Hobbyist walks in the room, leaves a DONATION on a dresser, something sexual is mentioned or performed, and then in come the police.  

I've read about this a couple of times now.  People even go as far to say that once you're in the room, there is nothing that you could do that would get you out on your own will.  

How are people legally getting arrested like this? Is it the fact that you are not getting anything in return besides whatever service the provider offers? In that case, couldn't the provider just sell something like a clothing item or food item and avoid committing a crime? I am sure I am dumbing things down. Interested to hear your thoughts!

Let's begin with the requirement to make an arrest.... probable cause .... That's all a cop needs to make an arrest.  So, how do they assert probable cause?  Well, maybe it's the appearance of an escorts web site ad, you call the number, make an appt., show up.  You are cooked.  Or, maybe you discussed sex for money during your phone call... you are cooked.  Or, maybe you show up to the room, place money wherever, then you approach girl for hug/kiss/remove clothing, whatever, you are cooked.  That's all it takes for cops to satisfy very simple standard to make an arrest.

Now, remember that an arrest does not mean "guilty" in court/trial.  That's not the cops job or their concern.  Their only interest is making an arrest without violating their department's standards or policies.  And remember, the "holier than thou" will say "get them pervs, child abusers, hookers, off the street.  So you are not going to find public outrage over questionable probable cause.  The public will side with the cops.

I wish I had a dollar for every arrest a cop made when he/she knew the perp would never be convicted or likely would never actually go to court.

As a non-lawyer, it seems to me that as a guy, the moment you walk in the room, there is probable cause for an arrest, and as stated, you are cooked for all the reasons mentioned above.
Would it be the same for a girl? In other words, the moment she lets an under cover cop in the room, is she cooked?

the nanny-cratic place it is. The fact that vice is more about "ick factor" and less about actual harm doesn't lead to any more tolerance of it.

In many jurisdictions, LEO waits or leads the suspect to say the magic words that mean "sex for money".   LEO will not quit until you say them so walking out is not an option.  Some jurisdictions are very good with evidence & have recordings to back it up.  In others, the sworn testimony of a LEO is all that is required.  This presupposes the LEO will have heard everything exacvtly the same as you did & no untruths are floated.
In other jurisdictions, ads or other information may be used because of different wording in the statute.  In those cases, walking in the door is about all that's needed.  
All those clever attempts to bypass the law will not stop you from getting arrested.  If you scroll down you'll see the church cover story.   LE does not need to completely prove their case to make the arrest.  Just Probable Cause that a crime has been committed.   Then the DA must press charges.  And a court convict.  These each have higher standards.  
The reason we commonly say that "There are 2 people in the room...  if one is LEO you are going to be busted".  In many jurisdictions, prostitution is a misdemeanor (though laws are changing as the Puritains have increasing power!)  Again, I generalize, that in many cases, a LEO must witness a misdemeanor unless the Suspect admitts the violation.  

If you see well reviewed providers, you minimize the chances that the other party in the room is a LEO.  This game we play can never be risk free (except for certain rural counties of Nevada or outside the US...  do be careful to pay the Central American girls!)

especially if she is found to have any tools of the trade, condoms, for example.

The point is, LE often doesn't care about getting convictions because just arresting people is enough for them to make their point to the community that they are cracking down on prostitution.  Besides, if it comes to trial and the person gets off, it's the DA's fault, not theirs.

And as for the perps:  They may get off but their cover is blown, they are embarrassed in front of their community, and have paid around $5,000 in legal bills.  Aquital is a pyhric victory, indeed.

(still not a lawyer)

Much to their danger, people get this misconception that only direct evidence can be used to convict someone of a crime, when instead circumstantial evidence can definitely be used to convict someone. The following is from California Jury Instruction CALCRIM No. 223:
"Facts may be proved by direct or circumstantial evidence or by a combination of both. Direct evidence can prove a fact by itself. For example, if a witness testifies he saw it raining outside before he came into the courthouse, that testimony is direct evidence that it was raining. Circumstantial evidence also may be called indirect evidence. Circumstantial evidence does not directly prove the fact to be decided, but is evidence of another fact or group of facts from which you may logically and reasonably conclude the truth of the fact in question. For example, if a witness testifies that he saw someone come inside wearing a raincoat covered with drops of water, that testimony is circumstantial evidence because it may support a conclusion that it was raining outside."

