I can't remember where I first found the link to this, but it's an interesting perspective.
Personally, as long as a client is respectful and appreciative I have no problem grandfathering him in at the rates I had when we first met provided we see each other at least 1-2x a year. If it's been much longer then that there will be an increase- though maybe not to current structure depending on the situation. If I feel he isn't appreciative of me or respectful, then as others have mentioned, he's no longer a client- let alone a grandfathered in one...
Kiss me,
Kate
so I get that it's a nice gesture to old friends b/c they were there from the beginning, but what sense does this scenario make:
A lady grandfathers an old client at $400/2hr to be nice after her rate increased to (let's say) $500/1hr. so whenever he visits, that's all he pays (peanuts) while he regularly writes reviews for $700+ escorts when he's not seeing her. If he only sees her twice a yr, what's the point? There isn't one, I know. She could just replace him with someone new who'll pay her new higher rate like he does all the others.
What do you think? Is grandfathering biz savvy? Maybe in some cases but not others? Only old friends who visit w/ regularity and not a couple times a yr?
thx
-- Modified on 2/14/2013 9:04:10 PM
-- Modified on 2/14/2013 9:04:37 PM
Who cares what the guy does with his money or if he spends more on other ladies.
If a lady is willing to see him for X amount, so be it.
Just because he spends more for other ladies, doesn't mean he has to spend the same amount for everyone.
The girl in question never would have been around to collect the $500/hr later. Of course you think grandfathering is bullshit wonders. Because grandfathering involves respecting people later, that were there for you in the beginning when you had nothing. It's called "loyalty" wonders. Look into the concept.
Loyalty is a great thing. BUT you have to choose very carefully who you are loyal to, or else you just get (or just feel) taken advantage of. It can be really tough to strike that balance.
I've worked all over the map, rate-wise - from average rate/high-volume incall to higher rate/heavily multi-hour. I have grandfathered TWO clients, and it's only because I don't want to hurt their feelings. Both of them are nice people, but a pain in the a** as clients. For them, it's only a business so far as I'm convenient to them and consistent w/the service I provide. But as far as my expenses/time goes? Not a business then.
Part of the issue is that I'm no longer high-volume incall. Now I'm part-time, outcall, heavily multi-hour. So it's a drag for me to drive and book a room just to see this one client for a discounted hour. I've refused certain appointments from these clients if the effort expended (like a rush-hour drive plus booking a room plus doing dinner) just can't be rationalized for the $$. I do like these men, they are very nice people. But even so, I'd go so far as to say that I wouldn't see either of these men if they contacted me today, which I'll explain more below.
But yes, these men have stuck with me, and they're good people, and I do feel grateful for that. So I bear with it and try to find a middle ground. But I'm not always happy about it, and honestly, I don't feel that they understand/appreciate my efforts as much as my current clients.
Part of that again is that I've grown and my life has changed, so I have much higher standards for who I see...when you market higher, you attract people with higher expectations, and the whole experience is better. So I expect the whole date to be treated like a special occasion, and also to be well-compensated for the effort I put forth. So these men just aren't like that, as I said it's more like McD's to them. It's so hard to explain but some men who book 1-hours at lower rates are all about convenience and 'getting their money's worth'...it can be very demanding/demoralizing sometimes even when the guy's nice. So I don't think I'd see either of these men if they contacted me...I'd be like, 'dude, you're speaking w/the wrong girl!', same as I do when someone tells me they want to see me tonight when it's 9:30pm.
Anyway, it's just not always about loyalty. Things change, people change. If the client really deserves that loyalty and can afford to pay...shouldn't he at least meet her halfway?
-- Modified on 2/14/2013 10:31:04 PM
They are a better provider today then when they first started. More experience, maybe less nerves, ways to make the client relax, dealing with guys who have Ed in a session, etc a million other reasons why you are better now. But they stuck with you back then when you were new/newer. You don't cast them off like dopey wonders is saying because something better comes along. Building a good client base in any business means keeping those customers that gave you the ability to get where you are today. Now if they disrespect you or something like that, that's different, but you are saying they are good guys. Hang in there with them the way they did with you. Of course it isn't always a bed of roses. Respect and loyalty transcend that.
But for me, it depends on how those initial clients are with me over time. Are they still respectful of my time, are they still the same amount of work as when they started with me or have they become more demanding?
