Sounds like some bad hombres to me. So even if they steal the car then don't they have to change the VIN number on it? Maybe one of them is tied to an auto theft ring.
Why references and screening is so important
Well known long time worker e-mails me 11/7/2016:
Hello Dave ! I hope this finds you well. xxxxxxxx here in Phoenix/Scottsdale I had a potentially really bad situation happened last night. I went to do an out call against my better judgment. Just about got robbed and beat. I could not verify the guy because he was texting me from one of those Internet text numbers. And then when I asked to speak to him over the phone before I came to him to verify him. He called from a blocked number.
He said he had a bad experience once with a girl contacting his wife. I thought that's feasible. Still very guarded I decided to go because he offered me $1000 to come see him after my normal hours. I got to the location in North East Glendale. The home was dark no lights on at all.
I text him and told him I had arrived it was not getting out of the car he needed to come out to the car because it was dark. He said to go ahead and just come on and he would meet me at the door. At this point I'm getting a little concerned about my safety, I decided to cruise through the neighborhood real quick with my brights on. Cruised back around from the other direction and noticed the old truck in front of his house loaded with garbage had a guy hiding in the back of the truck. Then noticed two other creepy guys crouch down to the side of the truck.
I text the guy told him I was creeped out something was not right. And I was going to leave.
At this point he proceeded to text and call me all kinds of vulgar names, and tell me I was lucky I left because they were going to beat me and rob me and take my Mercedes and money.
I have the photo of the guy he sent but that doesn't mean much who knows if it's even the guy, it was not any of the guys that were standing outside waiting for me. I also have the text number, however it was just an Internet text number I'm sure you can get one of those fairly easy probably throw away. So I don't know if getting that information to you will help anyone else or not.
The whole situation has left me traumatized and freaked out. I'm going to buy a gun and pepper spray today.
Dave notes this is also an example of the harm due to legal status, where bad guys know this is not going to be reported to the police.
Dangerous Client WARNING
Why references and screening is so important
Well known long time worker e-mails me 11/7/2016:
Hello Dave ! I hope this finds you well. xxxxxxxx here in Phoenix/Scottsdale I had a potentially really bad situation happened last night. I went to do an out call against my better judgment. Just about got robbed and beat. I could not verify the guy because he was texting me from one of those Internet text numbers. And then when I asked to speak to him over the phone before I came to him to verify him. He called from a blocked number.
He said he had a bad experience once with a girl contacting his wife. I thought that's feasible. Still very guarded I decided to go because he offered me $1000 to come see him after my normal hours. I got to the location in North East Glendale. The home was dark no lights on at all.
I text him and told him I had arrived it was not getting out of the car he needed to come out to the car because it was dark. He said to go ahead and just come on and he would meet me at the door. At this point I'm getting a little concerned about my safety, I decided to cruise through the neighborhood real quick with my brights on. Cruised back around from the other direction and noticed the old truck in front of his house loaded with garbage had a guy hiding in the back of the truck. Then noticed two other creepy guys crouch down to the side of the truck.
I text the guy told him I was creeped out something was not right. And I was going to leave.
At this point he proceeded to text and call me all kinds of vulgar names, and tell me I was lucky I left because they were going to beat me and rob me and take my Mercedes and money.
I have the photo of the guy he sent but that doesn't mean much who knows if it's even the guy, it was not any of the guys that were standing outside waiting for me. I also have the text number, however it was just an Internet text number I'm sure you can get one of those fairly easy probably throw away. So I don't know if getting that information to you will help anyone else or not.
The whole situation has left me traumatized and freaked out. I'm going to buy a gun and pepper spray today.
Dave notes this is also an example of the harm due to legal status, where bad guys know this is not going to be reported to the police
I've done some reading on legalized prostitution in Europe and in almost everything I've read it states that the price for service drops when the sex trade goes legit. Obviously comparing the sex trade in Europe and the Americas would be an apples to oranges proposition but it brings up some points.
As it stands the ladies here in Phx, other than being at risk for prosecution, are largely unregulated. They are essentially free to work where and when they choose and the more attractive and business minded ladies make substantial amounts of money tax free. With careful and consistent screening the chances of getting caught seem slim.
While the threat of legal action is obviously a huge threat, would the ladies here opt for legalization when they would be subject to licensing, taxation, placing their real names on a sex worker registration form for the public to see, increased competition and lower wages for the same work?
