TER General Board

Exactly!
MP67 11 Reviews 409 reads
posted
1 / 82

Goddam bunch of vaginas running around on this thread. The only one that made any sense was Cleo.

Yeah, I'm partial to her. For more reasons than one. In this case it's because she can see both sides of the coin and give an intelligent answer, whereas everybody else jumped all up and down your shit.

I need to get more beer and smokes! ;)

OSP 26 Reviews 2469 reads
posted
2 / 82

Does anyone really care? Maybe Romeo!

You all need to remember that TER is simply the Junior league for hobbyists. There are OTHER forms and forums where-in one can find R & R activities. Blacklists do have their valid purposes but remember that WE are all emotionally fallible. Do we really concern ourselves with the ONE pissy guy or girl that we didn't click with? When I began to see my missus, we had already had history. After about 5 times together she informed me that 1 girl had placed me on a blacklist. And i'm NOT black!!!LOL She said that she contacted the girl to see what the problem was. The girls explanation was ticky-tacky at best. A personality quirk(what?, who me? LOL)

A good friend of mine here on this wonderful board(is that big enough praise LP?)continues to remind me that TER is NOT the TELL-ALL and KNOW-ALL that some like to believe it is.

So be damned with Black-Lists! Who gives two flaming farts?

RED FACE?  Made you look didn't it?

OSP 26 Reviews 499 reads
posted
3 / 82

Get the fuck over yourself!

She told me because she felt the reason was estrogen based infantile.

Did she break your wittle code?

PostmasterGeneral 335 reads
posted
4 / 82

But it is not. Providers simply cannot keep their mouths shut and definitely cannot keep a secret.
The lists went from keeping yourselves safe to outing and other nefarious purposes. There is way too much abuse and providers who are not "all together" upstairs posting.  

Don't for one minute think your "sisters" don't blab in between cups or over drinks.

And no, I am not on any of the lists.

OSP 26 Reviews 348 reads
posted
5 / 82

one of those little pissy bitches who blacklist anyone who doesn't kiss your little ass! Or is your ass the size of a tractor-trailor?

Yo estoy no importante.

PostmasterGeneral 273 reads
posted
6 / 82

They are not ghetto type girls and do like to have some intelligent conversation. They don't refer to themselves as bitches either. Get my drift?

AlexLiarman 387 reads
posted
7 / 82

...your PM's, email....as wordy as you are...you'd be listed as a 'time waister'!

PostmasterGeneral 221 reads
posted
8 / 82
mattradd 40 Reviews 353 reads
posted
9 / 82

I feel really guilty for laughing so hard. Truly, I feel really, really guilty! :)

PostmasterGeneral 413 reads
posted
10 / 82

Unlike the hothead above with the trigger finger  to blacklist guys. ( No I am not addressing you granny).

The problem I see is the rampant abuse of the NBL. I have seen guys real name outed for being late or a NCNS and one because he sent too many emails.

I have always been in favor of providers protecting themselves and keeping safe, but the mental midgets and man hating providers ruin it for everyone.  



HalfHour 434 reads
posted
11 / 82
PostmasterGeneral 308 reads
posted
12 / 82

That was directed to someone else on this thread.

I hope you didn't stop reading my reply after the word granny.

GaGamblerssmarterbrother 307 reads
posted
13 / 82

if pressed for a guess on how many different women I have had sex with in my life.

My best guess is about 2,000, but I have been sexually active for over 35 years and only married for five of those. I also drink like a fish, and suffer from CRS (cant' remember shit).So the truth is, I don't have any real idea of how many women I have seen.

How a provider who sees several clients a day, and has both new and repeat clients could possible come anywhere close when estimating the number of men she has seen is beyond me.

MP67 11 Reviews 390 reads
posted
14 / 82

I'm on a few sites. Not as active on them as I am here, but none the less.

Not on a blacklist, that I know of, but it wouldn't surprise me. Especially lately.

If some of the ladies want to turn me onto the fact, I'd be more than happy to hear and know why.

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 773 reads
posted
15 / 82

I'm afraid to put clients on any black list for that reason: providers talk and it can sooooo turn against me.

When a provider is unpleasant clients aren't shy about writing all little silly details in a review (like my eating in my last review as if I had a steak Wellington while the dude was hanging out in his towel) so when a client is highly unpleasant with us why wouldn't we warn other providers? Internet isn't a one way street.

As I don't know who you are, I'm in no position to judge; I'm ONLY talking about my own experience.

Yes clients attitude vary between one girl to the next YMMV:) My favorite clients have been other ladies nightmares and vise versa, we're all humans some people bring out the best in us some others the worst.

