(Minneapolis/St. Paul - Near the airport.)

According to FOX 9 News, on 9/1/2010 @ 10:34pm:

RICHFIELD, Minn. -  ______ Medical Center CEO was arrested in Richfield Wednesday along with 13 other people in a prostitution ring.

Police arrested D.C., 60, at 77th and Lyndale Avenues in Richfield for engaging in prostitution.

Sources told FOX 9, the arrest was made during an undercover prostitution sting. They said undercover investigators reeled the men in with an online ad. When the men showed up for sex, officers made the arrests.

Richfield police refused to comment on the ongoing investigation.

Hospital Chairman of the Board of Trustees ______ released a statement Wednesday night:

“Today we were informed that D.C. (protect his identity publicly), _________ Hospital President and CEO, was arrested in Hennepin County on charges related to prostitution. This is a troubling, personal situation, but [insert hospital organization's] focus will continue to be on providing our patients and their families with excellent care.”


C****. posted bail of $300 late Wednesday afternoon.



This was the best report that I could find.


"-."-."-."-."-."-."-."-."-."-.


I chose to protect his public identity and because I'm not sure if I can post names in here or not. (Couldn't remember.) You can feel free to check out www.myfoxtwincities.com
and search for the story. "CEO Busted in Prostitution Ring"


"-."-."-."-."-."-."-."-."-."-.

Alias used so I can speak my mind without LE wanting to hunt me down.

I wish the cops would find better things to do with their time!!!

Isn't there enough going on in the Twin Cities for them to do like find and arrest the child molesters, gangsters, murderers, drug traffickers, violent criminals and others wanted on warrants? GOOD GRIEF!!!

I think the cops should just go back to their lazy dens and eat some more donuts. LOL! I don't really care but just leave us good hobbyists and providers alone!

It's getting crazy around here.  


"-."-."-."-."-."-."-."-."-."-.

Do your homework, play safe or stay home.

You may not think that this is a bad crime - I somewhat agree. But better things to do? Why is this illegal?

Because unfortunately, this type of stuff brings in the very same things you mentioned into the neighborhood. I know you would like to think that everything is hunky dory in this little world, but it isn't. Pimps, violence, drugs, rapes, murders, exploitation of minors, etc - all follow when it gets down to a neighborhood level.

Nice to see where all that bonus money the CEO got for all those over priced CT Scans are going for though. This is the same person (Name with-held) who wanted to downpay nurses, increase their work load, decreased care on patients as a result, and take cut their retirement while extend profits so he could get a bigger bonus.

If you want to take issue with anything, take issue with that. Not LE doing their job. You getting pissed off at LE at this point is like getting pissed off at Soldiers for going to Iraq under orders from the government.

If you want to take issue with your industry, take it up with the people that make the laws, not the people paid to enforce them.

I wish I lived in your world.

You say: "What is exploitation of 'minors' really ? Maybe this industry would have less "minors - 18 maybe - being "exploited " if this buss wasn't criminalized."

And just what do you base this on? It's decriminalized in Nevada outside of Las Vegas. Does that stop illegal trafficking in that state? No.

"If there really was some sort of "real exploitation of minors" going on then the person being exploited or other employee's could report it with out possibly facing jail themselves."

Yeah that would work considering it is underground. Just because you legalize one thing doesn't mean the others will still not flourish. For example, drug use for pot leads to other drug use down the road. This has been a stat proven time and time again. So legalize pot. Does that still deter the advent of other illegal drugs? Should be legalize those too? Like Meth? PCP? Have you seen the effects of people on those drugs? Does legalization deter crime? No.  

"Btw, The exploitation of minors is not specific to this industry, but it may be overlooked if it's a legal enterprise  that hires very young workers as slave labor - underpaid and over worked."

Not in this country. We have laws governing slave labor. I am talking about the United States. If you wish to carry on a conversation about sweat shops in China in a ommunist nation beyond our control, than go nuts.

"What is a 'pimp' really?
Is it someone who may helps manage a persons business affairs for a fee?"

No. It's called this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJicuvUHgNA

I am talking about people under control of the shadiest of the shady. This, will NEVER vanish even through legalization. Make sure to watch the entire video, but than that would require you to see the real deal in over 80% of prostitution in the United States.