These things are all taken into consideration when we decide to grandfather.
Example, I dropped one that was long standing when he became so much work I didn't sleep well the night before stressing about seeing him. I had grandfathered him but instead of asking him to pay the going rate I just couldn't see him.
If seeing someone out of loyalty breeds contempt, it becomes a lose, lose scenario.
If it really bothers you then speak your mind to the client. But if you are worried that if you do say something you run the risk of alienating him and losing him all together. So you have to decide what is more important, MAYBE getting the extra money or keeping him as a regular with making 500.00.
To me honestly, money is money and sometimes we need to relax a bit and not stress over what we are making. Meaning, yes, set your rates, change them if you want too, but to be successful in this business, don't make it JUST about the money. If you have a client that has been paying that 500.00 keep it at that. It is nice to see the same people again, and $500.00 in a short time is nothing to complain about really. Especially if you did raise your rates and people are paying.
-- Modified on 2/15/2013 11:35:23 AM
It's one thing if he was broke, but if those peanuts mean nothing to him and he willingly pays more for sex, why not show appreciation and pay her more too? It's like a smack in the face.
I know what loyalty means, but at some point if they only visit every blue moon, what's the point in being loyal to them if they're not loyal in return?
You come off as so unappreciative. You refer to your longtime devoted clients as "smacks in your face." So glad you "treasure" those that helped you become the pretentious and disloyal child you are now. You win. Just toss them to the curb. And kick them in the ass while you do it. And to really drive home the point, why dont you tally up all the times you saw them before your rate increase and back bill them for the difference. Maybe you can get CPA to figure out the interest on that money too. And maybe add in a penalty. And report them to a collection agency if they dont pay it. Dope...
The best bosses treat their employees well and pay generously, because they know in turn that they will get better work (assuming that they hire ppl with the right kind of ethic). For bosses and clients that go above and beyond for me, I make sure I repay them in kind and then some.
On the other hand, here and in life, is the kind of client who thinks that he's a paying loyal customer and is entitled to special priviliges/discounts...that's the worst kind, in ANY business. While HE may think he should be appreciated, the person doing the service rarely agrees.
Take my business now (civvie). When I first got started, I was THRILLED TO PIECES to be hired for anything. But then I got really busy w/stuff. So if someone wanted me to do the same kind of work I did once, I might TRY to do it, if I could, but if it was just too much for me time-wise, I'd refer them to someone else. We don't have the time/energy to do everything, it's just not possible. Nobody would expect me to spend time doing something time-consuming if it was not profitable for me. I'd explain that I am overbooked and wouldn't be able to do their task justice at this time.
I think the answer w/this is that both sides need to meet in the middle. It needs to work for both ppl. From my side, I'd really prefer that the effort be appreciated at least at little bit instead of the guy just feeling entitled.
To expand upon my 'civvie' job comparison, my first clients weren't doing ME a huge favor when they hired me. They got a HUGE FREAKIN deal because I was happy to do their work for so little. I feel that many first clients are somewhat the same. Now, some of those first clients I saw (both jobs) recognized the extra effort and compensation were not quite proportional, and paid me a little extra. So guess what? I probably would make extra time to do their work again, no matter how busy I was. And I'd even make sure to do a little more than they asked for, if I saw an opportunity.
Seeing a provider a couple times a year CAN be considered regular.
For example, if she is a traveling companion and only visits once or twice a year.
If the client sees her each time she visits his city, why wouldn't he be considered a regular?
How often must a client see a provider to be considered a "regular"?
Men like variety.
A lady grandfathers an old client at $400/2hr to be nice after her rate increased to (let's say) $500/1hr. so whenever he visits, that's all he pays (peanuts) while he regularly writes reviews for $700+ escorts when he's not seeing her. If he only sees her twice a yr, what's the point? There isn't one, I know. She could just replace him with someone new who'll pay her new higher rate like he does all the others.
What do you think? Is grandfathering biz savvy? Maybe in some cases but not others? Only old friends who visit w/ regularity and not a couple times a yr?
thx
-- Modified on 2/14/2013 9:04:10 PM
-- Modified on 2/14/2013 9:04:37 PM
to be considered a regular.
Variety, variety, variety.
Special ladies should be seen on special occasions..
Twice a month?