JLee567 1 Reviews 348 reads
posted
16 / 82

I got put on a national blacklist for doing a "no-show". I won't go into all the details here but I don't feel the least bit bad about it.

Fortunately, I didn't give her all my personal info and now I'm glad I didn't and will be much more wary of doing that in the future. She only had my P411 ID which can now be found with a google search. Not a big deal really but the thing is I can see she (not sure it's SHE, actually) could have done much more damage if she wanted to.

CheeseWithThat 604 reads
posted
17 / 82

He's talking about the chick he married divulging the info to him.  I understand clearly the concept of Bro's before Ho's and it's female equivalent, but do you expect that to carry to the person that you're banging regularly?  Ain't gonna happen, high horse or not.  Now, if you'd like to put me on the bad boy list, just let me know.  I'll reveal myself to you so you can.

MP67 11 Reviews 421 reads
posted
18 / 82

You got a ways to go pal! From what I understand, I'm the top of the heap! ;)

Fair_Use 29 Reviews 439 reads
posted
19 / 82

I just turned off my whitelist here on TER after reading this.  Its just not worth being associated with anything, even something more subtle as this list stuff.

MP67 11 Reviews 351 reads
posted
20 / 82

That's a relative term. What you percieve as shit drunk might be totally acceptable to some ladies. Especially if they partake and imbibe just as much, if not more, than the 'gent' in question.

But all the rest? No.

MsChayse 304 reads
posted
21 / 82

Informing you is a big "NO,NO" Doing so puts other providers at risk. She can, & should be banned from the site, & let me assure you, I am convinced she will be busted out eventually. An explanation of why a provider is blacklisting someone is required. Readers can then decide if her reason is enough to refuse to see you. If you don't have a consistent track record of problems, you probably have little to worry about. So get the fuck over it! The board I am a member of allows responses. As do most. That is where your "snitch" should have dealt with the issue.

MrMcCabe 311 reads
posted
22 / 82

Man, most of the posts here regarding blacklists sound pathetic.  A couple sound psycho enough just in writing to be put on a blacklist.  You folks have scary attitudes, just remember perception has to be dealt with.

johngaltnh 6 Reviews 1135 reads
posted
23 / 82

My first beef with the National Blacklist is that it OUTS hobbyists. That is, it puts their real name, work address, email, etc. right out there where any google search on the guy's name let's the whole world know he is a hobbyist.

My second beef is that too many providers, showing an extraordinary sense of disproportionate justice, out guys to the world on this list for things which are problematic to be sure, but unworthy of such an outing. About a third of all NBL listings are for NCNS. What is that missed appointment worth? $300? $600? And over a lousy 300-600, they think NOTHING of totally outing the guy so his kids get to grow up without a father or he gets canned from a six figure job. Total irresponsible bullshit.

My final beef is it is unaccountable. That is, providers who OUT a hobbyist nationally, especially when doing so for reasons other than violence, are in no way accountable for having done so. It's a way of being able to cost people their families, jobs and homes while being immune to reprisal. Used injudiciously, the lack of accountability can make it a form of terrorism.

With all due respect to providers, this is very different from trashing a lady in a review. The review is under your stage name. It is not the same thing as making your status as a provider show up under google searches for your *real name* so that future employers, potential boyfriends and future husbands won't touch you with a 10' pole or so that your ex-husband will use that as leverage to challenge child custody and turn your life into a living hell.

Furthermore, a review provides some context because most ladies have many reviews; so potential clients see both the bad AND the good. By comparison, the blacklists do not give that sort of context -- they list only the single NCNS (for example) and *never* show the dozens of on-time, cleaned-up, paid-in-full appointments.

Incidentally, to the best of my knowledge, I'm on no blacklists, so I don't have a personal ax to grind here.

MP67 11 Reviews 390 reads
posted
24 / 82

Tell her 'empinate yo lo meto'.

I'll turn you on if you don't want to do the translation deal on google. ;)

MP67 11 Reviews 317 reads
posted
25 / 82

I understand the need for personal safety for the ladies, but come on! You see 30 providers and do a NCNS cuz shit happened? Then get on the list?

And they wonder why business is slow.

johngaltnh 6 Reviews 465 reads
posted
26 / 82

When a provider gets a bad review, she often has the ability to challenge it; particularly if it was a fake review or contained patently erroneous information.

She KNOWS that the review exists. It isn't hidden from her. She can read it. She even knows who wrote it if it is someone she has seen. And if it is fake or erroneous, she can challenge it.

This is an above-board process that is certainly imperfect; but at least gives a provider SOME access to arbitration and justice.

