Recently, a would-be hobbyist contacted me for help because he has been trying to get his first P4P date, but no one will even reply to his emails.  It took me less than 5 minutes to discover why: He is Blacklisted to hell and gone everywhere I looked!  

But he hasn't seen anyone yet, how can that be??  Simple: He is Blacklisted as a Time-Waster.  

 
There is definitely something to be said for asking questions, and attempting to see if you and a lady who's caught your eye will be a good fit.  

HOWEVER!  It is not a good idea to contact multiple providers, getting screened by them, only to engage them in multiple back-and-forth emails and never schedule a date.  Worse, to schedule but get cold feet and cancel.  

I know, you want to make sure the two of you will be a good fit, you're very nervous and need reassurance and hey.... you're going to be spending YOUR hard-earned dollars and this is what you need to feel comfortable enough to do that.

I GET IT.  Truly, I do.   And "feeling out" a lady to then decide she's not for you is not the end of the world.  But try to pick someone and do the deed without going through this dance over & over.  

Why?  As mentioned above, some providers will BLACK-LIST you for this.   It's called "time-wasting" for a reason.    
2-3 emails is all it should take to set up a date.  Any more than that, without ever following through, can be perceived as a waste of her time.
So if you do this repeatedly, and these ladies all report you as a "time-waster" then you might find you're not getting responses anymore.  

Hell, all it really takes is one provider who's irked enough to take the time to enter you into multiple databases, which might then read as multiple incidents to future ladies who are screening you.  

 
Given how many people have posted here that they're not getting replies, I figure this might be the reason for at least some of them.

xoxoxoxooxoxoxoxoxoxo

 

PS ~ Please don't ask me to look you up and tell you if you are blacklisted.  Not gonna happen. ;-

Now I am not going to Wk for time wasters as the girls are running a business, believe me, I can relate as I run two businesses.

But placing someone on a BL bc they sent too many emails is a joke, imo.

There are many socially awkward guys in this realm. Add in the nerves, the illegality of it and their inexperience and the BL is just WAY too harsh a penalty for such a minor infraction.

The BL should be used to out stalkers, dudes that threaten, assholes that assault women, rip offs, etc

To put guys on there bc they don't know the unwritten rules of hooking is over kill.

All you need to do is delete his emails. Takes 2 seconds.

Running a business means you will get clients who window shop for too long. If a gal did that in Macy's and was barred from ever coming back, how would that work?

Debbie, this is not pointed at you. This is more of a generic rant against peeps who abuse the BL's by putting minor annoyances in the same league BL wise as a violent criminal.  

Just my 2 cents.

That he will send too many emails? Honestly, BFD. Like I said, just hit delete and no response to any more of his nonsense.  

That's what I do to time wasters in my field. I don't feel the need to take it any further than that as that strikes me as killing a mouse with a hand grenade. LOL

There are many upsides to this biz for the ladies. The money, the gifts, tips, dinners, shows, vacations, companionship, etc and there are some down sides. Some VERY serious downsides. Anyone that knows my posting history knows how serious I take the ladies personal well being.

That being said, FAR too many girls here will BL someone at the drop of a hat. Every business has to deal with annoying or time wasting clients at times. Its just part of the territory of making a dollar.

Now I will agree Debbie's post was a service to the guys here as they get to see how an over abundance of communications can land them in hot water for gals with an itchy trigger finger.

We are not all that far apart on this issue Ginger for as you say: "Myself, I only blacklist for Stiffing or Roughhousing."

I wish more gals had your sensibility and fairness.

I usually will report a NCNS, though.   No, we're not physically harmed or threatened, but a NCNS can cost money.   Not just "time is money" money, but money-money lost on a hotel room that turned out to be un-needed or even from turning down someone else who very likely WOULD have shown up.  

Some guys have long histories of last-minute cancellations and/or No-Shows and it helps if we know that prior to booking. Agreed and thank you.  My whole point was to alert guys that they might be getting blacklisted for "offenses" many do not consider deserving of such.  ;-

Pending length of date that could cost a girl 4 figs with hotel, loss of income, hours of wasted time, etc,

But I would say the same thing to girls as I do guys. Don't overreact at first. Give the other party a few days to get back to you before you act on a NCNS.

