When I first started this hobby and found TER, I was counseled by an experienced TER guy to "Not write a review based on one visit. I usually wait for a couple of visits."
 I used to follow that advice,  but my need for variety and the fact I'd rather spend my money looking for variety rather than repeating made me start reviewing after one visit.
 If a girl is okay, I usaually don't review,  just when they're worth it or really bad, so as to try to save some members.
 Recently I had something taht doesn't happen very often, at least not to me.
 I saw a girl, she shall remain nameless, who blew me away, literally. She was everything you could want, a hot K Girl who didn't follow "The Script", had just a great time,  we had great chemistry, talked, laughed, the session was awesome, I tipped her well, I was rather breathless, and added her to my rare list of have to do agains.
 Most times on the rare times when I return, the experience is almost as good, and sometimes better, when you have found the right girl.
 So I made a return trip, and wow, she had turned into a "Stepford K Girl." It was as if she had eaten from wedding cake, turned into a bored wife. The energy was non existent, it seemed like it was a chore for her, she wanted to get the session over with, it was like a different person took over her body She had oh no, dicovered and read "The Script".
 Perhaps my experienced hobbyist was right...Oh well...

Oops! Just jokin!!!  

.... specially the line that says: discovered and read "The Script" ... funny.  Sound very much like being married.

-- Modified on 2/14/2012 6:35:21 PM

OK taquitoguy, I hear you loud and clear; but the real question is which is the aberration, the first visit or the second? Maybe on the second visit the gal had had a bad day, was tired, wasn't feeling well, etc. etc.. I don't know all the details of when and where, a lot of factors come ito play. Maybe you should see her again one more time to see which is the "real her". I had somewhat of a similar experience a while back when I had an appointment with a K-girl that I had seen a number of times and on a certain visit I asked how her week had been. She proceeded to tell me that her schedule had been terrible and how demanding some of her clients had been. I looked at her, saw that she was bummed out, and really felt for her. I asked what she wanted to do, and she said she'd do anything I wanted. I said let's just relax, hold each other and talk. OK, at this point I know some guys out there are going to call me a dumb shit, telling me you're there to get laid, it's a business, etc. etc.. But I have to tell you that the next time I saw this gal, it was chemistry of the highest level; it truly was like being with a real girl friend that cared about you and was happy you were there with her. Unfortunately for me she has left the business but I still communicate with her and wish her well. So what's the message here? I guess it's all about accepting that these gals are human and will have their good days and their bad days. It's up to you to decide if you want to give this gal a "second chance". If you do and it's a dud, you've only lost money. If she's back to the gal you first saw, you've hit the jackpot! Ciao!

I've had the same experience as Cenzo1.  The first two times with a particular K-girl were incredible.  Great chemistry.  Then as she got busier and busier our sessions became less and less enjoyable.  But over time, I've come to expect it.  Unfortunately, the numbers game simply beat it out of them.

Most likely, burn out.  Some gals start of strong but just cannot keep up the pace when seeing dozens and dozens of guys.  The problem with the k-girl equation is that they are here for a very short time and they are working 10 - 12 hours days, some of them six days a week.  They are here to make as much money in the short term.  You're bound to run into gals that just don't have the constitution for this kind of craziness.  That's why you should hit all facets of "the hobby" -- I spend hobby time in all different kinds of worlds, the FBSM, the k-girl, the UTRs, and the wide variety of providers that LA has to offer.  ATFs are the ones that I connect with, repeat with, that I get consistent service and it's always a great time.  You have to space it out as well, so it feels fresh when you come back.  I've been very fortunate to have 5 - 6 girls in the rotation and I intersperse them with new talent that comes in, or see a gal that's been on the TDL for a while.  I've had my share of horrible TOFTTs (in most recent memory "Ann" who was gone after two weeks) but I also find real gems that just sparkle the entire time they are in town, case in point, Samantha.  I saw her the first week she arrived in LA.  She wasn't on the forefront of some of the more highly visible k-girls but with her laid back personality, phenomenal service, she was one of my favorites over the past six months.  She actually thanked me the last time I saw her for being her first reviewer and she said it made all the difference.  Loved that girl.  Chemistry is such an evasive thing and it's different for everybody.

Most of these K-dolls take their first appointment at 11:00AM and their last appointment of the day  at 11:00PM with as little as 10 minutes between appointment for the popular ones. That is 13 hours followed by cleaning the place and setting up for the next day, getting home tending to their needs before they call it a day. The lucky ones tend to get 2+ hour appointments in the mix , these tend to be less strenuous/stressful as they tend to be with familiar faces some of whom are elder gents who are mostly want one pop , a nice cuddle and a chat to help them pass the day. These lucky ones can be as enthusiastic at 11PM  as they are at 4or5PM .  

