Lately I have been pondering the issue of compensation for "overtime" and have some thoughts. I realize some hobbyists may see this as shooting them in the foot and providers will jump for joy, but I am merely stating my opinion on an issue that I think would merit some discussion or at least thoughts. Many reviews I read have statements like "we went over at least a half hour for a 1 hour appt. She is no clock watcher and didnt bat an eye." I have yet to see a comment that compensation was given for her "extra" time. Quality providers are not clock watchers and I have seen other threads discuss the "clock watching" issue; the over riding opinion if memory serves is: providers prefer to concentrate on the hobbyists pleasure and leave the clock watching to the hobbyist in the hopes they will be considerate. That said, (and from my own experience) this has proven true for me. But what about compensation? I understand, as I am sure the providers do as well, that to run five ten minutes over on an hour with those "pause at the door, wishing the moment didnt have to end goodbyes can linger for a few minutes and is probably expected. But when it is clearly broaching on moving up a grade to a nearly 2 hour session, compensation should be offered. I dont expect a classy provider to say "hey buddy you owe me an additional $$$" The onus is on the hobbyist to respect the time of the provider.  Why book for two when you can get nearly the same for a one hour rate? That is just clearly taking advantage of the situation.IMHO. I schedule an hour with my attorney ( a very good attorney and I dont plan on changing) and we go over...I am billed for the time. That is understood and accepted. Why not in this profession? A cash business for the most part and payment is often done discreetly prior to the onset. So how does the offering of more compensation take place? Cash in open view on the table? A subtle mention to the provider that you would like to compensate for ALL of the time? I would be interested to know the thoughts of others on this issue. I am anticipating hobbyist comments like " we pay enough already" Well, you picked an expensive hobby and if you cant afford the longer sessions then find a less expensive provider or a new hobby; like stamp collecting..you get to lick those too. In the long run I only think it will be to the hobbyists advantage to pay for ALL time spent I am sure. Afterall, employees who get paid for all of their hours are much happier employees. What does another C-note or 3 really matter in the long run; we did after all choose an expensive hobby. One last note. We really get more time then we spend with them anyhow. There is the "time" we spend on the memories of a date of a lifetime...the "time" we spend in anticipation of the date to come...all of this is "off the clock" and we can cash it in ANYTIME we want Your thoughts?????

I think this boils down to a mutual understanding of when the line is crossed in terms of taking advantage of the provider. I also know that often agencies call 15-20 minutes before the scheduled mtg end time, which often is a real downer, especially if you only booked an hour. From my experience and reading a zillion reviews on this site, it seems that 95% of the time the providers knowingly determine that going over will be to the benefit of both parties, either short term or long term.

Like everyone else, I have a busy life and have a seemingly endless list of errands to do every day. I can spend a full unrushed hour (or two, whichever is allotted) but then have to get going within a few minutes because I have other things to do (and usually it's not to see another client).

Not long ago, at the beginning of an afternoon session, the client asked my plans for the rest of the afternoon. I told him I was going to pick up my child when school ended and take a few kids to see a new movie out in the theaters. So, he knew in advance I had firm plans after our session.

Yet, he ended up staying 45 minutes past the allotted time (talking mostly). I finally rushed him out the door and ended up being late to pick up my child at school. The guy did not tip me,  and I felt that was wrong. He obviously did not respect my time. I won't see him again.

So, thank you for understanding, Paxem!!

took away her times even though most of it was spend talking with each other.  Otherwise, sooner or later, she is going to have the feeling that she is been taken advantage of, which is a lost-lost situation for both of us.

-- Modified on 10/4/2003 12:43:03 PM

I tend to agree with what you are saying but do not think the issue is a totally black and white issue at times.  For example I recall booking a one hour appointment with a lady on a saturday afternoon.  She greeted me at the door and ushered me out to her patio where she proceeded to talk for well over an hour before retiring to her bedroom.  It appeared she was trying to get comfortable with a first time client.  I did not feel that it was appropriate at 15 minutes into the conversation to say let's retire to the bedroom or at the one hour mark to give her the donation and leave.  After we retired to the bedroom it was a very unrushed appointment and I did tip her.  I did not have enough cash on me to pay for the total elapsed time of our meeting.  My point is that I did not feel particulary responsible for the first hour plus that she spent trying to get comfortable with me.  Maybe this is something she routinely does with every new client.  Maybe she does it with every appointment.  I don't know.

Very good points.  What I do is this.  When I see that our time is almost up, I will start to get ready to go.  Many, many times, a provider will basically tell me that she is in no hurry for me to leave.  That's my que that she wants me to stay for a while longer.  I also assume that the extra time is "off the clock".

Now, if I ask to stay a while longer, then the assumption is that I am going to pay for it.  Which I have no problem with.

Bond

This was hard to read but interesting.  I get paid by product put out and not for time so sometimes I have a little trouble relating to people who bill in six minute increments.

That being said I rarely go over an hour since I am normally slow to get my cup, more than 1/2hr, there is rarely time for a second cup and this actually allows for a leisurely time.  If I think I will wnat two cups, then I will just book for two hours rather than try to rush thing.

