (From Driver's Licens) so if his Verifcation Card shows a 40 year old  man with red hair who is 5'7" 150 lbs., and a 21 year old with brown hair who is 6'4" shows up...you know he stole (or "found") the card.

I dont think the guys can take exception to having their photo on the card...some credit card companies have your photo on them, The girl is going to see who you are ANYWAY, he doesnt want someoneelse using his card...so put your photo on it.

3. The Verification Card wouldnt say "For Escort Verification Purposes"...lol :0)  Not unlike Sydney Biddle Barrows' (The Mayflower Madam) escort service, the ONLY name that would appear on the card is the name of the "company" that is doing the verification for all of us...in the case of the Mayflower Madam the company name "CATCHET". No one really knew what that was. It would all be very DISCREET.



-- Modified on 4/21/2002 10:52:20 AM

-- Modified on 4/21/2002 11:05:01 AM

-- Modified on 4/21/2002 11:09:52 AM

Hi Sweetsable,

Thank you for the reply. You are right, After reading the other posting i see the point now re: providers using  client information for marketing purposes. I did not mean for my reply to be directed as a marketing tool for myself. A lot of my client have mention not dealinig with a third party and that is why the thought came up after reading your idea.

Remember I am new and learning the do's and don't from people like yourself that is more experience and know's the in and out of this business.

I really appreciate the reply to my posting. Very valuable infomation you gave. You are the greatest..As i mention before...Everybody love you....I can't wait until we actually meet.

Your sister in the biz











-- Modified on 4/21/2002 11:19:57 AM

-- Modified on 4/21/2002 11:21:12 AM

Hi Sable,

You've obviously put a lot of thought into this issue which is an ongoing bone of contention for a great many people.  Your suggestions also have a great deal of merit in many ways.  But having said that, I think I must respectfully disagree with the concept as you have outlined it for one very important reason.

I really doubt such a database can be protected against those who might use it for other motives.  LE is one example, but there are others.  Once something new is created, while it might at first be effective, those with adgendas manage to find a way of defeating it.  I could probably cite many examples of this, but maybe simply mentioning both home & auto security systems will suffice.  

I don't think I'm being paranoid about this, but I would not feel comfortable with my personal information being accessable that way.  I would not contribute to it.  If that means I am unable to see certain ladies, so be it.  Yes, there are presently ladies who require things in their screening process that I am also unwilling to provide (was once asked for a copy of my tax returns for example).  I don't quarrel with their requirements, I just move on.  And while I'm sure others have run into various problems with provider references, I have not on the few occasions I've been asked for them.  

A final comment....I am perhaps guessing, but I doubt that all clients would want their handles exposed.  TER began allowing  separate handles to be used for reviews & postings at the specific request of a great many guys.  I don't personally use separate hanldles myself, but I do want to have the choice each time whether or not I review my handle to someone.

Things I've thought of....
1) Giving each client whom I see and know is safe, a code word... some word they can use when they contact me again, so that I know I've seen them, even if it's been months and months down the road. That can be a problem for me, I do not save emails or ANY info, and often I have someone contact me several months down the road only to have me ask for screening info again... you'd think that would reassure them, but I promise you they do NOT like to hear that.

2) Because of that problem I've also thought of writing email addy's and first names of clients I know to be safe, down in code... but, too many problems. First of all I do not have the time or energy to be a high level secretary like that. Second of all I'd probably forget my own code. (I AM a blonde, after all) Third of all anything *I* could think up, someone else could probably figure out.  

Now my thoughts on what YOU'VE thought up are... gawd how I wish I could trust in a system like that. There are so SO many loopholes, things that are impossible to protect or ensure 100% of the time, that I don't think I'd ever EVER feel comfortable entrusting my safety to some "impartial third party."  I'm not impartial to myself, can't be by definition.  Just like people already abuse the systems we have in place, they would abuse any system implemented in future.  I think you are well intentioned and I am not saying that we shouldn't try to think up something like this that COULD work... but I hear bad things about the verification services that are already out there, and I'm darned if I know if I personally could ever bring myself to trust another one. Just like I shoot down my own ideas that I've had about trying to make things easier for my own clients, I look at the other ideas I see pop up with the same critical eye.... but I DO very much appreciate your intentions of trying to make things easier for both sides of the equation!

Hugs*
Nicole

So lets get rid of the Credit Cards, Library Cards, Checks,...lets get rid of just about EVERYTHING because they dont work either.

Credit Cards can be stolen and used. Someone can assume your identity, sign up for a Credit Card in your name...Spend spend spend till there's no tomorrow, and F*CK up your credit for years until you get it all straightened out. Credit Cards dont work! All of you...TURN IN YOUR CREDIT CARDS NOW! The system is flawed!

