I know this is a bit ranty, but you wouldnt go into a restaurant, barber shop, appliance store, or any other type of service provider offering them a partial payment, why is it ok to do it to sex workers? Negotiating makes a terrible first impression and is a major turn off.

How about the landscaper who offers to redo your front yard for $25,000, is it "disrespectful" to counter his bid at lets say $22,500?  

They sell a commodity...don't they?

I don't think so.  If they're truly "high end" they'll offer unique dishes / preparations, and likely a unique atmosphere, to justify their high price.

Which makes them just another commodity.  Whether you prefer a Big Mac or some designer steak/sushi/other foods...all are just food.

Initially you said you work with servers to get extras.  Now you say you work with the manager or owner.  

When you're just getting by on a small salary, you pretty much HAVE to negotiate everything you buy.  Otherwise, you will have to go without some things that you want.  

No, it's not negotiating but you can easily get discounted meals, etc.  And groupon is not the only site of this kind.

I generally ask the server to check with the owner/manager about what I'm "willing to pay".

Just because that's the only world you know...don't assume that some of "us" need a salary...or live on a salary.

I own and operate a service oriented business and my price is my price. I already don't collect tax on anything I sell and deliver for free. I often run over on hourly time and cap labor at my bid just to do a better job on an install. My work speaks for itself. Compared to guys doing the same thing cheaper, my installs look much more professional. Theyre get in and get out mentality shows in their poor craftsmanship. I don't cut corners and it shows in my work. Recently, I met an engineer who lived in a 500k home who asked for a discount on an installation of a product he purchased on the internet. After a few words, I walked out of his yard. The guy already removed my ability to make a fair market rate on the install by buying the product someplace else and gave the profit to them, a wholesale internet company, then wants me to install it at a discounted price? Why would I even bother? Its not worth my time. I wonder how long he would stay at his current job if his hourly wage, or salary was up for discussion every time he sat down at his desk each day? Service labor isn't sales. Salesmen get paid on commission, service workers get paid for the job, their expertise and abilities. Its not the same. Do you think the guys on PBS's this old house work for discounted rates? They are bad ass and have people lined up and waiting for the opportunity to pay top dollar to have them renovate their homes.  

I have seen lawyers, consultants, speakers (some of these suckers charge $2000+ per hr), and many others negotiate their prices without being offended. This is another shameless flim-flam by hookers to propogate their self-serving fantasy of "negotiating is a big NO-NO!" in this line of work.

But when I eat "fast food", it absolutely doesn't achieve the same goal as a 5-star meal.  And you know that's true.  Otherwise those 5-star meals at 5-star prices wouldn't exist, and you'd never go to those high-end restaurants to haggle with the managers and owners over extras because you could achieve the same goal for a LOT less money at McDonald's.  

Everyone should eat at least one Big Mac in their life, just like everyone should try one of those 7-11 microwave burritos. It will make you appreciate what real food tastes like. I get a craving for fast food about once a month, but I have to agree, I NEVER crave McDonalds, but I will confess to having eaten both a Big Mac and a Quarter pounder in my life. The Big Mac was about twenty years ago, and the Quarter Pounder was actually a "Viertel" pounder and I had it "mit pommes frites und bier" This was about 40 years ago when I was a kid in the Army stationed in Germany. I certainly hope it's at least another forty years before I have another one.

The pockets.

Put on your rates page of your site that your rates are non negotiable  😚☺
XOXO  
TL

As you stated, Groupon isn't negotiating.  But that what this thread is about.  

I AGREED with you, maybe for the first time ever and you still want to be an asshole. Are you always this insecure?

I would think a corporate mogul like you would be playing 36.  

That truly is amazing.  I don't believe you...but that's OK too.

Posted By: NoGreenBorderedEnvelope

Re: I NEVER want a Big Mac.  Never had one, never will.
But when I eat "fast food", it absolutely doesn't achieve the same goal as a 5-star meal.  And you know that's true.  Otherwise those 5-star meals at 5-star prices wouldn't exist, and you'd never go to those high-end restaurants to haggle with the managers and owners over extras because you could achieve the same goal for a LOT less money at McDonald's.    
   
 Have a great day, and enjoy your dinner at Mickey D's.  

That's the second time you've posted that acronym.  I'm too lazy to dig up the other post...but it's there.

