Seems like LE is trying to get info on our community from us on our phx board.  
Examples-
Random provider coming back from utr asking how things work in this arena. She should know, after all, she whipped out all of her info, handle etc before right?  
Random handles w/ no reviews asking about "no sex dates" (duh compensation is for time not sex). LE's tactic to get references from well reviewed ladies to get access to agencies or other sites.
Random handle w/ no reviews asking for gfe, multi pop while wife is away.
Random handle w/ very recent studio reviews asking for a new regular w/ a wild side to pm him...

Strange

CIA might be spiking it with a tracing agent too.  

There is a lot of activity recently in our community period. Some made news and some not.

And yes I agree a lot more posts here that seem....not right.

Thanks for posting GRP

To protect my identity from the wrong people. Obviously if I was LE or didn't have the community's best interest, I wouldn't be concerned at all! Make sense??

regardless of what is posted or not posted here?

END OF MESSAGE

wtf are you talking about?

As I’m pursuing the board in my leisure time, I read a thread referencing my post. To whoever you are, I’m going to try my very best to be as tactful and polite as I possibly can to stay within the board rules, addressing your accusation. I am as legitimate as they come, there is absolutely know need for you to feel threaten by my presents neither do I owe you an explanation why I removed myself from all online activity. But to all other board members I will share with you.  
1. I was a business woman and very well known in my City.  
2. I was married once upon a time.  
3. I started out in the business as a private provider due to the aforementioned.
4. I owned a small agency “Sweethearts of Dallas and became more active on line” which is verifiable. I made a poor business decision to hire a close friend,”talk about sex appeal and looks she had it all and was highly requested”.  
I made a business decision to let this friend go, for constantly being late for her appointments which reflected on my small agency six professional women. This woman who was a close friend at least I thought she was. Apparently she wasn’t too happy about my decision and in return wanted to cause me due harm. She put my business out in the community, my ex-husband got wind of it which caused me all sorts of problems and a whole lot of money. See, we have a daughter; use your imagination the hell I went through. Now that is why, I wanted no traces over the internet what-so-ever. Having said, my personal business is out. But I have know problem in sharing out of defending my presence here let known my name. I am as honest as they come.
So yes! It has been a long while and yes! I have to refigure sh!? out again, being that I’ve chosen to engage again.  Lastly: It’s possible I’ve been around a lot longer than the complainant. If I can recall correctly it was 1999, 2000 at the latest. Sorry to you all for the rant. That accusation sort of pisses me off.  I’ll be around I’m just taking my time.

 

Doesn't everyone just assume any & all boards, advertising sites, & everything else regarding this community are all monitored by officials on an ongoing basis anyhow?  It's absolutely absurd not to!  

I do see the oddity in what Alias & Misty claim as well.

TER is not based in the US and is not subject to their laws on the business side. there is no reason whatsoever to think that US authorities would have any more access to anything on the site then a regular member would. They can't read your PMs and they don't have the ability to link an alias with a main account.

TV, if you're reading this thread, is this true?

Not to discount your claim IT, but I am a skeptic, though I hope what you're stating is true.

All I agreed to was - AND NOT HIDING EITHER behind an alias - was that there has been an increase in LE activity in our community AND there have been some "odd" posts on the board recently from people with no board presence and no reviews.

What's odd about that? What's odd about wanting everyone to be on higher alert and playing safe?

...that it's based in the Netherlands where this hobby thing is legal. A U.S. subpoena for evidence served on a Dutch company for alleged crimes committed in the U.S. but which are not crimes in Holland are unlikely to be enforced by a Dutch court. So the theory goes, anyway. Part of the genius of this enterprise's founder. However, if there were cause to believe that this site had data that would be important evidence in a serious crime, like murder, a subpoena could reasonably be seen to be enforced by the Dutch courts. The servers for TER lie in Europe, most likely in Amsterdam

I think that the guys sometimes forget that the providers accept a lot more risk than we do. Jalaine's story is a prime example of that. It isn't just the LE worries but the things that can cause such dramatic issues in your personal life. Welcome back Jalaine. I hope this time around you won't have such issues.

Thanx guys... good to know.

As it turns out Drumsticks (and thank you for the aid in convincing me, not to discredit ITAdmin), common knowledge/common sense, isn't really all that common!  

Hey no worries. You don't know me. To you I am just some random guy you have never met with an opinion.  I couldn't possibly take it as an insult.

