Recently one of my ATFs and I were having a spirited session when I entered the wrong air space. Though she flinched, she did not protest as I continued to the point of no return. She "got off" as much as I did, but by the end of the session, she was crying and would not speak to me. Since this was her personal residence, I gathered my things and apologetically left without saying much. We talked the next day and she seemed okay. It's been a week, but now she won't return my phone calls. Ladies, what shall I do?

Once trust is broken, it’s almost impossible to regain. If that were not the case we would be telling everyone (yes, eveyone) what we did. You should write a note of apology, but don’t expect to see her again. You blew it. It’s now time to find another person to blow it in.

You should probably stop calling her.  It was obviously a very unpleasant experience for her.  She'll let you know if she wants to hear from you again.  Remember, an apology is just words, and money doesn't repair emotional scars.

You say she "got off" as much as you did, yet you further state:

1) she was crying
2) would not speak to you
3) won't return your phone calls

I'd say she didn't "get off". Sounds like because she didn't protest you assumed it was ok to finish but that it was definitely NOT ok with her. Since this is your ATF and you're obviously distressed about what happened, send her something expensive and thoughtful along with a heartfelt apology and if you are lucky enough to see her again, don't put her in that position (literally and figuratively) again.

Considering she was an ATF I would have thought you knew the "rules" or had at least discussed them.

It's just common decency to at least warn her that you are interested in anal sex before you plunge in, she may not want to.

Once again, we have a story of a guy not thinking about his partner, just doing what he wants.

Well, you may have just lost an ATF, too bad for you.
Good for her.

And remember this, any sex without permission is RAPE.

Just my opinion...
B

First, NEVER, and I do mean NEVER, force or guilt anyone into anything they don't want to do.  The fact that she "flinched" should have been your first and ONLY necessary warning. You should have immediately stopped, talked it over, and then proceeded with whatever the two of you agreed upon.

On the other hand, I am detecting a rather disturbing "trend" amongst providers and SOs that goes something like this.

"A man (hobbyst or SO) pokes the wrong opening (either intentionally or unintentionally) durng intercourse with a woman (provider or SO).  The woman allows the man to continue with little or no protest, often times indicating pleasure after the initial (verbal or non-verbal) protest.  After the deed is done, the woman blames the man for not respecting her limits and all hell proceeds to come down on his head"

Ladies, the time to strike is while the iron is hot (or the pud is poking you initially).  If you don't want any back door action, DON'T PUT UP WITH IT.  Make your point at the time of the initial poking, not after the deed is done.

I sometimes think that women are looking for excuses to make men out to be animals.  This may not be the case in most instances, but I am seeing a frequent number of "I'll let him proceed and give him shit after the fact" occurrances being reported.

Just my opinion and I could be wrong.
Loarthan.

PS: Thanks to the person that found the typo.  Regards and a tip of the hat.



-- Modified on 7/2/2004 7:01:39 AM

However, I do not think all women are like this and certainly not looking to bash men, but I understand your frustrations.

Hugs,
Ciara

L-

I think you meant to say DO NOT in paragraph 4!!

BTW,
I concurr with your sentiment.

how did that work exactly?  If I get near the wrong airspace I get all kinds of alarms going off.  Sometimes it seems like the AWACS is right there and CAP is on me.

and a "got off"?  Are you SURE?  Few women shed tears after enjoying themselves...?

Like I said "accidentally in Love" is a cute Shrek Tune.  "Accidentally in your ass"-? well, I never heard of it.  Should be an exculsive club...

I wouldn't even attempt greek without lots and lots of
lube being applied first.  

Guys that aren't sure about why this is necessary
should have a large dildo inserted in their behind
without lube.

My friend it takes a long time to build a good reputation but only a second to ruin it as you did.

In many states it is rape if the person on the receiving end does not say 'yes' and is capable of saying yes.  So the excuse, "Well she didn't say no." will not hold up in court.

This is why Kobe B. just might end up in jail.

Got some sleepless nights, huh. Try apologize with all your heart. Salvations are there for you.

Thanks for the posts both positive and negative. She called me today and I took off work early and we just finished a nice dinner. Unlike some of you, I do not push the 'hate' button when someone is earnestly seeking advice. Though out of our normal routine, we 'experiment' quite liberally during our sessions so lube was not the problem nor was it an issue of a first time. She told me that she has never gone there with someone who was not her SO or former husband, since I am technically neither, she felt a little guilty for not stopping and just didn't have the words to explain how she was feeling at the time. So for all of you who rushed to judgement, go suck an egg. For the genuine and heartfelt expressions that some of you tendered, I say thank you. Sometimes, in the course of human relationships it can be hard to fathom that some people have certain reactions. Taking her to that place and in that way while upsetting, made us even better friends. So time does heal most things. We are planning a long session for Saturday that just might include...

As some people here said, I don't think she 'got off' (that's your point of view) ... more like she's really really 'pissed off'.  She cried because it was painful as hell. That's the logical explanation.

The judgment was based solely on the information supply in your first Post, which gave the distinct impression that the Provider felt violated by your action.  You did not mention critical information such as “Though out of our normal routine, we 'experiment' quite liberally during our sessions so lube was not the problem nor was it an issue of a first time.” The responses may have been different had you included this statement in your original post. Finally is telling us to “go suck an egg” a typical response of one who “does not push the 'hate' button”?

