At least that's the tripe being spouted by the right wing. They all sem to forget that there's this little thing called an Internet (or if you're the Chimp in Chief, 'the internets') that allows people to find just that was said and when.

Here's what I've found so far:
"We are greatly concerned about any possible linkup between terrorists and regimes that have or seek weapons of mass destruction...In the case of Saddam Hussein, we've got a dictator who is clearly pursuing and already possesses some of these weapons. A regime that hates America and everything we stand for must never be permitted to threaten America with weapons of mass destruction."

- Dick Cheney, Vice President
Detroit, Fund-Raiser
6/20/2002

"Simply stated, there is no doubt that Saddam Hussein now has weapons of mass destruction."

- Dick Cheney, Vice President
Speech to VFW National Convention
8/26/2002

"There is already a mountain of evidence that Saddam Hussein is gathering weapons for the purpose of using them. And adding additional information is like adding a foot to Mount Everest."

- Ari Fleischer, Press Secretary
Response to Question From Press
9/6/2002

"We don't want the smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud."

- Condoleeza Rice, US National Security Advisor
CNN Late Edition
9/8/2002

"Right now, Iraq is expanding and improving facilities that were used for the production of biological weapons."

- George W. Bush, President
Speech to UN General Assembly
9/12/2002

"Iraq has stockpiled biological and chemical weapons, and is rebuilding the facilities used to make more of those weapons. We have sources that tell us that Saddam Hussein recently authorized Iraqi field commanders to use chemical weapons -- the very weapons the dictator tells us he does not have."

- George W. Bush, President
Radio Address
10/5/2002

"The Iraqi regime...possesses and produces chemical and biological weapons. It is seeking nuclear weapons. We know that the regime has produced thousands of tons of chemical agents, including mustard gas, sarin nerve gas, VX nerve gas."

- George W. Bush, President
Cincinnati, Ohio Speech
10/7/2002

"And surveillance photos reveal that the regime is rebuilding facilities that it had used to produce chemical and biological weapons."

- George W. Bush, President
Cincinnati, Ohio Speech
10/7/2002

"After eleven years during which we have tried containment, sanctions, inspections, even selected military action, the end result is that Saddam Hussein still has chemical and biological weapons and is increasing his capabilities to make more. And he is moving ever closer to developing a nuclear weapon."

- George W. Bush, President
Cincinnati, Ohio Speech
10/7/2002

"We've also discovered through intelligence that Iraq has a growing fleet of manned and unmanned aerial vehicles that could be used to disperse chemical or biological weapons across broad areas."

- George W. Bush, President
Cincinnati, Ohio Speech
10/7/2002

"Iraq, despite UN sanctions, maintains an aggressive program to rebuild the infrastructure for its nuclear, chemical, biological, and missile programs. In each instance, Iraq's procurement agents are actively working to obtain both weapons-specific and dual-use materials and technologies critical to their rebuilding and expansion efforts, using front companies and whatever illicit means are at hand."

- John Bolton, Undersecretary of State for Arms Control
Speech to the Hudson Institute
11/1/2002

"We estimate that once Iraq acquires fissile material -- whether from a foreign source or by securing the materials to build an indigenous fissile material capability -- it could fabricate a nuclear weapon within one year. It has rebuilt its civilian chemical infrastructure and renewed production of chemical warfare agents, probably including mustard, sarin, and VX. It actively maintains all key aspects of its offensive BW program."

- John Bolton, Undersecretary of State for Arms Control
Speech to the Hudson Institute
11/1/2002

"Iraq could decide on any given day to provide biological or chemical weapons to a terrorist group or to individual terrorists...The war on terror will not be won until Iraq is completely and verifiably deprived of weapons of mass destruction."

- Dick Cheney, Vice President
Denver, Address To Air National Guard
12/1/2002

"If he declares he has none, then we will know that Saddam Hussein is once again misleading the world."

- Ari Fleischer, Press Secretary
Press Briefing
12/2/2002

"The president of the United States and the secretary of defense would not assert as plainly and bluntly as they have that Iraq has weapons of mass destruction if it was not true, and if they did not have a solid basis for saying it."

- Ari Fleischer, Press Secretary
Response to Question From Press
12/4/2002

"We know for a fact that there are weapons there."

- Ari Fleischer, Press Secretary
Press Briefing
1/9/2003

"I am absolutely convinced, based on the information that's been given to me, that the weapon of mass destruction which can kill more people than an atomic bomb -- that is, biological weapons -- is in the hands of the leadership of Iraq."

- Bill Frist, Senate Majority Leader
MSNBC Interview
1/10/2003

"What is unique about Iraq compared to, I would argue, any other country in the world, in this juncture, is the exhaustion of diplomacy thus far, and, No. 2, this intersection of weapons of mass destruction."

- Bill Frist, Senate Majority Leader
NewsHour Interview
1/22/2003

"The British government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa. Our intelligence sources tell us that he has attempted to purchase high-strength aluminum tubes suitable for nuclear weapons production."

- George W. Bush, President
State of the Union Address
1/28/2003

"Our intelligence officials estimate that Saddam Hussein had the materials to produce as much as 500 tons of sarin, mustard and VX nerve agent."