END OF MESSAGE

Unfortunately, I must disagree IT. LE can and will discover any person that elects to use an alias as a part of a criminal investigation. In the event they can not get a Judge to sign off on a warrant, They have forensic experts that can hack anything. It is relative to some person that erases things on their computer thinking they are safe. NOT, their forensics people can extract the data and offer it up in a criminal trial. However, if the data is obtained without a warrant, they will use it only to direct them,LE to the target or targets they are desirous to pursue. If anyone thinks a hobbyist has no exposure to being charged with a felony, they are dead wrong...  Notwithstanding, I know there are no law breakers on this forum. I wish all the best!

Sorry TV but you are very mistaken. LE has no jurisdiction for any criminal investigations involving this site. Your answer is very general and not specific to this particular case. There can be no legal warrant for any action on this site as it is not a US site and does not reside on US soil. Healthy respect for LE is responsible but spreading fear where it doesn't need to be is not. Your entire post was written in a general sense about what is theoretically possible with absolutely no care for what is actually possible in this specific use case.

Your other comment about them having the ability to hack anything is also flawed. Yes, in a general sense there lies the ability hack things and certain levels of LE and government do possess resources to do surprising things in this regard. However, these resources are NOT available to LE in this particular field of investigation on even to LE on this level of jurisdiction. There is no one sitting at the Phoenix Sheriff's office capable of hacking this site or with the jurisdiction to do so.  

Further your third point of erasing things on your computer. I made no comment on this topic so I am not sure why you brought it up. However it is ALSO not completely true as it is actually quite easy to erase things in a manner that can absolutely NOT be recovered by LE and it is also easy to store things in a way that regardless of it being deleted or not could not be accessed by LE in the first place.  

Please do not confuse these ladies with false claims or generalized comments not pertinent to the specific case mentioned. Which is that it is not within the ability of LE to find out who your main identity is on this site if you use an Alias and assuming you do not screw up and provide the information yourself. Further LE has no access even to finding out who you are by your main account. Again, the LE I am referring is the LE that would be involved in the types of investigation that the ladies on this site need concern themselves with. Not some hypothetical murder investigation or other capital crime.  

If you disagree please do not do so in a general manner. Please provide specific examples as to why you think that the LE involved in investigations of this type would have either the jurisdiction or the capabilities to access any information on this Netherlands based business and server.

-- Modified on 6/28/2013 11:38:39 AM

ITADMIN, I suggest you go to law school and maybe practice criminal defense law for more than 20 years  before you  make claims that you have superior knowledge. I appreciate the fact that you have time to type an unlimited amount of meaningless information for our perusal. However, why would you want the attention of a few ladies and hobbyist  on this forum to depend on your theory that you may have seen on a television show. I don't have the idle time to poster back and forth with a lay person that has nothing better to do. However, for the benefit of our providers and in the interest of benefit to other hobbyist, I will refer you to google the following.  

Google; !8 indicted in illegal gambling that they were assured was protected by operating outside the US. Moreover, when you google people indicted in gambling outside the US, you will find that the indictments spanned across the US. They were also protected by operating outside the US. NOT

I also refer you to google (the Mann act) if you think "everything is ok" I don't have time to teach you everything you need to know to be an expert. If you want to be real specific, you may be rewarded with a subpoena by the State so you can share your vast knowledge and personal experience with them.

I suggest you review the file on the studio, did you happen to notice while you were watching your court shows that the FBI (which is federal) was a part of the execution of the warrants served on the studio??? No worry, they probably waited outside until they erased all the hard drives.NOT

The thing that is paramount is, that you are not allowed to lull other people to sleep when you have no clue of what you are professing to have knowledge of or, legal training to practice criminal defense law. There is only 2 reasons possible, you went to an ITADMIN school that was also a law school or you work for LE and you want to mislead everyone? I will let someone else come up with the conclusion. Best Regards,

Now, what makes you think I do not have a law degree? You are making assumptions based on my handle. You really shouldn't do that. That is neither here nor there though. Again you are refusing to address the actual matter at hand and are instead inventing your own.  

You did not say a thing to actually refute or even to address the actual matter that was being discussed. The matter being discussed is whether or not LE is able to get access to the data the TER holds through legal means. That answer is no. You have not actually provided any info against that. Instead you are inventing a topic and pretending that I said the people who commit a crime while in the US using TER are not guilty of a crime. But you see... I never said that.  

I never said that those who use TER have nothing to worry about. Nor did I say that LE is not free to use what info they CAN glean from this site to prosecute you. What I DID say was that LE can not coerce the owners of TER to give them any info or access.  

The matters of data retention and deletion are not the matters at hand. I don't know why you keep talking about them. Move along from that subject and if you wish to learn more let me know via PM. The singular and core matter here is the question raised in the thread above. Can LE know who you are even if you use an alias on this site. The pure and simple answer to that is no they can not. Period.  

