I went to go see a supposed to be client that was LE at there hotel room. Before i came there was no talk about sex over the phone and my add clearly adverticed dancing and or modeling sessions. When i arrived i asked The detective if i could take a shower and he agreed. I put my bag by the hotel dresser(the bag i carry all dance wear, wipes,oils,ETC), and went to take my shower. When i got out the shower i went to my bag naked to put on my dance clothes the the detective called to me to hand me the money. I took the money(really stupid for me to do), and went back to my bag to put on my dance wear in the process he came to me and asked if i had any condoms and i replied yes. Then thats when I heard the door open with  a group of vice and they began taking pictures of me and would not let me put my clothes on until they were done taking pictures.

I feel that every girl can carry some condoms in there bag just because i agreed that i had some condoms does not make a valid offer for sex for money. Like you read nothing was discussed and my adds clearly say exotic dancing or modeling and theres never any sexual acts offered.


I have a lawyer who is taking my case for free because he thinks i have a pretty strong case(nice guy i must say). I just was hoping someone can tell me if they have a a good chance against me. Thank You

It all boils down to whether a jury will conclude "beyond a reasonable doubt" that you were engaging in an act of prostitution. It seems that you may have some good arguments. A lawyer works hardest when the defendant "has a strong case". They shouldn't do such cases for free. There has to be an ulterior motive. Guess what I think it is.

-- Modified on 3/20/2007 1:10:36 PM

It sounds like the D.A. will have a pretty weak case.  There may be enough to support a guilty verdict, but I see reasonable doubt all over this one.  I'm surprised they even charged you.

I share Groovy2's concern about the lawyer representing you for free, but I'm a bit less suspicious than he is.  I can understand a lawyer taking your case pro bono if you can't afford counsel, since a victory will dissuade police and prosecutors from charging people with such flimsy evidence.  But if the lawyer is asking you to trade your services for his you probably would be better off with someone else.

When i got arrested i was arrested with like 4 other providers. And when i went for my court date they let the other girls off real easy and tried to stick me with like a year probation, Etc. So the lawyer came up to me and said he would take my case for free because he didint think that was right. He didnt ask for my services in exchange which i think is really decent of him. Im not sure if they tried too stick me harder then the rest of the woman because im younger and there trying to make an example....or what? But i really didnt expect for all that....

I was really nervous when i went to see the Detective pretending to be a client, and ive heard rumors that they can arrest you as soon as you get inside the room .Is that true?

I was a student and got arrested at an anti-Vietnam war protest.

The lawyer took my case and argued against my arrest on civil liberties grounds and won!

He even jumped over the railing at one point when one of my co-defendents started to get roughed up by a court cop and interjected himself between the two to stop the brutality.

I paid him only $100 as this was all I had to my name at the time and I tried to find him years later when I had more money to offer him; unfortuately, he had moved.  He must have put easily 20 or more hours into the case.

There are good hearted lawyers out there who do plenty of pro bono work and for that these people should be recognized and the rest of us be grateful.   I know I am.

(Still not a lawyer, thought I though about it once and even took the boards.  Didn't do too badly either.)

-- Modified on 3/20/2007 5:32:54 PM

I'm so sorry you had to go through that degrading experience.  I've been there too honey.

I agree with sidone and mrfisher who know far more than I do about the law.  But the case sounds a little shaky but they don't really care about that - it's essentially a shake down designed to cost you money.

You didn't say where this occurred. In CA there has to be an exchange of money and an "act."  You took his money, and said you had condoms.  While that doesn't imply an intent to USE them per sey, a naked girl saying she has condoms and digging in your purse is probably reasonable enough to prosecute the case.

Photographing you naked sounds to me like  serious violation of your civil rights.  Was there a female officer present?  Is it department policy to photograph people in custody naked? Etc.

And Lawyers are like escorts, you get what you pay for...    A win here could be good for his future too. But I personally don't see anything wrong with sleeping with your attorney - so long as he's as good as what he does as you are.  It might give him incentive to keep you out of jail. giggle

It's just so sad that LE spends so much time and money to victimize us for misdimeanor "crimes" which occurr between consenting adults in private - but hey would you rather arrest a naked lady or get in a shoot out with gang members?

Just my opinion...

Hugs,
TS Jamie

-- Modified on 3/20/2007 6:32:05 PM

Guess what?  It all depends on what STATE you were arrested in.  Several states have adjusted their anti-protitution laws to allow certain terms (such as "escort", "GFE", etc) to automatically mean an act of prostitution.  

