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Minnesota

The Question Remains . . .
mountaineer 4 Reviews 20315 reads
posted

... as to whether the local authorities / populace could choose to make prostitution legal. The state of Nevada allows for this, and all except the three big gambling counties have chosed to legalize and regulate the World's Oldest Profession.

There are casinos on Indian Reservations in many areas where casino gambling is not legal in any adjacent jurisdiction. Could prostitution be locally legalized in a similar manner? Obviously, federal law does not forbid this for the states - if it did, Nevada would not be able to have legal brothels.

It would certainly open up some interesting possibilities - the White Man being screwed by the Indians for a change :-) It would also be a healthy impetus for the authorities outside the reservations to end their idiotic quest to criminalize consensual behavior among adults, just as Indian Casinos have done with gambling to some extent.

Launce19782 reads

Seems like we might have discussed this a couple of years ago, but maybe not.  How for does sovereignty extend with regard to the reservations?  As I remember they had to get some kind of government approval before opening the casinos, however they make their own laws, have their own LE, etc.  

I remember some issue several years ago where the state AG stated that even though what happened on the res was illegal in MN it was not illegal on the res and therefore he couldn't do anything about it.

Are indie's legal?  Can they run a brothel?  Would they even want to?

Launce

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AndyPandy21614 reads

Contrary to popular belief, law enforcement does have jurisdiction on reservations.  Both Prior Lake police and Scott County deputies can, and do, perform duties in the Mystic Lake area on the reservation.  (My source for that was the Scott County DA himself, answering my direct question.)  Indian reservations are NOT sovereign nations, as commonly believed, but rather wards of Congress.  All that means is Congress is the only non-Indian legislative body which controls what happens on the reservations--and Congress makes them follow state criminal laws.  So, to answer your question, no, brothels would not be legal, nor would smoking crack, murder, fire violations, etc.


Andy

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maddawg696919308 reads

Not to brag, but this is an area of my expertise.  Minnesota is a Public Law 280 (legalese) state which means that the state has jurisdiction over certain criminal offenses on Indian reservations (with the exception of the Red Lake Reservation).  Not all states with Indian reservations are PL 280 states and the statute was modified in 1968 to require the Indian tribes to consent before the state could have jurisdction over the tribes.  Not suprisingly, no tribe has consented since the statute was modified in 1968. In non-PL 280 states (and on the Red Lake Reservation in MN), the federal government has jurisdiction over crimes committed within Indian country, under either the Major Crimes Act or the Assimilative Crimes Act.  Thus, even if the state of Minnesota did not have jurisdiction over Indian reservations, the federal government would.

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mountaineer20316 reads

... as to whether the local authorities / populace could choose to make prostitution legal. The state of Nevada allows for this, and all except the three big gambling counties have chosed to legalize and regulate the World's Oldest Profession.

There are casinos on Indian Reservations in many areas where casino gambling is not legal in any adjacent jurisdiction. Could prostitution be locally legalized in a similar manner? Obviously, federal law does not forbid this for the states - if it did, Nevada would not be able to have legal brothels.

It would certainly open up some interesting possibilities - the White Man being screwed by the Indians for a change :-) It would also be a healthy impetus for the authorities outside the reservations to end their idiotic quest to criminalize consensual behavior among adults, just as Indian Casinos have done with gambling to some extent.

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AndyPandy20693 reads

The three major counties in Nevada have no choice in whether or not to legalize prostitution within their boundaries.  Nevada law dictates prostitution to be legal only in counties under a certain population count (I *think* it's 500,000).  No choice to it.

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neboy23045 reads

The state must grant the Indians the right to have casino's on their reservation. Nebraska has a tribe that is not following this law and have had a casio running for a number of years. They have tried to shut it down and the US Goverment has upheld there right
to shut it down. Still it is running and nothing has been done about it. Now would the same thing happen to a Brothel?????

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Launce21162 reads

I'm a little confused.  MN is a PL280.  So, does this mean that tribes in MN must give consent to the state, county, and/or city govt's before they have any jurisdiction and none of the tribes in MN have given this consent or does PL280 mean that state, county, and/or cities have jurisdiction without getting consent from the tribes.

If the former, what jursidiction do any non tribal gov'ts have?

What jurisdiction does the fed gov't have with regard to tribes other than Red Lake?

Can any of the tribes legalize prostitution on their reservations?  Do they need any form of additional consent from Fed, State, etc?

Finally, is it possible that prostitution is in fact already legal on any of the reservations?

