You know, correct me if I'm wrong but there are a few select damn good QB out there. Regardless if you like the team or not you have to hand it to these QB's.

Brady has to be considered top tier along with P. Manning, Roethlisberger at Pittsburg and the Who Dat Brees in my opinion. It's based partly on their careers, what they have done this year and clutch wins. If it was just based on careers then Favre and McNabb would obviously be included.

You may want to have Vick and maybe Falcco  or even Rodgers in the elite ranks but I hesitate. I'm talking right now, this year. That's not to say Vick, Falcco and Rodgers won't be there someday along with maybe a Romo,  Rivers or Cassel. (couldn't resist, it's my post)

What got me thinking about this was the Vikings Eagles game and the announcers build up of Joe Webb. During the game, well more towards the end of the game they made him sound like Bart Starr.  He played a good game against a good team, but it was only one game.   And I kind of think the Vikings defense played their game of the year on that particular Tue night.

Now if I'm off base here, left someone out or you just want to disagree just click on the reply button and let your fingers do the talking. I have clearly defined the "Tier One" and "Tier Two" QB. Hmm, what about M. Ryan in Buba land?

Everyone is entitled  to an opinion and there is some pretty smart guys out there who follow the game and their team a lot closer than fans at large. There are several teams I can't name the QB off the top of my head, Bills, Houston, Titans and probably a few more.  

And to be honest, I may have got it wrong, me got it wrong. Nah, when have I made a mistake? Just name one, I dare you. OK, name another one. Even Brady has a bad day now and then.    

wussy NFL. Yes call me a detractor. Though I do love Matt Ryan, Rogers, Brady, Flacco, dREW bREES, et al, I wonder how many would be successful when you had the likes of Deacon Jones, Alan Page, Harvey Martin, Mean Joe Greene et al, who would eat QB heads for lunch. Today's NFL has modulated the rules to promote passing the football to the extreme. You can barely touch the QB without incurring a 15-yard penalty for unnecessary roughness. The days of the shutdown corner and the intiminators such as Jack Tatum, Ronnie Lott et al are gone. How does a penalty for pass interference result in a team lining up on the one-yard line is beyond me? Obviously with today's rules, a team best option is to pass.

If Peyton Manning had to play in the NFL his dad (great QB) did in the 70's his career would have been over  by his rookie season. Johnny Unitas, Bart Starr, Len Dawson, Roger Staubach, Joe Namath, Fran Tarkenton, Terry Bradshaw et al are the greatest QBs. Even Billy Kilmer was better than any of today's NFL QBs. They were men. I would not dare to compare a Joe Webb to Bart Starr or any NFL QB today to any I just mentioned.  It is not fair comparsion or a valid observation.

If your talking about today's QBs in today's NFL game, I like Matt Ryan and Josh Freeman of Tampa bay. It's amazing Bill Parcells was not critized for selecting Jake Long over Matt Ryan. Jake Long is a pro Bowler but Ryan is Franchise QB. No one is talking about Tampa Bay, but damn, they have some good players done there led by Josh Freeman. I wish I could catch them on prime time TV. The kid from St Louis Sam Bradford the rookie, is terrific.  Even with a receiver corp decimated by injuries Bradford is doing it. Tony Romo is overrated. I do not see him as a leader. Biggest mistake the Cowboys made was letting go of Wade Phillips. The Cowboys had the chance to go 1-15 and have the opportunity to select Andrew Luck, but they blew it. Jon Kitna is better QB than Tony Romo.

If you really believe that "Billy Kilmer was better than any of today's NFL QBs" it's obvious that you're not a serious fan.

In order to be considered a great player (i.e. Hall of Fame worthy), I believe you have to have a long period of sustained excellence. So in my opinion, there are only two "great" QB's playing in the NFL today: Tom Brady and Peyton Manning. Brady has been a league MVP and has won 3 Super Bowls while appearing in 4. He has led the Pats to the playoffs 8 of his 9 years as a starter. Peyton Manning is potentially the greatest regular season QB of all time, a 4 time league MVP, and has won a Super Bowl while leading the Colts to a second. The Colts make the playoffs every year. I believe, without Peyton at the helm, the Colts are ordinary at best. These two are way above the rest of the league.
 