For this guys who remember some provider who ran them off early, it is really not good to take advantage of a good provider.  Better to book the time you want rather than rely on her to give it to you.

I very much appreciate your doing so!

While most appointments have an 'ish' time (one hour-ish; two hour-ish) that I think is fair just circumstantially, there comes a time when you have to speak up when your two hour dates are becoming three; your three hour dates are becoming four on a CONTINUAL basis and uncompensated, and expected. That's not fair.

NATURALLY, if it is my suggestion that we continue, there's no way I'd expect compensation, and I ENJOY giving that time when the time together is flowing well and I have the time to spare.

Here's a few questions? How many of you all:

1) Think it's a mutual responsibility to keep an eye on the time?

2) Think it should be (or PREFER it be) HER responsibility?

3) Think it should be (or PREFER it be) HIS responsibility?

I don't post an Hour and a Half rate on my site, and don't normally have one hour dates, but I think a 90 minute date is just about right - one hour is not long enough and two hours sometimes is too much. How do you feel about 90 minute dates?

Thanks, Paxem!



-- Modified on 10/4/2003 3:44:11 PM

Hi Sedona,

I think it is a mutual thing.  As for myself, I usually am watching the clock.  I don't book 1 hour appointments.  They are just too damn short.  90 minutes is ok, 2 hours is even better.

However, for self preservation, if a lady doesn't know the "time", she should.  Because guys do take advantage.  As you well know.

Bond

Well, ultimately it's your responsibilty...but personally I keep an eye on the time because I don't want to put the lady in the uncomfortable position of having to say something.

One hour is definitely too short.  I think 2 hours is a nice session.  90 minutes?  Only if the lady doesn't enjoy DATY...

but, more accurately, I'm obsessed by it.  I just can't stand the thought of underpaying a provider.  Seems too much like cheating.  I think maybe this comes from having to work two jobs now to make ends meet and having had times in my life where I had no savings and no money coming in...  

1.  I completely agree with TIFFANI's post (when you've gotta get the kids, you've gotta go).  Have also been in STUMPY's shoes (over-time, no extra $ on hand).  See why I'm stressing out about fairness?

2.  "Price" was one of my key provider search criteria (it's been a few months since I searched).  No one could possibly love to get discounts, or find bargains, as much as I.  Therefore, since money is so critically important to me, I automatically assume my providers, my carpenter, my tile setter, my two masons, by maids, my banker, my property mangers and everyone else I do business with has the same focus.  I know my boss and my customers do.

3.  I LOVE SEDONA's post.  Those 3 questions really capture it all from a business perspective.  Is the customer's duty, the merchant's duty or a shared duty?  I think it must be that communication is they key.  BUT, given the YMMV factor, what do you do when you've agreed to 90-min., time's up, but you're hearing (or making) those "if you stop right this second, I'm not gonna be purring when I leave here" sounds?  And THEN, this being a not altogether unpleasant endeavor, you do go way over time?

   a.  Try to reach an agreeable stopping point and then dash off to the ATM?  

   b.  Factor it into the cost of the next visit?

   c.  E-mail immediately and ask whether she feels fairly compensated?

In my short hobbying time, I've done all these but still fuss constantly over whether I've met $$$ expectations.  In other words, I don't want money to ruin the experience.  It's just the grease that makes the wheels slid smoothly.

An hour of talk first?  If she threw in some nagging, now that would be a true "girlfriend experience"

Yeah, any of that chatter time is for her benefit only.  Play time is pay time.  There are plenty of free opportunities to be a good listener elsewhere.

When I work overtime at work for free, I feel like I'm being taken advantage of.  I pay for all of the time I'm with a provider though.  I either finish early or on time, sometimes running over a few minutes.  If I ever want another half hour, I offer to compensate for that time before creeping into it.  If I'm very satisfied, I tip generously.  Its just good karma.

cheers,
cy

This is because I know what my "dates" are generally like, and the amount of time needed to accomplish the "mission".  On many ocassions we have finished the date and, if they were so inclined and had the time, I would buy them lunch, or dinner.  Off the books, simply as friends.

That said there have been times that the synergy between my date and I have created an overtime situation that grossly exceeded the arranged time period.  In those instances I have never been asked for additional money by the provider, and when I asked them they simply said they had a good time and not to worry.  

In most of these instances they either got a reasonably generous gratuity (then and there) or were given a little "extra" in the envelope on the next date.  And in one instance a gift as well on the next date.

My take on responsibility is that it's a mutual thing, and it may vary from provider to provider, or even from date to date with the same provider.  I enjoy the unrushed date, one where a few minutes, or even half an hour, doesn't make any difference.  But I do understand the limits of alloted time, and respect those limits.

I totally agree with you sedona regarding hour and a half being an ideal length. So, if that's the case, why is it so rare that it is offered/available?

Well, I think the popularity is increasing for some of these reasons. The difficulty is establishing the appropriate fee.

In the past, and I'm only guessing, to offer a 90 minute session seemed to cheapen the time (I'm not coming up with the right adjectives here) just as no one usually has a 30 minute, or a 45 minute rate.
But, I think that is falling by the wayside as it seems to be a workable solution, offering both parties a win.