Launce



-- Modified on 5/29/2002 11:18:23 AM

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maddawg696920827 reads

An Indian tribe cannot "legalize" prostitution.  If an act is a crime under state law, it is a crime on the Indian Reservation under the Major Crimes Act or the Assimilative Crimes Act.  The only question is whether the state has jurisdiction (in a PL 280 state) or the feds have jurisdiction.  Also, can you envision Congress with Trent Lott permitting prostitution to "legally" occur on Indian reservations?

As to the consent issue for jurisdiction, I guess I should have been more clear.  MN was one of the original PL 280 states (from 1950s) and prior to 1968 other states could "become" PL 280 states simply by passing legislation to that effect.  In 1968 Congress amended PL 280 to require that before a state that was not already a PL 280 state could become a PL 280, the Indian tribe had to consent to state jurisdiction. In other words, MN was "grandfathered" in and retains jurisdiction over Indian tribes pursuant to PL 280.

Federal government ALWAYS has jurisdiction over Indian tribes.  Tribes are quasi-sovereign, but are considered wards of the United States and Congress has plenary power over Indian tribes.

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Launce20890 reads

Thanks Maddawg.  Several musicians I work with are Amer Indian and the view I got from them is that they are nearly completely sovereign.  Apparently there was a question about this, but the gambling issue supposedly cleared up any questions about sovereignty in general not just gambling.

Based on a survey we did last summer prostitution is a $229mm industry in the 7 county metro and $272mm statewide.  I would think that if it were legal for them to do it, the folks down at Shakopee or Red Lake would have by now.

Launce

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snafu92918503 reads

If not, you should take a saturday drive there and go see.  I know off at least one pilot who landed on the wrong part of the lake and was greeted (on the ice) by 4 heavily armed rez "Police".  He likened it to what you typically see in Mexican westerns.  His plane was CONFISCATED and later RESOLD TO HIM FOR ABOUT $25k.  Those that are familiar with the area do not cross after dark without loaded weapons, travel alone thru the red lake res after dark and certainly would not put themselves in any situation that would be compromising.  Unless, of course, you were armed and in numbers.  Red Lake, as I have been told, is one of three reservations in the Country that state and sorrounding agency police have no jurisdiction, right of pursuit or reciprocity agreement other than for major crimes (kidnapping/murder/etc).  In a sense, it is like an old fashioned "run for the border" for minor criminal activity.  If LE are in pursuit of a speeder, drunk, robber etc and they hit the rez they cannot enter.  Nice area, great people

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Lumberguy18489 reads

In reading your message, I can tell 1) You have never been to the Red Lake Indian Reservation. 2) You believe everything, anyone tell you. and 3) You need to get out more and experience life for yourself.

The truth of the matter is that the Red Lake Indian Reservation is a poor community with good people living in it. I am a Pilot and fly out of the Bemidji Airport, so I know the Res. area well. The story about a plane being confiscated it totaly bogus. If you are going to post information about people you should at least have some first hand knowledge.

Suggestion: upgrade your name from S.N.A.F.U. to F.U.B.A.R. meaning Fu--ed up beyond all recognition.

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pnut22427 reads

Just for your information the bit about the airplane being confiscated is a true story.  Read it myself in the outdoor news

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snafu92918625 reads

...but thanks for your thoughts concerning my handle.  Even though I am not an aviator nor do I live in Bemidji (which apparently is the two neccessary requirements for enlightenment) I do know the Northern half of MN like the back of my hand.  I've been a little busy these last couple of days, but I did take time out to find documented verification of the story about the plane that you referred to as "totaly bogus".  My first hand knowledge that you advised me to seek was in fact told by one of the two individuals that were in the plane.  You can read about in "outdoor news" as pnut stated or you can read about it from the Native American point of view at     http://www.press/on.net/articles/3-22airplane_seizure.htm  as reported on and described as a "black eye" for Red Lake.  I wrote my piece incorrectly stating that they resold his aircraft to him for $25k.  That is what they wanted.  What they settled for, as stated in the article was his personal fishing gear & equip and $4k in "fines" plus forcing him to trailer his plane off the Rez.  Yes, there are good people there, but unfortunatly, they are [the good people] not in power.  Speaking of under a rock, spend a little more time reading from the above site and less on TER and you might have a better feel for what is going on in your own backyard. And as for not ever having  been there, I plan on returning with my auger & poles and take some more of their crappies next winter!  This conversation is officially over.  Goodnight, Snafu (who fishes much)

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mountaineer20270 reads

There was a slight error in the link posted. The correct link is: http://www.press-on.net/articles/3-22airplane_seizure.htm

There is much that is not said in the article, so it's really hard to judge the "reasonableness" of the settlement. As for me, I think I'll stick with the other 9,999 lakes, and leave Red Lake to the more adventurous.

Related Link: Airplane Seizure

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