I would get bored before I run out of money, even if it's a pornstar.
Bc there are too many things to do, that I do fot them b/c they are regualrs.
But everyone is different.
It does me no good to keep him at the cheaper rate, if he is not seeing me "as much" as he once did. That is the issue with grandfathering just "anyone." Does not work that way. I take care of those, WHO TAKE CARE OF ME!
if he is no longer beneficial to me, grandfathering makes no sense aka is bullshit for him. Strong words, I know. I'll continue to grandfather others tho, who come around more frequently.
Grandfathering is more than you getting the guy to see you more often because you give him a lower rate.
Sometimes there are other things that you benefit from, like the guy referring guys to see you at the higher rate.
I have seen some girls who have given me ridiculous discounts like you mentioned. If I refer clients to her at her new, higher rate while seeing her infrequently at the grandfathered rate, how exactly has she NOT benefitted from this?
I agree, and do this as well, If a client I know and trust refers me to some of his friends, he gets 100 off each time he does it. That's "P I M P" talk ha ha.
And I can understand giving a client a lower rate in that case.
What I was originally talking about was giving a lower rate just for being an old friend. That's how lots of people define grandfathering, so if I'm wrong, I guess a lot of folks are.
I agree that you shouldn't give it to someone who is not gonna be beneficial to you. It has to be beneficial to both parties.
I only raised my rate by 50 dollars though.going from 4002hrs to 500hr is a big change though.
for keeping regulars. A provider can run her business anyway she wants, however, as most business owners will tell you, it's a lot harder to obtain new clients than it is to retain old clients.
As far as I'm concerned, if I'm not grandfathered in, I usually move on especially if the rate I'm currently paying is at my upper limit. I'm in a city with plenty of talent, and while it may be a hassle to find a new friend, hobbying isn't a necessity for me and there's always new providers starting in the hobby.
A lady grandfathers an old client at $400/2hr to be nice after her rate increased to (let's say) $500/1hr. so whenever he visits, that's all he pays (peanuts) while he regularly writes reviews for $700+ escorts when he's not seeing her. If he only sees her twice a yr, what's the point? There isn't one, I know. She could just replace him with someone new who'll pay her new higher rate like he does all the others.
What do you think? Is grandfathering biz savvy? Maybe in some cases but not others? Only old friends who visit w/ regularity and not a couple times a yr?
thx
-- Modified on 2/14/2013 9:04:10 PM
-- Modified on 2/14/2013 9:04:37 PM
"Never mix business with friendships".
That's kind of hard to do in this. We all want pleasure and a good deal, whether proprietor or client.
It all boils down to what it's worth in both the practical monetary need and the emotional need.
Personally, I wouldn't feel right about paying less than anyone else, because of the possibility of leaving the provider with lingering feelings of the fact, she could have gotten more from someone else, but I'm also playing on a field where there is great service for less $ than some.
The best way to show appreciation, in my view, is to frequent a favorite so much and insist on the highest price, until she insists on a freebie. Never expect or take advantage. Become her favorite too, and good things will happen.
Maybe not right up to the new rate, but at least something in the middle so that you are showing some respect and for the sake of good karma as well.
I've only encountered one case where the gal said: "That's too much." and actually handed me back a $.
I won't argue the point with her, but I try to make it up other ways.
I have slightly raised my prices through the years and find it hard to tell someone they need to give me more cash. It's hard to do this with people who have become friends but not so hard for someone you feel is taking advantage of you.
Living in a convention city "Orlando" many gentlemen visit me each year when they come for meetings. No way would it be right for these gentlemen to feel entitled to lower rates.
If I see someone often as in once or twice a month I let it slide but if they cum and go and you have to spend lots of time talking about catch up it's been too long. A gentleman I don't see once a month doesn't get a break. For my older friends on a fixed income I give them options of more time for the higher price. After all many of them are truly looking for my companionship.
Kisses Haley
As said on numerous times repeatedly on this boards, what a lady decides to with her time for what is the ladies prerogative, period.
On the other hand, your intention is to create drama and controversy, who is to stop you!
I am grandfathered with one Fav lady. I don't see her as much as we would like mostly because I need a whole day AWOL to get to her & back. The rate is fair...