And those snotty nosed little kids...who the hell thought to give them access to a Library Card? Books get "lost" and never returned...so the system doesnt work right? Kids (and grown ups) forget to turn the books in on time (if ever), they leave them in their lockers, on the school bus...the parents have to pay the late fees! Sure the kids are enriched by the experience of reading a book, but My Gawd this must be stopped!

And the BANKS...Close them all down now! They get robbed for Gawds sake! They KNOW that people write bad checks and checks get stolen from mailboxes and used. Cant they stop that? Why do they even bother???? NO MORE CHECKS! Checking must be banned!

Rapist's and Pedophiles get off on "Technicalities"... and we  put "innocent" people in jail (and sometimes execute them) should the justice system be done away with? We have "dirty" cops, should we get rid of law enforcement?

No matter how you look at it, almost EVERY system is flawed. Know of a system that is perfect? I'd love to find out what it is. No matter how flawed these systems are they are still the best in the world.

I'm sure you can think of other "systems" that suck but we use them anyway. Hey, "Reviews" are not perfect either but we use them anyway right? How many threads are there of gentlemen complaining that the ratings on reviews were incorrect, or the ladies complaning that gentlemen wrote about services that she does not provide?

COME ON PEOPLE WORK WITH ME HERE! :0) LOL!!!!!!!! No system is perfect.

"THINK"...A better system is going to benefit us both!

If you read through ALL the posts above you can read the "adjustments" that others have made to the original thought.

But again, I'm TOTALLY willing to admit that this may NOT be the answer...but at least I'm trying to come up with one.

Sable





-- Modified on 4/21/2002 5:34:18 PM

-- Modified on 4/21/2002 7:13:46 PM

After quite a bit of LE action here in Minnesota, I decided to get my act together.  
I found Pretty Good Privacy (PGP), which Mcafee.com has acquired and sells for about $100.  Cheap considering the peace of mind you get from it.

It scrambles not only your computer information, but allows for scrambled emails back and forth with "keys".

Now, if someone gets ahold of my computer, my sensitive information would cost many hours of time to descramble.  I'm sure there are others out there.
 
If you want further information, please feel free to email me at [email protected].  I'd be more than happy to help.  

Hugs
Misty

But from all I've heard, PGP is available FREE... McAffee.com has a GREAT virus scan that I love, but almost everything else on their site is a complete ripoff, methinks!I had a client give it to me. The only prob with it I see is that to encrypt EACH email that comes in or goes out, the people you are sending mail to need to have PGP installed also, and I honestly can't see telling everyone who contacts me to do that. Plus they have to have your key to access your encrypted email, which essentially means the key winds up being "public" info that others can access.

I could be wrong tho and I welcome anyone to correct me if these are misconceptions! I am hardly a computer security guru. I do have DriveCrypt but it's been easier for me to simply delete EVERYTHING, then it has for me to save anything and encrypt it.  Old emails, COULD I suppose, still be accessible, but they'd have to get a court order to get it from my mail server... and I don't know if they would be willing to go that far unless I committed a felony or something.  Of course I never break the law anyways

Hehe!
Hugs*
Nicole

Big hug to you girl! 'Cuz I am here to tell you that I sincerely appreciate your effort to come up with a solution instead of joining in with the general complaining about various screening that's been running rampant lately. THANK you!

Hugs*
Nicole

"was once asked for a copy of my tax returns for example"

Oh f*uck that!! Are guys REALLY that hard up that they would comply? My goodness...desperation is a terrible thing...

Did she say she only want to view them (AND DAYUM QUICKLY for that matter) or was she looking to keep a copy? I mean...your home address, social security number, account numbers for investments, TONS of information are on your tax return.

No way...no way...I don't care WHAT she looked like, or WHAT type of lay she was...

I don't know who are the bigger fools...her for asking, or the guys who obviously have complied in the past.

-- Modified on 4/22/2002 11:13:36 AM

Whether or not anyone else was fool enough to comply I have no idea.  I assume there may have been previously only because of the matter-of-fact way in which she broached the issue.  I really could care less what she wanted to do with them...she wasn't about to get as much as a sneak peek at even the first page!  I politely ended the conversation immediately after she brought it up.  

I did preface the statement you quoted from my post by saying it was something I was unwilling to provide.  I'm only posting this in case anyone may have misread what I had said.

just like the recent (03/12/02) "famous" poster from Tampa (and DC).  He gave them his hotmail account password as well as his membership passwords...so why not his verification card?

The LE would have the pass card to bust all the other ladies.  And no one would be the wiser until someone squealed.

