Politics and Religion

I'm deeply disappointed in BHO, but where did he say "no fuss" about gas prices ?!
Priapus53 1452 reads
posted

& gas prices in $1.50-$2.00 range under GWB ? Maybe 30 years ago,which shows how ignorant you truly are. If I recall, GWB said he "couldn't do anything about gas prices either" when they hit an all time average of $ 4.11 a gallon. But, then again, GWB being a former oil man, had many cronies in the "business".

OTOH, if gas hits a peak of $ 6 a gallon by Labor day, then BHO's ass will be "toast".

Still, with all this, one unalterable fact : nuguy, you're an idiot.

nuguy465027 reads

The BIG o says little he can do about gas prices!! thank you for all you do for our country mr H. Obama!

..seems not too long ago when prices were in the $1.50-$2.00 range, ALL the LEFT wing folsk were raising hell 'cause the bush-cheney team were gouging us Amercians with high gas prices..! so where are you guys now?????

nugay729 reads

everyone IS complaining.  That's why Obama has asked for his stupid, ass-covering Justice Dept. inquiry.  The only other thing he can do, short term, is open up the Strategic Petroleum Reserve.  Ask Gambler and St. Croix (not exactly Obama lovers) about that idea.  So what would you do, Einstein? Drill, baby, drill?  Great idea!  Only trouble is that, even if we started drilling tomorrow, it would have no, repeat no, impact on supplies or prices.  So bitch all you want, but Obama can't do anything more about it than Bush/Cheney, and they were oil guys.  Back into your mason jar.

could potentiailly have a dramtic effect on prices. even if it were simply rhetorical initially. prices are what they are because we are a HUGE consumer but not producer. if we were to be one in the same the market would react to that.

i do not know the precise economics of domestic drilling but i do know the price of delivery to refiners would be spot price LESS the cost of transportation. It is transport cost we pay dearly for.

saying we will not drill and find our own has the same effect as saying "we will never put boots an the ground" (whereever it may be).

nuguy463542 reads

mr notrouble is right on the money.  BHO is the biggest scammer to sit in the WH.  all talk, no action.

nugay1052 reads

so naturally, nuguy, the Board's Village Idiot signs on!  The idea that announcing new drilling would change the market price is so naive and stupid it's beyond belief.  Don't you think the markets know how long it will take to bring whatever oil that's found (if it's found) to market?  The markets bid on contracts months out based on what they believe the factors/risks are during that time.  An announcement of more drilling has no more to do with these markets (which are what set the price at the pump) than announcing a cure for AIDS.  At least mr notrouble admits his lack of knowledge, but you, nuguy, are so anxious to find anyone to agree with you that you'll salute and say "Yessir" to virtually anything that fits with your prejudices.  You clearly fall into the "too dumb to post" category.

re-read my post

i have more than a pedestrian understanding of commodity markets

""An announcement of more drilling has no more to do with these markets (which are what set the price at the pump) than announcing a cure for AIDS.  """

not close to true...

nugay2234 reads

In fact, that quote you cite of mine is exactly true.  And don't take my word for it, read Gambler's post below.  He's actually in the business.  But if you want to keep deluding yourself, be my guest, though you'll have no credibility on this board.

actually it would have a pretty decent impact on pricing.  although, again, refining in the US is near capacity. but make it a three pronged approach :
1. announce that we will begin drilling in the US.
2. announce the building of refineries.
3. release a good portion of the SPR in conjunction with 1 and 2. maybe a quarter to a third, even half, for a good impact. you release 375million barrels, its gonna make an impact.

Posted By: nugay
In fact, that quote you cite of mine is exactly true.  And don't take my word for it, read Gambler's post below.  He's actually in the business.  But if you want to keep deluding yourself, be my guest, though you'll have no credibility on this board.

my experience was as a purchaser of commodities. if queried, GaG would admit there are things Odumbshit "could say" that would effects the markets though most likely in the longer term, ie, tax credits for domestic production, opening previously off limit areas..etc. There are existing sources that could be tapped rather quickly but dont pencil out under current conditions.