 Unfortunately too many of the clients , according  to some girls , are unreasonably demanding , taking advantage of the language barrier, use their review as leverage to demand more than the standard menu, others are rough and of course you get the who want phone numbers ,  dates and free of the clock sex.

Their job has the potential to generate the girls , most of whom suffer from low self esteem a may have psychological problems, substantial income in a short period but at cost they are willing to  but unable take. They simply can't maintain the standards and the demands of the job or performing all kinds acts with total strangers. I have had times when I could not ask for more than a cuddle and a chat the state of a regular was not conducive to a good time not matter how much she wanted to please. It is not surprising that even the top girls succumb to the pressure and disappear , we all list  favorites who drop of every so often. Los Angeles is a top market , it is a demanding market that can be too demanding  for the Kz-dolls own good. Guys we  need to treat the ladies with respect and dignity , recognize their boundaries and not take advantage of them .              

Getting fucked by 500 guys in three weeks might do that to a women.  These K-gilrs work too much and get burned out way too quick.  Most other women in the hobby see 5 to 10 guys a week....NOT 70-100 a week.  They simply get too much dick!!!!!!!!!!  It's a fact....right?

The routine of a K-girl has always been mysterious to me, and this post provides new insight, for me at least.  The underlying theme, that we as clients should take care not to exhaust the provider, is absolutely right, and to the extent we make excessive demands or try to coerce behavior (who wants to have overtly coerced sex, outside of certain fetish guys?), nothing less than common courtesy demands that we do so.  But, I suspect that the fundamental issue is that business model cultivates burn out, not because the providers aren't durable or thick-skinned, but because the workload is just overwhelming.  I suspect that there is a fair amount of overhead that has to be covered for each of these girls, in addition to their income expectations, but, if they work themselves to a frazzle, they'll be out and the investment in them lost.  Excellent points, Harps.

Don't the bookers ban guys who try to manipulate the K-girls?

I met her as a provider, but we started dating off and on for a couple years.  Her need for money to pay her bills finally exceeded my ability or interest to help, so she decided to go to one of the brothels outside of Reno.  She did this 5 or 6 times before quitting.

After two weeks in Reno, I'd pick her up at LAX and she was like a different person (in a bad way).  It usually took me a couple weeks to help get her back to normal.  Unlike some of the women there, she was a real beauty and got fucked so many times in two weeks that her head almost exploded.  Needless to say, I didn't get any during the time she was recovering.

The sad part was she needed so long to recover, she probably would have made the same amount of money just staying in LA and working a steady schedule.  Especially when you factor in the airfare and the 50% cut the house takes.

She had a similar experience working "the circuit" on the East Coast a few years earlier.  The bottom line is you can only look at so many hard cocks before your eyes glaze over and you just become a robot.  I think this is inevitable in these situations.

Like it or not, when you pay the higher price of an independent, part of what you're getting are better odds that she'll be in a good frame of mind and happy to see you.  Most women are happy to see two men a day.  Very few can handle 6 or 7, and K-girls and brothel girls can easily see 10-15 each day.  It takes a toll on them.

This is an excellent post that everybody should heed.

The girls are lovely and, more importantly, human beings with the same fears and desires as us all.

Treat them accordingly.

Good post. Puts things in perspective. Often a girl gets top reviews when she starts, but her 2nd or 3rd week she gets a string of so-so or bad reviews. When that happens, I always assume the first few reviews were dishonest and the first reviewers were shills. However, it may be that, as in your case, the girl really was good the first week, but she changed after she was at it awhile ~ she got quickly burned out, jaded, developed a bad attitude, put off by some bad clients, or just decided she could skate by without so much effort. Whatever the reason, in some cases it may be the girl, not the reviewer.  

Harpman, Froomie & others made good points about this problem ~ it's inevitable that most girls will give bad service if their schedule is too dense & unrelenting. So...

In a sense TER is a kind of buyers-sellers club where hobbyists & providers figure out how to meet each others' needs. Win-win. Maybe as hobbyists we should draw up some suggestions and provide them to the bookers & the girls ~ basic guidelines such as....

Try to book girls for maximum of X customers per day (6?). Girls should have 2 days a week off. A vacation every 4 or 5 weeks. .... Also let them know that customers who make unfair demands on the girls should be blocked; that's what screening is for.... Also, let them know it's better to call a hobbyist and cancel, than to let him come for an appointment when the girl is too tired or feeling she can't give her best. Even if she has to cancel at the last minute, I'd much rather have a cancellation than a bad session, I'm sure most hobbyists would agree. ....

The idea of this is not to make rules, but  to make suggestions that will help keep the girls happy and also let them know that we don't want them to be overworked.