Another Fav, grandfathered me when she raised her rate from an Intro Special... when she raised again, I decided to up my donation by one step, so was still less than her latest rate. Well, the increase didn't work out as her traffic tumbled. So she's now LOWERED her rate... to one below the rate I'm paying & the old Intro Special. I could cut the donation & she invited me to do so, but I didn't. Why would I pay more than I have to? Because what I'm paying is fair.
Grandfathering is optional... a lady can set her price structure any way she chooses. If she chooses, she can tell her guest that she's raising rates & his next visit will only get a X discount. He can decide if he'll come back. Some gals do not grandfather at all... presumeably a returning guest is 'safe & respectful'... what is that worth? One gal I've seen, yet to repeat with as she's no longer close by... advertizes returning guests get 'special rates'. I'm not fool enough to think it wouold be the same as when I saw her 5 years ago.
After reading some of wonder's posts, it becomes obvious that she has some issues with anger and especially with resentment towards us "Tricks". Of course she can run her business any way she likes, and can raise prices in any manor she desires. More money may sooth the resentment she has, for a while, but the real resentment will come when her "tricks" realize there are other woman who have more respect for their clients and business dries up.
But that does not necessarily mean she is angry. She has her opinions, some of which rub many guys the wrong way....so the knee jerk is "she's angry". It could simply be that she sees this differently and acts accordingly.
I could say that some of the guys on here hate women/or resent paying for sex, the way they talk about escorts/hookers. Or I can say they see this differently and accept that and just move on. Good Lord I have been accused of being a man hater and will now simply agree to shut up the detractors...I know I don't, I just have certain views on this biz that rub some guys the wrong way...am I angry, no.
-- Modified on 2/15/2013 9:47:11 AM
My clients are clients, but the men on this board who make ita mission to call us hookers every chance they get, they my dear are tricks. So only time use that word is to make a point on this board.have
Don't worry about my biz. I have and always will have alternate options.
Here that like to call us names.
The other men I respect, and if a man isn't apart of the name calling crowd, he shouldn't worry.
But if you're going to address us as hookers, then lets be semantically correct and address u as tricks.
Such a simple concept that I dont get how that equates to hating my clients.
Sorry buddy you're wrong.
I made it a point to look over many of her posts before I made that statement, I stand by my opinion.
She comes off as having been wronged somehow during her early days as a provider, and she may have been, and because of that she resents all the guys in the hobby. Angry, resentful, and condescending.
You have absolute proof that this women, who I do not know, hates all men in the hobby? You got that from some posts you somehow found some personal slight in or that you completely disagreed with or that went against your view of how women should be in this hobby?
She has repeatedly said she loves her clients but finds some board guys distasteful. She has made no denial about this, yet this translates into she hates all men in the hobby?
My opinion, for what it's worth, is that something she said upset or angered you and now you feel she hates ALL men in the hobby.
Do you feel this way about the men on here who say mean condescending things about the women in this game? I don't think I have seen a post that mentions how angry, condescending and resentful they are.
Because she feels they look down on her...and those men are on here, and are NOT representative of her views on men as a whole or her client base.
I am sorry but I have been accused of the very same thing. There are guys on here I can't stand because either I find them insulting to women in general or escorts, but to say that I hate ALL men is going from the sublime to the ridiculous.
Clearly you feel slighted too, I get that, but to be that general is silly. Saying she might hate a few on here might not be such a stretch. I would admit to that.
-- Modified on 2/15/2013 12:53:46 PM
I am pretty sure I never said she hated anyone.
I did, however, state that her posts ( go read them before you say I am wrong ), cause her to come off as someone who has anger and resentment towards hobbyists. I mean she's going off about being called a hooker and blames the guys and says it's disrespectful. Maybe she's right, but London is the one who popularized that word here, because she is not offended by it. Nevertheless WOTW blames the guys for the use of the word, and retaliated by introducing the word 'trick' to the board. Boy, that really showed London, didn't it?
And she likes her clients so much more than the guys on this board that she doesn't grandfather any of them, or is she does, she obviously does so begrudgingly. That makes sense.
I feel slighted because she has anger and resentment issues? That makes no sense.
I am done with this discussion.
Good luck with the no grandfathering policy, I hope it works out as you hope it will.