A purchaser of oil, say like a Tesoro, would do their math on future commitments. at least some of the money pushing price is not in the hands of end users and they create momentum.

I think I exagerated that an announcement of some sort could have a dramtic effect but to say it would potentially have NO MORE effect than the announcement of the cure of AIDS is ridiculous on its face.

I dont give 1/3rd of a shit what anyone thinks about me on this board but I know YOU have no credibility with me.

Priapus531453 reads

& gas prices in $1.50-$2.00 range under GWB ? Maybe 30 years ago,which shows how ignorant you truly are. If I recall, GWB said he "couldn't do anything about gas prices either" when they hit an all time average of $ 4.11 a gallon. But, then again, GWB being a former oil man, had many cronies in the "business".

OTOH, if gas hits a peak of $ 6 a gallon by Labor day, then BHO's ass will be "toast".

Still, with all this, one unalterable fact : nuguy, you're an idiot.

GaGambler1266 reads

and in all fairness we are never going to drill our way into energy independence, but in the short term we do need to continue to develop our own reserves. Every barrel we produce domestically is one less barrel we don't need to import, but we will never produce the 20 million or so barrels a day we currently consume.

and yes we did have gas at two dollars or so a barrely under GWB, but only for about an hour and a half. lol When oil plummeted from the $140s to around $30 gas prices briefly fell along with it, but it was very short lived. I do recall selling one load of oil at the  market bottom and only recieving $29.75 a barrel. Yeah I know, your hearts all bleed for me. lol

Thirty years ago?

When I was about 11 years old - or about 25 years ago - I lived on a street that had a gas station on both ends of the block. I remember they had a bit of a price war for a while. Prices ranged between about $0.80 to $0.90 a gallon. And that was 25 years ago.

When I was studying at KU and living in Topeka, about 30 miles from KU, I remember lamenting at the cost of gas working its way up to $1.50 per gallon. That was about 15 years ago.

When Bush took office, gas prices were under $2.00 a gallon, and that was 10 years ago now. Your memory of gas prices is off by nearly 2 decades Pri.

Shortly after Obama won in 2008, I asked then what excuse liberals would use when gas prices spiked over $5.00 a gallon, since they couldn't blame Bush/Cheney for it. Just call me Nostradamus I guess, eh?

nuguy461583 reads

in friday newspapers.....(yeah he appointed a commission..never has resulted in anything.)...yesterday he shrugged his shoulders and said, it is what it is.  
expect tomorrow we'll read that his goons said, "it is bush-cheney conspiracy".
sad commentary on the low depths the presidency has fallen!

Priapus531628 reads

Until 5 years ago, lived most my adult life in L.A. Prices there have always been substantially higher than Kansas, so, the low prices quoted in OP STOPPED appearing in L.A. 20-25 years ago.

Stacy, you neglect to mention that oil prices reached its previous natl peak ( $ 4.11 a gallon ) under Presidency of GWB. Natl. average hasn't reached that high-----YET------

Btw, since I'm a skeptic, have always considered Nostradamus to be a fraud------:)

time to edumacate:
gas prices fell  below $2 a gallon because of 9/11 in 2001.  i guess you can say bush was responsible if you are a conspiracy  buff.  he DID help along in the highest gas prices we have recently seen, since he would not stop buying oil for the SPR, or in other words to make Dick Chenneys(i dont know how you spell his last name) Haliburton some more money

Posted By: SinsOfTheFlesh
Thirty years ago?

When I was about 11 years old - or about 25 years ago - I lived on a street that had a gas station on both ends of the block. I remember they had a bit of a price war for a while. Prices ranged between about $0.80 to $0.90 a gallon. And that was 25 years ago.

When I was studying at KU and living in Topeka, about 30 miles from KU, I remember lamenting at the cost of gas working its way up to $1.50 per gallon. That was about 15 years ago.

