What a tragedy, it would be nice if half the equipment, and people from the Nat'l Guard were there to help.  Oh well, at least we're bringing democracy to Iraq!

There was a similar concern in Kansas when a tornado hit.

a group of neighborhood activists i.e. Latte drinking Volvo driving liberals came a knocking at my door. They were asking me to sign a petition to limit the times of joint military maneuvers between the Navy and Marines at Camp Pendleton.  Apparently, many had complained when woken up early in the morning by a squadron of HH-60H Seahawks.

I replied: "Lady, that is the sound of FREEDOM"?

Furthermore, "if they do their fly-bys at 3:00 in the morning, I appreciate if you write a letter to the base commandant and say Thank You".

The point of my anedoctal story is this; many Californians are like the French they talk left but want to live right. The San Francisco Bay Area once had a proud tradition of serving our men and women in uniform but since Democrats took over we lost El Toro Base and Long Beach bases in SoCal, Alameda, Mare Island, The Presido, Treasure Island, FT. Ord, Moffett Field etc in NorCal.

Californians simply do not support the military like the rest of the country, they whine about the noise they make, the enviromental harm they pose and on and on, boo hoo! Then when they need them they cry.

During Loma Prieta earthquake of 1989, my division set up a mobile medical unit at Oakland Army Base to assist in rescue efforts at the Cypress Bridge collapse. Many injured were sent to Oak Knoll Navy hospital - now closed.

I just saw Sen. Barbara Boxer on TV and there she was saying where is our National Guard? What an ingrate! Where was she when our military was asking for her support. She can go to hell.


-- Modified on 10/24/2007 12:21:59 AM

put them up to it.

The people who cry are the ones who are caught up in their property values.

But you're just a little dumb here in that normals don't live or fight for the sake of fighting - normals fight to get it over with and finished.   Bases should have been closed as they were after the end of the cold war.

What pissed off most of us the most was sitting around wasting time. This is not a pleasant or enviable job, and normal people want to get it over and go home, and dumbshit leaders who don't know where to find the enemy are not appreciated in the ranks.

BTW, El Toro was at the OTHER end of CA.  I know, it's your Alzheimer's.

point of about the bases. Since most are closed, many Army Reserve and NG units have difficulty finding a place for their training. You do have point about real estate agents worrying about property values.

I used to enjoy watching from my balcony the Navy ships in the horizon. Your right, about about being a soldier, marine or sailor, it's not an enviable job and it doesn't help when realtor licensed condo officers complain about your work.



-- Modified on 10/23/2007 8:26:25 PM

it's the logistics of having the equipment & ammunition and getting to the space to use it.

So these separate facilities you mentioned don't affect the availability of the places they really need to go - Hunter-Liggett, Ft Irwin, 29 Palms, places where you can move and shoot without worrying about getting off your postage stamp.

Why are you worried about civilian use of a military hospital that gets shut down, when it's almost certainly being used now as a civilian hospital?

The fact of the matter is that military personnel work for a FRACTION of what civvies would, as Blackwater has shown us, and the draft is a MAJOR tax on being male.  

If you want to support the troops you will FUCKING FINISH THE JOB and LET THEM GO HOME and GET LAID - that's what every normal one of them wants to do.

Following orders of a person who may be stupider than you is a necessary part of military operations - it is not a lifetime goal.

Boxer's point is obvious - if the NG wasn't in Iraq doing who the fuck knows what - probably fighting the Turks here soon enough - they could be here.  Again, living under military orders is an unpleasant necessity, not a fucking lifetime goal.   If I'd wanted that, I'd have stayed married.

Yeah, you modified it to say that El Toros in SoCal.  Alright.

-- Modified on 10/23/2007 8:58:26 PM

The folks in New Orleans had what, 7 days advance notice? Most of the residents in San Diego County had less than 30 minutes. I am hearing absolutely no bitching from the evacuees, especially those at Qualcomm Stadium. There is plenty of food, cots, and support. Nothing but praise for the local fire, police, all first responders, and local volunteers. The operative word is local, not the Federal Govt or FEMA. Is this worth a comparison on how to do it right at the local level?

We live near Qualcom and I drove by there just a few hours ago.  if you didn't know the people had been driven from their homes you would think it was a tailgate party.

Hundreds of motor homes, big circus tents, local bands giving free concerts, restraunts catering food, I even heard there was a massage tent for people who were stressed.  We were thinking maybe we should get some volunteer providers and open a "hospitality" tent.  