-- Modified on 2/15/2013 2:53:40 PM
London has no issue being called a hooker, but it is obvious that WOTW does. And some of the guys who use this term, use to irritate and not as a term of endearment..but that is another issue altogether. And maybe she finds it a disrespectful term when a guy uses it not unlike some racial terms that are fine with that race but when another race uses it is deemed negative
What I took from the grandfather thread was that she found it unfair to have to grandfather a guy she has seen once 3 years ago. She didn't seem to have an issue with gentlemen that visited more often and showed their loyalty to her as well.
-- Modified on 2/15/2013 2:13:55 PM
sees me maybe once or twice a year if that and expects to be grandfathered. I didn't say all of my clients. I'm sorry you read it that way. I give my clients the world: extra OTC time, services like Greek that would never be on the menu for others, any fetish they request (again, not offered to the public) and I've even paid for dinner. I don't hate men or my clients but I don't have to prove myself to u or anyone else.
& I don't care if London popularized the word & she's a woman. So what? We could banter back and forth using the bitch term, but it's different when I man does it. & She doesn't say it for spite or at least it doesn't come off that way. That is however how it comes off with some guys on this board. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. If you're offended by "trick" you should be offended by "hooker", but it doesn't work where you can use it & then get offended when the complimentary word "trick" is used for clients.
If I see someone once a year, I generally expect to pay whatever her rates are even if I met her 4 years ago, but if we see each other 25 times a year we obviously do more than just tolerate each and we generally arrive at an arrangement that ends up being somewhat less than her posted rates.
I don't think that's bullshit at all. Its simple economics.
A lady grandfathers an old client at $400/2hr to be nice after her rate increased to (let's say) $500/1hr. so whenever he visits, that's all he pays (peanuts) while he regularly writes reviews for $700+ escorts when he's not seeing her. If he only sees her twice a yr, what's the point? There isn't one, I know. She could just replace him with someone new who'll pay her new higher rate like he does all the others.
What do you think? Is grandfathering biz savvy? Maybe in some cases but not others? Only old friends who visit w/ regularity and not a couple times a yr?
thx
-- Modified on 2/14/2013 9:04:10 PM
-- Modified on 2/14/2013 9:04:37 PM
Any good business knows to take care of the very people who allowed them to get where they are at, and escorts are no different. It's not the client's problem if a provider "decided after 3 years of his patronage, that she can't afford to take care of him," all of a sudden. That's her problem. Bottom line, it is about respect and honoring your word. If you don't feel that "cheaper client" is worth seeing, don't see him period. If he only sees you twice a year, it might not be worth it to keep him, so just stop seeing him but don't go up on the rate. He will likely walk, anyway. Going up on his rate, proves you don't like him all that much to begin with so why keep him around?
I also call bs on the "I have to be low volume now" comment, and can't afford a hotel. Raise your rates if that's the case. Once again, that's not the guy's fault if a provider's situation changes. It's called good business sense. I have heard the "I have to pay for a hotel now" aspect, and again call bs. Raise your rates, or share an incall with another girl. Problem is, many of these providers CAN'T command a higher rate to be able to do what they want, and still be low volume. I have 3 incalls, and only see 2 clients a damn week, yet I can afford it. Why? Because I am a good business woman...that's why. If your volume has to be so low, that you can't even make money here...what's the point? It's still about PROFIT.
I have men from 2008 who STILL SEE ME, and had I not kept the same rate for them, I doubt that would be the case. I could not see justifying going from 250 to 600, for a guy who has literally spent thousands of dollars on me in the past. Had it not been for "those guys" I would not be able to charge what I do now.
Don't get me wrong...at 250, all I was offering was one pop and no gfe, so I am not suggesting that I also provide the 600 dollar service I offer now, to those who never got that to begin with. I offer the same service, for the same rate. I have guys who pay 250, 400, and 600 but they are all getting different things...some, only a bj. There is also no shame in telling the clients who pay less, that they will have to be fit in around the guys who pay more. Most will certainly understand that the only way for them to get the cheap rate, is to allow the woman to make money from others so she is not stuck in a jam.
There are so many ways to be able to grandfather, and accommodate incalls/hotels so that everyone is happy. It's not as hard as some like to make it out. I've done it for years.