- George W. Bush, President
State of the Union Address
1/28/2003

"We know that Saddam Hussein is determined to keep his weapons of mass destruction, is determined to make more."

- Colin Powell, Secretary of State
Remarks to UN Security Council
2/5/2003

"There can be no doubt that Saddam Hussein has biological weapons and the capability to rapidly produce more, many more. And he has the ability to dispense these lethal poisons and diseases in ways that can cause massive death and destruction. If biological weapons seem too terrible to contemplate, chemical weapons are equally chilling."

- Colin Powell, Secretary of State
Addresses the U.N. Security Council
2/5/2003

"In Iraq, a dictator is building and hiding weapons that could enable him to dominate the Middle East and intimidate the civilized world -- and we will not allow it."

- George W. Bush, President
Speech to the American Enterprise Institute
2/26/2003

"If Iraq had disarmed itself, gotten rid of its weapons of mass destruction over the past 12 years, or over the last several months since (UN Resolution) 1441 was enacted, we would not be facing the crisis that we now have before us...But the suggestion that we are doing this because we want to go to every country in the Middle East and rearrange all of its pieces is not correct."

- Colin Powell, Secretary of State
Interview with Radio France International
2/28/2003

"I am not eager to send young Americans into harm's way in Iraq, or to see innocent people killed or hurt in military operations. Given all of the facts and circumstances known to us, however, I am convinced that if we wait, a threat will continue to materialize in Iraq that could cause incalculable damage to world peace in general, and to the United States in particular."

- Bill Frist, Senate Majority Leader
Letter to Future of Freedom Foundation
3/1/2003

"Iraq is a grave threat to this nation. It desires to acquire and use weapons of mass terror and is run by a despot with a proven record of willingness to use them. Iraq has had 12 years to comply with UN requirements for disarmament and has failed to do so. The president is right to say it's time has run out."

- Bill Frist, Senate Majority Leader
Senate Speech
3/7/2003

"So has the strategic decision been made to disarm Iraq of its weapons of mass destruction by the leadership in Baghdad? I think our judgment has to be clearly not."

- Colin Powell, Secretary of State
Remarks to UN Security Council
3/7/2003

"Getting rid of Saddam Hussein's regime is our best inoculation. Destroying once and for all his weapons of disease and death is a vaccination for the world."

- Bill Frist, Senate Majority Leader
Washington Post op-ed
3/16/2003

"Let's talk about the nuclear proposition for a minute. We know that based on intelligence, that has been very, very good at hiding these kinds of efforts. He's had years to get good at it and we know he has been absolutely devoted to trying to acquire nuclear weapons. And we believe he has, in fact, reconstituted nuclear weapons."

- Dick Cheney, Vice President
Meet The Press
3/16/2003

"Intelligence gathered by this and other governments leaves no doubt that the Iraq regime continues to possess and conceal some of the most lethal weapons ever devised."

- George W. Bush, President
Address to the Nation
3/17/2003

"The United States...is now at war so we will not ever see what terrorists could do if supplied with weapons of mass destruction by Saddam Hussein."

- Bill Frist, Senate Majority Leader
Senate Debate
3/20/2003

"Well, there is no question that we have evidence and information that Iraq has weapons of mass destruction, biological and chemical particularly . . . all this will be made clear in the course of the operation, for whatever duration it takes."

- Ari Fleischer, Press Secretary
Press Briefing
3/21/2003

"There is no doubt that the regime of Saddam Hussein possesses weapons of mass destruction. And...as this operation continues, those weapons will be identified, found, along with the people who have produced them and who guard them."

- General Tommy Franks, Commander in Chief Central Command
Press Conference
3/22/2003

"One of our top objectives is to find and destroy the WMD. There are a number of sites."

- Victoria Clark, Pentagon Spokeswoman
Press Briefing
3/22/2003

"I have no doubt we're going to find big stores of weapons of mass destruction."

- Kenneth Adelman, Defense Policy Board member
Washington Post, p. A27
3/23/2003

"We know where they are. They're in the area around Tikrit and Baghdad and east, west, south and north somewhat."

- Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Defense
ABC Interview
3/30/2003

"We simply cannot live in fear of a ruthless dictator, aggressor and terrorist such as Saddam Hussein, who possesses the world's most deadly weapons."

- Bill Frist, Senate Majority Leader
Speech to American Israel Political Action Committee
3/31/2003

"We still need to find and secure Iraq's weapons of mass destruction facilities and secure Iraq's borders so we can prevent the flow of weapons of mass destruction materials and senior regime officials out of the country."

- Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Defense
Press Conference
4/9/2003

"You bet we're concerned about it. And one of the reasons it's important is because the nexus between terrorist states with weapons of mass destruction...and terrorist groups -- networks -- is a critical link. And the thought that...some of those materials could leave the country and in the hands of terrorist networks would be a very unhappy prospect. So it is important to us to see that that doesn't happen."

- Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Defense
Press Conference
4/9/2003

"Obviously the administration intends to publicize all the weapons of mass destruction U.S. forces find -- and there will be plenty."

- Robert Kagan, Neocon scholar
Washington Post op-ed
4/9/2003

"I think you have always heard, and you continue to hear from officials, a measure of high confidence that, indeed, the weapons of mass destruction will be found."

