I keep seeing the phrase "first time ever" being used in regard to the possibility (yes I know we won't actually default) of defaulting on our debt.

I would swear I remember seeing somewhere that we have in fact defaulted in the past. But I can't find any information out about whether we actually did at some point, and if so when did it happen, and what was the fallout from it?

Can anyone enlighten me?

Why a tax increase on just the highest bracket only? They the only ones that have a dog in this fight?

agree to a tax increase, would you agree to never ever again utter those time tested liberal catch phrases?

The rich can afford it
They need to pay their fair share
Shared responsibility
Shared sacrifice
It takes a village

in response to failed "trickle-down theory." I can't remember any revolutions caused as a result of failed "Peculate-up theory."

Uh-oh! St. Croix will probably want me to vow never to mention those theories again, either!

I don't work on Wall Street, or for GM, Chrysler, Fannie or Freddie. No one bailed out my ass when the stock market tanked. So not interested in your offer.

Will you be the one extracting via guillotine additional taxes? Let me know when you are coming out to SoCal? Maybe you can stop by the City of Santa Monica, (just another dysfunctional progressive enclave) and perform a few circumcisions.

Nor was anyone suggesting a subsidy for small oil producers like me when oil fell to $30 bbl a couple of years ago.

People like Willy expect people like us to assume all the risks of investing, running businesses, etc. yet want "their share" when and if we succeded.

Personally I subscribe to the ant/grasshopper analogy, if Willy loses his job due to excessive TER posting and subsequently ends up living on the street, I won't shed a single tear. He is a prime example of "class envy" he wants what other people have "earned" through hard work, just "because". Willy FUCK YOU!!! I worked hard for my money, and I am smart enough to not allow you to steal it.

Here's an article from USA Today in which Sec. Geithner says it would be the first time.  I'm not his biggest fan but I do trust him on this one.  What I do recall from my days as a history student is that, when the first US government was convened under the Constitution, it had to decide whether to honor the debt accumulated by the old Continental Congress during the Revolution.  Many advocated defaulting on the debt, saying the new USA had no obligation to pay debts assumed by an earlier government.  Hamilton won the argument that the new government's credibility as a financially responsible institution required it to repay the debt, which was done.  I am quite sure there has been no default since then, either.  I also believe the Republicans are playing with fire on this one.  Even in the best of economic times, a default would harm the economy.  Now, it could throw us into a deep depression.  We shall see.  I don't want to find out.
PS:  I am in favor of deep, across-the-board, spending cuts coupled with a tax in increase on the highests bracket only.  Even that, I fear, will throw us back into recession but I don't think we have any choice.

The stock market could have fallen to 3,000 and it would have cost you more than me, I don't drill offshore, and quite frankly the less we do the higher oil prices and the more I make, so again FUCK YOU!!!

The world is going to use oil no matter if comes from Iraq or Texas and someone has to produce it, corn prices have risen just like all other commodities but no one is pissed at the farmer who is making unheard of profits  because of the boondoggle called ethanol, so once again FUCK YOU!!

I provide a product this country needs desperately, I make a payroll every week even if there is not a nickel left over for myself, which has happened more times than I can count. I pay several times what you make in taxes. I pay more in medicare than I could possibly use up if if lived to be a thousand years old. What the fuck do you do? You sit on your fat ass posting on TER on the taxpayers fucking dime. So once again Willy I say FUC YOU!!! You are nothing but a worthless fucking government parasite, and the sooner your job is cut, the better.

and btw I am the fucking taxpayer, you work for me. If only I could fire you, but at least I have the peace of mind knowing that I am not only a much better person than you, my life is also a thousand times better.

Not to mention that you don't increase taxes on a middle class that already bears an unfair burden.  As you well know, there is no one suggesting this, even Democrats rule it out.

Of course, I never used it before, either.  And, by the way, I fall into the tax bracket that would be affected, just as I did when Clinton vowed to raise rates on the top bracket and I voted for him anyway.  Why?  Because, well, I could afford it.

No, you're wrong! I don't see it that way at all!

How about speaking for yourself next time!

from Willy:
"you're just a gear in a giant scam that is fucking up the country I love."

Its fucking up Venezuela?

Everyone knows, if they actually do, like you said we are going to be fucked for a long time. The bet is they won't.

