But seriously, aren't those the best sex ever?

It's too bad you don't shop Walmart. There's a special on hairshirts down there.

I am in no position to judge the choices someone makes. I have chosen to pay for sex, providers have chosen to be paid. I Do choose providers that I feel show some class and intelligence in their posts/adverts and I tend more toward 30 y/olds so I feel they may have the intelligence and life experience to make a considered choice, but again it's really not my business.

Your completely right, supposedly 90% of escorts were molested as children. With the exception of the girls who abuse drugs and alcohol you are actually benefiting the girls circumstance by seeing her for an appointment. Either shes lost her job or can't find one, hasn't finished school, was out on her ass with nowhere to go, had a kid at 16 etc etc. Shes got her issues, she will have them regardless if you see her or if some other guy will see her. Generally the more selective the girl is, the less chance that she really HAS to escort to survive.

Sooo off base. I was raised in a 2 parent upper-middle class family, went to college twice, don't use drugs OR drink AT ALL... So, why is a normal girl like me doing this? Because it pays more than working 2 jobs, and I still have time for my kids that I didn't when working the 2 jobs all the time. And not all of us "buy designer clothes".. I still shop at the mall here in town, and Walmart.. just like a regular person. I get to meet people from all different lifestyles and backgrounds that I NEVER would have gotten to know if it wasn't for providing

Don't ever get married! You are way too conflicted and guilt ridden, and the woman will use it to guilt you into having everything her way. I can imagine that deep down you even feel approaching any lady for sex is an assault on her sensibilities. Also meaning that if you do get married, your sex life will be very short lived.

I hope this is on track with your whole post, because I couldn't stand reading past the first paragraph.

someone pretending to be a sincere hobbyist, but who is actually the cuckolded wife of a hobbyist, a married hobbyist found out by his wife & forced to write the OP, A "Bible thumper", or an "End Demand" feminist who wants to wipe out providing ?

I'm not saying there isn't a "seamy underdside" to hobbying/providing & that it isn't a problem,
but my BS alarm went off after reading the OP.
If you believe he/she is sincere, then I can let you have the following piece of prime real estate dirt cheap-----

Because there's no way a woman would ever do this because she wants to?  Whatfuckingever.  I'm white and was raised in the suburbs by a well-educated father (Stanford for undergrad, Columbia for Grad school) and mother (master's degree).  My mother stayed at home with us kids until we were teenagers and she decided to get out and have more time for herself.  

I have a bachelor's degree and gave up a perfectly well-paying respectable career to do this.  I have choices in life that others would love to have.

But there is the matter of my sister.  She was raped.  I wonder why no one ever asks if that's why she became a lawyer?  The assertion that sexual transgressions are so unusual it must surely account for the rare species of Provider is unfounded.  All the stats we have indicate that sexual assault, molestation, etc are prolific.  Ever thought of asking why other professions have so many adult survivors?

i feel guilty and conflicted about hobbying
>>>>>>then don’t

I just feel al ittle uncomfortable taking advantage of someones economic and psychological state
>>>>then don’t

im not saying every provider is bi polar homeless drug addict
|>>>Whew….glad you’re clear on this

sex and psychology are related are sexual likes and dislikes and persusasions
are based psychological factors that probably developed during childhood

>>>>umm……well…not always. Maybe sometimes. What’s your point?

Im going to say that alot girls in this buisness did not grow up in the typical
suburban two parent households

>>>>>hell, LOTS of people didn’t grow up in the typical two parent suburban household. Raising my hand. And?

and...just decided two sell sex for expensive designer cloths

>>>>>>lol….I suspect motivations for choosing to go into this business are more complex that this. But, if it allows (provides?) for expensive designer clothes? Cool. I can’t afford those cause I spend all my disposable income on providers who use my money to buy expensive designer clothes?....hmm……wait a minute….

If a girl is 18-24 is sucking off fat old guys  for money in a hotel  room ….Im going to cocncur that something unique happended to her as a childhood whether its molestation,rape or maybe just bad relationships with men.

>>>>seriously? The ‘ol 'all providers were sexually abused as children' schtick?

sucking off old guys for money is not normal in the context of American society.

HAHA….HAHA....since when?


I’m conflicted.
>>>>>>no kidding. That’s about the only thing in your post I can't disagree with.