- Ari Fleischer, Press Secretary
Press Briefing
4/10/2003

"But make no mistake -- as I said earlier -- we have high confidence that they have weapons of mass destruction. That is what this war was about and it is about. And we have high confidence it will be found."

- Ari Fleischer, Press Secretary
Press Briefing
4/10/2003

"Were not going to find anything until we find people who tell us where the things are. And we have that very high on our priority list, to find the people who know. And when we do, then well learn precisely where things were and what was done."

- Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Defense
Meet the Press
4/13/2003

"I have absolute confidence that there are weapons of mass destruction inside this country. Whether we will turn out, at the end of the day, to find them in one of the 2,000 or 3,000 sites we already know about or whether contact with one of these officials who we may come in contact with will tell us, 'Oh, well, there's actually another site,' and we'll find it there, I'm not sure."

- General Tommy Franks, Commander in Chief Central Command
Fox News
4/13/2003

"We are learning more as we interrogate or have discussions with Iraqi scientists and people within the Iraqi structure, that perhaps he destroyed some, perhaps he dispersed some. And so we will find them."

- George W. Bush, President
NBC Interview
4/24/2003

"There are people who in large measure have information that we need...so that we can track down the weapons of mass destruction in that country."

- Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Defense
Press Briefing
4/25/2003

"We'll find them. It'll be a matter of time to do so."

- George W. Bush, President
Remarks to Reporters
5/3/2003

"I'm absolutely sure that there are weapons of mass destruction there and the evidence will be forthcoming. We're just getting it just now."

- Colin Powell, Secretary of State
Remarks to Reporters
5/4/2003

"We never believed that we'd just tumble over weapons of mass destruction in that country."

- Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Defense
Fox News Interview
5/4/2003

"I'm not surprised if we begin to uncover the weapons program of Saddam Hussein -- because he had a weapons program."

- George W. Bush, President
Remarks to Reporters
5/6/2003

"U.S. officials never expected that 'we were going to open garages and find' weapons of mass destruction."

- Condoleeza Rice, US National Security Advisor
Reuters Interview
5/12/2003

"I just don't know whether it was all destroyed years ago -- I mean, there's no question that there were chemical weapons years ago -- whether they were destroyed right before the war, (or) whether they're still hidden."

- Maj. Gen. David Petraeus, Commander 101st Airborne
Press Briefing
5/13/2003

"We said all along that we will never get to the bottom of the Iraqi WMD program simply by going and searching specific sites, that you'd have to be able to get people who know about the programs to talk to you."

- Paul Wolfowitz, Deputy Secretary of Defense
Interview with Australian Broadcasting
5/13/2003

"Before the war, there's no doubt in my mind that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction, biological and chemical. I expected them to be found. I still expect them to be found."

- Gen. Michael Hagee, Commandant of the Marine Corps
Interview with Reporters
5/21/2003

"It's going to take time to find them, but we know he had them. And whether he destroyed them, moved them or hid them, we're going to find out the truth. One thing is for certain: Saddam Hussein no longer threatens America with weapons of mass destruction."

- George W. Bush, President
Speech at a weapons factory in Ohio
5/25/2003

"Given time, given the number of prisoners now that we're interrogating, I'm confident that we're going to find weapons of mass destruction."

- Gen. Richard Myers, Chairman Joint Chiefs of Staff
NBC Today Show interview
5/26/2003

"They may have had time to destroy them, and I don't know the answer."

- Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Defense
Remarks to Council on Foreign Relations
5/27/2003

"For bureaucratic reasons, we settled on one issue, weapons of mass destruction (as justification for invading Iraq) because it was the one reason everyone could agree on."

- Paul Wolfowitz, Deputy Secretary of Defense
Vanity Fair interview
5/28/2003

"The President is indeed satisfied with the intelligence that he received. And I think that's borne out by the fact that, just as Secretary Powell described at the United Nations, we have found the bio trucks that can be used only for the purpose of producing biological weapons. That's proof-perfect that the intelligence in that regard was right on target."

- Ari Fleischer, Press Secretary
Press Briefing
5/29/2003

"We have teams of people that are out looking. They've investigated a number of sites. And within the last week or two, they have in fact captured and have in custody two of the mobile trailers that Secretary Powell talked about at the United Nations as being biological weapons laboratories."

- Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Defense
Infinity Radio Interview
5/30/2003

"But for those who say we haven't found the banned manufacturing devices or banned weapons, they're wrong, we found them."

- George W. Bush, President
Interview with TVP Poland
5/30/2003

"You remember when Colin Powell stood up in front of the world, and he said Iraq has got laboratories, mobile labs to build biological weapons...They're illegal. They're against the United Nations resolutions, and we've so far discovered two...And we'll find more weapons as time goes on."

- George W. Bush, President
Press Briefing
5/30/2003

"It was a surprise to me then -- it remains a surprise to me now -- that we have not uncovered weapons, as you say, in some of the forward dispersal sites. Believe me, it's not for lack of trying. We've been to virtually every ammunition supply point between the Kuwaiti border and Baghdad, but they're simply not there."

- Lt. Gen. James Conway, 1st Marine Expeditionary Force
Press Interview
5/30/2003

"Do I think we're going to find something? Yeah, I kind of do, because I think there's a lot of information out there."

