In my mind I see a group of jovial men in suits, cocktails in hand, sitting in dark leather armchairs speckled with brass nails around a low walnut stained table in a dark, panelled bar, a boys' club if you will.  

They start out talking business but as the evening wears on, the subject turns to girls and ribbing each other, laughing and dropping the occasional crude guy joke commences.  Competitively comparing girls -- paid for or not -- but only skirting around actual events, never being too graphic.  

However, it is my understanding that men involved in this hobby generally keep things under wraps for fear of the unfair speculation that he must 'pay for it' when all men know what a pain in the ass it can be to find a girl, especially when you are attached or working yourself to the bone.  

Do you tell your buddies?  If not, why?  If you do tell, what type of reaction do you receive?

Kate Bishop

-- Modified on 4/6/2006 9:06:23 PM

Reo You Kiss and Tell?

Kate,

Real gentlemen would never impugn a ladies honor by kissing and telling. And a confident gentleman doesn't need to brag. They just take quiet satisfaction in sharing delightfully intimate times with lovely and loving ladies. (No I am not into tongue twisters).

Yours,

M

which is why I am asking.  

Kate

Reo You Kiss and Tell?

All I generally say is, "Yeah, I saw so-and-so. She loves me" and I let it go at that.

The guys never believe me, of course.

I never discuss intimate details with other guys no matter how close a friend he may be.  In fact, I would wager that women, as a general rule, discuss intimate details with one another much more often than men do.

Reo You Kiss and Tell?

Been there, mostly married men and idle talk of what we are or not doing at home, what we would like to do to whom.  Alot of fun, kidding around, serious ribbing, some fairly graphic/some not. No one has ever admitted to having a girlfriend outside marriage or currently using escort. Alot of when we were single stories.  Stories told are taken with grain of salt. We have a pretty tight group, we do talk/kid about preferences, frequency, performance, etc, never really knowing what is real or made up. I know I will not share my actual activities. Its not the speculation  of having to pay for it, rather than this is an area where keeping my own council limits possibility of gossip or round about info getting home, which has not happened to any of us, but better safe! Being a member here at TER seems to satisfy any need to share.

Reo You Kiss and Tell?

Depending upon the guy I'm talking to and also depending upon the lady I'm talking about,sometimes I'll let him know about my seeing a particular escort.Especially if I think he'd be interested in meeting her himself.I generally think most guys have "paid for it" in some fashion at one time or another....some say they haven't or they don't and in general,they are full of sh*t! If it's a girl he wishes to meet and he asks "does she do this or does she do that?" then yes,I will kiss and tell.But not if he's just looking to hear a dirty story.Also,I'm closer to some escorts than others......those ladies I won't kiss and tell about no matter what since they're more like friends or girlfriends to me.....unless they tell me to talk about them to others to get more business.

Reo You Kiss and Tell?

I only discuss intimate details in TER reviews.I don't go to bars for fear of a beer belly....

-- Modified on 4/7/2006 4:49:57 AM

Reo You Kiss and Tell?

I share generalities with a couple buddies who are also hobbyists, but never graphic details. I'm not hung-up on the "gotta pay for it" stigma, either - I'm somply an enthusiastic consumer of a wonderful commodity.

The only things that could happen from telling about experiences with escorts are all bad. Having friends think you have to pay for it is the least -- hell, as old, fat and butt-ugly as I am they KNOW if I'm getting any its because I'm paying for it!!!

Telling someone else only increases the probability that family, friends and employers will find out.

Come to think of it I have told one friend/coworker, but he and I have gone together to so many strip clubs, etc while traveling that it was pretty much common knowledge between us.Its like the joke abot the missionary in an African village where an albino baby is born to alocal girl. Trying to explain genetics to the irate vilage chief, who is about to kill him, the missionary spots a black sheep in an otherwise all white flock. "How do think that happened, chief?" The chief lowers his spear and says "Alright, you no tell on me, I no tell on you."

-- Modified on 4/7/2006 5:53:22 AM

how much she was writhing in ecxtasy, no ecxtacy, make that extasy -- Fuck it, pleasure -- and complimenting us on our DATY skills, when in fact she was filing her fingernails and trying to remember what she was supposed t pick up on the drive home, there is little risk she'll bother to correct the record.

all about the crazy boyfriend relationships she has.  I've know her for about 15 years now, so I'm like a confidant.  In exchange, I tell her about the inner workings of the life I had with  my ex, but I never talk about other providers, at least not with any intimate details, and she does likewise.

I never thought about it, but it speaks volumes about what we consider important and what we don't, and the lessons are rather counterintuitive.

It doesn't come up in any detail with any of my friends, and anyone who did bring it up would be treated as a loose cannon.  Frat boys might tell stories about their conquests, but not the grownups.