However, the blacklists are done more like Soviet-style blacklists. When a guy is on one, he is never told. He has no idea who put the information there, what information is there, or any recourse to arbitration to challenge a provider who might have mistakenly credited him with something that another client did, etc. (Note: according to LGs survey, the average provider has seen over 860 clients. Getting someone mixed up is not impossible.)

Basically, the blacklists are the epitome of Soviet-style injustice.

The fact that someone broke a rule which is unjust to start with doesn't outrage me at all.

The underground railroad broke all the rules and laws too. But in so doing, it sought to right an injustice.

If providers are actually interested in accurate information and justice, they can open up the process to hobbyists so that hobbyists can know if they are on a list, why, who and when -- and have the same capacity to challenge such entries as providers have to challenge reviews.

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 393 reads
posted
27 / 82

I agree that outing real names and real info for a no show is very wrong and I'm always aware and careful with people's information. In my experience, most people who were not good did not give their real info, just hobbying info and references. I don't want to discuss my bad experiences here but I really felt at the time that other girls needed to be warned. You're right it's not like a review so it can't be taken too seriously unless there is a real issue; otherwise you have to read between the lines as I've seen clients in those sites that I really liked.  

Posted By: johngaltnh
My first beef with the National Blacklist is that it OUTS hobbyists. That is, it puts their real name, work address, email, etc. right out there where any google search on the guy's name let's the whole world know he is a hobbyist.

My second beef is that too many providers, showing an extraordinary sense of disproportionate justice, out guys to the world on this list for things which are problematic to be sure, but unworthy of such an outing. About a third of all NBL listings are for NCNS. What is that missed appointment worth? $300? $600? And over a lousy 300-600, they think NOTHING of totally outing the guy so his kids get to grow up without a father or he gets canned from a six figure job. Total irresponsible bullshit.

My final beef is it is unaccountable. That is, providers who OUT a hobbyist nationally, especially when doing so for reasons other than violence, are in no way accountable for having done so. It's a way of being able to cost people their families, jobs and homes while being immune to reprisal. Used injudiciously, the lack of accountability can make it a form of terrorism.

With all due respect to providers, this is very different from trashing a lady in a review. The review is under your stage name. It is not the same thing as making your status as a provider show up under google searches for your *real name* so that future employers, potential boyfriends and future husbands won't touch you with a 10' pole or so that your ex-husband will use that as leverage to challenge child custody and turn your life into a living hell.

Furthermore, a review provides some context because most ladies have many reviews; so potential clients see both the bad AND the good. By comparison, the blacklists do not give that sort of context -- they list only the single NCNS (for example) and *never* show the dozens of on-time, cleaned-up, paid-in-full appointments.

Incidentally, to the best of my knowledge, I'm on no blacklists, so I don't have a personal ax to grind here.

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 407 reads
posted
28 / 82

There are so many back channeling venues that can potentially talk about me (email lists, private forums etc...) without my ever knowing it right? Usually those providers black lists are the same, not open to everyone you need to sign up and be verified as a provider (not sure I only use one). That's very soviet too but there isn't much I can do about it.

MsChayse 392 reads
posted
29 / 82

You do have the option to dispute a BL entry. On providerbuzz, we are warned that a client can dispute an accusation via Email, & they are obligated the post the argument.

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 360 reads
posted
31 / 82

got to that number of clients per provider...

johngaltnh 6 Reviews 351 reads
posted
32 / 82

On many others, that doesn't apply unfortunately.

You can setup your profile to email you automatically when you get a bad review.

Can I have providerbuzz (which I've never heard of before) inform me if anything negative about me is posted there?

But at least there is one place doing things the right way -- good!

johngaltnh 6 Reviews 328 reads
posted
33 / 82

There's no combating the rumor mill, and the rumor mill can be merciless.

Of course, just as hobbyists have back channels, so do providers. So that situation isn't unique to either party.

It's important to keep in mind that erroneous information hurts safety overall.

johngaltnh 6 Reviews 298 reads
posted
34 / 82

It was a voluntary survey, so there is some self-selection bias. And nobody put a lie-detector test on the providers answering, so they could have been lying. But from those answers, the average was over 860.

If you have only seen, say, 100 -- there's another ter-listed lady out there who has seen 1500 to bring that average back to 800+.

It boggles my mind!

johngaltnh 6 Reviews 403 reads
posted
35 / 82

Usually providers use diet, exercise and maybe a little liposuction to deal with their waist; not me. (*grin*)

And any provider who knows what she's doing knows how to make me speechless. LOL

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 322 reads
posted
36 / 82

All the really bad experience I've encountered with my agency or by myself have been gents with stellar references so they must have acted right at some point. There was a lady who complained about a guy I liked that he was stalking her. Was it her perception or did he send just one too many emails? It's not that simple, maybe for you it is but in general it's a big mystery to me how some really dangerous guys can turn real fast without my understating why.