- Maj. Gen. Keith Dayton, Defense Intelligence Agency
Press Conference
5/30/2003

"This wasn't material I was making up, it came from the intelligence community."

- Colin Powell, Secretary of State
Press Briefing
6/2/2003

"We recently found two mobile biological weapons facilities which were capable of producing biological agents. This is the man who spent decades hiding tools of mass murder. He knew the inspectors were looking for them. You know better than me he's got a big country in which to hide them. We're on the look. We'll reveal the truth."

- George W. Bush, President Camp Sayliya, Qatar
6/5/2003

"I would put before you Exhibit A, the mobile biological labs that we have found. People are saying, 'Well, are they truly mobile biological labs?' Yes, they are. And the DCI, George Tenet, Director of Central Intelligence, stands behind that assessment."

- Colin Powell, Secretary of State
Fox News Interview
6/8/2003

"No one ever said that we knew precisely where all of these agents were, where they were stored."

- Condoleeza Rice, US National Security Advisor
Meet the Press
6/8/2003

"What the president has said is because it's been the long-standing view of numerous people, not only in this country, not only in this administration, but around the world, including at the United Nations, who came to those conclusions...And the president is not going to engage in the rewriting of history that others may be trying to engage in."

- Ari Fleischer, Press Secretary
Response to Question From Press
6/9/2003

"Iraq had a weapons program...Intelligence throughout the decade showed they had a weapons program. I am absolutely convinced with time we'll find out they did have a weapons program."

- George W. Bush, President
Comment to Reporters
6/9/2003

"The biological weapons labs that we believe strongly are biological weapons labs, we didn't find any biological weapons with those labs. But should that give us any comfort? Not at all. Those were labs that could produce biological weapons whenever Saddam Hussein might have wanted to have a biological weapons inventory."

- Colin Powell, Secretary of State
Associated Press Interview
6/12/2003

"Those documents were only one piece of evidence in a larger body of evidence suggesting that Iraq attempted to purchase uranium from Africa...The issue of Iraq's pursuit of uranium in Africa is supported by multiple sources of intelligence. The other sources of evidence did and do support the president's statement."

- Sean McCormack, National Security Council Spokesman
Statement to press
6/13/2003

"My personal view is that their intelligence has been, I'm sure, imperfect, but good. In other words, I think the intelligence was correct in general, and that you always will find out precisely what it was once you get on the ground and have a chance to talk to people and explore it, and I think that will happen."

- Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Defense
Press Briefing
6/18/2003

"I have reason, every reason, to believe that the intelligence that we were operating off was correct and that we will, in fact, find weapons or evidence of weapons, programs, that are conclusive. But that's just a matter of time...It's now less than eight weeks since the end of major combat in Iraq and I believe that patience will prove to be a virtue."

- Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Defense
Pentagon media briefing
6/24/2003

MS. BLOCK: There were no toxins found in those trailers. SECRETARY POWELL: Which could mean one of several things: one, they hadn't been used yet to develop toxins; or, secondly, they had been sterilized so thoroughly that there is no residual left. It may well be that they hadn't been used yet.

- Colin Powell, Secretary of State
All Things Considered, Interview
6/27/2003

"That was the concern we had with Saddam Hussein. Not only did he have weapons -- and we'll uncover not only his weapons but all of his weapons programs -- he never lost the intent to have these kinds of weapons."

- Colin Powell, Secretary of State
All Things Considered, Interview
6/27/2003

"I think the burden is on those people who think he didn't have weapons of mass destruction to tell the world where they are."

- Ari Fleischer, Press Secretary
Press Briefing
7/9/2003

On March 9, 2003, just days before the invasion began, Dean told Tim Russert, on NBC's Meet The Press, “I don't want Saddam staying in power with control over those weapons of mass destruction. I want him to be disarmed.”

-- Modified on 9/24/2007 3:31:31 PM

Could translate that to mean we should invade a country, kill a large number of it's citizens, occupy it for an undetermined length of time ostensibly to lure terrorists from all over the world to come and use it as a battlefield so we can (again ostensibly) avoid fighting them in our back yard and refuse to think about leaving until the government we shoved down their throats votes to divide up the only natural resource they have in a manner that we approve (that being to the benefit of Big Oil, a liesure service of the Republican Party).

That is what you meant, right? Of course, one could always suppose it meant using the UN inspectors to make sure Saddam didn't develop any WMDs - which they were doing very nicely, thank you. And before you parrot the right wing spin about Saddam kicking them out, that didn't happen - they were in place doing their jobs right up to the day Bush unilaterally invaded the country.

keep chanting Alex Jones is God and one day....Viola!

too bad there's a shitload of Dems I could site that thought there were WMD right up until the last minute.

it's a horseshit fucking lie for anyone to say THEY KNEW there were no WMD.

only kucinick the syrian mole...

-- Modified on 9/24/2007 4:48:19 PM

Whenever you completely ignore the substance of a post and use one of your throwaway insults, you've just conceded that point.
Can't argue intelligently? Use distraction.
I thought you were smarter than that.

I guess neocon chickenhawk doesn't qualify.

C'mon Puck I won't even begin to try to list the Dem's who also believed and stated publicly that Saddam had WMD's, including your hero Hillary.

lecture on intelligent debate?