I'm all for legal status as I don't believe in government dictating consenting adults behavior but I really wonder how many of the ladies would change the status quo for an increase in safety. Risky work pays more and there seems there would be a lot of things they would sacrifice for the "gain".
Of course that's just my view from this side of the equation. Would the ladies care to chime in?
While the threat of legal action is obviously a huge threat, would the ladies here opt for legalization when they would be subject to licensing, taxation, placing their real names on a sex worker registration form for the public to see, increased competition and lower wages for the same work?
Decrim would also mean can report rape, robbery, assault to the police unlike in the U.S. Safety plus not risk prison if unlucky enough to have an assistant/driver/phone persons or work with another for criminal enterprise felony
The zillions of large agencies in Canada, especially Toronto you work very safely and get better payout than typical U.S. agency, driver provided, agency does marketing, setting up appts, and no legal risk for companions or the adult massage places. Of course, we now have a huge discount in $US off these CDN prices above.
While the threat of legal action is obviously a huge threat, would the ladies here opt for legalization when they would be subject to licensing, taxation, placing their real names on a sex worker registration form for the public to see, increased competition and lower wages for the same work?
They are already subject to taxation, and no evidence to show would be lower fees. Of course I use Canada as an example with no special requirements other than in some places like B.C. that require licensing for about $100/yr but I believe names are not public. Rates are comparable mostly $CDN250-$300 outcall and lower for incalls all legal. There are also the very high end above $300 but I would never consider.
Decrim would also mean can report rape, robbery, assault to the police unlike in the U.S. Safety plus not risk prison if unlucky enough to have an assistant/driver/phone persons or work with another for criminal enterprise felony
The zillions of large agencies in Canada, especially Toronto you work very safely and get better payout than typical U.S. agency, driver provided, agency does marketing, setting up appts, and no legal risk for companions or the adult massage places. Of course, we now have a huge discount in $US off these CDN prices above.
Didn't the Canadian system change? Since 2014 it is legal for the girls to "sell" but it is illegal for guys to "buy". Girls face no legal issues but johns can be arrested as it is illegal on their end.
Didn't the Canadian system change? Since 2014 it is legal for the girls to "sell" but it is illegal for guys to "buy". Girls face no legal issues but johns can be arrested as it is illegal on their end.
I know agency owners that have met with police and welcome them at their incalls etc. Agencies for decades never had a problem with the prior "living off the avails" law and have no concerns about the new C36. They never offer or sell sex, only time with a companion. Likewise in adult body rubs, the hand release is just standard, you don't pay any silly "tip" you pay for a 50-minute nude-reverse massage, not for sex.
If a customer is arrested or an agency under C36 there is a boat load full of attorneys that will argue it violates the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, just like the Canadian Supreme Court tossed out the incall etc law as unconstitutional based on the principle of harm reduction. Outcalls had always been legal.
For the customer or zillions of huge agencies, you simply never pay for sex but all sexwork is legal for the companions as long as consenting adults
Can you explain how they are already subject to taxation? Under the table cash transactions are by definition non taxable unless reported but obviously I have no knowledge of how the ladies manage their finances after I walk out the door. As to lower fees I use Europe as an example where girls from slavic nations flooded the market and caused the price to plummet. While this is a conversation of what if's, with lax immigration policy's, Latin American woman could do the same thing to the market here were it legalized.
Clearly legal status would allow for the ladies here to gain certain benefits but also at a cost in other areas. My question remains the same. Given the status quo would the majority of the providers opt for legal status if it meant dealing with regulatory burdens.
While the threat of legal action is obviously a huge threat, would the ladies here opt for legalization when they would be subject to licensing, taxation, placing their real names on a sex worker registration form for the public to see, increased competition and lower wages for the same work?
They are already subject to taxation, and no evidence to show would be lower fees. Of course I use Canada as an example with no special requirements other than in some places like B.C. that require licensing for about $100/yr but I believe names are not public. Rates are comparable mostly $CDN250-$300 outcall and lower for incalls all legal. There are also the very high end above $300 but I would never consider.
Decrim would also mean can report rape, robbery, assault to the police unlike in the U.S. Safety plus not risk prison if unlucky enough to have an assistant/driver/phone persons or work with another for criminal enterprise felony
The zillions of large agencies in Canada, especially Toronto you work very safely and get better payout than typical U.S. agency, driver provided, agency does marketing, setting up appts, and no legal risk for companions or the adult massage places. Of course, we now have a huge discount in $US off these CDN prices above.