AllyMoore See my TER Reviews 445 reads
posted
37 / 82

Personally, I no longer share information with other providers about inconveniences such as time wasting, soft bookings, last-minute cancellations, attitude problems/conflicts or other general annoyances.

I once shared my thoughts about a hobbyist on the Provider-Only board after what I perceived to be antagonistic communication ( I provided his name and email address as a *warning* to others.  My intuition said he was a time bomb - and others did find him to be a problematic client in months following).  

This entry made its way from TER's Provider Only Board to the National Blacklist.  I had to work to have it removed- but too late, damage done!  

I posted another entry about a client who frightened me because he brought a very large knife to an hour appointment to cut fruit; the odd behavior scared me so much that I let him remain for an additional hour.
This complaint immediately returned to the client.

Simply put: A this point I am now unwilling to endanger my livelihood or compromise the quality of a client's life over anything less than physical or mental abuse, thievery or refusal to pay.  

In addition to the siphoning of entries from private provider networks there are the entries which are placed purely to disrupt lives over petty grievances.
 
I saw a client who visited Boston last summer despite an entry for him on the Blacklist because he was extremely forthcoming, thoughtful, kind and engaging in correspondence with me.
Upon meeting I found him to be the consummate gentleman: fun, energetic - really everything that a provider could hope for in a client.
I mentioned in passing that I made myself available to him despite the entry on the public Blacklist- and he was completely unaware of it.  He immediately Google'ed his name and lo- there it was on the National Blacklist directly under professional and personal profiles.  He suspected the entry was placed by a vindictive provider he'd dated.

The National Blacklist is completely abhorrent and I agree with your complaints entirely.

MsChayse 332 reads
posted
38 / 82

I really don't know about that one hon. What I do know is if you discover you have been blacklisted you are welcome to dispute through "contact us" & it will be posted. It is ok BTW for a lady to tell you. Just not cool to tell who blacklisted you, or disclose info that may jeopardize the identity of of the reporter.

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 329 reads
posted
39 / 82

I don't buy that one at all. I don't know one lady who really counts how many guys she sees per week, month, year. I've never had that kind of conversation with any of my peers. I could guestimate (but it wouldn't be accurate) if I really put my brain into it however I have better things to count than that. It takes a civie to think about counting that stuff. LG should stick with counting her own number of times she gives it out for free, sorry couldn't help it.

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 329 reads
posted
40 / 82

Who r u calling Granny? I don't get why the alias' though. We are all here behind fake identities anyways. Maybe I'm missing something.

MP67 11 Reviews 274 reads
posted
41 / 82

Right on Cleo! BTW, I know you don't count, but I'll be the one that counts, know what I'm sayin'?! ;)

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 321 reads
posted
42 / 82

I spend too much money to look like her grand child:) No I read don't worry!

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 374 reads
posted
43 / 82

I stopped at 20 y/o knowing it was going to be a very long one. Providers count 2 things: they count money and they count on themselves:)

MP67 11 Reviews 269 reads
posted
44 / 82

Damn, that was a week ago. Didn't think anyone remembered that! ;)

OldArmyGuy 37 Reviews 359 reads
posted
46 / 82

Easy for you to say....your NCNS was with 2 hobby buddies. Am I wrong????

pwilley 59 Reviews 350 reads
posted
47 / 82

Just curious if anyone knows why admin has this policy.  On the surface, it just doesn't seem to serve any beneficial purpose, but maybe I'm overlooking something.

madiba51 339 reads
posted
48 / 82

One common reason it happens is that the victim reminds the aggressor of someone from their past, and they are reacting to that person instead of to the person in front of them.

Even in relatively "mild" cases, like someone suddenly being upset with you for very little or no reason, it is good to remember that this might be happening. Knowing this can help prevent an escalating cycle of misinterpretations and unnecessary bad feelings.

Posted By: sensualcleoforyou
All the really bad experience I've encountered with my agency or by myself have been gents with stellar references so they must have acted right at some point. There was a lady who complained about a guy I liked that he was stalking her. Was it her perception or did he send just one too many emails? It's not that simple, maybe for you it is but in general it's a big mystery to me how some really dangerous guys can turn real fast without my understating why.
-- Modified on 12/18/2010 7:45:53 PM

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 335 reads
posted
49 / 82

if people were to write reviews about appointments that didn't occur there would be no end to the story however NCNS goes both ways and it is just as bad if a lady does it.

BoondockSaint 305 reads
posted
50 / 82

I am not trying to be argumentative, and I fully support a provider's need to stay safe.  But how does it out a provider in jeopardy when we don't know their real name or address?  You ladies know so much about us, hell you even call our offices to verify identity (I live in DC and I ain't no bricklayer, so I cringe at this).  We know very little at all about you, and if you wish to avoid a hobbyist it is much easier to do so than it would be for us to avoid being outed.