LOL

BTW, for all your volume,

You NEVER proven your point.

LMAO

I start out with neocon chickenhawk, yes - and go on to post something of substance. Were you insulted? How about that - I didn't point it at you. Guess I hit a nerve, eh?

Now, how about posting something that requires reasoned thought, like a rebuttal to what I wrote? No? I didn't think so, insults are so much easier.




------

A conservative is a man who is too cowardly to fight and too fat to run.
Elbert Hubbard (1856-1915)

Go ahead and list them, and then be honest enough to say where they got the information. Damn near all of them start out with the same qualifier: "According to Intelligence".

Where did they get that intelligence? It was cherrypicked by Cheney. Remember the Downing St Minutes? "The Bush Administration is fixing the facts to suit the policy." Do you know what that means?
Only a complete fucktard (have a laugh, BK) would try that tired crap and expect a thinking person to buy it.

Let's see, he says "I don't want Saddam staying in power with control over THOSE weapons of mass destruction."  

The problem there is that the only reason people thought there were weapons of mass destruction is because Bush and his cronies had enough disinformation floating around to make any and all think that Saddam had enough WMD's to blow up Earth.  It was lies.  

He also said, he doesn't want Saddam staying in power, he didn't say, "we MUST ATTACK IRAQ if they have WMD's."

If I say, "I don't want ice cream" it doesn't mean I want all the ice cream in the house destroyed.

France has said they don't want Iran to have nuclear capability.  Does this mean they have expressly authorized a war against Iran?  No questions asked.  No, they're investigating further, trying sanctions, etc...
 

There is a huge difference and you're selective reading is proof positive that you're so biased, and perhaps simple, that you can't even make anywhere near an unbiased assessment of any situation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnceSIxxOYg

he planted the story early!!!

Powell: “We should constantly be reviewing our policies, constantly be looking at those sanctions to make sure that they have directed that purpose. That purpose is every bit as important now as it was 10 years ago when we began it. And frankly, they have worked. He has not developed any significant capability with respect to weapons of mass destruction. He is unable to project conventional power against his neighbors.” --February 24, 2001


Rice: “But in terms of Saddam Hussein being there, let's remember that his country is divided, in effect. He does not control the northern part of his country. We are able to keep arms from him. His military forces have not been rebuilt.” --July 29, 2001

Amazing he became such a threat right after 9/11.

It seems Clinton put him in his place!  Hooray Dem's for the TOUGH TALK on Saddam and a bombing that made him no more threat to the world!  



-- Modified on 9/24/2007 7:13:50 PM

there is a difference between rhetorical devices, like overstating an enemies power, etc...and lying and misstating facts to justify a war.  You see a difference there, right?

If Bush had merely talked tough about Iraq, well, that's par for the course in politics.  However, when you turn tough talk, and exaggeration, into justifications for war you have a problem.  Saddam probably did pose a minor threat to the world, however, a minor threat should be dealt with on a small level.  Send some troops over Bush, bomb Iraq, whatever, you don't invade the country, declare war, and kill 120,000 Iraqi's.

Sarkozy in France is talking tough in France about Iran right now.  At this point he's doing it for political reasons.  He may be trying to appeal to the US, he may be trying to "talk tough" so his people see him as a strong leader.  That is what it is.  If he decided to invade Iran tomorrow, because he says they all of a sudden have a (non-existent) nuclear device, then you have a problem.

as much as questions like, 1st is the cure any better than the disease, 2nd wouldn't it be smart to catch bin Laden, and 3rd, if WMDs is what we're worried about, why are we still there?

I think the WMD discussion is a smokescreen, and not even a very good one.

"eat me".

You got no room to talk about it.

Is the Left Wing spin machine trying to say that Dean never said it? Is that not what Puck's original post is about? That the Right Wing spin machine is trying to claim that Bush and Co. never said Iraq had WMDs? How does your example counter his post?

Yeah, but it's Puck's discussion. he's lists numerous Rep's who stated that there were WMDs, but refuses to admit that there were at least as many Dems who believed the same thing.Typical partisan thinking, all my guys are smart and honest, all your guys are stupid liars. Cmon, Give me a fucking break. and yes, it sounds equally as stupid when a rightie does it.

Almost all who pressed us into this war had no experience of war themselves and scant experience of the military. It's become part of a curious pattern in current conservatives: the biggest hawks avoided service to the country the most; the young republican conservatives mostly avoid signing up for Iraq or Afghanistan. Meanwhile, on a different front, the most sexually conservative among Republicans are turning out to be closet libertines.

All through the Republicans have undercut policy with personal behavior and self-contradiction.  

In the years that follow the Bush administration, I think "chickenhawk" is going to be a lasting description of this "regime."    

It reminds me what a truly great President Bill Clinton was. He saw the building threat and, WITHOUT RECKLESSLY INVADING IRAQ used diplomacy, measured force and the United Nations to render Hussein incapable of harming us, and it was done even while the yapping dogs of the Republican Party were trying to tear him down. He did the job so well that our current idiot-in-chief has had to admit that there were, in fact, no WMDs to be found. What he was saying, for the fucktards in the crowd (thought I'd throw in a chuckle) is that Bill Clinton was successful.

That's the real story, Bill.