But then you see people sleeing in cars and on cots under the stars instead of their homes and realize it's not all fun and games.  sigh.

But it's a huge difference from New Orleans where people were dying at the evac centers.

Something else that was surreal about this.  We had dinner tonight by the bay.  I notices a lot of people had dogs on the patio.  Then realized it was because they were refugees from local hotels and had their pets with them.

And along the bay front on Shelter Is. were dozens of expensive motor homes, some towing big boats and horse trailers, with expensive cars parked nearby.  I guess the wealthier folks evacuated in proper San Diego style.

And while a little comic relief is good for the soul - there are at least 1,250 families who have no home to return to.

Sigh, and hugs,
TS Jamie

yippeeee!!

fuck bushco

we get to stay home all week and mess with Dad's computers

"Chertoff called federal efforts 'phenomenally better' than the 2005 response to Hurricane Katrina 'because we have been preparing and planning and training together for the last 2 ½ years.'"

So it's not all local improvement. Every level of government is working better here.

BTW, it also shows that the Bush Administration can learn something.

-- Modified on 10/24/2007 8:07:15 AM

hell is their native element, and they hardly notice a little fire anyway.  They think it's just another excuse to party.

I think it's largely a matter of the nature of this calamity. With a hurricane, many residents of New Orleans had ridden hurricanes out before; I don't think they imagined the strength of Katrina, nor imagined that the levies would break. Maybe some couldn't evacuate, but others were afraid that if they evacuated and Katrina wasn't so bad, looters would stay behind and steal whatever was in their homes. I think that was more of a certainty for them.

With a fire, you don't "ride it out."

isn't San Diego a pretty wealthy area, at least where the fires are burning?  Mostly white?  there is the difference.

just wanted to add some "fire" to the debate since it was such a love fest.

Or not helpless because they're so fucking wealthy?  Something else, or what?

Remember, this is Enron-by-the-Sea we're talking about here.

you notice He isn't burning the Central Valley or desert, which vote Red (we're looking into the unfortunate historical associations of that color).

And He isn't burning Mexico.  Damn (excuse me) I wonder why?  Oh yes, I remember - because He already afflicted all them with syphilitic plagues which He doesn't want to relieve with fire.

And He isn't burning the oceans.  Rest assured, you'll know when He's Really Pissed, because then He'll start burning the oceans.

This is such a cool gig, just making this shit up as I go along.

Two of my friends have lost their homes, a third cannot get to his home because the roads are blocked, and my daylight is suffused with a post-Apocalyptic "reddish" tint.

As for me, the air outside my home is so foul and dirty, I have to stay indoors.

The smell of  burning wood in a crackling fireplace is a very pleasant aroma, but not so much the smell of complete annihilation by flame on a large scale.

The fact that it's conservative country might not make as much difference as that.

I hope things improve for you, your friends and family, and for all of California.

perhaps because of experience.

But it does raise the question of, what does it take to make us learn?

Why do we worry so much about earthquakes when in fact fires and (flood) slides cause more and more preventable damage?  

Probably because of the psychological impression.

Global warming or not, AL GORE may do us one hell of a favor by focusing our attention on managing our environment as our home (as indeed it is) instead of shooting up anybody who doesn't look so much like us.  

True, (per Billy Joel) "we didn't start the fire".  But we still have to put it out, or live with it.  

"The San Francisco Bay Area once had a proud tradition of serving our men and women in uniform but since Democrats took over we lost El Toro Base and Long Beach bases in SoCal, Alameda, Mare Island, The Presido, Treasure Island, FT. Ord, Moffett Field etc in NorCal."

The base closures happened on the Republican controlled Congress' watch, as I recall.

Thanks for the spin.

"More than 350 installations have been closed in four BRAC rounds: 1989, 1991, 1993 and 1995. The most recent round of BRAC completed in the fall of 2005 and with the commission's recommendations became law in November of 2005."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Base_Realignment_and_Closure

The level of devastation is no where near the same. Put LA county and San Diego uder 6 feet of water, take out most of the electric utility of SOCA and then we can talk.

Of course they could use and actually might appreciate all that water right now.

the week. I like Zepplin, Johnny Cash, Sam Cooke, the Stones, and Bob Marley and mucho jazz. In the meantime, will you accept my prayers?

I'll keep the light on...

-- Modified on 10/24/2007 11:19:34 PM

could land and he could come eyeball it.

With friends like that, our fire depts don't need enemies.

way more likely than not.

When the Prez comes into an area, everything freezes for hours and miles in all directions.