Also, let's do the math -- even if the girl is giving away 1/3 to her booker... and after taking out the shared cost of the apartment rental, clean sheets, soap, cosmetics, etc. ... at standard K-Girl rates, if the girl sees 6 customers a day 5 days a week --  (that's less than a 40 hour week with 2 days off) --- she would still be pulling in well over $200,000, a year.  She could see far fewer customers than that and still be making a decent living from a light schedule. So there is no need for these girls to be over-scheduled and over-worked.

Can someone please tell me how seeing 6 guys a day/5 days a week is taking it light??
I can't even see 6 a week, if I do I am burnt out.... Wow!
Hopefully the alias that wrote the above post doesn't have a vagina. If you do, holy wow!
I realize everyone is different but WOW.
So, when I first started I went out east and had one day, ONE DAY where I saw five
Clients. Afterwards, I sat in the bath tub and cried like a baby. I could hardly walk. Perhaps
Endurance and building up stamina is key but I would rather have higher rates than
To put my body and MIND through that.
Do the math..***based on 500/hr****  6/clients per week * 4 weeks --- 144,000  288 appointments a year/ 77 days off if you don't double book

So you are telling me it is reasonable for 200k per yr to see 120 clients/month... 1440/yr

?????? Things that make you go hmmmm ????

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but the math doesn't lie. ;/ that's sickening
So Much exposure to
STds
Mentally damaging
Physically uncomfortable
All for money

I wouldn't be able to look at myself in the mirror. There isn't a price tag on your soul, don't loose in the Chase for riches.
If you are one of the amazing providers who can honestly juggle that much work and still love yourself I am truly amazed and commend you for being such a strong person.. believe it or not I am a nympho and cannot go without certain pleasures in life but when those pleasures become my chores or the means to an end, it is no fun.

Yow ~ Eyva ~ slow down. My post was in response to Froomie and Harpman who reported, I believe correctly, that some K-girls are working 13 hour days, 6 days a week, with 10 minutes between customers ~ girls who you can't book because they're so busy. That translates to 54 clients per week.  ~ So...

I raised the question, what would be reasonable? ~ I suggested a number that would cut that total number almost in half, I put a question mark next to it, then stated that the girl could see far FEWER customers than that and still make a healthy living --- i.e. she'd still be making 6 figures seeing 2 or 3 customers a day. I then asked for feedback which you gave which I welcome. If you say 6 guys a day is way too high, I'm happy to accept your opinion. You say you personally can't even see 6 guys a week ~ of course keeping your volume down is a great thing ~ you are making sure you are fresh and rested and can give each guy your best ~ that's great. However...

If you think anyone could convince these K-girls and their bookers to limit to 1 client a day, I'm afraid your mistaken. You are calculating at 500$ per hour, but they only make half that. They depend on volume and live by it. So the question is how to balance volume on one side with health & sanity on the other.  
....  I don't claim to have the answer; I'm posing the question.

I absolutely understand where you were coming from I was just sharing my opinion. Those girls should realize they are worth so much more than being enslaved into basically, sex trafficking. My heart goes out to anyone who is in this industry and is controlled by someone else. When I see someone it is my choice and who I do not see is my choice because it is my body and my fantasy to share. I hope these k-girls, whoever they are, (really I have been wondering who they are, shows how much I follow the industry.) One day can.wake up and realize they do not need someone controlling them. This part of this industry disgusts me and its companies and brothels like that, that help base the shameful appearance of this industry. If it was not for such unjust acts like this, the independents would not get so much flack. It is the ugly side and I pray for anyone involved in it because I understand life can be hard and at times you may not see a way out but Damn, that's like a slow suicide emotionally if not physically.

It is good that you at least claim to not know how the k-girl industry works. Others would just sput of their misconceptions about the girls and the scene in general. Without giving away too much, these girls are here willingly and have no one controlling them.

They go on vacation, shopping sprees at the Grove/Beverly Center/ Rodeo Drive. It has been covered before. These girls are free to return or do as they please. Probably the only thing they are prisoners to are their spending habits.


Beems

I imagine the owners are aware of the types of things you bring up and aren't especially interested in having the clients tell them how to run their business.

Why in the world would you equate making a friendly suggestion with telling them how to run their business?

Thanks for this post, Beemer. I didn't want to sound combative, and I appreciate Eyva's conciliatory tone, but referring to K-Girls as "slaves" who are being "trafficked" is not just inaccurate, it's off the chart. These K-Girls girls are independent and doing quite well, thank you. They've chosen a temporary job with high demands and high rewards, and they are dearly loved. I feel like this part of the conversation went way off the rails; feeling sorry I brought it up.