As for McD's it's not likely that I will be eating a Big Mac in any country any time soon, or EVER for that matter. Given a choice between a Big Mac or one of those nasty, doughy things you guys in Chicago try to pass off as Pizza, I'll pick starvation any time. I can go for a decent brat though.

This isn't an auction with bidding for our time and services, unless a lady is actually offering herself up in an actual auction style ad.

You might only need three!

I agree with you. However, I do not negotiate with providers because resentful women provide bad service. I learned early in my years of hobbying that negotiation causes deep resentment. Some providers will say yes and give you bad service.

It's not even your OP but you're telling me what to post? LMAO!  Not to mention that negotiating is all about getting a lower price, which is exactly what groupon is all about.
Go eat a 1/4 Pounder.

...I could agree with you for the most part when it comes to attempting to negotiate rates with a provider. Her rate is her rate. That said, let me ask this:

As someone noted, big ticket item are fair game, most everything is negotiable. But would you haggle with your barber? Or your trusted auto mechanic? I wouldn't haggle with them, just as in this "Personnel" service world. That sensual DFK, or MSOG that's she famous for may not be there for you. And if she gets a offer at the same day and time as you, guess who . gets canceled on, yup,the cheapskate looses out. So why chance it, don't be "That guy".

Things go bad for me the moment I start hearing things along the lines of: "Well, sweety, I don't know why you aren't smarter about your business model.  But you go right ahead and stay home, waiting for your little phone to ring, while I'm out spending these dollars on a ho who's happy to have them."    

MiMi,

I totally agree that condescension can make things go down hill fast. And those are the type of clients that I would want to stay away from as well.

Try acquiring some handyman skills and see how popular you become with your relatives who think you'll be happy to work for cheap cuz they don't want to pay the going rate.

We're not handy men and never will be, so comparing the two is silly. While your negotiating with her, there someone not too worried about her prices. So go to the next young lady that's in your budget. It's rude and pretty much telling her she's not worth it.

Personally as a business man I HATE haggling.If  someone offers me a good deal I will take ,but I am not gonna try and haggle.
There  are instances where I think some fee are 'over the top but am a 'take it or leave it' kinda guy  ,so no issue.
Also I don't think most ladies would give 100% with a 'watered down price'.
Finally it also  depend on what you are getting.There are different quality levels out there.

You think you're better than handymen?

And why in the hell do you think negotiating has ANYTHING to do with a budget?

Why is that ok, but it's not ok to negotiate with you?

Handymen (or anyone in construction) is synonymous with negotiate.

and I am interested in a 90-minute encounter, I will ask her what her rate would be.  

You mean we're not just paying for her time?  Oh what a fool I was.

First off you are not "purchasing" companionship, you are renting it.

A much more common (and potentially hackle-raising) question is: "When I contacted you last year for an appointment, your rate was X - I'm hoping you can honor that now."

"Can you fix a hi-fi?"  
No.
"Then shut up!"

When you rent a car to take a vacation, you return the rental car - but you keep the vacation.  It probably had some highs and lows, maybe a few disappointments along with some happy surprises, but - at the end of the day - you are largely responsible for how your vacation turned out.

Hey, I'm one of those construction guys. An electrician actually. "I have a particular set of skills, skills learned over a long career, skills that make me dangerous for men like you"
Lol, sorry couldn't resist. I have a business and offer my skills at a certain rate. ZERO negotiation. Im not offended if someone wants to haggle. I just turn around and move on to the next customer.
Easy peasy
I'm so busy right now that I'm turning people away.
I'm actually looking at hiring some new help.
Uh, I could really use her on my crew!
If you could get me her resume, it would be much appreciated.
Thanks

I couldn't agree more to this statement.

I think any business, you can definitely try, just don't be too cheap and cut off too much from what the person asked for. Well worst can happen is she won't see you or respond to your email,lol then you can move on to next one within your price range. And negotiating at the session after you guys already meet is a waste of your time, so better do it beforehand.

You "work with servers" in restaurants to "get extra's?"  If the server won't negotiate with you, you go over their head to the manager?  You give restaurant workers a hard time and you're going to get "extras" all right.  I wonder how much human phlegm you have consumed in your lifetime?

I should not have assumed you get a salary, but my point also applies to your social security benefit check.  It will go further if you can get an extra slice of tomato on your sandwich by "negotiating" with the serve, and if not, demanding to see her manager.  

they emphasize that while the seller sells a product (or service), the customer buys benefits.

"Sorry, but I tried that on my landlord and he wouldn't go for it, so until he can honor last years prices, neither can I"

What are hackles and are they related to cockles?