I agree in spirit with the NBL but there is not enough accountability and way too many crazy providers for me to not be scared shitless about it quite frankly.  I've heard enough from a ex-girlfriend who was a retired provider to know you can not collectively be trusted to police yourselves.

Anything that is not violent or otherwise unsafe should NOT be grounds for possibly ruining someone's life.

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 317 reads
posted
51 / 82

Why the alias? A brick layer's life is less important than yours and he can afford to be outed? If you were that high up in the government you would be here chatting us up for our entertainment and you wouldn't be dating ex providers as you wouldn't be able to afford it.

-- Modified on 12/18/2010 8:49:21 PM

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 281 reads
posted
52 / 82

Usually the infraction is premeditated that means that he looked at my pics and felt that way before hand? Yuck!!

BoondockSaint 341 reads
posted
53 / 82

When did I say that your life is any less important than mine?  I simply asked how it puts a lady in danger if she can't blacklist a guy for a simple NCNS or by him finding out.

And why do you care of I post under an alias?  Would you otherwise blacklist me just for asking a question?  I'm not against you ladies having a way to keep yourselves safe.  I want all of you ladies to be safe and avoid creeps.  But if you expect me to close my eyes and pretend it is not abused by some you're crazy.

Basically anytime I give a provider my information I am trusting she's not going to flake out and disclose that information because I gave her a subpar review or didn't tip or got pulled into an emergency meeting or got in a car accident (I have never, ever given a woman a legitimate reason to blacklist me, I am a very non-violent and caring man, nor have I ever been blacklisted AFAIK).

It only takes one time for an unbalanced provider to have a bad day, or perhaps even a bad trip, and now my info is potentially available on Google.

Yeah, pardon me for giving a shit about that.

BoondockSaint 321 reads
posted
54 / 82

What is it with you and your constant assumption that I value others as less than me?  I am no better than a brick layer, but my job is certainly much more in jeopardy if I am outed.  There is a lot more than congress and politicians around here.  Some people here have jobs where a misdemeanor DUI can result in them being blacklisted from an entire industry.

You ask me why I am using an alias... well why are you modifying entire posts?

johngaltnh 6 Reviews 294 reads
posted
55 / 82

Of course, references in a sense are self-selecting.

By that I mean that if you ask me for references, I certainly wouldn't use a lady I had mistreated as a reference. Instead, I'd use a lady I had treated well. And since (other than reviews, which I would only do for ladies I had treated well) you have no way of knowing who I have seen; references can never be fully relied upon to tell you anything except that I am not LE.

So even the most stellar of references, in terms of predicting behavior, are not particularly reliable.

I think at some point, most providers develop a very good sense of reading people implicitly and through indirect means; and by reading between the lines can pick up on positive and negative traits. I don't think references can be used as a substitute for this.

But I DO agree -- certainly, I would suspect that a great many entries in such lists are not erroneous.

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 307 reads
posted
56 / 82

If you have good references I'm not quit sure why you have to keep giving your office info to every new provider you meet. The black list sites I know you need to be screened as a provider to be able to see what's in there I don't remember any sites where info is available without being screened but it wouldn't surprise me and yes I find that wrong.

I'm in the same boat, I never know what a client can do or if he can flake out on me during a session, after a session while chatting on boards or in back channel, mailing list etc... He can turn around and have his friend Charlie to book me for a session and get even with me. It's that simple and in the States LE could care less about an escort and because it's sooooo illegal I couldn't even call the police to press charges. In a less dangerous scenario my name could easily be wrongly trashed and that would be tragic for me. I can't change my fake identity that easily, my business is just as important to me as your office job is to you, plain and simple.

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 285 reads
posted
57 / 82

You brought up the brick layer honey... People have big balls behind alias'.

BoondockSaint 315 reads
posted
58 / 82

Thanks for explaining; that all certainly makes sense and I certainly encourage you to do whatever is necessary to stay safe.  I find it hard to imagine how anyone would ever be capable of harming another (let alone having the desire) but I guess it is a fact of life.

Several of my regular ladies have retired during the recent DC implosion, don't know the other referenced provider, or explicitly do not provide references outside of date-check or P411, so I have had to do employment screening the last couple of times.  There is a lot of paranoia going on around here right now.

PS:  I just PM's you so you'll know I am not a board troll hiding behind an alias.