 I figured you were a Bible thumping, anti hobbying, hypocritical preacher before finishing the second  paragraph. When you mentioned you are liberal,and your anti Wal Mart spiel I knew for sure you are lying.
I reckon you want Wal Mart to fire the million employees they have that would not be hired at Sachs or Bloomingdales.
What do you know about providers with four experiences..or was  fourt not a typo and your way of saying  forty .
For further discussion and analysis bring it on to the Politics and RELIGION Board, if you dare.

You really ought to reserve them for yourself.

And if the thought of a woman being forced into degrading labor for your benefit makes you queasy, then please never buy any electronics from Asia. (Ever see one of the dirt floor factories where the components are assembled?)

And finally, please don't go around saying your a liberal.

We liberals are having a hard enough time as it is without this.

I'm a liberal libertarian ( yes, the two philosophies are compatible ) & I DON'T buy into the the philosophy that "everyone is a victim".
I know many liberals that agree with me. You're
stereotyping a particular philosophy. The equivalent of that would be me saying that all conservatives are stupid bigots, & of course, we know that to be untrue.

I think the OP IS pushing a particular agenda ( outlined in my above thread ), but I don't think liberalisim has anything to do with it.

"Only the provider can say if the compensation and working conditions are to her liking.'
"The hobby is not all lily white and gilt edged - it is not for the squeamish or faint of heart"

Personally I would rather my daughter was a provider than a coal miner or some other job where she is being exploited under dangerous conditions. Coal miner can't walk away if the smell isn't right. Elevators don't go back to the surface  until the shift is over or the mine blows up.

I am single man that has hobbied about fourt times over the last 4 years.
But i feel guilty and conflicted about hobbying. I just feel al ittle uncomfortable taking
advantage of someones economic and psychological state. and im deciding whether
to keep hobbying or go back to the civvie world or just hobbying on rare occasions when
I really need to

Now im not saying every provider is bi polar homeless drug addict.
but sex and psychology are related are sexual likes and dislikes and persusasions
are based psychological factors that probably developed during childhood.
Im going to say that alot girls in this buisness did not grow up in the typical
suburban two parent households and just decided two sell sex for expensive designer cloths. Even though there is some of that, I think us hobbyist try to convince ourselves that is the majority of providers story.

If a girl is 18-24 is sucking off fat old guys  for money in a hotel  room instead out having fun with her freinds. Im going to cocncur that something unique happended to her as a childhood whether its molestation,rape or maybe just bad relationships with men. sucking off old guys for money is not normal in the context of American society. I know that we can consider sexual or psychological behavior relative or subjective,  but i think we have some standards.


as far as econoic exploitation. I know people go to work everyday and do things they dont wanna do. As a liberal I dont wanna go to places like walmart because I feel like they exploit people to a extreme degree and i feel the same way about some aspect of hobbying. especially girls who are forced here overseas from asia and russia. or forced into the profession under false pretenses. Or afrcian american females who might be railroaded into the industry becasue of racial and class disparites and inequality.

I know in the civvie  world there are aspects of pay for play that defitly benefeit woman.
Paying for dates, dinners or getting half you money taken in divorce with nothing
to gain for it is frustrating and pushes me towards the hobby sometime, and that economic and psycholoigcal exploitations is debatable in the hobby depending on circumstances. its like a choice being taken advantage of in the civilian world take advantage of others in the hobby world.

im conflicted give your opinion sorry for the long post.

Yea I feel guilty too, but WTF it goes away quick.

But, it is your responsibility to make sure---- absolutely sure---with no question, that you are dealing with a lady who is in this business with full consent, and doing this because she is choosing to do so.

That part is completely on you.

If, at any point, you think you may be dealing with a woman who is not participating willingly, with full consent, it is up to you to stop.

OTOH, if she is in this biz willingly with full consent? Well freaking good for her. She’s probably making more $ than most of her clients. And I’m sure there are good days and bad days in her professional life---like all the rest of us

But, that is not some kind of Dateline NBC travesty.

Doctor: "...Then don't go like that."

" feel a little uncomfortable taking advantage of someones economic and psychological state."

Then quit taking dates with CL girls, fly out to Nevada and pay for what is legal.