So glad you now understand what DW is all about  LOL

Hah!  
I'm not that stupid to get involved in a hooker board discussion about what is the right or wrong way to behave with this issue.

Pathetically weak comeback, even by the lower standards everyone allows for you.  If you want me to keep playing, you need to up your game. You're embarrassing yourself.  

When you play 18...do you break "100"?

I did and it said you have dog hair on your back.  So I thought maybe it would be better to have warm cockles, except I don't know what they are.

I guess you would see a hooker without asking for a discount...and get whatever service you got.

dense with obtusity for the sake of humor.  Try to keep up.  I'm not going to dumb-down my posts.  

Never said that but our work is different.

That's all I was saying...some of y'all are petty.

but it actually only speaks volumes on his character as a man and what he's truly about (here). Insecurity in paying for companionship (however one defines that) I have found is the biggest thing that makes men want to negotiate or even think they have a right to. It also has a TON to do with one simple little word...respect. If he can't wrap his brain about being here (in general) and what it's all about, or feels like a woman owes him for whatever reason (because of his own issues), of course he's going to haggle. He's not ok with the concept, clearly. It takes a man with an undeniable respect level as well as that security to pay a woman her rate and more without one doubt or question in the world. And I can almost guarantee most women here who have men who do not question get respect back much more than those who don't. It's a simple equation once again here that some just cannot grasp.  

it's understood that customers will get quotes from a few different competitors before cutting a purchase order.  I win some and I lose some, but I really appreciate the customers that come back to me and say "boy, I really love your quality and turnaround time but you are x% higher than your competitors."  This gives me the opportunity to a) renegotiate (Depending on the value of x, I may make a counter offer or I may just let them know that I can't get close to that price and please give me another opportunity to quote for you in the future), and b) keep tabs on my competitor's pricing so I can stay competitive with them.

But too many of your "friends" said that this was much closer.  Why are you so concerned about your skin color?   Be proud.

Posted By: TS.Melania

Hi Richie.  I really loved our afternoon together.  The way you worshiped my cock was AMAZING.  I hope that I didn't insult you when I asked if you were all the way in.  Sometimes I am just so excited and my other senses take over.  That $ 75 tip wasn't necessary either.  I know that you won't be getting your social security till next week.  But as is often said, a tip goes a long way in this business.  

 
Especially from Mandingo's like you.

 
Can't wait to see you next week  
 

Service jobs with billable hours have one unrecoverable opportunity -- lost time.   As I've said over and over, if your billable hours are not as many as you'd like, it is better to get paid half price for a hour than $0.   Refusing to negotiate and to lose the opportunity is to throw that money away.

She never did much for me.  I always kind of felt she was pushed on us as looking hot by corporate interests.  Same with Liza Minnelli who always struck me as an unfeminine caricature.

We've had more than one private chat...and you know how I think regarding this topic.

If you pay less than full rate you will most likely get less than full performance.  

This reminds me of when I was in my 20s.  My best friend came down from New Jersey to visit me in New Mexico where I was stationed with the Air Force.  I took him across the border to Juarez, Mexico during the day (completely different town compared to nighttime).  I told him, "whatever you do, don't pay the asking price for anything!"

Of course we are business women, but most of us do have a brain in our noggin and do know what we are doing lol. We can debate this topic til the cows come home but truthfully until you are on the "providing" end of things and can honestly switch roles from Johnny to lady here, you will never know what runs thru the mind of someone conducting her business and what it entails. No matter how many women you know here or have "helped". You are NOT in the mind of a woman doing what she does here. It's that simple and never will be.

Stop charging for your "human interaction" and then maybe you can claim it's not a business transaction. Are the two of you sharing the same sippy cup of stupid juice?

I never quibble over rates. Ours is a discretionary transaction and I believe the "take it or leave it" approach is appropriate. However, and some may disagree, but I find the discussion of tips or gifts sends a mixed message about the ability to negotiate the fee for services.

By your line of reasoning a girl running a "special" is likely not to "give her all" because she is not getting full price for the session. I think you, like most of the guys on TER have been brainwashed into thinking that the only way to get a great session is to pay "full freight". Nothing could be further from the truth. I have had a lot of sessions at less than full price that have been fantastic and I have had some rather lack luster sessions where I "pre tipped" and let the girl know I was giving her a bit extra in the hopes of getting "her best" only to be rather disappointed with the results. (Obviously, this too was a LONG LONG time ago as I would never do such a thing today)

...my rates.
Why?  Because I'm worth it.  As far as I've been told by clients, I'm worth much more.