I think Brees needs a few more seasons like his past several to move closer to Brady and Manning. But he is well on his way. The Super Bowl championship last year really upgraded his resume. After Brees, I would put Big Ben, Rivers and Eli next. Roethlisberger has a very unique style, but its effective for him and the Steelers. He simply wins games and two Super Bowl victories are proof (hopefully, # 3 this year!!!!). Eli does have a Super Bowl title but needs to develop much more consistency in his play. While Rivers does not have a Super Bowl title under his belt, his passing has been so profilic these past few years, I put him in this tier. Yes, Vick has had a breakout season for sure, but needs a few more similar seasons to move up the pecking order.  

There are a slew of young QB's who very easily could join the discussion of elite QB's in a few years. Among them Ryan, Flacco and Rodgers are the best of the lot. Rodgers prob. has the best skills of the group and is on the verge of taking that next big step. I have watched Flacco closely (as a division rival of the Steelers) and I have been impressed with his maturation. He has already won 3 playoff games in his two seasons, which is really impressive. Matt Ryan is developing quickly. With home field advantage throughout the playoffs, this will be a big post season for him and the Falcons. Get Atlanta to the Super Bowl and he immediatley jumps up the list.

But in the NFL, greatness at the QB position can be fleeting. In 2005, Carson Palmer was considered a can't miss elite QB. 5 seasons later, he may never join that group. Tony Romo was annointed as "great" by fans/media. But after winning only one post season game in several disapponting seasons, we may never witness his potential. Jay Cutler has had a nice comeback season with the Bears, but again, can he do it over time.

There are a lot of very good QB's in this league, but if we are looking at all time greats, there are only two: Peyton and Brady.   (Obviously Favre is an all time great, but today he is a shell of his former self)

There's one major difference in todays QB's versus the "field generals" of the past. Until Tom Landry started sending in plays from the sideline all the QB's called their own plays. Today everything is called in from the sideline via a radio and all they have to do is execute the play unless they read the defense and check off at the line of scrimmage. The quarterbacks of today are definately more physically talented with more emphasis on fitness & training, but the guys prior to 1970 had much more responsibility.
And by the way, Billy Kilmer????? Some of his passes looked like punts! LOL!
 

Breaker....the level of talent is way different today than back in the 60's and 70's. Players are bigger and faster. And it starts in Pop Warner and high school.

I played HS football back in the early 70s. Our offensive and defensive lines averaged 210 lbs. I still follow my old HS, and the average today is over 260 lbs. Football, or should I say weight training is year around. It wasn't when I played. Players are being groomed for college.

Now, I understand why HS coaches utilize a spread offense. It's so much easier to coach a young QB, but it doesn't prepare him if he has pro aspirations.

The players today would eat up players from the 60s and 70s due to their size and speed. The game is so much more complicated today. The prep work, film (not the old 8mm stuff), multiple defensive schemes, requires today's QB to interpret, adjust and execute in less than 3 seconds.

I just can't see a Bart Starr, Tarkenton, Kilmer, Stabler being that successful today. If they tried to run today, they would get killed.

Can't believe you did that, you damn old fox. Now you have me defending "Big Ben" that club footed, broken nose, sack of potatoes quarterback of the Steelers. He is undoubtedly a better opera singer than an athlete. Now that would be a new high when the fat lady sings!

I can maybe buy your argument about Brees, maybe he is a little light compared to Brady and Manning but Roethlisberger has a damn strong resume, gets the job done and is always difficult to beat. Neither Brady or Manning can deliver a 30 yard pass with a middle linebacker hanging off their back on a 3rd and 12 and the game on the line. And it's not like he's just done it once. I don't think he goes into the second tier. Damn, here I am defending your fucking quarterback.