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 317 reads
posted
59 / 82

I do ask for references what else do I have to protect myself but I'm sure that I've met cops. Like they wouldn't see escorts? I've lately heard of a few girls I know who had cops on their dance cards. I'm sure these same cops get references from these girls... argh... Makes me sick to think about it.

johngaltnh 6 Reviews 331 reads
posted
60 / 82

Not surprisingly, we agree on this.

But here is where the rubber hits the road, and why the misuse of these lists by anonymous providers in an unethical and disproportionate fashion is actually bad for *providers*.

Human beings remember negative stuff much more powerfully than positive stuff. As a result, it looms larger in our minds.

When a hobbyist becomes aware of the pervasive nature of such misbehavior on the part of providers, he becomes very concerned about certain aspects of verification -- specifically anything where he gives the provider any information that she could use to hurt him. But this is the VERY information she most desires, because her mere possession of that information could be used as a deterrent to misbehavior.

A cycle of mutual distrust ensues.

A cycle of distrust is bad for business. It makes a marginal difference in thousands of decisions every day where appointments aren't booked and money is never exchanged.

OSP 26 Reviews 254 reads
posted
61 / 82

"Can a brother get an"........AMEN.  LOL


I ain't callin you anymore. You never pick up.

scoed 8 Reviews 258 reads
posted
62 / 82

Posted By: johngaltnh
When a provider gets a bad review, she often has the ability to challenge it; particularly if it was a fake review or contained patently erroneous information.

She KNOWS that the review exists. It isn't hidden from her. She can read it. She even knows who wrote it if it is someone she has seen. And if it is fake or erroneous, she can challenge it.

This is an above-board process that is certainly imperfect; but at least gives a provider SOME access to arbitration and justice.

However, the blacklists are done more like Soviet-style blacklists. When a guy is on one, he is never told. He has no idea who put the information there, what information is there, or any recourse to arbitration to challenge a provider who might have mistakenly credited him with something that another client did, etc. (Note: according to LGs survey, the average provider has seen over 860 clients. Getting someone mixed up is not impossible.)

Basically, the blacklists are the epitome of Soviet-style injustice.

The fact that someone broke a rule which is unjust to start with doesn't outrage me at all.

The underground railroad broke all the rules and laws too. But in so doing, it sought to right an injustice.

If providers are actually interested in accurate information and justice, they can open up the process to hobbyists so that hobbyists can know if they are on a list, why, who and when -- and have the same capacity to challenge such entries as providers have to challenge reviews.

scoed 8 Reviews 339 reads
posted
64 / 82

Many don't let you even know your on it and even if you some how find out you have 0% chance of getting it removed, or to tell your side of the story.

MsChayse 276 reads
posted
65 / 82

Point taken. I am not, & will not be a part of those sites. Additionally, posting clients real first, & last name, place of employment, ect is NOT something I advocate. I agree my $$$ loss to a NCNS, or "time waster" is not good cause for virtually destroying a person's life, & more importantly, the lives of the innocent parties that love them. I personally caution hobbyists from giving out TMI to providers. It is not necessary to know where you work, see photo ID, get pics of you via email, ect to do a proper, & safe screening. Le can, & do have second employers, personal email addresses, & civi ID's. The reality is, as long as gents are willing to provide such personal info, providers will continue to require it. This is just my opinion, & I am not slamming anyone here. I respect everyone's right to do business as they see fit. A person's comfort level by far out weighs my opinions.

EdrienneCole See my TER Reviews 214 reads
posted
66 / 82

Doesn't anyone you know pay taxes?  Or track their advertising efficacy in ROI?  To do that, you have to know how many dates (and from what sources) you've had.  I keep a calendar with the entries limited to initials, amount, duration, location.  I can tell exactly how many dates I've had - as well as what percentage/frequency of repeats and the ratio of increase event/duration as correlates to rate raises.  I don't advertise other than the verification sites (or here now and then), so tracking advertising ROI isn't important to me and the location info is useful for mileage purposes. There is nothing incriminating in keeping track of your income, unless you plan not to pay taxes on it, and other than the initials of gents there is nothing for LE/IRS to decipher regarding the identity of my friends (as if they even cared in the first place).  Granted, I've not done this the entire time I've entertained in this demimonde, but since I turned the corner and decided to actually treat it like a business and not some hobby.... it seemed silly not to track these things.

Cynamon See my TER Reviews 344 reads
posted
67 / 82

I may have lucked out thus far but I have not had to even consider putting anyone on a blacklist. I honestly don't feel like a NCNS is an adequate reason to blacklist someone. I just block their number and move on. This didn't put my life in danger and just because he NCNS with me does not mean that he will be like that with every provider. I had to do a NCNS once with a client and would hate if that would have negatively effected any potential clients that I would have in the future.

On the other hand I can understand having a blacklist for anyone that may have some STD or was violent towards a provider or was LE, as these are things that put providers at risk.