Distinguishable from a girl who is running a special.  Specials most often mean she needs to raise money quickly or she is trolling for new regulars to beef up her dependable cash flow.  While I agree asking for a discount  may result in less than stellar service, responding to a "special" may get the absolute best she has to offer.

He specifically said he did NOT ask for a discount, she offered it, yet he was still afraid of getting a subpar performance, and THAT is why I said "he blew it"

C'mon CDL...you can tell the class how your corporate empire is really pimping out a few low end hookers.

you got out of your cubicle long enough to post this during your lunch hour.  Its short because you had to do it from your phone.  If you're such a hot shot, lets see some posts during the work day like GaG, several other business owners here and yours truly to prove you're not a cubicle drone with some mid-level supervisor breathing down your neck.  You burn up the keyboard on the weekends and evenings.  Why not posts in the middle of the workday, Chicago time?  You are indeed Dr. Hooey.

Set up an analysis of ALL my posts (around 10k on GD...I'm too lazy to look up ALL the posts on ALL the other boards...but please include ALL those as well) by the times they were posted.  That should give you something to do for the next few months.

Your cubicle getting a little claustrophobic, Dr. Hooey.

If you finish it by this Friday I'll pop for an IPhone upgrade for you.

of the rehash.  You spent a whole day on this thread bragging about what a big time negotiator you are at restaurants, and now it seems you have no anecdotal examples to back up your claims.  It makes you look like you're only big league in your own mind.  Of course, many would argue that chiseling restaurants makes you a bottom feeder in the business world.   Finishing your career in a cubicle is a sad way for even a broken man to end up.  You have my sympathies.  

I thought we tackled this issue a  month ago.  

If we don’t know one another personally (as in a longstanding repeat client), you’re wasting my time by negotiating my services. The problem with negotiation is that it’s exploitative. You don’t know why women become sexworkers and under what circumstances. So, to offer less money to someone who may be struggling to pay medical bills, legal fees, tuition, or just put food on her familys table is taking advantage of her financial situation. Also, a great deal of providers are very young women who don’t know their worth and are much more easily manipulated than the rest of us. They also have less experience with negotiating than the 50 year old dude who is attempting to low ball them. In short, it’s just a dick move and a red flag. The best clients value your time and respect you as a human being. So, they pay you what you’re worth. If you don’t

Damn, I hate to argue with such a hot woman, (given how easily I'm pussy whipped), but what makes sexworkers so special that they're beyond negotiation? And for that matter, if it was true, how is it somehow less wrong if we know one another as a longstanding repeat client?  Given your scenario, that makes it even worse since this personal relationship should clue the client in tot he providers REAL LIFE financial needs.

If we periodically have someone try to negotiate a multi hour or day(s) rate. But no majority of hagglers are crying over our 1hr rate. Or asking for something that we don't offer. How much is 5 minutes? What can I get for $40-80? So you offer qv or ss?

I know some guys probably only  have very little money but they see young ladies that they really want to see and don’t have enough money to pay for it so they try to offer all the money they have to try to see someone they want to see I think that is very sweet even if a girl says no which she probably will .  That would be sweet .  But if they have the money and you negotiate it because you want to better deal on a secret rendezvous the kind of ruins the rendezvous part and let unless it’s a BDSM then it could fit in really well .

Does the negative perception of a negotiator change if the discussion is about a more long term contractual arrangement.  Something like, I request 5 more meetings at a rate with a clear understanding about the kinds of things that can void the deal.

I have been watching this thread and the various opinions. So many clearly one sided while others very open to being reasonable thought out.  

I sheepishly admit to working out a longer term arrangement with a very well regarded and beautiful local provider at a mutually agreed upon price below her posted rate.  I noticed the level of enthusiasm and chemistry dropped.  In hindsight I don't think it was a good thing to do.  I'm convinced that pay as you go is better.  Additionally note that some girls will openly offer a discount for earlier bookings.  (Good ......until one gets a cancellation rep)

Actually, a lot of guys report that their regulars offer or at least agree to either extra time or other incentives for frequent fliers. The question under your scenario is whether you're willing to pay up front for those 5 more meetings. It definitely takes some mutual trust however you set something like this up.