I'm sorry sweetie...but I think it is a VERY bad idea (the idea, not you).  But I do have to commend you are your well thought out plan...especially at 2am!  

Stay Safe everyone!

I can't imagine the purpose of asking for that. Taxes, like death, are unavoidable, and even psychos and cops have to pay them, so what possible use could they be? I agree that it is far too invasive, and useless for our purposes!

Hugs*
Nicole

Asymmetric cryptography is also called public-key cryptography. It was developed in the mid-1970s. It uses different keys for encryption and decryption. Each participant actually has two keys. The public key is published, is freely available to anyone, and is used for encryption; the private key is held in secrecy by the user and is used for decryption. Because the two keys are inverses, knowledge of the public key enables the derivation of the private key in theory. However, in a well-designed public-key system, it is computationally infeasible in any reasonable length of time to derive the private key from knowledge of the public key.

-- Modified on 4/23/2002 7:27:29 PM

Now my head hurts. =:O

I didn't GET that... but does it mean that even if someone else doesn't have PGP installed, they can still read your mail? Methinks no... but, maybe try that one in english? hehe! God I love techies! Hey baby, how big is your hard drive?

Hugs*
Nicole

You are correct. Both the sending and receiving parties must have PGP.

If someone with PGP wants you to send him (or her) an encrypted message he (or she) must give you his (or her) public key. You use the public key that the receiver gives you to encrypt the message.

Because public keys can only be used to encrypt messages they can be distributed via e-mail and other insecure methods. It does not matter who gets hold of the public key. It isn't of any use to them in reading messages you have sent. The receiver decrypts the message using a second key. This key (the private key) must be kept secret.

Bottom line is that PGP is only useful if the person you want to send a message to also has the program. Not only that but I would expect that sending messages to a list of people would be a real pain because the message has to be encrypted with a different public key for each receiver. I haven't seen the software, however, and it is possible that it does this automatically once an association has been made between an e-mail address and the key to be used with that address.

It's certainly a good thing that none of us ladies engage in any illegal activities and only sell our time and companionship.   Hehe! Thank you for explaining in English!

Hugs*
Nicole

Given all of the issues involved, and all of the risks in providing, I am open for any sort of screening required.

Wanna call my secretary to verify my employment?  Go right ahead.

Easy for me to say, I suppose, since I am single and everyone at my job knows I am, uh, iconoclastic.  Maybe a punter with a wife and two young kids would have a different attitude.  Maybe a punter with a wife and two young kids shouldn't be punting.

MAYBE, there is a direct correlation between a client's reluctance to provide enough information for a screen and whether or not he has the ethical right to be punting at all.

Sorry, Providers.  I know this point of view cuts down on your potential client base, but if you insist (as you have every right to insist) on screening, then you have to accept that this process by its very nature eliminates potential clients who should not be punting.

GOD, I love economics.

The general idea is good.  But a better approach might be for a third-party entity to process the verification of both clients and providers, and then when approved, issue a revolving PIN number to both. The database could be encrypted so LE could not confiscate it. Also, all on-line traffic would be exchanged in an encrypted mode, verisign signature. When a client requests an appointment, they use a username that is associated with the PIN number in the database. The provider can submit the username of the client and her pin number, in encrypted mode, to the database for verification of the client.  When the two meet, both can go on-line or dial a phone number and enter their usernames by voice, voice match verified, then they would both enter their respective pin numbers.  If all match, they are given an OK validation.  This also insures that the provider you requested is the provider standing in front of you. The pin number would change every month or two so if LE got a hold of it, it would have very limited time for use, and with the voice verification required, misuse would signal the verification service and provider that something is wrong and get a NO GO notice. Additionally, if LE obtains a provider’s number and tries to setup a sting to catch clients, it too would give a NO GO notice when the pin number expires, voice does not match, or a report by a provider of loss her pin number is given to the service.

For the client and provider to receive his/her new PIN number each month, he/she would call on the phone, put in his/her current pin number and voice username, the service would randomly issue a new pin number. If by On-line, the client and provider would enter his current pin number and the system would verify the IP address of the client/provider against it database or by an additional password with his/her username. Once verified, it would issue a random pin number.

A provider would be verified by some personal information, references by other current verified providers of the service and/or a minimum of two verified hobbyists reviews posted at TER.

Random re-verification would occur for both clients and providers to keep things honest and keep LE off balance.

This eliminates the need for a card that may be difficult to explain to a SO.  Photos could be maintained on the service site and only accessible by a hobbyist or provider by entering their username and password and then enter the username given by the hobbyist or provider. It is not 100% protective, but I would assume a 99.9% rate of security.

Sounds like a potential business opportunity.  Would hobbyist and providers be interested and at what price would it be of value?  Give me some input.