Since there is not yet a magical device that can tell what a person is thinking, circumstantial evidence often comes into play when a particular intent is required for a crime. For example, in California, possession of marijuana with intent to sell it is a crime.  Now, how do you show what the person intends to do with the marijuana if he or she has not actually sold it? If a person has 10 pounds of marijuana, it is common to charge that person with possession with intent to sell, because that quantity is far in excess of what one can personally consume, despite any claims that the person bought in bulk to get a discount. As another example, people who repeatedly drive drunk and then kill someone may be charged with murder. Murder requires malice aforethought, which pretty much means a conscious disregard of life. This conscious disregard is shown by circumstantial evidence that the person knew that drunk driving is a dangerous activity that puts people's lives at risk. The circumstantial evidence will include the judge's warning in the previous DUI convictions that driving drunk is dangerous, and the DUI classes that the person was force was to take, where again the person was warned about the dangers of drunk driving.

In this "hobby," there is lots of circumstantial evidence. In your example, "Hobbyist walks in the room, leaves a DONATION on a dresser, something sexual is mentioned or performed". Money is exchanged and then sex occurs. Despite whatever you might call whatever happened, it's not hard to draw a connection that one led to the other. Outside of strip clubs and porn movies, people usually don't spontaneously shed their clothes and engage in sex just because money is given to them. With all the ads and reviews, there certainly is an expectation of sex--think of how some providers are called "rip offs" or accused of "upselling" if certain acts aren't performed. Ads say that GFE is for a certain amount of money, PSE or MSOG for an additional amount. Have you ever read a review where a person says, "We went to dinner, we talked, and then we parted, and no sex happened, and it was great"? No matter what terms you use to cover it up, people aren't stupid and can use Google searches to find out what terms mean. For that matter, a jury of twelve people aren't stupid, can look at the totality of circumstances and tell what's going on. As a concrete example, Helms v. State (Fla.Dist.Ct.App. 2010) 38 So.3d 182 held that because of all the circumstances, such as the sexual nature of the Craigslist ad and that the escorting was to only occur in the room, there was an intent to engage in prostitution despite the following disclaimer: "[m]oney exchanged is for time, companionship, and legal services such as nude modeling, erotic dancing, body rub, etc. Anything else that may occur is between two consenting adults and has not been promised or contracted for!"

People also forget that the solicitation of prostitution or the agreement to engage in prostitution are in themselves crimes, even though they are inchoate. No actual prostitution need occur. As many courts have said, there don't need to be any magic words that need to be uttered. If there were, then of course, people would adopt other words to avoid the magic words. The California Supreme Court in People v. Superior Court (Hartway) (1977) Cal.3d 338, rejected a requirement that offers of prostitution require price and services. The court even said offers need not be communicated verbally. Otherwise, everyone would sign up for sign language courses. All that needs to happen is the agreement and an act in furtherance of that agreement. The act can be as slight as words. It just needs to be unequivocal. Whether going into a hotel room after making all the arrangements is equivocal would probably depend on the specific facts.

Basically, my point is this: You can play all the charades and the pantomime you want, but don't assume that it will be a 100% foolproof disguise for what you're doing. If you yourself could discern what is being offered, then it probably isn't that hard for someone else to put 2 and 2 together to figure out what is really happening.

Excellent summary.

And GFE on an ad is an offer of sex in most jurisdictions and nothing else is needed other than including GFE or worse on an ad or website.  

Disclaimers are legally worthless

Along those same lines, how does a hobbyist get busted if he knows he is seeing a well reviewed provider... even one he's seen before?  Have there been cases where either the provider has (1) flipped or (2) have their incall location staked out by cops?  

Another situation I can think of is if a provider's hotel workers get suspicious, or if guests in the next room put 2+2 together and complain about noise or 24/7 client traffic.

Please share your thoughts.