In this particular Game Theory, they are pretty much caught between fire and the frying pan. What can they do? Disgrace the country? That will go over well. Pushed themselves into a corner.

It is possible they may since their supporters understanding of the Federal Budget is less than their own check books.

and the cliche word "tax and spend". Let us start with that.

Another group that thinks they are going to reap immense benefit from tax and spending cuts. Don't even want to get started on the whole nonsense about tax cuts while it has relegated the country into the league of third world countries on infrastructure spending.

Pawlenty's Google idea is great. I found on Google that I can pay off all my debts including my mortgage in 3 to 5 years. Wonder how many banks will give me mortgage?

You are not going to get a different result by doing the same things the same way and expecting a different result (tax cuts, spending cuts, giving swops to friends and family). Does republicans have any vision for this country other than concentrating all the wealth on a few.

For all of you out there advocating higher taxes for the wealthy, how 'bout these little factoids:

1) Those in the highest 1% of the income bracket earn 20% of all income, yet pay 40% of all federal taxes. How much more of the burden should that bracket carry?

2) In the last tax year, 51% of taxpayers paid no federal taxes and/or got more money back than they paid in. How can a society function when less than half the people are paying all the bills?

3) As a member of the top 1% bracket, and a small business owner, my tax burden breaks down as follows: federal 36%, state 3%, local 1% Medicare 2.9% x 2, SS works out to about 1% x 2. Thats nearly 50% of my income, before I see anything in my bank account. When those calling for higher taxes on the "rich" pay anything like what I'm paying, then we can talk about higher taxes for me. Seriously, a 15-25% tax bracket for the middle class is hardly "unfair."

Here's a novel idea, let's have EVERYONE pay taxes. I seem to recall ponying up when I was in college earning $3.35 an hour while working nights and weekends in fast food.  

If everyone pays something, then I'll pay a little more. Until then, hands off my wallet...

The worst part is according to the accepted political narrative GaGambler is the bad guy and Willy is the salt of the earth.  GaGambler supplies something we need and produces jobs and he's the villian and Willy takes the moral high ground and everyone buys it.

I wasn't speaking for you and I didn't follow your post.

Thank God for soulless bureaucrats who "target capitalists".  How the fuck do you look in the mirror every morning when your job description is fucking over your fellow Americans?

"The worst part is according to the accepted political narrative GaGambler is the bad guy and Willy is the salt of the earth.  GaGambler supplies something we need and produces jobs and he's the villian and Willy takes the moral high ground and everyone buys it." Note the "accepted political narrative," and "everyone."

I'm sure Gambler will respond to the stuff that's specific to him, so I won't bother.  As to the rest, since when is oil a product anyone is "forced to consume?"  If you mean gasoline, people do have choices and are buying more fuel-efficient cars.  To the extenet we are "forced" to own cars (which is not the case for many urban dwellers), it's the great size of this country that created the need for autos.  That and a desire for personal freedom of action.  Oil, as you may know, is also the main ingredient in plastics and other polymers that are the basis for our consumer economy.  So I presume you mean to indict our entire economy as being driven by conspicuous consumption and too many choices.  If so, perhaps you need to reside in a planned economy like Cuba.  Other socialist states have fallen because the people who actually live there hated the system.  It's human nature.  So if you are indicting anything, it's human nature itself.  Good luck with that.
As for your mission to hunt down capitalists, you are misguided.  Small businesses, run by capitalists, are the engine of our economy and always have been.  Recent reports show virtually no jobs being created by large corporations and all our anemic growth is coming from small business.  So, by all means, go after these fledgeling, small-potatoes capitalists.  Squeeze the economy, throttle the tax base and choke off the revenues that pay your salary.
PS:  If you are still the sole arbiter of who's a Liberal, please let me know.  I will mail you my  credentials today.

I think it's clear that this alleged agent of the Federal government considers the 2 synonomous.

He of course is not alone. The entire government class is thourougly saturated with people like him.

This is why this economy is going to collapse.

Feel free to assume that any general term I mean does not apply to you.  You are not exactly in the front of my mind.  That being said, yes you are a mindless drone that follows whatever conventional wsidom is spoon fed to you by the liberals and media.  

I would LOVE to see the tax code re-written in a simpler, fairer way.  Now give me odds that can happen in this political environment.  They are even longer than the  odds against any tax increase passing this Congress.