I never refused to admit that many dems fell for the doctored and cherrypicked Intel. I never said that many Republicans fell for it too - the Cheney spin machine didn't allow much oversight, ya know? What YOU apparently refused to see in my posts was that there were NO quotes from rank-and-file Republicans - only from the Neocon High Command. Wanna go back and check? So you counter my quotes by Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, Powell, Frist, Wolfowitz, Petraeus, Franks,  Fleischer et al by trotting out a few quotes from members of the opposition party who had absolutely no chance of seeing intel first hand.

What Did The Democrats Say About Iraq's WMD


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JANUARY  30, 2004   |   Printable Version
"Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime ... He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation ... And now he is miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction ... So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real..."
  - Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23. 2003 | Source

"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force -- if necessary -- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security."
  - Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002 | Source

"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line."
  - President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998 | Source

"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."
  - President Bill Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998 | Source

"We must stop Saddam from ever again jeopardizing the stability and security of his neighbors with weapons of mass destruction."
  - Madeline Albright, Feb 1, 1998 | Source

"He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has ten times since 1983."
  - Sandy Berger, Clinton National Security Adviser, Feb, 18, 1998 | Source

"[W]e urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S. Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs."
Letter to President Clinton.
  - (D) Senators Carl Levin, Tom Daschle, John Kerry, others, Oct. 9, 1998 | Source

"Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process."
  - Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D, CA), Dec. 16, 1998 | Source

"Hussein has ... chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass destruction and palaces for his cronies."
  - Madeline Albright, Clinton Secretary of State, Nov. 10, 1999 | Source

"We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandate of the United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and th! e means of delivering them."
  - Sen. Carl Levin (D, MI), Sept. 19, 2002 | Source

"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."
  - Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002 | Source

"Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power."
  - Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002 | Source

"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."
  - Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002 | Source

"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of 1998. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons..."
  - Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3, 2002 | Source

"There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have nuclear weapons within the next five years ... We also should remember we have always underestimated the progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction."
  - Sen. Jay Rockefeller (D, WV), Oct 10, 2002 | Source

"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including al Qaeda members ... It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons."
  - Sen. Hillary Clinton (D, NY), Oct 10, 2002 | Source

"We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam Hussein has, and has had for a number of years, a developing capacity for the production and storage of weapons of mass destruction."
  - Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL), Dec. 8, 2002 | Source





 
 
 

Try and keep up yourself.

Clinton believes Iraq had weapons of mass destruction: Portugal PM

LISBON (AFP) Jan 09, 2004
Former US president Bill Clinton said in October during a visit to Portugal that he was convinced Iraq had weapons of mass destruction up until the fall of Saddam Hussein, Portuguese Prime Minister Jose Manuel Durao Barroso said late Thursday.
"When Clinton was here recently he told me he was absolutely convinced, given his years in the White House and the access to privileged information which he had, that Iraq possessed weapons of mass destruction until the end of the Saddam regime," he said in an interview with Portuguese cable news channel SIC Noticias.

Clinton, a Democrat who left office in 2001, met with Durao Barroso on October 21 when he travelled to Lisbon to give a speech on globalization.

The US justified going to war against Iraq last year citing the threat posed by Baghdad's weapons of mass destruction.

Republican President George W. Bush used Iraq's nuclear, chemical and biological weapons programmes and Saddam Hussein's ties to terrorism as the main case to the United Nations for the US-led war against Iraq.

But since the US occupation of Iraq, American forces have failed to uncover any chemical, biological or nuclear weapons since the war. Hundreds of experts are still scouring Iraq in the hunt.

An influential Washington think-tank said Thursday the Bush administration "systematically" inflated the threat from Iraq's weapons programmes in a bid to strengthen its push for military action against Iraq last year.

In its report, the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace also said it was unlikely that Iraq could have destroyed, hidden or moved out of the country hundreds of weapons of mass destruction without Washington detecting some sign of activity.




All rights reserved. Copyright 2003 Agence France-Presse. Sections of the information displayed on this page (dispatches, photographs, logos) are protected by intellectual property rights owned by Agence France-Presse. As a consequence, you may not copy, reproduce, modify, transmit, publish, display or in any way commercially exploit any of the content of this section without the prior written consent of Agence France-Presse.

with a "whiny lib"?

Naw, you're playing smokescreen.

I don't give a shit what every - or any - Democrat said.   If they had stepped on our dick half as bad as Idiot-boy had, you can bet I'd be on their ass instead.

Oh, he had no choice.   He couldn't possibly have used his fucking brain, because he doesn't have one!  See, I proved it for ya.

the administration can guess better than a simple country lawyer could.  But they never do, so I may as well guess on this one too.

I don't see that the USA wants or needs to run the mideast as the 51st state or US territory.  I've got nothing against theft, except that you don't steal liabilities, you get tricked into them.  If the locals can't manage the place, what makes us think we can?

So what we should have done is pretty obvious, ie set up what we wanted in advance, then use the Marines to just pull the support out from under them.  Because if you DON'T do that, you find yourself starting an endless war, which is of course somewhat stupider than cutting your wrists and jumping into the shark cage.

The problem is making fairly sure that it's going to come down the way you want it, and that's where Dubya ADD boy excels.

Or, if you CAN'T manipulate a situation into a predictable result, then you at least defer it until you can catch bin Laden.