If I followed correctly you said it would be foolish for a client to prepay his 5 2hrs appointments at 80hr opposed to 90hr?
In that sense it would also be foolish for a provider to take him at his word. If that's the case all a man has to say is I will see you X amount of times for X whereas his intentions is to only see you once and he will still get the discount he wanted.  
Just like every other profession makes you by in bulk for a discount, this shouldn't be any different.  

Cheap people are trying to be cheap.  Good point on negotiations being two sided.  If you get nothing out of the arrangement, why should you negotiate?  I negotiate fees in my business if there is something to be gained by me.  if it is one sided, that is quickly apparent, and not the business/client I want.

I think there are two big things going on here

Normal rate 100 x 10 visits = 1000
Discounted rate 80 x 10 visits = 800
But he doesn't want to pay all 800 up front.
Visit 1: 100
Visit 2: 90
Visit 3: 85
Visits 4 through 10: 75
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
= 800, total, the agreed upon amount for 10 visits x 80
.
Problem: She starts blocking his calls after Visit 3.

I have had that thought too. I can see where they are different fro a provider perspective but not a client perspective.  

"Not all of course, but I think for many asking to pay less is just the start of a power game that involves the client thinking a win comes from getting something the provider doesn't want to give. No wonder many providers have learned just not to deal with negotiators.  "

THis.
I
Suze Orman said I am for sale but I am not ON sale. So, I don't cut my rate but that allows me to have greater flexibility with my time as a reward which, doesn't that FEEL better than getting her at half the price?  
It's more of a real GFE situation. More time with the same highly valued companion.

Word! read my post about the same dynamic. Some folks have money because they are takers. Everywhere they go they strive to take more than the give. Be a Giver. I

This IS so simple and yet ignored when communicated. They'll still try and sometimes do. I don't give discounted service so I don't come at a discounted rate. When I have caved I still give my best.  who hurts worst but me from that I want to do MY best, whatever that is that day, and it can vary, of course, but I would never tarnish my own reputation by performing poorly to show someone. That's not the long game if you're on that.

Sophia,

Spot on. I own and operate a service business and have walked out of many potential customers yards because it wasn't a win win. When someone buys a product online that is interested in me installing it, so they get a full warranty and starts asking for a discount on my labor I'm out.  It's all about them. I'm certainly not there for the privilege of doing a job for someone.  For it to be worth my while, I have to make something for my service and the quality craftsmanship my experience provides. I don't have time for that.  Those kind of customers usually show a very little amount of respect for my expertise as a skilled labor worker and they make the worst customers. Their expectations are higher than anyone else's and they want to pay the least.

Absolutely correct.  Asking for a discount without a quid pro quo is NOT negotiating, its chiseling.  Once in awhile, I have asked for a price for a multi-hour session that was NOT on the menu.  Sometimes I have countered the offer and the provider accepted.  In those situations, its a true negotiation, not a request for a discount.  

Total newbie here and only used providers  17-20 years ago in Costa Rica. Yes, many were negotiable, but realized ones that I just paid what they asked for were much more fun.  Now, if I had to email for donation rate and it was too high, I would just say not in my budget and thank you.  If they are ok with less, then they can respond.  If not, just find something in my range.  

way to approach this topic.  You aren't asking for a discount, but you have opened the door for her to offer one without insulting her by asking.  Probably the most polite way to do this, IMO.  I have had this happen a few times when inquiring about extended sessions where there was no price listed.  I will not pay the same rate for the third or fourth hour as I will for the first, but rather than negotiate, I just tell her that's more than my budget.  If she counters with something more reasonable, or doesn't, I'm okay either way.  There's always other options.  I like girls that build in an incentive, such as $400/1 hr, $700/2 hrs, $900/3 hrs, etc.  Extended sessions usually involve a lot of, pardon the expression, "down time" so its easy extra revenue for the provider.  If a girl with a rate of $400 quotes me 3 hours at $1200, I will just pass.  If she wants to counter with something else, that's on her, but I will not be the one to propose it.  Sometimes, the best negotiating strategy is to let them see your back as you're walking away, but I'm not going to insult them by asking for less than their quote.  

I should clarify my statement from my previous post. I do negotiate, but prefer to be given the opportunity to present the idea myself. It's civility.  

That's all you can do.

I remember one of my bookies laughing about the dumb gringos paying the "ridiculously overpriced" rate of about $30 at the Del Rey back then.

Thank you for making sure they have a steak on the grill that they can pay less attention to than mine.