" If the worker wasn't terrified of the law and if the business was legal , the other abuses would be less likely, in my opinion."

Community Oriented Policing, especially in Minnesota, has deterred viewing the escort/prostitute as a suspect but a victim if underage (about 60% of cases). You can ask any department that.  Over 78% of prostitution in this state is ran by Pimps who control through terroristic threats, control via drugs/alcohol, and violence. So when people are being busted via the neighborhoods, you can rest assured these are the people being sought after for the most part. Yes, high profile is too.

"Drugs? This buss and drugs according to the media go hand in hand - bull shit -"

Really?

http://www.eric.ed.gov/ERICWebPortal/search/detailmini.jsp?_nfpb=true&_&ERICExtSearch_SearchValue_0=EJ648437&ERICExtSearch_SearchType_0=no&accno=EJ648437

Here is one small study. Read that.

I have about 70,000 more on my desktop should you need to read them.

One last thing: Legalizing your trade will not stop this:

http://www.naswdc.org/pressroom/2001/091001.asp

The police are doing what they are told to do. They take orders just like soldiers do. If they are told to crack down on an area to clean up a neighborhood, they do it.

If people want to talk about decriminalization it still won't matter. Over 75% of protitutes in this nation are addicted to drugs. Those people will do whatever it takes to get their next fix or to retain their lifestyle. Do you all of a sudden think leaglizing it, taxing it, and maintaining legal STD tests to remain in business is going to stop a solid majority who have STD's and do not wish to pay taxes? Do you think the pedophiles will all of a sudden quit being attracted to underage females? Do you think Pimps will all of a sudden be "Managers" of a business and play by the rules?

No. It sure is wishful thinking, but I think the majority underestimate the downfalls.

Do I think there are respectful people here who would do the right thing within decriminalization? Yes. I do. But unfortunately the fact remains that those ideas will account for about 4-5% of the actual follow through within an underground industry that will continue to go about business as usual even with those safeguards in place to bypass those same safeguards.

So in a sense, the rotten apples (Oh which account for the majority of people - - sorry, that is just a fact) will ruin the possible positive outcomes from the very few who would follow it.

-- Modified on 9/2/2010 5:05:51 AM

According to Hennepin Cty Jail records the count is closer to 19 and up.  Must have been like shooting Fish in a barrel.  

As usual Fox doesn't get any facts straights the bail he posted for release was $50 not $300.  

It is really embarrassing to be in this town, the media go after and prosecute a person for this misdemeaner crime. God help you if you have a profile online that they can exploit.

"And just what do you base this on? It's decriminalized in Nevada outside of Las Vegas. Does that stop illegal trafficking in that state? No."

No. It's not decriminalized in Nevada; It's legalized in a few counties.

Legalization is not the idea situation for everyone since one is required to work away from home ,give up 50 to 80% of their earnings,and register as a prostitute with the police dept.

However, legalization does protect the working lady from those who might take advantage of the illegal status of the profession if she chose to work independently. If she does get arrested the police can confiscate all her money and valuables, for ex.


There are criminal elements in every facet of all legal professions too.Those who choose to harm others will do so whether legal or not.

I do believe that both legalization and esp decriminalization does and could help protect those most vulnerable in this profession from abuse. It wont eliminate all abuse but it could eliminate some. Some is better than none.  
Decriminalization would help eliminate the underground element.

Right now all workers in this business who work independently and choose this work free of force are still labeled trafficking victims.
This would not be the case if it were decriminalized. Real trafficking victims - those that are truly forced against their will could still be labeled as such.

I happen to know people who smoke weed but they don't do other drugs. I don't agree with the theory that 1 thing necc begets another. This is from personal exp not statics from someone pushing their personal agenda.

Huggy addressed part of the slave labor issue perfectly below. : )  

One can be labeled a pimp without being shady at all. But i do believe legalization and decriminalization helps protect one more so from abusive people that exist in this world. This shady of shadiest element exist holy unrelated to any outside of any 1 business including this one. The law should focus on the shady types not those who work within the law.

"You Know people by what they Do not Say."