If you disagree with that singular point then tell me why. Are you able to do that without all this tangent BS you keep going on about? Without talking about hacking? From a purely legal position tell me if I am wrong and why.  

To anyone else following this conversation keep the following in mind please so keep in mind what it is we are really discussing here despite TV forgetting. Kelsi made the comment that she believed that LE could find out who you are even if you use an alias. Both myself and Drumsticks replied that because TER is operated outside the US it is not subject to US laws. A warrant can not grant LE access to it's servers and there is zero leverage that US LE can use on them. Kelsi then asked TV to weigh in. TV unfortunately seems to have somehow lost the topic and seems to think that I am saying that you can not be said to have broken the law if you used a non US site. But I never said that. He further decided to bring up hard drive deletion and hacking but I have no idea why he decided to do that when it was not pertinent at all. The hacking argument also would seem to indicate I am correct as he implied that LE could hack TER if they wanted to. Now, he is continuing to remain off topic and has decided to resort to personal attacks on me and implying I am working with LE. Real mature there. I have an idea TV. How about you just forget all the BS you have said and answer the single and central point that Kelsi actually asked. Is it or is it not true that as a Netherlands company with servers operating physically in the Netherlands the site TER is not subject to US law and specifically that as a result of that LE is not given access nor can they demand access via court order or otherwise as our courts have no jurisdiction over TER. I am NOT saying that admissions of anything illegal read here can not be used against you. I am talking about access and only access.

-- Modified on 6/28/2013 1:56:51 PM

Not a lawyer but 20+ years following the legal issues, court records etc.

TvLaw in correct - couple short issues

Any "control person" in the U.S. can be served to disclose info.

Remember evidence books full of reviews - no would be very hard to get admitted but powerful to get plea deals.

FBI has local jurisdiction under the Federal Trafficking Act even if they falsely allege transport, recruitment, encouragement.  The Act since 2000 (keeps getting renewed) includes in private consenting adults (if coerced than "extreme trafficking.").   No state lines have to be crossed like for the MANN Act.  

The war on in private consenting adults is going wild with huge funding for LE and the "rescue industry" farse like ROSE III etc and of course "trafficking" which sounds terrible but includes consenting adults.  

We also have attorney's ready to fight laws based in two important Court successes but need to raise at least $100k for top experienced lawyers to take it on.  Assume lose in lower courts and want a 9th Circuit case but no one willing to fund a real fight.

Dave Phx, you appear to be pretty accurate. Moreover, if a company does business and receives revenue in a state or Country, they are subject to the jurisdiction. To add, Feds often work hand in hand with State LE and the Feds call the shots if they so desire. In other words, the State is subservient to the Feds. Hey Dave good job Lawyer or not. Maybe you missed your calling. I do not think your information is paranoid. I think you have a realistic view and appear to have knowledge.

Again you are correct, to go to trial on a case like this may very well be a loser depending, most people are not willing to roll the dice. Then the appeal, it would be very costly and never any guarantee to be successful. Who wants to do the time and be first?

Dave
I don't doubt that he is correct on the issues he posted about. It is just that he never posted about the question at hand. I found it difficult to figure out just what you were saying in your post so correct me if I am wrong, but it seemed like on the issue of LE access to the data and servers of TER the only thing I saw you say that was relevant to that one topic was that if there is a control person in the US that person could be coerced to divulge information. On that point I agree. But the main question asked is could LE have any grounds for access to the servers themselves which are located in the Netherlands or coerce any peoples involved in the running who are not in the US? I understand as lawyers the needs to point out the whatifs but that core question seems to be continually evaded in favor of other points not asked for.

-- Modified on 7/1/2013 8:24:00 AM

Yes all interesting but none of it really had anything to do with the question. the question was quite simple but continually evaded. Here you are again referring to businesses acting in or collecting money in any state, which TER is not with any presence. It is accurate and good info but not pertinent to the question posed about this specific case. Instead of an answer to that question we get a general "be scared" response.

Direct connection to an admitted criminal organization - another  known a felon - all sorts of probable cause and most likely control people in the U.S. (fewer than in the past however)

Keep legal - NEVER OFFER OR DISCUSS SEX FOR MONEY. YOU CAN NOT PAY FOR SEX - and many busts going on funded by $millions from the "rescue industry" and the "trafficking" scam that includes consenting adults.  Lots of money to LE and religious groups to "save" = lots of busts and raids with Phoenix often ground zero.

DO NOT USE GFE or other terms on ads (slam dunk prostitution bust just from ad).  

Explicit reviews used in evidence books.  

Lets just leave it at that ... some things can not be discussed here as we know FBI/PD monitoring