" If a girl is 18-24 is sucking off fat old guys  for money in a hotel  room instead out having fun with her friends."

I am not ignoring the fact that there is coercion, pimps, and 'bad things happened when I was younger'.  It's a fact and it does happen but why isn't a girl 18-24 at work somewhere, with a vanilla job?  

To assume that someone has absolutely no other choice in life but to __(fill in blank)___ for a living is demeaning and denigrating to their person and intellect.

As a libertarian, I recommend you just buy a Real Doll.  That way you can tell your 'playmate' "...Oooooo you little 18 year old slut, I'm so glad your here sucking my old fat cock, instead of working at Walmart with your friends."  Then spank her.

I have no doubt that there are some folks providing because of the various upbringing issues you mention.  But, without revealing much about me, let me just say the situations you mention are a very small segment.  The vast majority are folks who are doing fine for themselves who have found that this type of work is easier for them than anything else available.  I mean, let's face it, where else can folks make 200 bucks an hour or more, choose their own work schedules, etc....  Now of course, if you are talking about street walkers in the seedy parts of town, that's another whole story... but if your talking about the "rest" I think your perception is way off base.

Good point...I pay for sex because its a rush to be with a variety of woman on my schedule...I use discretionary income that doesn't effect my family.  My upbringing was a fine loving two parent household and I never got molested by an uncle.  

I also know for certain that a dear friend (provider) has between 2 and 5 appointments a month.  Why does she do it???  Because its a rush to be with a variety of men on her schedule (see above)...she doesn't rely on the money for survival so she can pick and chose who she sees and when she sees them.

Sure, there are run-a-ways that get coerced by their pimps to turn tricks but that (I think) is a very small minority of those providers appearing on TER or other widely read review sites.

To the OP...please don't ever have this conversation with a provider, you make the leap that they are all desperate and begrudgingly doing this...in reality some may have underlying issues from childhood but then again...don't we all????

Face it, I am friendly with all the ladies & consider myself a friend (with certain benifits) to my favorites (repeats).   We both get what we want...  often times we get to enjoy great sex with a friend whom we'd not have had a LTR with...  
If I felt the lady was pressured or abused, I'd not go there.
skb

I've fallen for a hooker and I can't get up!!

It seems the only thing that helps me out of my depression over this part of my life is to go on spending binges at Wal Mart. Somehow it makes me feel better.

Problem with that, is now I have also become a hoarder. What's a hobbyist to do?

I am a fat, old guy.  How else am I supposed to get  an 18-24 yr old girl to suck me off?  If there is an alternative, I would like to know.

feel bad about it or feel good...however I personally don't see how You can feel bad about something that feels soooo Good....lol...I Enjoy what I do...I did Not have anything bad happen to me when I was a child...I have met a lot of Awesome Gentlemen...and have Enjoyed soooo much Pleasure myself...I think You have been watching to many movies...because I too had the same thoughts You do...until I got into this myself...and Life is Good

I am not a ringerf from a logical stand point i see the appeal and justification
for  hobbying especially since regualr dating involves alot of money. and i defended hobbying at the end of my firs post.

everyone who is paid to do anything is being "exploited" for their time and talents. Thats what an economy is based on.

Only the provider can say if the compensation and working conditions are to her liking. She is as far as we are able to discern (unless she tells us otherwise) either a contractor working for an agency or a sole proprietor of her own business. Any more than that is not our business or our concern.

The hobby is not all lily white and gilt edged - it is not for the squeamish or faint of heart

or the PC

just the PC ones - they are just as much a danger to freedom and human dignity as the fucking Christian Reconstructionist movement lol.....

"Now im not saying every provider is bi polar homeless drug addict."

No. Apparenly only about 90% of us are. Yay for us.


"If a girl is 18-24 is sucking off fat old guys  for money in a hotel  room instead out having fun with her freinds. Im going to cocncur that something unique happended to her as a childhood whether its molestation,rape or maybe just bad relationships with men. sucking off old guys for money is not normal in the context of American society."

How about you don't *concur* anything other than the fact that you don't know jack. You don't know any of us, who we are, what we are, why are what we are, or why we do what we do. Don't ask us either. If we want you to know our life history, we'll tell you.

"sucking off old guys for money is not normal in the context of American society."