Why is he taking your case for free? Are you trying to tell us that you have no money, or is it that you'd rather not spend any money on legal representation? You are the one involved in risky activity and it is ultimately your future.  How much are you willing to invest in your own future? Do you honestly think you'll get his best work out of him?  Does he expect you to blow him periodically during the case?  If you piss him off, do you think he'll still do his best work for you?

IT depends on the totality of the evidence. They might be after you, because you have a higher profile than the other girls. Lawyer still wants to get into your pants.

WOW! First off- he got you nude by letting you take a shower, second they barged in taking nude photos of you, not allowing you to clothe yourself.  Depending on your state/location you might want to find a whistleblower association and tell them what happend.  [email protected] if you want more help! The LE didn't do protocal and the case will be thrown out if you can suggest this- I use to do pro se legal work- Kelly Brandon

"I was really nervous when i went to see the Detective pretending to be a client, and ive heard rumors that they can arrest you as soon as you get inside the room .Is that true?"

It depends on what happened before you showed up.  If your ad simply shows a picture of you and a phone number, then no. But if your ad is explicit or using code words such as GFE, French lessons, etc, then your showing up at the room will be considered the "act in furtherance" of prostitution. You don;t have to say anything, and he does not have to hand you any money.  Showing up gets you arrested.

So few girls seem to understand this, and really do not belong playing the game.

The prosecutors might have treated you in accordance with your attitude towards them. If you were nasty or defiant, then you were probably treated worse than the others.

for LE to wait until the girl is naked, then barge in and take pictures of her unclothed. It's scary as hell and very degrading, which is intentional. Maybe it's used as evidence, or maybe it's just to instantly make her very vulnerable, both psychologically and physically, thereby giving them a lot more control over her.

The experience can have long-lasting emotional consequences, which can be likened to post-traumatic stress syndrome. I've talked with many ladies who've been through it, and a lack of trust seems to be the most common long-lasting effect. In the short-term, intense lack of trust - even in her own judgement - is one of the most devastating effects. It can affect her decision-making ability to the point where she can't even buy a pair of shoes. Maybe that sounds silly, but it's an example of just how pervasive that lack of trust in oneself can go. If she can't even decide on a pair of shoes, you can imagine how impossible the more important decisions in her life would be. At a time when she needs to choose an attorney and go through the legal process, her impaired ability to trust or make decisions makes it very difficult.

Generalized anxiety, sleeplessness, nightmares, night terrors, fear of being alone, fear of being around strangers all are things some women experience after such a bust.

But, it's totally legal.

-- Modified on 3/24/2007 3:44:24 PM

Often, it is the intention of LE to wage a type of psychological warfare against certain crimes.  The goal is not to get convictions per se, but to create in the minds of not only those who get arrested but those who hear about the arrests that this kind of degrading treatment could happen to you if you persist in the activity that LE is targeting.

Unfortunately, there are no good prospects for getting the police to end this as they can justify their actions based upon the reasonable suspicions that the provider's actions have created, at least in the minds of the jurors if not the judges who will decide.

The only real defense against LE's efforts are knowledge, screening and discretion so that you avoid LE in the first place.

(still not a lawyer)

"pro se"

Does this not mean representing oneself?

One can represent oneself and still get help from others.  Many pro se litigants hire paralegals who know the procedural rules and are able to do legal research or other taks.  Sometimes pro ses pay to consult with a lawyer when they need to and do as much as they can on their own.

"The experience can have long-lasting emotional consequences, which can be likened to post-traumatic stress syndrome. I've talked with many ladies who've been through it, and a lack of trust seems to be the most common long-lasting effect. In the short-term, intense lack of trust - even in her own judgement - is one of the most devastating effects. It can affect her decision-making ability to the point where she can't even buy a pair of shoes. Maybe that sounds silly, but it's an example of just how pervasive that lack of trust in oneself can go. If she can't even decide on a pair of shoes, you can imagine how impossible the more important decisions in her life would be. At a time when she needs to choose an attorney and go through the legal process, her impaired ability to trust or make decisions makes it very difficult."

Are you serious?

"A man can have many failings, but he himself is not to be called  a failure until he starts to blame others"

If her ad (GFE, BBBJ, etc.) can get her arrested, can answering that ad get a hobbiest arrested???

The police can arrest you for anything whatsoever. That doesn't mean it will stick, but they can drum up anything they want to make an arrest. I know girls that have been arrested for "escorting w/o a license" for simply walking in the LOBBY of the hotel.
They also can have sex with you THEN arrest you.
The police can do whatever they please, hon.
(and that's part of the problem..)
Hunter

"[email protected]"

I assume she is from the UK by the location of her email address.  That's a paralegal I would not hire.