See, that isn't rocket science.  It's basic.  But you're pretty stupid if you think the GOP can't figure it out, and aren't in fact getting what they want, ie the mess in Iraq benefits them.

I guess that means that you consider the coinhabitor of the white house for the previous eight years, who was also a US senator had no access to anything but "the Cheney machine doctored info"

You either think the democrats are extremely stupid to allow the wool to pulled over thier very high ranking eyes, or you're giving very high credit to the "cheney machine".

Since when did anyone say that Bush et al never said there were WMD's. Of course he said it and so did everyone else including your heroes, Hillary and Kerry. If you now claim that a high ranking Senator and the former resident of the white house, also a US senator didn't have access to information, then none of the Dems are smart enough to be in office, and if they were so stupid to be manipulated by the likes of "Dubya" as you like to call him, then who is really the stupid one?

Some are taken out of context, not surprisingly, and most tend not to link to the source of the quote.  That doesn't really mean much, but whenever I see "....." scattered throughout quotes I get a little nervous when I'm dealing with conservatives.  Just for fun, take a read from where most of the Al Gore quotes come from.  Please.  Read the whole thing.  Not just the quotes that Fox News provides to misinform you.

Maybe this will help you.... (sorry, didn't mean to make you nervous with the ..... )

You know, I appreciate the response.  You're responses are helpful at least.  I'll take a read later to see what I think about them.  When I searched for the quotes I got a 'Glenn Beck' webpage with all busted links.

Anyway, thanks.  

(I still don't trust the ...........!!!)



-- Modified on 9/25/2007 10:47:18 AM

Do you really believe that every member of Congress and the Senate has the same acces to intelligence as does Cheney? If so, I have some Florida land to sell you, and a bridge or two.
The White house first said they were invading Iraq because of WMDs. When that was proved a lie they pretended that was never the reason and began to shuffle through their deck of 'reasons' - bringing Democracy, fighting al Qaeda (non-existant under Saddam), the list goes on.

Maybe this will help you - here's a failry important qualifier to the 'true' nature of all those quotes, taken from the page you reference:

However, some of the quotes are truncated, and context is provided for none of them — several of these quotes were offered in the course of statements that clearly indicated the speaker was decidedly against unilateral military intervention in Iraq by the U.S. Moreover, several of the quotes offered antedate the four nights of airstrikes unleashed against Iraq by U.S. and British forces during Operation Desert Fox in December 1998, after which Secretary of Defense William S. Cohen and Gen. Henry H. Shelton (chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff) announced the action had been successful in "degrad[ing] Saddam Hussein's ability to deliver chemical, biological and nuclear weapons."


Not so supportive of your side, is it?

Here's your quote:

"Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power."
 - Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002 | Source

Here's the full context:

Nevertheless, all Americans should acknowledge that Iraq does, indeed, pose a serious threat to the stability of the Persian Gulf region, and we should be about the business of organizing an international coalition to eliminate his access to weapons of mass destruction. Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to completely deter, and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power.

Now let's be clear: There's no international law that can prevent the United States from taking action to protect our vital interests when it is manifestly clear that there's a choice to be made between law and our survival. Indeed, international law itself recognizes that such choices stay within the purview of all nations.

I believe, however, that such a choice is not presented in the case of Iraq. Indeed, should we decide to proceed, our action can be justified within the framework of international law rather than requiring us to go outside the framework of international law.


Not really the same meaning, is it? Gore isn't really saying the same things the Bushies did, is he?

I misunderstod the substance of your post - you're right, the left has never denied sthe statements by Dean and other Dems, we have only questioned the source (and veracity) of information that rationally led them to those statements. I would include many Republicans in that group as well, they are not all evil.

Do you really believe that Hillary and Kerry did not have access to the same quality of information as the Vice President? I think you are the one who should not be shopping for bridges and such, until you get a better grip on reality.

Inquiring minds want to know.

Or, is this just more pointless discussion?



Do you think this war could have a faster more advantageous resolution if the USA did __________(fill in the blank)(No, you can't materialize another 1 million Arabic speaking troops and $18 trillion, or anything else that does not presently exist, and yes, you will be subject to cross-examination, and possible hooting and jeering)  (BK's answer to "just believe and not make the GOP look so bad" is disqualified in advance.  Answers must be reasonably related to reality, acknowledging that reality does have a well-known liberal bias.)

Of course they didn't have the same access! Cheney is the first sitting VP to go to the CIA and micromanage Intel, do you think for a minute that he and Rove would let ANY member of the opposition party look at the raw intel, especially in light of what we have learned in subsequent years? A number of CIA analysts have since retired and blown the whistle on Cheney's browbeating and insistance on the analysts coming to the conclusions HE wanted. Colin Powell didn't even have access, as he freely admitted later when he said that his testimony before the UN, where he told the lies that were fed to him, was the lowest point of his career.

If Colin Powell didn't have access, what makes you think two Democrat Senators did?

because just offhand I'm betting he wasn't endorsing the invasion; more likely saying that he wanted the same goal by different means.


It doesn't really matter, because it comes back to the same thing - do you think Iraq was a smart decision?

There are some really obvious points that have always been very obvious:  1st, the one that Cheney raised in Gulf 1, what are you going to do with it, once you have it?   It really doesn't take a half-wit to see the built-in problems.  