Not everyone agrees with the  victim status. The victim status serves a function for those who want the profession abolished.
Why arrest and steal from a "victim?"  


Drugs? I don't do drugs and never have.
I've been in this buss for years and i've also worked in Nevada. I've met many working ladies from all over the world over the years and 90% of them DON'T DO DRUGS.
You can quote stats all you like but i bet those who quote high #'s dont have the personal exp i have and i'm sure they have an agenda that goes against those in this profession !!!!

Any Decriminalized profession will not stop the criminal mind. But it may protect some who might be further victimized if it wasn't decriminalized.
 

I did some digging.  BP is where I looked, and I found 1 gal who never posted before, and had 5 postings yesterday for the 494 strip... Every couple of hours for the whole day.  Also, the price was very, very low, which makes me think that's how LE would attract 14-20 people.

To me, the point is for the most part this is a victimless crime, two adults meeting for fun at a price.
Because of that  the writer feels that the police should focus more on crimes such as robbery, theft, break-ins and such.  To bring in the CEO's position is not fair. To do that you might as well shine the light on everyone's job here on the board including your own and and how we should be spending our money otherwise (legally). Just my two cents.  This is a bad time so let's keep things in perspective. Play safe!

..."Because unfortunately, this type of stuff brings in the very same things you mentioned into the neighborhood. I know you would like to think that everything is hunky dory in this little world, but it isn't. Pimps, violence, drugs, rapes, murders, exploitation of minors, etc - all follow when it gets down to a neighborhood level."...


If "it" was decriminalized, it would attract less predatory elements and crime.
It's because it's illegal that violence - rape, murders  - is more likely to occur.
Report it and go to Jail !

What is exploitation of 'minors' really ?
Maybe this industry would have less "minors - 18 maybe - being "exploited " if this buss wasn't criminalized. They would be employees' or contractors - it would be legal work.
If there really was some sort of "real exploitation of minors" going on then the person being exploited or other employee's could report it with out possibly facing jail themselves.

Btw, The exploitation of minors is not specific to this industry, but it may be overlooked if it's a legal enterprise  that hires very young workers as slave labor - underpaid and over worked .  

What is a 'pimp' really?
Is it someone who may helps manage a persons business affairs for a fee?
So if it's legal work then it's your boss. If illegal work then it's your pimp.

I'm aware that there are some "pimps" that may not simply be the boss in this situation.
They may use the illegal categorization  of this work to commit real abuses and other crimes on their
"employee."  If the worker wasn't terrified of the law and if the business was legal , the other abuses would be less likely, in my opinion.  

Drugs? This buss and drugs according to the media go hand in hand - bull shit -

It's less likely to be the women in this industry using or abusing drugs.
Most women choose to stay alert - self preservation is key.
I would imagine if drugs are really found they would likely come from the buyer of services not the other way around. Legalize the buss and maybe the few clients who dabble at home alone without consequence would think twice before bringing that illegal element into a decriminalized business.

People in many industries abuse drugs.
It's just that these people who abuse drugs and who work in legal industries are less likely being monitored at work - so linking drugs to work is unlikely in their situation.

"For example, drug use for pot leads to other drug use down the road. This has been a stat proven time and time again. "
This is far from a proven fact.
"Btw, The exploitation of minors is not specific to this industry, but it may be overlooked if it's a legal enterprise  that hires very young workers as slave labor - underpaid and over worked." Not in this country. We have laws governing slave labor."
What a dream world you live in, this is far more common in this country than most people realize.  There are individuals working as domestics who are in slave like conditions.  There are "sweatshops" in the garment district of NYC.  

"This is far from a proven fact."

http://alcoholism.about.com/cs/pot/a/blwusm030503.htm

Now don't get me wrong. Medicinal pot is great. It helps people live better lives if terminal, and takes away the pain. It has also been proven to destroy brain cancer cells while leaving healthy cells alive and in tact.

" What a dream world you live in, this is far more common in this country than most people realize.  There are individuals working as domestics who are in slave like conditions.  There are "sweatshops" in the garment district of NYC."