Pro se means someone who has studied the law and filed, or rather represented one's self and won. In the UK it is termed Barrister.

If it is legal in LA I'm surprised no one has brought this issue up to higher authority.

Pro se is a Latin adjective meaning "for self", that is applied to someone who represents himself (or herself) without a lawyer in a court proceeding, whether as a defendant or a plaintiff and whether the matter is civil or criminal.

I wouldn't take your anecdotal experience in England as factual guidance for a case being waged in Los Angeles.  Best to hire an actual attorney.

Nude photos of you? Defin. illegal of them to do! You will I am sure not only get out of any legal ramifications but also counter sue and perhaps even have them lose their jobs!
Not too mention your nightmares, fear or public, mistrust of men now- ; o I would have this court case in every paper and tell it to anyone listening ` these men were incomp. rude, abusive, perverted PIGS
best of luck xoxo

-- Modified on 4/5/2007 3:29:42 PM

they can arrest you, shoot you, kill you and answer any questions later. never get nervous, never talk when being arrested or about to be arrested.be calm and fair to the cops. Just think that your way out is silence and the court process.

furtherance can only be established if an actual contract was established, in other words monetary exchanged, yes even if implied. if the add contains codes but no donation or rates hard to see it stickm, by just showing up does not constitute exhcange. by the way she can get arrested for anything but the court process will determine convinction.

are you referring to prossecutors as LE? hello!!the prosecutor is an attorney, a DA. LE is just an agent, nothing more.  and by the way they do have a reputation for being abusive of their entrusted powers and judges know it. Are you cop?

Why they do it: most sting cases can get dismissed easily if no  contract/exhcange/obligation can be established. Evidence establishing exchange/contract or obligation is generally (even if you advertise $$ for GFE,BJ...) a very difficult thing for LE "to cause" without crossing the line and actually inducing the crime, thus constituing entrapment and yes, many of these cases can get dismissed on a preliminary hearing wihtout trial for lack of evidence establishing obligation and induction to act. By taking pictures of you naked they hope that the prosecution will be able to use this as "establishing evidence" and get a trial and even a conviction. But in addition, cops hope to create sufficient pressure on the suspect to have her admit it and self incriminate.  Cops can do that? yes and if you're smart you can later even sue them for infliction of emotional distress and abuse of authority (harsh case to take though). However, the ones who plan the sting op, they know you're unlikely to do so or even be able to do so and rather think you're likely to talk an answer their trap questions.
Again. If you get arrested in a situation like this, don't talk, you may cry or show emotional distress if you want to, but don't say anything, don't resist arrest, don't insult or evn talk to the cops. Just ask what is happening? they must clearly answer whether they're arresting you or not, they must also clearly state the charges (why are you being arrested). Then go ahead and request the presence of an attorney, they may insist in questioning you or asking you for cooperation, just insist on the attorney before any questioning.   They will book you and ask who's your attorney (you should already have one already!!!! for god sake you're running your own business!),provide them with the name and contact info (be sure your attorney knows what you do, and have his/her 24 hr. emergency phone number) ask them to allow for you to call or have them do notify him/her. Please refuse to answer any questions. Please don't accept any so called offers of cooperation. These are all traps. Just wait for your attorney. Cooperating with their questioning WILL NEVER help you!! Doing their job is getting as much evidence to the DA so they can have you convicted. Cops are not there to help you, they just doing their job, which is everything but helping you.

Had a party request and had someone else doing my screening, never again.  Get there and there are 3guys and a girl.  I feel this is odd but we stay for a few minutes.  The whole time they are trying to discuss money and sex etc and I continue to change the subject.  After about 10mins of the charades, I motion to my friend it's time to leave.  We get up and are almost to the door and are grabbed and arrested.  We were charged with 4 counts of soliciting prostitution to undercover cops and one count of Minor in casino.  We spent the next 18hrs in jail freezing to death and were OR'd.  I had a lawyer friend who offered to handle my case and also knew the DA.  The charges couldn't stick because there wans't exchange of money or any verbal reordings so I ended up with one count of trespassing and a $500 fine.
With 90% of these cases, they have nothing to make the charges stick.  Also, because he allowed you to shower and such, most likely you will end up a fine simalar to mine,  and a stay out of trouble order.  I honestly wouldn't worry to much about it.

Tasha