No the odds are not good that he will make it up to you, or the girl to the guy in the reverse situation, but I like to give peeps the opportunity to do the professional thing.

Good debate

I have had a few clients that I've wanted to black list.  

One called me every other day, using the same number but saying he never contacted me before, would disappear when I asked for verifying info. and then gave me references who had never seen him.... Ultimate time waster and just plain scary.

rough play, not treating a provider like a lady, etc. is JUSTIFIED. (T2) BL for being perceived as a time-waster because he sent one too many emails is BS.

(Q1) Why do providers put their phone number on their website or in their ad and then complain about guys contacting them too often?

Ok, I have a phone number posted but I do NOT accept phone calls.  I am text & email only.  So for me, it's excessive text messages and emails.  

The thing about guys contacting us "too often", especially prior to meeting, is that it can come off as being a potential stalker.  A few messages is fine; don't blow up her phone.  

But the thing that happens most often are the true time-wasters, those who have perfected their technique to keep ladies dangling.
 

 

Here's an example of a recent Time-Waster I had: this is a condensed version of a REAL interaction:

 
HeMail: Love your website & reviews, you're very beautiful and want to see you when you visit Smalltown.

MeMail: Great! Which day & time do you have in mind?

HeMail: I really like that pic of your legs...... so sexy, I can't wait.....

MeMail: Thank you very much, that's one of my fave pics too.  When would you like to meet?

HeMail: Either day work for me.... can I make an outfit request?

MeMail: OK, well Tuesday is wide open. Please send me your screening info and we'll take it from there!

HeMail: I'll look at my calendar and get back to you.... can't wait!

days and days go by without a word and then.....

HeMail: Work's had me very busy but I can't stop thinking about your legs!  Excited to meet you next week!

MeMail: (trying to be nice even though it's pretty clear he's not gonna book) Sorry but I don't seem to have your screening info or any record of an arranged date.  Could you please refresh my memory?  

HeMail: Oh I am very disappointed, I thought we were confirmed for Tuesday. You're so beautiful, that I'm sure you're all booked up by now.   I'll try next time you're coming to town!

Me: No reply

it's now the week I'm visiting his town

HeMail: Just thinking of you and knowing you're so close but so far is driving me crazy! I could wish you weren't so popular!

MeMail: Thank you for keeping me in mind.  I do have availability; just send me your screening info and we're all set!

HeMail: (waits till the day AFTER my scheduled dates) So sorry!  I just read your email; it must have gotten lost.  Been so busy with work I couldn't have made it anyway.  No chance you're still in town, are you?

MeMail: Why yes, I am!  Just send me your info and we can meet!

He never responds.

 

That is what we're talking about when providers refer to time-wasters who will NEVER book.  He's probably getting off when he reads every response.  

There are people who get off on boobs, feet, asses, smoking and even wasting another's time.  Don't ask me what that's about, but it's obviously true.

 

 

-- Modified on 6/28/2016 8:31:24 PM

-- Modified on 6/28/2016 8:35:01 PM

I think we've all been there...  Might I suggest that the wonderful ladies of TER refer newbies with questions  
A) to your web sites which has the information  
B) to TER Self Help section & even this board.  They can read for free.

END OF MESSAGE

OMG those types make me want to pull all my hair out.I went off on a couple of guys these past few weeks.It sucks that we have to deal with that type of bs.But hey it's part of the business

I was and am somewhat of a newbie. I hobbied years ago when single, but not quite this way. Fast forward 16 years later and I had been window shopping for some time, not ready to quite take the plunge to FS. Finally thought I was ready, contacted the one girl I wanted to see. Since I had zero references she declined, but we discussed a public meet and greet and she agreed. Well, I got cold feet and essentially day before or of I cancelled. Fast forward 6 months later, I did take the plunge with 2 reputable other providers then contacted my original girl.

In the email I laid out my situation with honesty and offered to pay for 2 sessions for her time that I wasted. She agreed to see me and now she is a regular. Great girl, great donations and my ATF.

Moral of the story is don't write us off if we are shy and not ready yet....have patience with us and you might find a gem.