Wanna bet?? It isn't called the world's oldest profession for nothing. Men want sex. Women want money. That has been a very simple equation since before we even had such a thing called money. Back in the day, cavemen traded fish and deerskin for a quick tumble. We may be a little more sophisticated about it today what with the internet and all, but the basic equation has never changed, nor will it ever change as long as the human race continues to exist.

"as far as econoic exploitation. I know people go to work everyday and do things they dont wanna do."

I wake up every day EXCITED to do what I do. Can you say the same? I get to have orgasms, and get paid for it. Jesus, everyone should be so lucky. So who is the exploited one here, me or you? I won't argue with women being forced or coerced into providing. It does happen. Women coming from other counties are very vulnerable to being exploited in this way to 'pay off their bond' so to speak. Its wrong, and it shouldn't be tolerated. Do NOT confuse that sort of exploitation with ladies who are educated, independent, and who make a decision to become a provider on their own. They are two very different things.

You asked for suggestions, and here is mine - take up stamp collecting and please for God's sake stop trying to play armchair psychologist. You don't know me, you don't know any provider, so stop thinking you can make any assumptions about who we are or why we are what we are.

Brains....beauty (I checked out her website and just about slid out of my chair).....and excellent writing skills.

You said it exactly right Edrienne. Kudos.

whoa the hostility here is crazy.
1st i have no problem with people who hobby or provide.
I do not think it should be illegal at all and would have any problem with legalization.
As fas as my liberalism goes my issue with walmart is they drive
out other buisness like aldi that pay a higher wage to to employees
and that they get alot of goods from china and korea where people
work 15 hrs a days 98 cent and hour.

but i do not beleive walmart should be made illegal
that is the same way i feel about hobbying sometimes

as a far as psychological exploitations. I said in my first post all girls
in the hobby are not psyvhological damage. but there is enough of it even on the internet higher level circuit that you will run into a significant amount of girls with a
rough past, and the fact that i might know who had a happy childhood from the ones
who didnt makes me un  comfortable.

In the civvie world i feel the shoe is on the other foot when it comes to dating because
the man get screwed  paying for dates or getting half of his assets taken in divorce
so i understand why men like myself are drawn towards hobbying.

sucking old guys cocks lol - any of them who have the self discipline not to blow it all on silly shit, or who are not actually being pimped (suitcase or otherwise) are making one helluva living. A lot more than most of these guys worrying about them.....  

If I run into a lady who strikes me as (or informs me to the effect) under duress or not compentent to make a decision in the matter. I decline.....

Otherwise I'm good!

I mean that in the best way possible....me just like most of the ladies here do so by choice....I hope so anyways. Soooooooo yeaahhhhhh ummmmmm don't see it as the guys taking advantage of a girl. I feel worse for the guy if he spends 400 on someone who acts like she can't wait for him to leave.  And it's not like we just sit in our hotels for appt....good thing is we can set shed's how we want to.  Some of like being a man's fantasy a lot of us are. Lol and there's racial/class dsiparities in this industry too so meh ..... this will be going on after you leave hobbying if you do.... but I hope not and you shouldn't feel guilty.

I am going on my 8th trip to the Dominican Republic this year... One of my best buddies (who initially signed up to go) had some doubts (he is married); so I advised him to sit down for this trip. Problem solved.

So there ya go... feel guilty? Stop doing it and get off the "high horse morality preacher podium"...

Have you been to the DMV lately?

Sorry if this strikes you as hostile, but if you stand back and look at where you are coming from, you will see that the response is generated by your narrow point of view on these matters.

As you sow, so ye shall reap, and all that.

Thanks for not saying it isn't about the money, it is! I've seen too many times about how providers really don't make that much or this or that. I would retort, why in the fuck would you do it then? Do you really like meeting, balding, sometimes malodorous men with time and money to burn? Regardless of how you get here, you're here and that goes for all of us. You can psychoanalyze this shit until you are blue in the face and the answer would be the same. The OP is conflicted and should stay on the bench. He pities women that turn to this and for that he is really someone that doesn't get it. You get it. You make a living and are raising your family. Try doing that on a Walmart salary.

If you are not comfortable with hobbying, then don't.   As for Walmart, I made no comments, but  I disagree with you on that also.  As for being psychologically damaged, practically everyone in the human race has had their bad moments, some worse than others.  It's not the bad things that happen in life that define you, it's how you respond that does.  