Yeah you have to remember that a girl being an escort is generally considered public knowledge assuming she posts online or in print. If she's been prosecuted for it in the past thats also a matter of public record. In theory ANY guy she sees for the rest of her life could be a potential client and the cops can use that BS logic to hassle any man that ever talks to her.
Depending on the circumstances they have PC and can storm the house or at least wait outside and bust whoever leaves first. If there is cash laying around anywhere in the house that could be considered evidence of a crime. Doesnt matter if its in a piggy bank or a safe with the words "Rent Money" on the envelope, they will assume it was for illegal services.

The Patriot Act gave local law enforcement a little too much freedom in harassing American citizens.

Sorry, this is long,but it's*FULL* of information to SAVE YOUR REAR END!!!

FIRST--Show the the Laws--How this is "Illegal" and how you get arrested

NEXT THREAD (as this turned out too long)--I'll show you how you could *LITERALLY* Sign the Title over to your FERRARI--for Sexual Acts---and be*BULLET PROOF*--NO WAY to get Arrested!

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Short Primer on the Law (my apologies if you know this--but sine you asked, I'll answer)

For a *TRANSACTION* of (any) Business service to be considered an agreed upon Contract/"transaction" there has to be what's called *CONSIDERATION"---"Consideration, is  ANYTHING* of value (my emphasis--will make sense in a second).

Example.
I live in a Multi-Million Dollar/High Rise Building. The Builders when done with construction/occupancy rate was "Legal" to turn over to Home Owner Association. Lawyers got together, had the contracts signed/fixed and LITERALLY (cause it's in the Meeting Notes I read).
The transfer/contract was "Sealed" with a $10 Bill the Lawyer pulled out of his wallet with a Handshake.

The "Consideration" was the $10-thus making it a *FULLY LEGAL-BINDING CONTRACT"
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(I'm assuming TER does not want the "P" word used on boards thus why I changed).
Therefore, [the "P" word for the business]

Laws are written as follows:


MY STATE LAW:
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§ 16-6-9.  [the "P" word for the business]


  A person commits the offense of [the "P" word for the business] when he or she performs or offers or consents to perform a sexual act, including but not limited to sexual intercourse or sodomy, for money or other items of value.

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It's why I always LAUGH when I see some idiots post 150-"Roses"---it does *NOTHING* to protect them from Prosecution. Of course Roses/means money. Still a form of "Consideration"--so are "Gifts"/*ANYTHING*).

So, the "Urban Myth" if you don't "Hand it to her:" (makes you safe is *HOGWASH*).

If you bring *ANYTHING* even $1 for her to keep when you leave--eyes of law, you are "PAYING FOR SEX"--The "Envelope"--all the other Nonsense is that. Nonsense

Envelope, is worthwhile as is "discrete/tactful"---but does nothing for "any sting/set up protection". As it's not'"Normal" to put $350 $400 on a counter/immediately have sex, leave the envelop behind. It's clear (to any Jury what was going on).

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*NOW*, don't get me wrong---(if is a set up) you *WILL* get a ticket/Maybe Patty Wagon Arrested.
An Officer  job is to write Tickets. It's how they keep their job/prove they are "Working" Writing tickets.

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By the way, depending on State

*NOW LET ME MAKE THIS ABUNDANTLY/HUGELY IMPORTANT--SAY NOTHING--to the Cops. They are *LEGALLY* allowed to Lie.

Might do the Handcuffs, say "Right now, not under arrest, just detained. What were you expecting being here?.--(HE CAN!!! SAY (in court-- "HE advised me he was looking for Oral Sex"

--Indeed, not yet under arrested, but can sure as HELL tell the Judge--well, he said this, this, this. Once reading Miranda Rights, he asked for Lawyer, I shut down Interrogation.

THE ONLY THING YOU SAY TO COPS-(PERIOD)
---"Officer, I respectfully ask to speak to my Lawyer before Saying Anything"

(Make very sure not to be a "PUNK"--Dudes doing his Job. His job that night is to Bust Johns/Write tickets--Don't show your ass. So don't start babbling about "I KNOW MY Rights/You can't do this, etc.etc.). Nothing to piss him off, so Cop then tells Judge regarding your behavior and because you showed your ASS--Judge refuses to go easy on you.

Reason not to talk (it will be your * LAWYERS JOB(--Make it EASY on him/Her.) to speak for you!