I see nothing wrong with telling a wanna be newbie how to learn about the hobby.  At the same time a gal needs to tell him (at some point) that she's not his pen pal.  Don't call me until you have an actual date to schedule.  I'd even suggest a wanna be newbie put an actual date & time in the subject line...

I got bored reading that after the first 2 exchanges!  I dunno how you girls do it!  My communications (as a hobbyist) are limited to [time, location, duration, price].  And if you can't/won't meet in the next 4 hours or so, then w/e, I move on to the next girl.  Then again I'm also not very interested in going through more "screening" than a face pic / voice call either...tho that might just be me.

There are newbie-friendly ladies who are alright with this..... to a point.

The gentleman I mentioned in my OP, however, did not understand that sending multiple emails/texts every day just isn't how this is usually done.  
 
When I explained to him that the majority of my clients give me everything I need to screen them in the first or second contact and we're all good to go, no further contact until the day-of..... he was shocked.  

He was approaching this more like dating; looking for a "connection", seeing if there was a "spark" and so forth.  

There are some ladies who will do this, but he needs to tell them right off the bat that this is what he NEEDS  to get to the point of booking.  
That way, the lady can decide whether or not to indulge him without feeling like he sucked her into a time-wasting vortex.  

It was back in year 2005.  I was 22, shy and socially awkward.  So like any red-blooded young man in that situation, I started looking toward the hobby as a solution to my problems.

However, I kept running into the *opposite* problem: the providers were time-wasting ME.  Usually "no bueno" things like NCNS'ing, canceling last minute, and not replying to e-mails.  Granted, I may have been breaking an unwritten rule or two, but even banal "I want to meet for 1 hour; here's my information" e-mails were getting ignored.  Or worse, promised appointments that never got delivered.  One provider went as far as giving me fake directions and then not picking up the phone when I called to clarify.  It almost made me never consider hobbying again.  Almost.

Of course, looking back, my main problem was my age: I was 22.  And from what I heard, providers don't usually like young hobbyists.  Or maybe they didn't like the nervousness in my voice.  Or how young I sounded.  Or maybe they mistook me for LE somehow.  All of which made me even more nervous when I called the next provider, leading to a vicious cycle in getting my first-ever appointment scheduled.

Long story short, by May of 2005, I found an agency that was willing to see me.  Their scheduler was awesome: BIG kudos to her.  She patiently explained the process to me, and told me to get an RS2K membership.  I got past the screening, went to the provider's hotel, yada yada yada, walked out (more like staggered out) with a big goofy grin.  Of course, I was totally non-functional at work for about a week, but that's what happens when you lose your V-card at 22.  

Funny story.  Later on, after I became more established in the hobby, I briefly worked for a small telecom company that leased AT&T's lines for communication outside its local area.  My boss had a habit of referring to AT&T as "our provider".  So you can imagine my internal reaction when he kept saying he'll be "calling our provider to set up an appointment".

My first-ever provider (agency) gave me plenty of hand-holding, although my hand was being held by the scheduler, rather than by the lady I was seeing (at least until I showed up to see her ).  She explained the whole process to me, patiently responded to my e-mails, and even gave me a pep talk in a happy, calming tone, when I had a question on the way over and sounded super-nervous on the phone.  That said, I already learned the process just enough not to call or e-mail (texting was rare back then) except for appointment-related communication.  So she could tell the difference between genuinely nervous and time-waster, I suppose.

-- Modified on 7/1/2016 9:43:29 AM

That's exactly what he sounds like.  He probably enjoys reading erotic messages, or something.  While today, we have sexting, in 1998, there was cybersex.  It was most popular among teens and maybe 20-somethings.  Heck, I myself used to have fun with it.  At least I wasn't wasting anyone's time.  And it was with civvies, but I digress.

I'm sure that guy will be no different.  "A/S/L" and "Wanna cyber?" will be textual music to his ears (eyes).  Anyone over 25 probably remembers those.

I wouldn't know if I am blacklisted, as I have several whitelistings here and okays on P411, but I find that new gals entering the business don't bother to respond to p411 date requests.  You can tell they've logged on (it gives the date of their last visit) and you can tell they looked at your profile (it tracks the date of that as well.)  Then nothing.  No response.  