Not reporting is tax evasion. Same today as it would be if decriminalization.
I guess the appropriate response would be no shit. Really? Just because they are subject to taxation doesn't mean they actually pay taxes hence the whole illegal aspect of it all. Jesus! Pedantic much?
Today this is called tax fraud/evasion and you go to prison i.e. AL Copone. All income is taxable whether it's cash or not.
Not reporting is tax evasion. Same today as it would be if decriminalization.
Sounds like some bad hombres to me. So even if they steal the car then don't they have to change the VIN number on it? Maybe one of them is tied to an auto theft ring.
Why references and screening is so important
Well known long time worker e-mails me 11/7/2016:
Hello Dave ! I hope this finds you well. xxxxxxxx here in Phoenix/Scottsdale I had a potentially really bad situation happened last night. I went to do an out call against my better judgment. Just about got robbed and beat. I could not verify the guy because he was texting me from one of those Internet text numbers. And then when I asked to speak to him over the phone before I came to him to verify him. He called from a blocked number.
He said he had a bad experience once with a girl contacting his wife. I thought that's feasible. Still very guarded I decided to go because he offered me $1000 to come see him after my normal hours. I got to the location in North East Glendale. The home was dark no lights on at all.
I text him and told him I had arrived it was not getting out of the car he needed to come out to the car because it was dark. He said to go ahead and just come on and he would meet me at the door. At this point I'm getting a little concerned about my safety, I decided to cruise through the neighborhood real quick with my brights on. Cruised back around from the other direction and noticed the old truck in front of his house loaded with garbage had a guy hiding in the back of the truck. Then noticed two other creepy guys crouch down to the side of the truck.
I text the guy told him I was creeped out something was not right. And I was going to leave.
At this point he proceeded to text and call me all kinds of vulgar names, and tell me I was lucky I left because they were going to beat me and rob me and take my Mercedes and money.
I have the photo of the guy he sent but that doesn't mean much who knows if it's even the guy, it was not any of the guys that were standing outside waiting for me. I also have the text number, however it was just an Internet text number I'm sure you can get one of those fairly easy probably throw away. So I don't know if getting that information to you will help anyone else or not.
The whole situation has left me traumatized and freaked out. I'm going to buy a gun and pepper spray today.
Dave notes this is also an example of the harm due to legal status, where bad guys know this is not going to be reported to the police.
If a provider chooses to take a risk seeing a client who can't be verified she is asking for trouble. No, she doesn't deserve anything bad to happen but she should expect that the risk is much higher and be unsurprised if the outcome isn't desirable.
We live in an era with resources to verify clients and providers. Not doing so has no excuse.
No money is worth risking your standards or personal safety.
Maybe you should be more empathetic? Just verifying people doesn't make it safe and carefree. You ladies are subject to tons of risks when you show up at an outcall location where you can't control your surroundings. Thankfully usually its just some poor guy trying to get laid but there is lots of bad news out there that happens that I won't bring up. Thankfully it didn't happen to you but it sure could even if you verify and screen. I feel bad for the lady.
So no empathy from me.
I am a VERY empathetic person but I refuse to feel for someone who knowingly is choosing to endanger their life. Just because screening isn't 100% safe means I should feel bad for someone who chooses not to screen? I'm sorry but that's ridiculous. Had he somehow duped her screening, ok, I am totally on her side and feel for her as she did what she could to be safer but not this case. In this case she chose to ignore screening in favor of the money. That's the bottom line.
I'm gonna just say what nobody else will: this was desperation or urgency for the money.
Not all money is worth earning nor is every client with "privacy concerns" really concerned about privacy.
Perhaps this was a rookie mistake on her part but if you haven't had the guy OK'ed then why risk it (if not for the money)?
am not a victim blamer, and fortunately nothing bad happened to her, but she went against all her own rules! She did an outcall outside of her normal hours for someone she couldn't screen properly because $1000.
Desperation is never a good decision maker. The "too good to be true" alarm should make us even more strict with our personal boundaries.
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Agree on all accounts. Offering outrageous amount money would be a major red flag I would think. It's the first thing I thought of. Glad she got the hell out of there.
I agree with all the comments here that is was dumb which she realized before it was too late.
But she is hardly a rookie, in the business like 10-20 years and usually does screen better and has had lots of great customers. She probably got to use to nice gentlemen and not the bad guys. I had a nice session with her at least 10 years ago.
I would avoid a provider like that personally.
Judgement like that will only lead to trouble for both parties at some point