When Bush took office, gas prices were under $2.00 a gallon, and that was 10 years ago now. Your memory of gas prices is off by nearly 2 decades Pri.

Shortly after Obama won in 2008, I asked then what excuse liberals would use when gas prices spiked over $5.00 a gallon, since they couldn't blame Bush/Cheney for it. Just call me Nostradamus I guess, eh?

GaGambler1032 reads

Not to mention the fact that the SPR is not a hedge against high prices, it's a reserve designed to be tapped in times of national emergency, not a way to manipulate prices.

With a scant 35 days of consuption at it's current level, the SPR is hardly a way to manipulate crude prices any how. You really need to get a clue before spouting off on topics you know nothing about.

there i go again with my regurgitated thoughts lol.

actually, they way it is calculated how they would release the SPR, there is a 70-80day supply. there is not much refined oil in the SPR, and at the current refining capacity, they would not be able to refine anywhere near the 20million barrels you are estimating.  do some research.  and in regards to HAL. do some research before you open your mouth, didn't i already shut you up once on my last post in response to your blather :D
where did i say Halliburton PRODUCES oil?  i merely said they make money off  of oil, which they do.

"Halliburton Company provides various products and services to the energy industry for the exploration, development, and production of oil and natural gas worldwide"

unless you think a quote from how they describe there business model is incorrect an you know more? LOL :))

Posted By: GaGambler
Not to mention the fact that the SPR is not a hedge against high prices, it's a reserve designed to be tapped in times of national emergency, not a way to manipulate prices.

With a scant 35 days of consuption at it's current level, the SPR is hardly a way to manipulate crude prices any how. You really need to get a clue before spouting off on topics you know nothing about.
-- Modified on 4/24/2011 1:47:16 PM

GaGambler1319 reads

I just have little tolerance for idiots, so I rarely engage stupid people in conversation.

You were wrong then and you are wrong now, and FWIW I am not a Repulican. I dislike Republicans almost as much as Democrats, and I have voted for both parties for both State, Local, and national office including the Presidency.

You sound like a die hard Democrat to me, any one who belongs to either political party rarely has any independent thought and you are no exception.

see, now i'm a moron to for responding, so you are right in calling me a moron :D
explain where i am wrong. i really want to understand, but i'm too slow :( am i wrong on Halliburton?  am i wrong in regards to the SPR?

name me one diehard dem who wants to cut medicare, keep taxes low for capital gains, close loopholes that gives free money away to lazy people and to businesses who don't need/deserve it.  you can't win a battle of wits against me,  you come unarmed, only throwing insults and nothing of context.  i'd just really like to hear this independent thought you keep speaking of.  stop holding out! maybe YOU HOLD THE KEY TO OUR SALVATION with your original thoughts and ideas.  

lets hear em for real though, no insults, just one original idea. like i said, who knows, you may have that one idea that brings us back from the brink.

Posted By: GaGambler
I just have little tolerance for idiots, so I rarely engage stupid people in conversation.

You were wrong then and you are wrong now, and FWIW I am not a Repulican. I dislike Republicans almost as much as Democrats, and I have voted for both parties for both State, Local, and national office including the Presidency.

You sound like a die hard Democrat to me, any one who belongs to either political party rarely has any independent thought and you are no exception.

...it'll just help the Nissan Leaf and Chevy Volt sales. The higher petrol goes the more viable solar becomes. Once it's affordable to everyone, we can put the oil industry out of business for good.

Not from solar, that's for sure.  It comes from nukes and giant coal-fired plants belching smoke that falls to the east as acid rain.  Thanks, all you Leaf and Volt drivers for that!

the vast majority of all electricity in the US comes from coal. Which isn't great, but at least we don't have to import the stuff.

The nice thing about electric cars is that they're far more efficient. Using controled fuel explosions to power pistons wastes a metric ton of energy potential of gasoline, a problem that is completely resolved just by applying direct power. If you can tweek the efficiency of the batteries and the supply lead ohmage, you can make it even more efficient.