-- Modified on 2/15/2013 11:59:21 AM
But I agree with (LR)... I have regulars (see 10-15 times a yr) from 9 years ago and I grandfather them in. Obviously I enjoy my time with them, otherwise I wouldn't see them regardless of rate... and some tip to make it closer to going rate. In the end, either you like said client or you don't and go from there. If I feel I should raise a rate because I am not fond of client, I just don't see him anymore.
-- I wouldn't grandfather someone in who I see 1-4 times a year, but that is just me and I don't travel (yet).
I also call bs on the "I have to be low volume now" comment, and can't afford a hotel. Raise your rates if that's the case. Once again, that's not the guy's fault if a provider's situation changes. It's called good business sense. I have heard the "I have to pay for a hotel now" aspect, and again call bs. Raise your rates, or share an incall with another girl. Problem is, many of these providers CAN'T command a higher rate to be able to do what they want, and still be low volume. I have 3 incalls, and only see 2 clients a damn week, yet I can afford it. Why? Because I am a good business woman...that's why. If your volume has to be so low, that you can't even make money here...what's the point? It's still about PROFIT.
I have men from 2008 who STILL SEE ME, and had I not kept the same rate for them, I doubt that would be the case. I could not see justifying going from 250 to 600, for a guy who has literally spent thousands of dollars on me in the past. Had it not been for "those guys" I would not be able to charge what I do now.
Don't get me wrong...at 250, all I was offering was one pop and no gfe, so I am not suggesting that I also provide the 600 dollar service I offer now, to those who never got that to begin with. I offer the same service, for the same rate. I have guys who pay 250, 400, and 600 but they are all getting different things...some, only a bj. There is also no shame in telling the clients who pay less, that they will have to be fit in around the guys who pay more. Most will certainly understand that the only way for them to get the cheap rate, is to allow the woman to make money from others so she is not stuck in a jam.
There are so many ways to be able to grandfather, and accommodate incalls/hotels so that everyone is happy. It's not as hard as some like to make it out. I've done it for years.
-- Modified on 2/15/2013 11:59:21 AM
I used to do the whole expensive incall thing (4000+/mo in NYC). Sure, I made more money in those days that I could ever now. The thing is, I chose not to do that anymore. I had quite the life in the old days, but it distracted me from what I really aimed for coming into this life...in the short term, I was taken care of in a grand style, but all long term plans fell away as I couldn't really commit my time/energy to anything else. Or it wasn't that I COULDN'T...I just didn't, for a variety of reasons. So I chose to move away altho I could have afforded to stay for a while longer and make more $.
What did I do? I moved someplace cheap and quiet and did outcalls only...IF it was convenient for me and IF the money was worth the trouble. Money wasn't what it was by any means, but it covered my bills just fine. With the rest of my free time/energy (which increased by bounds), I studied, developed skills that are now starting to pay off (yay!). So have a guy contact me for 2k and I'll be too happy to book the nicest hotel I can find plus give up my whole day. But to drive for 1+ hours, plus book a hotel for a discounted 1-hour appointment...I mean, come on. It's not that I can't afford it, it's just that I want to do other things w/my time. How much does a girl really want to commit/invest in this lifestyle? That will determine how she runs her business, not always the bottom line.
I did this work to get myself someplace better...not to make as much $ as I can. If it's taking too much time/energy away from other things, I don't want to do it. And I won't restructure my life to make more money escorting unless it also has some benefit elsewhere. So yea, no incall for me anytime soon...and yeah, I'll grumble about booking a hotel and schlepping up to a place not close to me, all for a net profit of $200, when I could be doing something more fulfilling/productive.
If they are that much of an issue, why see them? I know you said they are nice b=guys but from reading your post, it's more trouble than it's worth financially to you. If you could see another client, closer for more money, then why keep these two on if that's the way you feel?
At some point you might have to decide on the irritation factor and adjust accordingly and by the tone of this and the other post, it sounds like time to drop those two and move on.
The thing is, I totally agree w/u!! In a business sense. But to actually cut them off...I just can't bring myself to do it.
The thing is, w/these two, it really is a little bit about more than business. We know each other's personal lives and I really would like to keep corresponding w/them in a non-business sense even after I stop working. They are great people in so many ways. But as clients, obviously, we're not of the same mind at all. I wish they'd be a little more appreciative and take the efforts I make less for granted. And no matter how much I like a client as a person...to leave my day-to-day life business AND travel AND book a hotel...it's always a drag, a little more $$ makes it less so.