It's fine if I don't meet their standard (I assume they want younger clients.)  But they should say something because when I attempt a booking, I hold those days open on the assumption I will be seeing them.  I give them 48 hours now to respond before I cancel the request.  But that means I've lost 2-3 days and have to start the clock over again on a new girl.

It is convincing me to just stick with the older established providers.  They are always quick to reply and set a date.  The new blood maybe just want to see young cute guys -- I guess we all have our fantasies.  Wish they would just respond that they were unavailable, though, rather than having me run the clock out on them waiting for a reply.

Actually it's quite the opposite.  Providers usually prefer *older* men; a few had a lower limit as high as 38 (while they're in their late 20's).  You should have seen my other post, about how ridiculously difficult it was getting my first appointment; I felt like I was back in the civvie world.  I was 22 back then.  Imagine how it felt to follow directions to the incall and find myself in a supermarket parking lot.  I started wondering if I'm blacklisted too.

One thing that helped me get my foot in the door in the hobby is starting with an agency; that and an RS2K membership.  They generally see whoever's safe, and don't pick and choose hobbyists for the most part.  Agency girls' response to me was quite mixed: a few were happy to see someone their age, most were decent, and one was clearly repulsed.  Perhaps you can start with agencies too; because they have a scheduler, they respond quicker.  Of course, now that I'm in my 30's and well-established, it's all a non-issue.  And I now prefer providers 24 or older; hard to suspend disbelief with anyone younger.

May I ask how old you are?

-- Modified on 7/2/2016 9:14:17 AM

esp. if it's newbies we're talking about.  if some guy w/lots of reviews under his belt sends tons of emails, that's another thing.

but guys who are new to this don't yet realize the effort a woman puts into her business (or that it even is a business).  they are too obsessed with their own performance to even think about the other person (hopefully this will subside and they will become more aware of both sides of the equation the more experience they get).

black lists should be used for dangerous people, not confused people.

it took me a while, i must admit, but i have honed my approach down to sending everything a lady needs (my name, brief description of myself/life, reference info, likes and preferences) in my first introductory email, except for date and time.  i am looking for specific things; if the lady isn't able to provide them i move on, so i don't ask to set up a date until we both agree on the parameters i am looking for.

i found that multiple emails tended to irritate the receiver, and i can totally understand that.

for flirting and other connections i rely on other social media and restrict it to women i have already seen.

I think of blacklists as information. I would rather have the option to make an educated decision. As someone who works another job fulltime and only takes a handful of appointments per week, if someone has a history of multiple cancellations, I probably won't even bother with them.  

In another scenario, let's say I have two gentleman contact me for the same day, same time. One is blacklisted for timewasting and the other is not, obviously I am going to the pick the one that is not. I suppose I'm in the camp that knowledge is power. Blacklisting is our only comprehensive feedback network. Because truthfully, in terms of screening, providers receive biased information. Only that which the client wants us to know. He obviously isn't going to give a provider reference where he did something he shouldn't have during the appointment.

Recently, I've been finding a LOT of blacklist reports on guys who claim to be newbies.

 
Naturally, some of them are likely stretching the truth a bit, but I've gotten the impression that most of them are true hobby-virgins.  

 
All the tension in the world at the moment could be contributing to ladies being more prone than ever to blacklist the gentlemen for offenses they don't realize CAN be taken as such.  

However, I've also personally had more "tire-kicker" emails than usual in the past few months.  
 Those are the people who reach out to ask a couple questions, say they want to schedule but don't give screening info, then stop answering after a few messages.    
 I realize there are currently more reasons than usual to have second thoughts.   I don't blacklist for such things but it's clear that others DO.  

 
So..... Newbies:  each time you do this, you are risking being blacklisted.  Many ladies will take one look, see you have a few reports for being a Timewaster, then not even bother to respond to you.

So my advice is if you exchange a few messages and aren't ready to schedule: explain that, thank the lady for her time and tell her that when you're ready to take the plunge, she'll be the first one you contact.    

 
Smoothing any ruffled feathers can go a long, long way.