It is a good topic and wish that more of the US born providers would at least educate themselves regarding the K-girls before saying these girls are trafficked. When was the last time you saw a trafficked kgirl shopping freely in Ktown or down at the Beverly Center?Does it happen? Of course it does. But don't fool yourself into thinking that it does not happen to US citizens here in the states. Don't just single out the kgirls. Every nationality or ethnicity gets trafficked.



Beems stuck in traffic (how ironic)

(Not really I was parked!)

Alias thanks for your thoughtful post.it is necessary to understand most of the K-dolls are here for less than 90 days . Their primary purpose for coming here is to generate as much income as possible and then return home to start a better life, pay off high interest loans , support their families etc. Those who do well and resist the temptation of shopping , gambling ,predartor/client boyfriends and other pitfalls exceed their wildest expectations.

Again the K-dolls have left their country to end up in a storage country , culture and society whose language they do not command are here to make as much money as possible. Asians are known for their work ethics and the K-dolls work hard. They would rather work and make money than hang around . Theoretically they can generate $3000 per day plus tips. We are talking serious money for those who are consistently busy. Most of these have been here for sometime and have come to terms with their lot in life and managed to cultivate a loyal following of repeat clients.
   
Unlike women from Eastern Europe and South America in particular , the K-dolls as a whole are not part of or victims of any human trafficking . The moment they land here they can walk away from their agency and disappear never to be heard again.

The agencies and bookers have very little leverage over them. Not all girls succeed , some are either not professional or overwhelmed by the work and environment. Some get distracted , others fall for some guy, others get an STD , some cannot cope with the nature of the job and the stress it brings. We are all familiar with some of the casualties  who have fallen over this past year.  

Your absolutely right.  There's no way they might possibly see your freindly suggestions about how they should change the way they do things as telling them how to run there business because I'm sure they live by the motto that the customer is always right.

Putting your sarcasm aside, the bookers ARE responsive to our suggestions and they do treat us very well as customers. The service that K-Girls give here is tailored to their American clients in direct response to what we write in the reviews. TER has given us a way to communicate what we want, and by responding to that, the bookers have gained long lists of happy repeat customers.

By the same token, we are responsive to them. We show up clean, sober, well behaved with the pre-set payment in pocket. If we don't, we risk getting blacklisted.

It's a terrific system that allows everyone on both sides to participate with the minimum risk and the maximum chance of a good experience. Win win.

The most successful girls stay popular because they learn how to pace themselves, which allows them to stay fresh and upbeat. I can't imagine why it's a bad thing to point this out or discuss it in a positive spirit. Of course the bookers will probably ignore the suggestion -- LOL -- but no harm trying. It’s the same kind of advice you’d give to an athlete who was here for athletic competition or a young  performer on tour.

That said...

In the bigger picture, as Harpman appropriately points out, many of the girls are here for short stays where their whole purpose is to make as much money as possible in the short time they're here. Obviously if the girl wants an intense schedule, then all we can do is wish her well.

Harpman - thanks for your post -- this is helpful and really does put things in perspective.

When you watch the boards from day to day you see some girls show up, pay for a beautiful set of CV pictures, set up their Ads and their apartment, then a week later, they're gone. You wonder what happened. Others are clearly here for the long term. Others come and go. Some girls get 6 reviews in their first week. Others are on the board for months and never get a single review. I feel like a Sherlock Holmes watching the boards, trying to figure out what's going on. Posts like this help to give a clearer picture of what's actually happening. Thanks

Overall, these girls & bookers provide outstanding service under tough circumstances. The more we can show appreciation and support ~~ and let them know we're all on the same side ~~ the better.

I would disagree with the comment about leverage.  Just because they can walk away doesn't mean owners have very little leverage.  Unless the girl is indie, if shes want's to work and make the coin she needs a place to work, which mean she needs the agency and the agencies have a limited number of slots available.  I can walk away from my job too.  That doesn't mean my employer has very little leverage over me, although they have less now since I'm retirement eligible.  One thing my job does have is that employees are unionized.  Some may think unions and "union bosses" are an evil thing, but I'd guess pay and working conditions are generally better for unionized workers than they would be if not for the union.

One of the worst things when I was working, was working at a unionized place.  Lazy slobs getting promoted along side dedicated workers due to them having their "time in". One guy was so hard working that once he got his "time in", he just did the minimum and glossed on by with the rest of the union workers.

I was glad to get out of there and work at a place where merit and hard work was valuable and not paying your "dues' or having "time in".

The unions are still using an outdated model in doing their business. It was always nice to see the Union president driving his brand new  BENZ SLK 500 while he cut down the workers benefits to appease the company I used to work for...

but all those Chinese workers making ipods etc  might benefit from a little unionization.  I hear their working conditons aren't so great.