If you think that civvie ladies are less damaged/better adjusted than providers, you need a wake-up call.

Being a whore. I wrote all about it in my blog. The short version goes like this... Early on I recognized three women as elegant, beautiful, - WOMEN OF MAGNIFICENCE - whores. Jaquelin Kennedy Onassis, Elizabeth Taylor and MY MOTHER.

Does economics play a part of it? OH YES!
Does early childhood experiences contribute to my motivations? OH YES1      
I wrote all about that in my blog too.

All that said, what a wonderful way to go. Now at 52 I do wish I had applied myself to anything else so I could say I had a choice but that is not true at this time. When ever I take in a newbie one of the requirements I put on them is to go to school and learn other things that she can do if she should ever want to.

I love sex. I love men. I love money. I love leisurely living so you can come visit me and not feel as though you are exploiting me. Just make sure you treat me as a business woman in the best business of all. Treat me like a lady and be the best lover you can be and we'll get along wonderfully

Renee Holly

The few providers I've seen have all been normal, intelligent, creative women.  I have never felt like I've been taking advantage of them at all.

Some girls hobby thru college. It's like tuition assistance. The girl blowing you may go on to cure cancer or be a nurse or teacher.  You may run into her on parent - teacher day.

OK -- You feel guilty about buying clothing of the rack...
 ...it's almost all mad overseas in factories that exploit the poor and children who have no choice

OK --You feel guilty about shopping at WalMart...
 ... because their oppressive business and employment practices put mom-and-pop shops out of business and reduce local wages for struggling workers who have no choice

So you NEVER DO THOSE, RIGHT??? RIGHT???

You must also feel guilty about enjoying any music or entertainment thaty come from the US...
  ... the corporate machine and social network involved destroys the lives of young artists by dragging them into a life of drugs and sex and them casts them aside

You must also feel guilty about going to fast food chains...
  ... they are destrying the health of the poor and innercity youth who have no other choice

You must also feel guilty about driving a car...
  ... using petrofuel....blah blah blah

You FEEL guilty when you look at porn?
FEEL guilty about going to a casino on Native American land?
FEEL guilty when you eat meat?

Frankly, I CALL BULLSHIT on your entire post.

I do not belive you are a hobbyist.

Every person has the right to decide at what level they want to be involved in any activity and why. I don't care what you do in this life, there is some fallour somewhere, with few exceptions.

Those who take a high road and limit their involvement, or take a proactive, or activism stance, for LEGITIMATE reasons should be respected even if we ourselves don't choose that path for ourselves.

But your post is chock full of alarmist, uneducated, overgeneralizations and stereotypes. Frankly it's a load of shit. I am frighteningly liberal, and in my book whiny ass bleeding-hearts who cannot balance their misplaced myopic FEELINGS with ACTUAL CONVICTION AND ACTION are just quivering lumps of annoyance. I'd rather smell farts than listen to that tripe.

Your inner conflict is misplaced and unnecessary. I've written before on the reasons I hobby so I'll not go into huge detail again. Suffice it to say I have a disorder that manifests as skin lesions. Totally harmless and not contagious, but unsightly. As you may imagine I have my difficulties in the civvie world of dating so I turned to the hobbying world. Best decision I've ever made. And as far as sex and psychology being linked, yes and in more ways than one. The providers I've seen have been far more understanding and empathetic towards my condition and situation than any civvie woman I've dated has ever dreamed of being. I don't think they would be capable of that if they were all "damaged goods" or pharmacologically dependant. I believe providers are just like everyone else. They provide a service and deserve to be compensated in kind. It is a necessary service, be it legal or otherwise. It is a more personal service than most so they also deserve a higher class of treatment from their clientele. And yes, the exploitive and coercive side of provider life is a reality in some areas and in some situations but that's true of just about any industry you can name. No one ever profits without someone else losing, it's the nature of the beast.

By the way, thanks for identifying yourself as a liberal, as if we couldn't figure that out around two sentences into your diatribe. I'll be sure to tell the nice African-American lady that helped me out at Walmart today that she should quit and not do her part to take care of her family because she's being exploited. Oy vey!

Enjoy! WIT

THAT had to be the best post I read on this thread!