Again, severely underground, and always being dought after to destroy the ring. And very sparce. Not where entire American organizations are outsourcing their labor to 3rd world countries for pennies on the dollar for profits. We should go after those corporations too in my opinion.

Either way, the point originally made still stands. To think that about 85-90% of this industry isn't completely tainted with trafficking, narcotics involvement, pimps, control, abuse, etc - is just whistling dixie and turning their head so they do not have to hear it. Reality is reality. No matter which rose colored glasses are put on in any given day to deflect it. And that is why LE and the goverment is after it.

Respecful "two adults having fun" accounts for about 5% of this entire trade in the US. And for those people, you have an uphill battle - because the other majority ruins communities, ruins lives, raises crime indexes two fold, creates illegal vertical markets, and slowly erodes the entire radius of that certain population in the process.

So my advice? Cut the supply to the street walkers, pimp supplied trafficked women - Erode their source of income (Which will never happen... but it sure is nice to think about) and keep your "business" to the 5%.

i would like to know which ad or provider name was used to hook people in this sting.  i never see that disclosed when this happens.  there has to be red flags in these LE ads that we should look out for...  anyone have input on that?

Germany has it right with their FKK clubs.  Not sure about the Netherlands who are starting to rethink their red light districts.  In the UK, the massage parlors are essentially decriminalized brothels and they leave private independent escorts alone, as does Canada.  LE concentrates on eliminating the street trade, underage, and trafficing, and thats what we should have here too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_trafficking

"Due to the illegal nature of trafficking and differences in methodology, the exact extent and growth of the industry is unknown. According to United States State Department data, an "estimated 600,000 to 820,000 men, women, and children [are] trafficked across international borders each year, approximately 70 percent are women and girls and up to 50 percent are minors. The data also illustrates that the majority of transnational victims are trafficked into commercial sexual exploitation."[33] However, they go on to say that "the alarming enslavement of people for purposes of labor exploitation, often in their own countries, is a form of human trafficking that can be hard to track from afar.""

This definitely doesn't sound like it is working.

"100,000's Of East European Women Sold For Sex"

http://www.rense.com/general43/sex.htm

"These women are transported westward to be "broken" by being raped and beaten. In cities such as Belgrade, Yugoslavia, stunned women stand naked in secluded apartments waiting to be bought by pimps. A woman can sell for as little as $500 or as much as $10,000. After being sold, she will be locked in a room, fed one meal a day, tortured with cigarette burns to destroy her self-esteem, and forced to have sex with up to a dozen men a day, seven days a week, until exhaustion or disease wipe out her market value. The pimp makes back his investment in less than a week. "

the article I saw said that police were not releasing the hotel name nor the website where the ad was placed and that future stings could be expected.    

Screen screen screen ladies!!   And gents, try to stick to those you know are well established.  I know the little guy has a mind of his sometimes, but, just the same, try to keep him in check.  You know, pat him on the head every once and a while when he's being really good.  Or, if you want, I can do that for you!!  LOL

Be careful!

The report on fox news that someone mentioned earlier had the cross streets of the hotel.  And there's only one hotel on those cross streets that I know of!

I have only two possible answers.  First, there are 14 or so people who know what ad was used.  Either they are not aware of what we do here (which, in part, may explain how they got in trouble) Or they are simply too freaked out by the whole experience to log in and talk about it.  

Those are my best guesses.

That also raises a good question ....... is there anyone on here that has actually been busted in the past??  If so, I would love to hear the story or at least situation and feelings that went through your mind at the time.

That would be great to know...and/or even where it was posted?

Good point there!  Its surprisingly not too bad of a hotel either...

This SW part of the cities there around 494 sure seems to have more "problems" than other area's these days. Been in this area for a couple dates before, but am thinking I will be staying away for now.

ME TOOOOO!!  Very curious to know what AD!!! I just warned some guys in Fargo not to see a certain provider on escorts.com that stole some photos of well known providers and she doesn't have any reviews!!!!!  And if she doesn't like it...tough shit!   I don't want my clients getting busted!

Luv, AXO

"Those who choose to harm others will do so whether legal or not. I do believe that both legalization and esp decriminalization does and could help protect those most vulnerable in this profession from abuse."