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 278 reads
posted
68 / 82

in fact it doesn't take me much of a system to understand if I'm ahead or not by adding on a little piece of paper (that I throw away after my tour) my entries minus my expenses and trust me I remember the next time around when it's time to plan which cities to visit. To me it's seems silly to trip in the flowers of the carpet for such details but to each is own.

Posted By: EdrienneCole
Doesn't anyone you know pay taxes?  Or track their advertising efficacy in ROI?  To do that, you have to know how many dates (and from what sources) you've had.  I keep a calendar with the entries limited to initials, amount, duration, location.  I can tell exactly how many dates I've had - as well as what percentage/frequency of repeats and the ratio of increase event/duration as correlates to rate raises.  I don't advertise other than the verification sites (or here now and then), so tracking advertising ROI isn't important to me and the location info is useful for mileage purposes. There is nothing incriminating in keeping track of your income, unless you plan not to pay taxes on it, and other than the initials of gents there is nothing for LE/IRS to decipher regarding the identity of my friends (as if they even cared in the first place).  Granted, I've not done this the entire time I've entertained in this demimonde, but since I turned the corner and decided to actually treat it like a business and not some hobby.... it seemed silly not to track these things.

EdrienneCole See my TER Reviews 306 reads
posted
69 / 82

I guess I'm just a little more anal than some. ;-)  I like knowing details like what percentage/frequency of repeats I get, what the cycles and flow of business are (seasonal, influenced by political happenings/financial or tax policies/stock market fluctuations, etc) and I absolutely track overhead.  I like keeping it under 20% and if I didn't track it, I'd have a tendency to overspend in the wrong areas and underspend in others - and all at the wrong time.  Keeping a running balance on income v expense, I can monitor what tax bracket my net profits fall into.  If I need to make quarter/year end deductible purchases to keep from getting nailed into a new bracket, I want to know about it!  lol  Its useful also for deciding how to divide my personal income between "income" and dividends.  I can't imagine doing it any other way, but if your method works for you, great!

smartassplayin 328 reads
posted
70 / 82

Especially if your doing things like paying taxes, tracking advertising, and keeping track of expenses.  A provider should be able to reach a reasonable # of clients she sees per yr working backwards from her financials,  These are only good business practices.  I do feel however many ladies aren't happy with the reality of the number that they get at the end of their arithmetic. IMHO

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 250 reads
posted
71 / 82

the only important number that matters is the amount I save at the end of each month and if I have reached my saving goal or not. If you need a bunch of graphics to get to that point... hey that's ok, nobody's perfect.

You're going to tell me that providers pay the right amount of taxes per year according to who they see and the frequency of their regular clientele? Maybe cash business means something different in the USA; I'm open to new concepts.

The rest of the important counting is done by my accountant; he is the best. I'm being audited by the tax department for the past 3 years so he's busy counting alright but nobody so far has been interested to know how many dudes I slept with during that period. One year I only slept with one guy for a huge amount all free of expenses does it mean I'm ahead? If you think so you should survey American married women and get back to me on your findings.

smartassplayin 238 reads
posted
72 / 82

My point was if you wanted to figure out a rough # of guys you were with per year you should be able to do so given the information you probably already track, or information you could ask your accountant for.  Is it my business or anyone elses, Hell No!!

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 359 reads
posted
73 / 82

Then auntie Cleo has to go talk with the adults...

The # of guys I sleep with doesn't = the amount of profit I yield. For 6k I can see 10 guys or I can see one guy so no there is absolutely no direct correlation between the numbers of guys I have sex with and my gross profit.

The end.

scoed 8 Reviews 216 reads
posted
74 / 82

Wrote a bad review so she is seeking revenge?
NCNS only once Seen? this on the very public National Blacklist
email/called a lady a few times to many times?
Pissed a provider off somehow?

Clients have been Blacklisted for all of the above.

Good honorable providers don't blacklist for little things. Unfortunately not every provider is even close to honorable. Most providers are honorable and trustworthy, but some ladies don't give a crap about their clients and are on the vindictive side. Just like some of us men are scum and use reviews as a weapon I have heard some ladies use the blacklists the same way.

I know those ladies that do so are often ignored by most of the others that know who she is but on the Google-able ones like the National Blacklist can and do out people and destroy lives. And to make things worse the guy can't ever get his name off.

Providers can always get delisted.

I think blacklists are necessary just like review sites are necessary but not being able to even contest the listing is wrong on so many levels. To make the guys real information public for something like a NCNS or showing up drunk if wrong on so many levels.