Can you talk to them about your feelings? They are completely in the dark and unless they know, they can't do anything about it.
Or, say to them that you feel awkward with them being client but still want a friendship that does not involve sex.
Their opinions about hobbying aren't going to change, so #1 won't work. They were agency clients - just want it as cheap and easy as possible, will NEVER consider paying for a long date unless WAY heavily discounted (think like $1000/overnight).
I thought about telling them I wasn't working any longer but would like to keep in touch. I recently had to change my name. But one is a very active hobbyist and would definitely find my photos online. If he knew I was still working but just didn't want to see HIM, it would hurt him. The other one would find out eventually...even in NYC, the hobby is a small world and word gets around.
Such is the nature of this job sometimes! When it comes that time of the month to see them, I just focus on the positives and have a glass of wine beforehand. Once I'm there with them, it's usually fine, it's just the getting there and the hassle that make me crabby.
You seem to have it worked out to where you do it and that is has not become a full on resentful thing.
Me, I would tell them I raised my rates commensurate with travel etc and see if they then still wanted to see me. I would tell them it was not financially viable anymore and that I was sad I could not see them.
Shit happens and guys see different ladies at different price points all the time...they don't seem to have such an issue with their loyalty, it's more about what they pay for services they get.
You see it here all the time about ATF's that start to take guys for granted and the service drops off, they can move on, and so would I if I started to feel crabby about seeing a client.
I made a promise to myself..I would not see anyone I if I started to dread the appointment
You are not stuck unless you want to be. What do you think they will do to you if you go that route? The last thing you need is to have that time of the month effect you negatively or stress you out.
Given all of the above, which is what I would do...you seem to have it where you can put up with it so good for you. Just be kind to yourself and don't get to the point where you feel beaten down and without options...
No one says if you raise your rates you have to, it's done at the discretion of each individual provider. But if you choose to, pick those guys you like the best for whatever reason and let them know. The others, you can simply tell them the new rates and let them make the choice if they still want to see you.
And of course when deciding to grandfather, the regularity of the visits is taken into consideration along with many other aspects. Loyalty can be seen as many different things other than the frequency of visits and should be somehow rewarded. I give extra off the clock time to chill and chat and such.
If the grandfathering causes distress or bad feelings, then don't. No one is forcing anyone to do this.
Who I feel deserve it.
But wanting to see me for a 3rd of the price he regularly pays b/c he saw me when I first started isn't cool. I dont like entitlement.
You're right about choosing who gets grandfathered.
In the past I did it for anyone who saw me ONCE as a newbie, but just for seeing me once doesn't guarantee loyalty.
It was good to read everyone's responses.
Going forward, it's only select men that get the option.
Thx SS
This is how I feel. If I think a guy is too much of a pain in the ass to deal with, he is not getting a lower rate, but he is also NOT BEING SEEN AT ALL. If I truly want to spend time with a guy, I offer incentives to keep him coming back. If I don't truly value him or his money, he can take a hike. There is no rule that says you have to see former clients who are a pain in the ass, but saying you will still see them for a higher rate makes you come off as desperate for the money. Not "you" saturn, but in general. If a provider really needs that money, she is wiling to put up with a lot more than one who can tell half of them to get fked.
and what works for her. I have seen a lady who didn't grandfather people in, also I have seen a few who advertise cheap introductory rate when just starting out. Either way if it was a great time I'd see her again.
What bothers me more is ladies who offer a $50 an hr discount to new clients. As a previous and respectful client the idea of a new person getting a discounted rate bothers me for some reason.
Damn right it's bullshit. If he is lowballing me for a discount and I'm seeing reviews for high priced ladies, damn motherfucking right that's a slap in the face. Damn motherfucking right it IS my business that I'm being screwed over. (and not the way I want) If I'm supposed to be so loyal, then it's expected of him to. If you truly enjoy a service, you want it to be around when you want to use it, right? Then support it by acknowledging and respecting price increases rather than trying to bankrupt it by lowballing.
If everybody else's cost of living is going up guess what? SO is mine!
Providing has a fairly high overhead. IF your doing it right and ESPECIALLY if your using hotel rooms for incall. OMG that's 75% of expenses right there.
I'm not going to turn down full paying clients so MR Serial Hobbyist can low ball me. If you want variety EXPECT to pay full price for it.