First let me say I enjoy this discussion. Thanks for keeping it civil

Second, I will disagree. Look at Germany in my last example linked in response to another poster.

I will quote a different source this time.

http://action.web.ca/home/catw/readingroom.shtml?x=130078&AA_EX_Session=4553b6cd56444cdd39f0ca00fe53db73

"Five years later, a federal government evaluation of the law found that the German Prostitution Act, as it is called, has failed to improve conditions for women in the prostitution industry nor helped women to leave. It has also failed "to reduce crime in the world of prostitution."

So as you can see here, legalizing this has done nothing to deter what you would have hoped it would. In fact, it has become even more rampant.

" I happen to know people who smoke weed but they don't do other drugs. I don't agree with the theory that 1 thing necc begets another. This is from personal exp not statics from someone pushing their personal agenda."

I agree with you. Some people can smoke weed and never do anything else. Unfortunately, the tats do not lie in the fact that a solid majority turn to other drugs after, or while under the influence, of weed.

"One can be labeled a pimp without being shady at all. But i do believe legalization and decriminalization helps protect one more so from abusive people that exist in this world."

Did it help in the case of Germany? So with that said, knowing there is a country that did, according to your thoughts, legalize to minimize the underground, which had no effect what so ever on abuse, underground, drug use, etc. do you still feel the same way? Should we keep trying in other countries? How many would be enough? Thailand? Tijuana? These are all the same examples of which nothing was deterred, and in fact, grew the underground and abuse further.

"The law should focus on the shady types not those who work within the law."

But it's against the law.

" The victim status serves a function for those who want the profession abolished."

Over 10 million women and teenagers, some as little as 11 years old, are exploited every year for financial gain. It isn't a political scare tactic. These statistics are very real. They are real here in the US.

"You can quote stats all you like but i bet those who quote high #'s dont have the personal exp i have and i'm sure they have an agenda that goes against those in this profession !!!!"

The agenda notion can only go so far. Right now, tens of millions of women and girls across the world, whether it is in countries legalized or not, are being abused and tortured for financial gain not for them, but for whoever owns them. In the US alone it accounts for the majority of the underground market. You may say stats are stats, and you may know 100 escorts that would never succumb to this. I agree. I am sure you do. But I also know of 500,000 that are being abused in the US alone.  

"Any Decriminalized profession will not stop the criminal mind. But it may protect some who might be further victimized if it wasn't decriminalized.  "

I know you do not like stats, but again, I will point to Germany. A country which did research 5 years after legalizing prostitution, which found it did nothing to curtail the underground violence associated with it, which is what they, and you, hoped it would.









You say, "   Decriminalization would help eliminate the underground element." again, I say look above. I use Germany as an example because this is exactly the proof needed that it doesn't help eliminate that underground element.  

This cannot happen. Obstruction of justice has to be within the confines of the official arrest in the state of MN. Stings, and alerting to stings, is not obstruction since technically there has been no crime committed yet.

Is it possible for LE to use providers for these stings.
Would providers who have been busted oblige for a slap on the wrist?

Just my guess but ad on BP.  Location 494/incall, ran 4 times. Just a body shot for picture.

Decriminalization does reduce crime, because it makes a once illegal act, legal. Criminalization creates higher crime because it makes a legal act, illegal. Neither has any significant effect on the number of people who will choose to partake in the act whether criminal or non-criminal. But this is too obvious to require further elaboration. The point here would be that quoting numbers and stats means jack shit.

Stats are numbers on paper that clueless policy makers think translate into actual people. They are created by people who want to manipulate facts to support their own argument. Show me a stat that says 85% of any given people are one way, and I’ll show you another that says it’s a load of crap. And most likely, both would be wrong. People don’t live on stat sheets, they live in the real world, and they don’t worry about what stat sheet their lives are popping up on. That’s a fact – or at least I say it is – which makes it just as relevant as any “fact” you’ve stated.    

Criminals choose to commit crimes because…they like jail? No. Why do people choose to become criminals then? They don’t. PEOPLE do what they do and lawmakers can make them criminals by making their activities illegal, or not. Because I see prostitutes I am a criminal. If you legalize it tomorrow, then I am no longer a criminal. How is this indicative of my suitability to be a free citizen? It isn’t, it’s nothing but a numbers game.