The closest I've ever come to anything like that was when I was on a business trip with several coworkers, and I was having a drink with one of them.  A lady came into the hotel bar who was a dead ringer for Carrie-Anne Moss, and we exchanged a few comments about how close to absolutely perfect she was, and how wonderful it would be to bring her back to a private hotel room.  We stopped at that, though, and the conversation went in another direction.

There's also the leverage that talking about it would give to someone else.  Many of us are discreet for a reason, and the best way to keep a secret is to not talk about it under any circumstances.  Anonymous forums are a decent second-place solution, although they have their own issues.

In general, I don't discuss anything explicit about my sex life with my friends, and I don't really want to hear about theirs, either.  I don't talk about who I've been with, and I don't expect them to do so either.  I don't talk about the contents of my porn collection, and I don't go checking out the computers of my friends when I go visit them.  I expect them to make some minimal effort to keep their erotic lives private, and I respect the boundaries that get created to do so.  I see any moves to cross those boundaries as highly intrusive, so I don't do it, and I expect the same from them.

I regretted it because it came back to bite me when I finally married the woman. lol To many, knew to many details.

The worst part is that I only related my story out of some sort of insecurity and lack of self confidence. Even writing my reviews here I felt a twinge of self doubt as I was writing them.

Its funny, but I rarely share other great pleasures in my life either. Maybe I need to think on that... lol

I had the most amazing bowl of popcorn last night while watching CSI.... Hmmmmm it just doesnt sound much like me.

As I have written here before, I am divorced.  Had tried the "straight" life... was very faithful to what turned out to be an unfaithful wife.  Divorced now, and am older with two young children.  I am not interested in a serious relationship... only casual.  I do become very attracted to some ladies, but in my case, I let the big head, and my kids' schedules rule the degree to which I "engage."

What does this mean?  This hobby is almost tailored to my needs right now.  I truly like a lot of the women that I frequent and the ladies on this board are just that, ladies.  Would, were I to meet them, with my head in a different place right now, want to take any of them home to Mommy (or in my case, worse, a discerning 9-year old daughter who is tougher than Mom ever is or was)?  Absolutely.  I have no problem with most of the ladies that I have met or who have posted on this board...  but that is NOT where my head is now.

So that is my position, now to the question- kiss and tell.  Well, I do post reviews - and had posted reviews under another name on this board.  Why?  to pay back the hobby that has taught me so much - about me and life in general.

Do I boast to my non-hobby friends... I think that is the question.  yes or no.

As described above -- I am not in a search and acquire (an SO, wife, girlfriend) mode... more a sample and move on mode...  but during conversation, some have asked about my "private life"  - and I get kidded about not having an SO.  My comment, "kids take all my time" only goes so far.  One of my friends though, has seen some of the strippers that I date... he assumes a lot.... and he projects a lot of things that actually don't happen, but I am pretty quiet... about everything... so the speculation continues...

if I say anything - then I say, well, I really do not see anyone, but let me tell you about... and I tell about some of my experiences with the weird psychotic civie dates I have had.  But about the ladies of this hobby and what we do behind closed doors... nope. off limits except in the anonymous writs of TER.  You see, if I am with a lady, the courtesies of the date have no time limit and talking directly about who I did what with, well that is just no ones business. I do have one friend who has seen me with some of my stripper friends.  He is still in recovery, and is expected to come out of the coma soon! lol  (those that meet me are struck by the fact that I am not out of the ordinary... kinda bland and boring in real life)

What TER does, is sort of keep the privacy, while allowing some disclosure... Is it possible for the men to remain completely unknown with resepct to this hobby - I do not think so - just because there are women out there who have seen him.  But because of the nature of acquiring clients- the ladies are more public.  So is it possible for them to go into annonymity?  I believe so... as I have seen one so do.  

So, I keep my musings with most of my friends confined to movie stars, and random nice looking women walking by on the street.  



-- Modified on 4/7/2006 8:58:37 AM

Mostly it depends upon my relationship with the lady involved.  Much more so than my relationship with the men in the other arm chairs.

There are some Ladies who have become real friends; They have let me into their lives and I have let them into mine.  I do talk about my friendships with those ladies, I have taken some of them to work and personal events and gladly introduced them as my friends by their real names.

I would never talk about them in terms of their work, nor would I mention them with their work names.  In neither even do I get into any erotic details, or even if anything erotic did or did not happen.  I wouldn’t do that with a lady outside this business so why would I teat the ladies here any differently?

And it says a lot about the relationship with the Lady.

I have several friends among the Ladies I know.  Two of them are my closest confidants for almost everything in my life.  People I can talk with, trust, be open with.  Not how I would have expected things to turn out, but then I have been very fortunate with the ladies i have met, so many are great people.