I'm not darkening my door to operate at a deficit for ANYBODY.
I show my loyalty by giving my faves more time but leave the dollar amount to where it suits me financially and in my head. The very second I feel taken advantage of, I stop it right there. That's the reason I will not offer lower rates PERIOD and I have guys that see me weekly!
I have a client that I sometimes take to breakfast after on my dime. Now he asks for breakfast every time he books. I now purposely have other business to attend to and only OFFER the breakfast if he has not asked me about it. As soon as he becomes a jerk about it, he can go find someone else...with my blessing.
There is a very fine line that can tip into resentment on both sides if we don't step back and put ourselves in the other parties position before we want to push the limits.
and your tone is not very friendly either. So can we say you are also angry and label you an angry man/hobbyist/trick/whatever?
examples. (1) The airline you use for most if not all of your travel is the one with both good connections but also a very good frequent flyer program. (2) The hotel chain you utilize the most is also the chain with the best frequent stay program.
With a provider, instead of a free flight or a free room or upgrade, you get a discount.
is about a man who does not visit often, but was one of the firsts, so that expectation is there that he receive a discount even if he only visits once a yr now.
I'm totally open to frequent flyer miles tho & do it all the time for my regulars. You're right that that's a good way to appreciate those "frequenters".
It would depend on what else I have going on. If a guy who saw me 4 years ago at say 250, expects to see me for the service I offer today, I would not do it. I would honor BOTH the rate and SERVICE I provided for that rate, which was a half hour bj deal lol. I am not going to give away 2 hours of GFE/MSOG for that rate, but I will honor his bj request since that's how we started out.
I am with you here, but I thought you meant in general about grandfathering anyone. I don't agree that the "concept" of taking care of your past clients is bs, but I do agree that the volume they once saw you at, has to remain constant to get that same rate. If a guy used to see you once a week for 250, and now only wants that once a month, I could not see keeping the rate low. I could see referring him to someone else, though.
I can't remember where I first found the link to this, but it's an interesting perspective.
Personally, as long as a client is respectful and appreciative I have no problem grandfathering him in at the rates I had when we first met provided we see each other at least 1-2x a year. If it's been much longer then that there will be an increase- though maybe not to current structure depending on the situation. If I feel he isn't appreciative of me or respectful, then as others have mentioned, he's no longer a client- let alone a grandfathered in one...
Kiss me,
Kate
You gave me a lot to consider.
I appreciate it!
xoxo
Many hobbyists play in a price range. Dozens of guys I network with are all that way. The range does not usually extend beyond $100. i.e. a guy that targets $200 an hour, may go to $250, or MAYBE $300 on rare occasion. But he won't go to $400.
A young and top lady from my home town started making a name for herself at $250, then $300 an hour. Every gent in the established community saw her and RAVED giving her 10/10. Her looks and performance deserved it. At first she grandfathered a little, but later on dropped it.
Over 2 years she went to $350, then $400 with occasion specials, then $450 with occasional specials, then up to $500 with no specials. Her reviews stayed 10/10. Her ads, photos, website, etc, shot up in quality to match. By that time she attracted the high-end hobbyist that never pays $250.
Now she is at $1000 minimum. She only does 2 to 3 sessions a week. Not more that one of two of the wealthiest guys who booked her on her rise ever see her now. She has 98% new and different clients.
It worked for her, no grandfathering needed.
Contrast and compare.
Another gal, same scenario, went from a $125 hr BP girl to a popular local with a website, nice photos and 8.5/8.5 reviews. Her price went up to $200 hr, and $300 hr for a "specialty session. Same group of local guys all booked and see her just like the first gal. Then she announces, I'm going away for a few weeks, see me now and get grandfathered in because when I return all my rates are going up $100 per hour.
She did that as to not lose her current clientele. For her it was a good move. She went away, came back and raised her rates for new clients. She continued to get bookings and 8.5/8.5. However, she could not get enough new clients at the higher rate. (Why? who knows??) Within 6 months her published rates were right back down to the $200/$300.
Had she NOT grandfathered, she would have lost her current clients during the time period where she tried to move to a new level of client. For her grandfathering helped keep some stability while she learned that she was marketable ata $400 an hour.
Grandfathering is just a marketing tool. Sometimes it is not needed, sometimes it is.