But the real benefit is in costs. From the estimates I've seen, the Leaf gets the equivolent of 38 cents a gallon. Multiply that out by the lifetime of the car, and that's a lot of savings.

It is amazing to hear you defend burning more coal just 'cause it comes from the good 'ol US of A.  You are a Fine American! And thanks for the acid rain!  But you gloss over "tweeking" the efficiency of batteries.  I know an engineer who's an expert on such batteries and assures me it's not as simple as you think.  You also underestimate the environmental cost of mining, manufacturing and then disposing of the batteries.  The result is that, right now, the savings of battery-powered cars is an illusion.

Spot on about the batteries. Lot of 'green types' don't give that a second thought. Guess they think expired batteries will just disappear, lol.

Also don't think willy's got the $40,000 to buy a new Volt. If he did, how's he gonna charge it fully to get home, after seeing his latest provider? She gonna let him plug into her electrical outlet? Now there's an upsell charge.

there isn't much of an upside to using fossil fuels, no matter what form it's in. But if we're going to use fossil fuels, I'd rather we not have to import the stuff. Solar has a ton of potential. Batteries are not all that difficult a thing to improve. You can get all the lithium you'll ever need from the ocean, if you want to go that route. I don't know how efficient they would be, but hell, you can use deionized water in batteries as well. You can recycle them as well.

The big problem with electric vehicles right now is that they have a limited range. But what they've discovered with the volt is that most owners are going a 1000 miles before filling up again. Most just charge the battery at night.

If we had feed-in tariffs for solar like they do in cloudy Germany, then solar would take off in this country. You could power your car while being off the grid, and the minus maintaince and repair, your energy costs would drop to zero.

I'm all in favor of electric cars, Willy, it's just that they're not ready for prime time yet because of limited range and long charging times.  Both of these negatives are direct results of current battery technology.  Of course that will improve.  But the source of the electricity is also key.  Oil, and especially natural gas pollute much less than coal.  We're also the Saudi Arabia of natural gas.  Trouble is, the fracking method for getting it pollutes ground water.  And don't forget the other poster who pointed out that current batteries must be discarded after five years.  Each of this drawbacks is an environmental nightmare.

-Sparky1362 reads

How are you defining efficiency? Just where are you calculating your “metric tons of energy”

The average IEC engine is about 20 to 25% efficient in converting the thermal energy content of gasoline into mechanical energy.

It’s true that electric motors and solid state inverters are about 90% to 95% efficient in converting DC electric power into mechanical energy. But examining the typical battery charging system reveals that coal fired power generation (the most common source) is typically about 40% efficient in converting the thermal content of coal in electric power. Then there are the losses of the distribution grid which average about 10% nationally but can be as high as 25%.

Of course there are production and distribution energy costs (losses) in the manufacture of gasoline and diesel. But the energy density of batteries doesn’t even come close to that of gasoline, hence the poor range of total electric vehicles. And don’t expect things to improve anytime soon regarding batteries.

Electric vehicles certainly have the edge on several items. Most maintenance is far simpler and have much lower pollutants of Carbon Monoxide, and Nitrogen Oxides, but the total Sulfer Oxides, heavy metals and other particulates goes way up due to coal. But as mentioned the manufacture and disposal of batteries is quite polluting.

At 10 cents per KWH (low side of average) the mileage equivalent of a TEV is actually closer to $1.00 per gallon. Still attractive but the energy density of batteries is still lacking and five year maintenance does include replacing the batteries at a substantial cost of several thousand dollars making the actual energy costs go way up.

don't forget to mention how much more energy and resources are used to actually make an electric vehicle. I haven't read up on it in a while, but about 5 or so years back i read an article that stated they are no better for the environment then gas powered vehicles because of all the extra costs and resources used to build them cancels out the good mileage.

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