You know here is the funny thing about this. If you go on just numbers, quarterback ratings that is for this year, it's Brady number 1 and Rivers number 2. But the stats just don't get it. They work for Brady. I can't argue with that, but not for Rivers. You just know a Manning is always going to be dangerous and the same can be said for Big Ben.

As for you BreakerMorant, and the Johnny Unitas, Bart Starr, Len Dawson, Roger Staubach, Joe Namath, Fran Tarkenton, Terry Bradshaw, damn, what a list. Nice of you to include Lenny Dawson, although one of my favorites he wasn't quite on par with the rest of the group.

Matt Ryan, yea I'm beginning to take notice. Haven't seen a lot of him but a 12 and 3 record wasn't penciled in by the damn announcer.  Atlanta has to be damn happy with that pick. Be interesting to see where he is in two years as the Manning's and Big Bens fade a little.

Now Hardy, if you think I'm a closet Steelers fan, you wrong. Well, if I am, I'm gonna lie about it FOREVER.

Good post but I'll have to strongly disagree with Kilmer being better than today's QBS-well maybe Jamarcus Russell-whoops, he's gone! Bill Kilmer was a good leader, but was slow afoot and had a less than mediocre arm as well- Good point on the Cowboys-If Wade stayed, they'd have been lucky to win another game-but JJ's ego couldn't have stood it-Garrett did a good job-and Romo makes too many mistakes at crunch time-but as a Skins fan -that's fine with me-Freeman is a good one but since we get blacked out here in Tampa, few have seen him-1rob...have a great New Year's...OUT

and yea sure he probably never hit the inside of a weight room but he had something today's QB's don't have. Kilmer had heart. The game of NFL before 1978 was brutal and violent. The players of those times played the game for little money and little recognition. In all due respect to today's players, the Billy Kilmers deserve all the props we can give them. Kilmer would wobble onto the field, throw the ugliest spiral, and somehow some way the ball would be caught for a first down, while the Dallas Doomsday defense would pummel him. and like Jackson Browne would say, he get up and do it again.

had today's weight room techniques, steriods err nutritional supplements, but I really do believe they were stronger competitors. I truly respect the players of that era. Just look at the numbers. The baby boomers flooded football fields, basketball courts, hell you had to fight to even make the practice squad. By the time I played high school football in 1980, a scrub like me could make varsity. There simply was less competition.

Now, funny you should mention offensive lineman. Offensive lineman of that era had to be able to run sweeps to set up the running game. Lineman could not be 300 lbs like today's NFL lineman. The offensive lineman are selected for pass protection, where beef is more important than stamina. OK I will give you the point that yesterday players could not play today's game. My contention is that today's players could not play in yesterday's head slapping, pound the ball football.

Yesterday's QB's were actually required to call their own plays. Today in the headset era that is no longer the case.Buddy, we have got to get together, you got knowledge. I respect that.

Kilmer's skills. My point is that today we look at QBs too much on statistics or how many TV cameos they have and not enough in the context in the game they played. Like you said, yesterday's QBs were field generals. They were leaders, best of the best. Ken Stabler he is another guy no one mentions. Jim Plunkett won two super bowls and he is not inducted into the hall of fame. Those QBs had grit.

Now there's a name. Although not a Raiders fan, I always was a fan of Jim Plunkett. He was tough as hell. Y.A. Tittle, Norm Van Brocklin, and Roman Gabriel are a few others that never got full credit from the sportscaster's media. For me, these names, along with breaker's are the QB's that had 'true grit', and played the game for love, and definitely not a lot of money.

I watched a special, eons ago, on TV called , "The Violent World of Sam Huff". He was playing for the Giants then, and he made it perfectly clear that maiming, disfiguring, bone breaking, eliminating, etc., the QB was always a game time goal. Penalties, what fucking penalties?