2nd, the timing:  WTF were we doing going off on this tangent, when we actually believed, then and now, that Osama and most of the AQ organization was in Afghanistan, and probably getting away from us?   Jumping into a 2nd front war is the sort of mistake that fucked the Germans, do you recall?

3rd, how exactly was stabilizing Iraq going to work?   If you have enough bayonets to point at these heathen, they're going to become democratic (or republican or whatever you want)?   At least as long as the bayonet is halfway up their ass, eh?

Now after 4 years, it looks like whoever asked those questions in 2003 was one hell of a lot smarter than this administration, who obviously blew those questions off - they are too obvious to say nobody thought of them.  

And you think that *I'm* the one making the GOP look bad?!?  WTF have you been smoking, BK!  Is the present situation, as reported by Petraus eg, your idea of a satisfactory solution?   Do you see any irony whatever in McCain walking thru the market with a platoon of escorts saying it's all back to normal?   Would you do business anywhere you needed an armed escort?  

I'll tell you what I think, and that's that anybody defending the administration on Iraq is fucking delusional.    I'm sure they have their reasons, but I doubt it's anything they should want out in public.

So let's hear your theory.

-- Modified on 9/25/2007 10:53:33 PM

Puckster, the point was to demonstrate a certain impartiality when it comes to quoting the Dems I referenced. Quotes off the web are often suspect so the filter through which I presented them would have a measure of credibility as to the accuracy of the quote itself.

I posted these quotes not to argue the merits of the war but to counter your initial thread concerning Bush and his lies about WMD. If Bush "lied" about WMD in Iraq he had a lot of company from the opposition party.

A couple of the Dems quoted were not in favor of war while some were. But my point was not to quote Dems in favor of the war but to quote Dems who believed there were WMD. The "qualifier's" you reference were not about the accuracy of the quote but about the context of the quote as it relates to the war. The quotes are acknowledged as being substantially correct.

I enjoy the snopes.com site because with all the bullshit out there it's nice to find a site that can on occasion offer some clarity... sorry if I was less than clear. I really was initially posting with a little tongue in cheek so to speak because given all the claims made by the previous administration, the "Bush lied about WMD" claim just rings hollow to me.

WMDs or not, the question has always been, what are we gonna do about it?   The obvious answer has always been, since invading iraq would almost certainly be a quagmire of epic proportions, and stepping on our dick in a way that could destroy American power and influence for all time, then Bush should wait until the worst possible time to do it, when people are distracted by the fact that he should be chasing bin Laden.   THAT's the time to be a complete and total jerked off fuckup!!!

Look, we understand.  You're all a bunch of bigtime submissives, who get off on chestbeating and sucking the asses of people who keep you in financial slavery.  You're afraid your neighbor will think you're a pussy if you don't talk big, and then he might throw dog-doodie in your yard.
You're afraid you'll lose control to your wife if you don't grumble about the news, and you're too stupid to realize she's had you by the balls for years anyway, and the dog-doodie is the only reason anything grows in your yard at all.

What you need is a fucking conservator.  Just ask your wife what to do now, you've been out of the loop since 6th grade anyway.

More blah, blah, blah...

"What are we gonna do about it" is/was NOT the the question of this thread. That may be your question but Bush lying about WMD was what started the thread and the specific issue I am responding to.

Mr. country lawyrer, I hope your comprehension skills are better when reading briefs. Because if you represent your clients positions as well as you represent your own, you must lose a lot of cases...


-- Modified on 9/26/2007 9:29:50 AM

yammering incessantly about something that doesn't make shit for difference.

You might want to check your drawers to see if the Republicans haven't transgendered you.

Don't sell yourself short Jacko-ff. YOU are the KING of yammering incessantly...No one even comes close...

Sorry, ever since I lost my leg fighting in this "stupid" war you love so much, I haven't had much need for drawers...and the "equipment" doesn't work very well either so I might as well be "transgendered" at times-- but thanks for your interest in my sexuality.

my suggestion would be use your head more, it could work better for you.

""WMDs or not, the question has always been, what are we gonna do about it?""

That's what we finally get around to after debunking the BUsh Lied tinfoilhead crowd.

Yea, that's one of the reasons I'm on TER. My doc told me that the more head I got the better it might work for me...

and of course everybody saw that coming, including Cheney.

But after 9/11, it was all or nothing, they had to go for it, and it's been pretty good for them so far, and the Democrats could still fuck up 2008.

Unless of course you want to tell me that the GOP planned it this way all along.    I think it's very likely that there are aspects that they have in fact planned, and that's the reason they aren't changing anything, ie, they're really basically happy with the way it's going.

So far all you've done is call people names - I wait with eager anticipation for you to bring a fact to the table.

As soon as it is established that Bush "Lied" then there will be something to debunk...Until then, the burden remains on you. Just because you say he lied more often than the son rises, doesn't make it so.

Let's suppose Bill Clinton, Al Gore, John Kerry and George Bush all said you are a brilliant poster. But, unfortunately, a review of the evidence for that claim suggests otherwise. Doesn't make them liars does it?-- it could be they are just wrong...

-- Modified on 10/3/2007 9:03:10 PM