Murder, rape, theft – these things are easily defined as criminal because they are all acts which take away the civil liberties of another person guaranteed to us by the constitution. But how do you have a crime without a victim? Who would be the victim in this case, morality? Whose morality? Yours or mine? Answer – whoever has the biggest campaign fund – that’s whose.  

War on drugs – war on prostitution – this is our own government declaring war on US – its own citizens.    

Riddle me this – how has making prostitution an illegal act, benefitted America? (Jeopardy music begins to play)………..I can think of several ways decriminalizing it could benefit us, but I have yet to hear one plausible answer as to how keeping it illegal does our society any good.

Many things get bought and sold in this country without anyone getting hurt. Why are drugs and sex the glaring exceptions? Well, because they have one thing in common – they are illegal. And what happens when you make something illegal, does it make it go away? No. It just makes it go underground – it creates a sub culture. And people predisposed to criminal activities will flock to them to capitalize on the black market that our government has created for these things BY making them illegal, simply because legitimate business people will avoid them due to the criminal stigma, leaving the door wide open for whoever holds the biggest gun.    

Remember prohibition? You’ve no doubt heard of it. It gave rise to some of the most notoriously violent criminals our nation has ever known. But how many people did it stop from drinking? My grandpa told me the answer is zero. But he didn't get that off a stat sheet, he lived through it, so maybe I should seek out a stat sheet, cause stat sheets know everything...

Ask yourself why the douche bag standing on the corner of Broadway and Lyndale with his pants hanging down to his knees is standing there with crack pills hidden in his shoes. Why isn’t he out there selling flowers or candy? Why not tobacco or alcohol? I’ll tell you why, because those things are legal, and are mass produced, taxed, shipped and distributed in bulk, at a price that he can’t compete with. But crack…you can’t buy that shit at Walmart, now can you? Nope, you gotta go see him, or someone like him.

If we legalize crack, will he still be out there selling it on the corner, holding entire neighborhoods hostage via fear…Glock .45 tucked in his waist? Not for long, because someone with a lot more money and brains than him will be selling at half his price and at twice the quality in a mortar and brick building on the same block. Bye bye asshole, go get a job or starve.

And don’t give me that useless argument about ‘look what crack, meth, heroin etc. does to people.’ It’s bad shit, no arguing there. But there are dozens of man made substances that can do as much damage or worse that you can obtain legally, so there is no point in making that argument. Yeah, I’ve seen what crack does to people. I’ve also seen what Percocet does. It’s really hard to tell who will drop dead first, the crack addict or the pain killer addict, trust me. Bottom line - people who want to get high, WILL get high, come hell or high water.

So our solution is to lock them up? Because that is all criminalization does – subsidize the billion dollar people-warehousing industry better known as prison. Makes DA’s look good with their flashy numbers, look how many people I’ve locked up, hooray for me. God forbid we stop putting them in jail and take those billions of dollars and put them towards treatment and prevention.        

Now throw prostitution into the same argument. Men who want to fuck a woman who doesn't sleep through it, WILL, come hell or high water. And women who can stomach the social stigma, (and the smelly fat grease balls who often come through their door), who realize that the gold mine between their legs can get them further ahead financially than a masters degree, will continue to profit from it.

You can talk about all the underlying issues that lead women into the profession, and those issues are noted, sad…and tragic… but you have no point to make when it comes time to explain how arresting them will help with those issues. Uncle Sam is the biggest pimp out here and here he exploits them more than anyone. “Yeah, that’s right bitch, I said you DON’T sell that pussy, or I’ll send my fucking blue-suited goons after you. Then I’ll humiliate and permanently stigmatize you by making it public record that you’re a whore. Yeah, because that’s MY pussy, not yours.”

So what are you gonna say now? Tell me about the underage girls who get manipulated and abused into selling their bodies? Yes, that is disgusting and despicable. But we don’t need a law that says you can’t prostitute a minor because we already have a law that says you can’t have sex with a minor - period. And here’s a news flash, the sentence for a statutory is far more severe than the penalty for promotion of prostitution.