I have yet to find a friend that I can share my sexual experiences and thoughts with. My wife whom I love and share almost all else with views my ideas as over the top. She certainly does not approve of my finding pleasure with other women. My friends both male and female view polyamory as un-acceptable even if they themselves have had affairs. So I am left on occasion finding a courtesan that understands and is willing to listen for a while.

If I am out with someone - anyone - date, escort friend, business associate whatever.  and they are rude, inconsiderate, obnoxious, mean spirited or otherwise looney tunes....  well, they are not, in that case a lady, and do not qualify for the consideration that I would provide any lady.  They become an amusing anecdote.  

And now let me tell you about..... lol!

I keep this part of my life to myself.  My feeling is anything you say can and will be used against you in court (in this case, divorce court).  

Crowroyal

That seems to be the way it is most places, at least in "polite" society.  Some men, especially younger, like to boast about their sexual exploits as a kind of status symbol.  But those who are more advanced tend to treat the subject of sex much like religion or art.  Some things are just not meant to be said.

I rarely ever talk about sexual experiences with any of my friends.  I just don't really feel the need.

Reo You Kiss and Tell?

No. Lots of frowns and no understanding. TER provides the outlet for talk.(EOM)

Of course we talk.  Why, I was in the bar of the Cosmos Club in DC not long ago, awaiting my publisher, Clare, when I overheard from over my left shoulder:

  "She was a bit shy at first, you know, with the Audrey Hepburn non-plussedness, but she warmed up when I took my socks off."
   "Ho! Ho! Old man!  So that got her going?  How about the bottom line?"
   "Sweet and fruity, as you might expect at that age, but lingering on that palate, as you might expect at that price.  With an excellent finish.  And she even gave me a foot massage when it was over."
   "Excellent, you disgusting lech."
   "But how of you, you dirty anal old man.  Still keeping that spreadsheet of your exploits and that Ming vase full of the stolen panties?"
    "Be quiet, Chipster. There might be someone civilized in this place.  Actually, I've been slumming.  Down into the two digits.  Had Monroe drive me around last night until I could pick up some company, and then we cruised the Mall while she performed oral ministrations."
    "Ho!  Nothing like letting the top off the old impulse control valve, now is there!  I'll drink to that one!  How was she?"
    "Dammit, that was the problem!  She finished me off, we pulled to the corner, she kissed my cheek and said 'Next time you'll have to suck my cock.'"

Around my 25th birthday I was in Vegas eating at Le Cirque and sitting next to a table with two men and one woman.  One man was young, quiet, possibly the other man's son or something of an assistant.  The older man was big, boisterous and Texan.  The woman was an escort -- I knew by their conversation.  The older man and the escort were drinking and their personal conversations made their way to our table.  My dining partner and I hardly spoke, we were enthralled by our neighbors' conversation.  At the end of dinner, we were offered free dessert as our waiter felt badly about it, having heard their X-rated conversations himself.  Of course, we took him up on dessert though we were not one bit irritated.

I got to thinking about that weekend and that's what got me wondering.  The older man seemed like the type to kiss and tell.

Kate

...in some form or another.  Whether she is an escort or civie, there is no such thing as "free pussy", so YES, ALL guys have "paid for it".

Two responses:

Sweetie, you've left out the best part:  just what were they saying???

Two: Is it possible that they were deliberately doing it as an act of exhibitionism?  I once took my girlfriend to a Valentine's day dinner and a couple of tables over, and on an upper level of the restaurant (so that we could see under their table), a couple was madly making out; their frolic ascended to her slipping her hand down his pants, followed, at dessert, with his hand down her skirt, and her splayed out on the banquette like an unflipped omelette.  I have to think that the main point was not doing it, but being watched doing it.

But then, I always have two responses.

First, let's start with the common understanding that humans communicate, and people love to both hear and tell stories.

From there, let's attribute the old Texan's loud indiscretion more to being Texan than to being old. (Of course maybe he was just trying to prove to the young man that he still had memories of what it takes...

When I was a young man (I'm not yet fifty) I was fortunate to have some fantastic se3nsual experiences. I have one friend of 30 years who I'll tell these stories to. He married young and early and was, shall we say, deprived of such experience. He is enthralled. For him it's like reading one from a collection of short stories, but it's real and he can ask question.

I have another friend of 15 years who had his own set of experiences with whom I exchange stories. For us it's reliving the old days of youth and freedom from responsibility.

The best lesson I ever got in K&T discretion was when I was in my early 30s and... Ah well, while he has passed away she has not so I'm afraid I cannot pass on this particular story.

All the best,

Le Vieux Foque