Cop might say, hey, trying to make things easy on you,just tell me, what were you expecting coming here.And maybe we just write ticket, let you go home tonight

--"Officer, I respectfully ask to speak to my Lawyer before Saying Anything"

He'll then arrest you, read rights, then say again, You wanna talk to me? If you talk, will just make it easier on you. -

-"Officer, I respectfully ask to speak to my Lawyer before Saying Anything"

He is now *REQUITED* then to stop.

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It is a JUDGE'S JOB, to determine the Law, and if indeed you broke it.

Reason I point this out, let's assume *YOU THINK*, if by saying "Officer, was not expecting Sex, you know, like any guy, was hoping for oral--you *MIGHT*---just have SCREWED yourself from a "Misdemeanor into a FELONY!!!".

EX--My state (because of old ancient 1800-Early 1900--Laws had on the books that *ORAL* was worse than * Missionary" (punishable as a *FELONY*--Mandatory years in Jail).  BECAUSE* it was Bigotry against Homosexuals. Thinking they could lock up, throw away the key on Homosexuals, made oral a Felony.

Was not until the Late 1980's/early 1990's enough people were up in arms about that, law was changed to a Misdemeanor. So *NEVER EVER EVER EVER* say *ANYTHING* and I man *ANYTHING* when you have Handcuffs on/and or have an officer asking you question after shit goes "Bananas" (Jesse-Breaking BAD!

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End Part One:

If the Mod Posts this, will then show you how to make yourself *BULLET PROOF*---NO WAY---can you get in trouble (either side)--for the Hobby.

AS knowing the Law, it's not the moment you walk in. Nothing illegal about walking into a pretty woman's home, it's once *CONSIDERATION*---has been applied. My post I hope Pops up...I've explained it.

It has *NOTHING* to do with leaving money on counter, putting in envelope, calling it *Roses*, etc,. Only thing it has to do is some form of Value is presented/immediately after, sex is performed. Hopefully Mod posts, * BECAUSE*--I'll show you how to make yourself *BULLET PROOF*--and *NO WAY* to get Prosecuted for a crime (like guy said above)--you can get *ARRESTED* for Anything "Prosecuted is another story.

Disclamer--none is LEGAL ADVICE--talk to your Lawyer. Ask their opinion.

I've researched "Sex Crims Codes" for State of Georgia
http://www.lexisnexis.com/hottopics/gacode/Default.asp

Title 16. CRIMES AND OFFENSES (click--expand that)>
CHAPTER 6. SEXUAL OFFENSES
16-6-9-P.....



Not sure if Sugar Baby is on your Radar (Google it)--it's nothing different than a Hobbyist does.

---HUGE FYI---if you Google it. Find the popular site---scan it. You'll find some girls asking for $10,000-$30,000/month. NONE--are getting that.

The founder of the sites says that "The Most Generous Men"---ironically tend to make between $50,000-$70,000 a year. The *LEAST* Generous (most demanding0---are the men making over $1MM a year, *GO FIGURE*


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HOWEVER, since there is a *CLEAR" line in the Sand (from "Paying Bills", then having sex. There's is *NO WAY* State/Feds can make a law against it,

BECAUSE--there's nothing "illegal" about giving charity to someone to help them pay for Schooling (Broken down Car/Power/Rent/Credit Card Bills).---the extra curricular (just like on phone)---never Discussed, but of course *FULLY implied.

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(Geesh!!! I read (ABC NEWS) about One dude--Has  7-women (SB) he supports, spending $150,000 a year on them!!!! (just one, gives $5000 month--help her out).


Written ARticle: http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/sugar-daddies-cover-debts-sugar-baby-dates/story?id=16623859

Video: http://abcnews.go.com/2020/video/sugar-babies-tuition-cash-college-escort-internet-15359381
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There is *NO WAY*--the Government can make Sugar Baby (or "Arrangements") illegal *BECAUSE* when you enter into a "Sugar Baby" arrangement. You *FIRST* meet for dinner/Drinks. Discuss the Business Transaction. Discuss monthly needs, negotiate accordingly.

Yes, I know Providers don't "Negotiate" but for this "arrangement"---would have to.
Because, it's not a "Full time" thing. You still keep your "Day Job" (just like girls have School to do). But, to keep the money coming--Have to go out, "ETC."