"flamed" you could only respond to the original post... There was not enough information to let anyone know which way to take this!  (It's kind of the nature of "web" communication to abbreviate information-giving...  A shame.)  Of course they should've asked questions to get more info out of you, but I think the natural instincts of an experienced hobby-est is to jump in and speak for the lady without trying to see both sides...(protect our most precious adventurers from "evil-doers")
 Seriously, after reading your original post I thought you were talking about Farting (until I got to the crying part...and even then I thought it was tears of laughter.  It wasn't until you "gathered your belongings" that I finally "got" what you were talking about.)
So, please, don't be mad (or keep hurt feelings)...take more time with the initial post because most of these guys aren't coming from the same "space" as any of the other guys.  They need the beginning, middle and end.
 Just expressing my thought on relating thoughts!  (Because on the other hand, if everyone had the concise physical and emotional info you provided in your second post, no one would have called you a rapist.)
 Again, very very happy to hear about the positive way things seem to be going.  It makes me relieved after all the turmoil of reading the "alarmists".  Best success for you both.

-- Modified on 7/2/2004 2:08:21 AM

You are a gentleman.

Look slo-mo, here's the deal.

You came onto this board, dumped a load of stuff on us and left the reader with every limited context.  None of us know you, the woman or the relationship's background.  

You apparently were interested in commentary and you got it.

You have to learn to live with what you get.  If the feedback was too personal or if you feel attacked (and you should), next time consider either clamming up about your personal affairs or provide the reader with more context concerning the situation.

No one pushed the hate button here.  In fact, almost everyone came to the defense of the woman.  Also, I came to YOUR defense in a left-handed manner.  You should take the time to read the post I left; it cuts both ways and I don't think I was being judgemental.

As for sucking an egg, I do that just about every weekend.  Good for the body and if done properly, one can avoid getting sick from them in the process (flash homogenization, sp).

Just my opinion and I could be wrong.
Loarthan

Sounds like a bunch of hogwash to me. so you went to dinner and everythings a-ok and you'll be back to more stealth anal next session. bullshit. so she finally took your phone call? howd ya end up at dinner if she wasnt talking to you because you accidently fucked her in the ass with out her permission.

oh and did ya pay her extra for the anal sex or did ya think that was included. Shes not your girlfriend or your wife or your SO. Shes paid to like you.

so many of us forget the transaction. Dosent mean we all cant have fun..but a business it is.

you read a thread like this one and it just stinks. why in th world would you post something like that and get all pissed off when people responded. I think its ALL bullshit another TER fantasy meant to inflame people for your personal amusement.

Tom

Avoiding me won't be an issue. I am sure the rainbow doesn't go past your house. So in the event you personally run into some a$$hole, don't blame me. I still don't think you get it.

Oh quiet contrare, I did see that you had a very open-minded view on the situation, my comments were for the guys who were using rape and the Kobe situation to suggest that there was a comparison. If my "go suck an egg" comment bothered you then apologies. When comments are constructive, it's great to hear from people, even when people disagree. If you can say that the remarks that were made were 'constructive', then I question whether you had an open mind when you were reviewing the limited detail. But none of what was said could make anyone of normal intelligence come to the opinion that she was forced to do something against her will.

many providers keep the backdoor sacred for SO's. Since they share every other sexual body part with many men, having something open for only SO's is very important to some providers.  Sounds to me like she was more upset with herself than she was with you.  I think I've had this rational given by providers as often as "because it hurts, that's why!".

By your post I didn't sense that you went backdoor intentionally so I don't agree with all the bashing and negative posts.  I'm sure many hobbiest have found themselves accidentally probing the wrong area once before while trying to reinsert on their own (usually during K9).

I've had this happen before and the lady was always VERY quick to let me know that my aim was off. The lady knows right away which orafice in her body is being penetrated. I think if we weren't all covered up in latex it might be easier for the guy to recognize that he's in the wrong place on his own.  

The fact that you continued even after you knew you were in browntown is probably not the best judgement on your part. But it's not a haneous thing either. A lot of guys would have assumed by her reaction that she didn't have a problem with it.  

Glad you patched things up with her.

Thank you for having the sensitivity that most will never seem to get because they want to judge the post as some gross violation of  human rights. Admittedly, I did the wrong thing at the wrong moment and yes, I knew what I was doing and no, I wouldn't have continued if I got a stop sign. To that end, I regret having shared the story w/o the right amount of detail and believe me, that will never happen again in that way. I am clear now about why she felt so bad. Since I know now, I won't be apologizing for my actions to the board. I shared it because like many of you, I never had that reaction before and didn't quite know what to make of it. So if people want to assume that it's some warped fantasy, then so be it. Many of these same haters would love to live the life I have led.

Frankly the whole thing confused me as real rape would have featured way more histriionics and if it was totally cool, there would have been no bad response.  I just recall the one time I tried it that there was no way I could "slip in" w/o some work.

I hope my response was not too upsetting- I was just tryin' to figger it out...

Yes, I very much get it. Apparently, you either didn't read my below post or don't understand it. Since you aren't a woman or a provider, you wouldn't understand. You raped this woman. When a woman is truly enjoying herself, she's won't be crying a river of tears. Again, what you did was wrong. Shame on you. Shame on you. Shame on you.

You are BOTH felons, seeing how what you do is not a misdemenor in any of the fifty states. Go ponder that before you use a senseless flame. Yes, have an opinion, but calling someone that name is as vulgar as calling you a HO.

Too bad people get suckered into responding to phony posts, and too bad some people put up phony posts - hey, get a life.