What then, the poor girl is selling her ass because she’s addicted to coke? So you’ll help her by locking her up for prostitution AND possession. Brilliant. I’m sure she’ll be a pillar of society when she emerges from county lock up.

But wait, what about the ones who are trafficked into this country illegally and forced to work as prostitutes? Human trafficking is already illegal is it not? Entering the country illegally is already illegal, is it not? As is slavery, I’m pretty sure, something about an emancipation something or other… so for some reason we still need to lump them all in the same boat as the consenting adults who enter into a mutually beneficial agreement? Yes I can see how that’s the same thing…and George Clooney looks just like the Elephant man only with better hair.

Glass window…yeah, the boys in blue are just being good soldiers, following orders. I have to follow orders too sometimes. But if I am told to do something that denigrates my own values, then I don’t do it. So I guess if I was a cop, I might opt for an assignment other than vice, which is nothing more than a political-morality Gestapo. Fuck them and the guy who signs their paycheck. No alias needed.

All due respect to those law enforcement agents who CAN actually see the forest, even though the trees are blocking your view.    

Do you know what is extremely troubling about this entire situation.  LE has infiltrated the verification sites, the boards, and even the websites designed to provide safety information to women in this industry.                    

Where are ladies supposed to turn to get reliable, safe information?  Or help?  Because LE sure isn’t going to do it.  And we are talking about real crime here!  

The egregious ‘prostitution’ laws in this country have set women up to be seriously hurt, up to and including death. And I am sorry officers, but you are part of this, including female LE.  How do you men even go home every night to your wife’s, daughters, sisters, mothers, grandmothers, aunts, girlfriends, and cousins knowing that every day you are setting women up and hunting them down like wild animals.  

You know what they say - keep your friends close, but your enemies even closer.  

Did anyone else get a PM recommending a provider from another TER member lately? I got one on Monday from basically saying, check out this lady, she's great. Oh and she has a new phone #. First that that ever happened to me in 10+ years on this board. I checked out the guy and he had a few reviews but it rang quite a few alarm bells so there was no way I was going to contact her or him.

Funny thing that this happens shortly after another "great verification debate" where most posters sang the praises of references, verification services and that we had to be ever so considerate of everyone's safety. Trouble is, providers and johns will flip on each other when busted, verification service records can be accessed by court order (TY for moving offshore TER btw) and everyone will look out for themselves first when faced with charges.

So here's to me being a paranoid S.O.B. - my hobby phone got ditched last week since I had used it for a few months (phone & battery in 2 different places and the SIM card got crushed), there isn't a single provider who knows my real name or what kind of car I drive (let alone my license plate #). I always scout the area for suspicious vehicles and other red flags first and the money (which is kept in a wallet that I can ditch without any identifying contents in it) never leaves my pocket or is even mentioned before the provider and I have completed a mutual safety check.

Best of luck to everyone busted, let's all use our heads and trust our gut - if it feels wrong get out of there - both guys & ladies!

What you describe is slavery, which is already illegal, as it should be, and should have severe punishments.

What I and many others here are looking for is encounters with adults who are deciding of their own free will to do this sort of thing.  That should not be illegal.  Nor is the fact that many participants in this activity make bad choices with their lives, such as using drugs, etc., a reason to make this illegal.  Part of being a free society is the freedom to screw up and live with the consequences of that but that doesn't mean those consequences should involve going to jail for having sex with another adult.

I see no reason why it is possible or why a provider (or hobbyist for that matter) couldn't cooperate if they thought it would help them.  LE makes all kinds of promises to get people to cooperate although how much good it does them is another question.

LE does not have the resources to go after all the crime there is.  They make choices on how to use their resources and I believe that makes them a legitimate target for criticism when they run stings like this.  Unless they can show that the people they arrested were actively involved in human trafficking, every penny and every second they spent and continue to spend on this is wasted and allows people who actually harm other people to continue doing so.

yes, and i have seen ladies there!  but only ones that i know

http://minneapolis.backpage.com/FemaleEscorts/afternoon-delight-with-a-hot-blonde-add-a-little-whip-cream-and-have-a-taste-28/4686209

Might be important to bookmark the phone number too!