After first dinner, either seal the deal that night--maybe another night.

HOWEVER, what you have done, is to draw a *VERY CLEAR LINE*-in the sand, you are not "Paying for Sex"---you are paying to help with School Bills (and the unspoken/yet fully implied is sex is exchanged for this too. Mix in Dinner/Drinks---every few times, come home, "Have fun"---it's ABSOLUTELY ZERO DIFFERENCE----Thank having a GIRL----FRIEND with a NSA relationship---when you "Need" to hook up---like an NSA--you do.

******************************

NOW, meeting a Provider.

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Like Explanation above--it is NO DIFFERENT--than if you were bar hopping, hooked up with a girl you took home. When done say I'm really sorry, I have to get home. I have to get up early for work. Maybe we can have dinner/hang out again.

HECK--I hooked up with a girl (NEVER WENT OUT)---just drunk, asked me to come over...party started. that was it. ! (not illegal). --SAME THING

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This is what BLOWS ME AWAY--Why providers (especially Outcall--don't don't do this--then try to  "ding the clock" (no guy will agree with a "clock ding)----

Making it "Legal" is THE *LINE IN THE SAND*---makes it's a *REAL LIFE* "Date":--by going out for dinner.

Remember [p word] is illegal because it's "quid pro quo"--exchange of gift immediately followed by Sex.
*CLEARLY* (any Jury)---would say "YEP meets the legal def of law"

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if you asked "Let's get Drinks/Quick Appetizer.  *IT'S CLEARLY beneficial to both involved*. You know it's not a set up. *NO "STING*, would allowed HER--to come to you,  She knows a sting not involved (cause no sting would allow her to come to you--plus it's not a "cold call"--just walk in door, drop envelope, head to bedroom. YOu hangout 15-20mins--say, hey, let's go back to my place.

Just like ANY Heterosexual Male has done (least *ONCE* in his life)--he's "Snared" a HOTTIE from a bar *grin*---A Hottie he's taken home.

************************************

HER:While eating, he listens to a "Sob story"---I can't believe it, I have a $360 XYZ bill due 2-days from now, don't know what I'm gonna do,.

HIM:I can help you. If one day you're able to pay me back, great. If not, I'll consider it helping a new friend.

Then, the "Hey, you probably shouldn't drive, Let's go to my place. Least for a little while, so you know you're o.k. to drive.

***********************************

Pull envelope from back pocket, leave on counter.  'Hey, here's what I said would lend you. Had planned on depositing it, but, it's here, it's yours, hope it helps. If you can one day, pay me back, if you can't, no worries.

HE--takes your customary Shower.
She (mind if I lay down, will help sober me up). Sure, make yourself comfortable.

Exits shower in only a towel--she's laying down, only in Under clothes (or naked if makes her feel better). Reminds you how great he is.

By *ALL ACCOUNTS*--nothing more than a dude./woman-consensual relations, after sharing a few drinks together.


About Fee's
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Even if fee is $400 (thus the Separation of the two fees)---again *COMPLETELY a Date"

Then can do  can I have $50 for a  Cab. I'm not  sure I need it, but just in case.  
You get wallet  here $50 PLEASE cab it, if you need to.  

Entire night, There is *NO QUID PRO QUO*---just 2-adults, too much to drink (fyi--even just "one"--say can make you tipsy




Here's a Legal Quote from 1st Amendment Lawyer
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A First Amendment lawyer from Las Vegas, Allen Lichtenstein, explained to the Huffington Post that this type of arrangement is a "legal gray area when there is not an immediate exchange of cash for sex." He elaborated, "One could even consider certain marriages where there are unequal financial resources to not be overly dissimilar. But any relationship that is an ongoing one that's not purely about sex but may have a sexual aspect to it, you can't really classify as [the "P" word for the business]."
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So what does the Dude do when he meets a lady?
You spend the first 20 minutes of the hour retreat at lunch or coffee?

Don't worry about paragraph 2.  No law broken. Even if law comes, no evidence of act.  
At least one credible witness is needed who every juror believes who saw the money solicited in some manner or the act of prostitution (not the sex alone).