And to not even let you know you are on the list so you can depute it, that is punishment without trial. It is like if TER reviews had the providers real personal information and the ladies were not allowed to see who posted it, contest it, get delisted, read it, or even be let to know they even have a review, while having her information and the fact she is a provider very public. Not fair in the lest.

No I am not on a Blacklist, (i have a provider spy) but the way some work is like the National Blacklist is more than wrong it is criminal.

I have no problem with things like the providers only board or other nonpublic ways to blacklist problem clients. I do think that there needs to be a way for ladies to share information on LE and dangerous clients, but to do so publicly without even giving the guy a chance to dispute it is wrong. Very wrong.

scoed 8 Reviews 325 reads
posted
75 / 82
MP67 11 Reviews 235 reads
posted
76 / 82

It is always preached in my job that the customer doesn't remember the good shit you did for them, but the bad shit sticks in their skillet.

You could've busted your ass, saved them thousands of dollars because you were 'looking out' for them, but you fuck up once, of yeah, that sticks.

It's fucking bullshit, but that's the way it is.

inicky46 61 Reviews 355 reads
posted
78 / 82

I was off the board for the day and look at these threads as long as my arm!  I can't even read the whole thing!  I need to sleep so I can go see my hoped-for new ATF tomorrow night.  But, jeez, I had no idea providers paid taxes!  Really, that's news to me.  Why do you need to do that?  I mean, I know you don't want to get arrested but how would you get caught?  What do you list as your profession.  Mine used to say "Public Relations," which reminded me of the old joke that went: "I'm in public relations, but please don't tell my mom 'cause she still thinks I"m playing piano in a whorehouse!" So I figure it would be a big step up for me to list my profession as "Provider" next time on my 1040.

sensualcleoforyou See my TER Reviews 300 reads
posted
79 / 82

they're not too interested in knowing what you do for a living (or who you do). All they check is what you spent on paper versus the amount you declared as your income. As long as it balances you're good. Reality is we don't get paid via our bank accounts unless we accept deposits and even then you can get away with it so not so sure why the argument of paying taxes on ALL our income was brought up as it makes no sense at all. I don't think I'm bringing up a new concept here about not claiming all income on a cash biz. However, I live in a country where it's legal, where I can call the cops if I catch a beating while at work and where taxes would be 40% to 55% if I would declare ALL my income so it may be a very different story for me.

EdrienneCole See my TER Reviews 344 reads
posted
80 / 82

Why pay taxes?  
Because god-forbid a girl gets caught and a slap-on-the-wrist misdemeanor becomes years of jail time for tax evasion.
Because (arguably) it'a the civic-minded, right thing to do.
Because if there's ever a chance that you might need Social Security (assuming its still around) for disability or old-age pensioning, its better to have paid into it than not.
Because if you plan to ever buy a decent car (over 10k), house, investment property, send a kid to college, start a legit business, etc you need a healthy bank account balance, records of your taxes paid appropriate to the level of loan you seek and some sort of "job" (even self-employed) and for your debt-to-income ratio being appropriate to make you a good loan candidate.  
Because its smart to keep your resume updated and competitive (running a company always looks good) and it's smart to be able to get credit for all the marketing, administrative, executive experience that being self-employed affords - provable by tax records. (Anyone can claim anything on a resume but tax records are especially important for the self-employed)
Because everyone must retire one day and investing for that purpose requires traceable income.

How could a girl get caught on tax evasion?
Anytime something prompts the IRS to audit her or look into her standard of living v reported income.  Could be dozens of different things that trigger this.... only one of which is a nutty client.

Listed profession.... anything you please!  "Escort", "model", "entertainer" are all relatively accurate, legal and appropriate.


smartassplayin 223 reads
posted
81 / 82

I don't believe that you cant remember a client payed you 6000 grand this yr.  I believe you may not remember his name but i would think you would remember 6000 grand from one guy.  No need to be a smartass, perhaps you cant figure out the # of guys you slept with I'm not sure why you would want to anyway.  But obviously there were a decent amount of providers that could.
Thanks for playin,
Smartass

Dr Who revived 427 reads
posted
82 / 82

You are spot on in your reply as far as "why pay taxes", but I doubt that the majority of ladies report this income, let alone think long-term as to how to utilize the information to an advantage for all of the reasons you have correctly listed.  For those ladies (like yourself) who do understand that this is an important part of running this "business", I truly applaud you.  Where I find the others lacking in their objectivity is so short term as to see that they will be forced into making bad decisions for perhaps the rest of their lives.  And I see similarities amongst many small business owners who simply fail to understand long-range planning.  All you need to look at are the current crop of "retirees" who are living in sub-standard lifestyles since their earnings power is gone and the "nest egg" was no where near enough to maintain their standard of living while they were earning (in many cases) a nice living.

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