Every time I read a post here asking "would this be illegal?" or "could I get arrested for this?", I think about George Carlin's old routine about sin and the Catholic Church: "eh Fodder, aaaah, so what if you're on a ship at sea... and you haven't received Communion yet, and it's Easter Sunday, and now it's midnight - too late! But den, you cross the International Dateline! Would dat, den, be a sin, den, Fodder?"

I don't really get the purpose of making up all these elaborate scenarios to ask "would dat, den be illegal?" In this country, it doesn't really matter whether it is legal or not. The real question is, can you be arrested? Can you be charged? Can someone cause you embarassment or make you spend money on a lawyer?

For instance, a lot has been made of the fact that prostitution is not expressly illegal in Rhode Island. But that doesn't change the fact that many people have been arrested in Rhode Island for engaging in prostitution, then turned loose because the DA could not prosecute. They still got their name in the paper; they still sat in a jail cell for a while - and some probably had to call their SO for a ride home

When, and why do people get arrested for prostitution? Do you believe that there is an Eliot Ness wannabe out there researching the hobby and travelling from state to state, systematically taking out providers and hobbyists alike? I don't. And most LE doesn't really care about this hobby as long as it doesn't make trouble in other areas. If they are getting daily complaints about streetwalkers, they will react. If there is serious drug trade related, they will react. If a crime is committed in conjunction with the hobby, they will investigate. and so on. Hypothetically speaking, if I were the type of fellow to consort with providers
I would be more interested in what the local LE climate was than how the specific laws were written - have I read about recent busts, has the mayor vowed to clean up the city, is it an election year? Then I'd research the provider in whom I had interest, be careful and follow the rules while booking, and in the end run keep my fingers crossed, since no matter how careful you are, shit happens (I read that on a t-shirt).

I don't know why I'm ranting about this. It's a slow day at work...

but I don't let it interfer with my ranting.  8o)

In any case, the questiion sometimes reminds me of the response snooty sales people give to customers who inquire of the price of something; to paraphrase:

If you have to ask, then it probably is illegal.

hey mrfisher, I have a couple of questions to ask you - are you a vip?

The bottom line is, any police officer can arrest you and take you to jail weather you've broken the law or not. Then it's up to you to have your day in court or if you're lucky have the charges dismissed. Either way, you end up with your name in the paper.

There are two reasons people on this board ask what the law says rather than what the police do:

1.  This is the "Legal Corner" board, which means it's about the law.  How police do their jobs isn't determined by law.  It's more a matter of local preferences, which can vary quite a bit from one city to another even when those cities are in the same state and thus subject to the same laws.  Questions about police practices are better suited to the regional boards.

2.  A lot of the people who answer questions on this board are lawyers.  Lawyers are not allowed to give advice about how to get away with a crime.  We can tell you if X is against the law, but we can't tell you how to reduce the odds of being caught while doing X.  There may be other users on this site who won't mind giving such advice, but the Legal Corner board probably isn't the best place to find them.  Again, you would probably have better luck looking for them on the regional boards since the answers will vary from one place to another.

The question isn't really whether you can beat the rap or not, it's what is the best way not to get arrested.

Almost every response post regarding this issue throughout this board has included the advice that if you research and prepare through TER and sites like it, you will reduce your chance of being popped.

Sidone is right on when he says that us lawyer types can't really help people evade the law, but I think that a very important aspect of a lot of these posts is the advice about what to do when you stumble into LE.  This is usually reduced to STFU, but I think it is always important to understand the reasons behind why so that Hobbyists don't think that they can just talk their way out of it.

Research is important because it will reduce the chance of stumbling into either an LE sting or surveillance when seeing a provider; or during a raid at a MP.  As you pointed out, local LE is really only going to care about morality based crimes when they are getting complaints from citizens or politicians, have a slow period, or are trying to justify a grant through statistics. The Feds will only really be interested if there is a drug, underage, or illegal immigrant issue.  So if you stay away from situations that involve those issues, then your chances of getting popped are reduced. That is where research comes in.

My impression of most of the posts from the creative or clever hypothetical guys is that they are very nervous about jumping in and are looking for that one thing that will give them hope that they are not going to get popped. Ultimately, they will have to accept that it is illegal in most jurisdictions, but it is the holding cell to be avoided more than the courtroom.

Great post.  

-- Modified on 2/6/2008 6:48:57 PM

I agree with what you are saying about LE in general. What really blew my mind, though,  was finding out how they operate sometimes. My best friend's brother is a cop in central florida (I won't say where exactly). He and his fellow officers seem to kind of get off on stings and arresting "johns" and especially gay men (Think Larry Craig from last year). He's often said to me that he loves arresting the sickos (uh, I don't believe most are. This isn't Dateline!) It always sounds more like a moral statement than actually protecting society or upholding the law. They'd be better off putting their resources towards drug dealers, rapists and murders than worrying about someone guy that just wants some fun. There are aspects to everything that aren't always great, including the hobby, but I believe the majority of guys (especially here) just want some company, not get into drugs, gangs or kiddie porn, which seems to be the impression of some LE.

Except for a few counties in Nevada.  And, from what I hear, expect to pay triple!  As for LE, they need to be taken into account always.  Ever been in a strip club during a raid?  Been there, done that, not cool!  And please use your head about drinking during sessions...this comment is to everyone who reads this, not to the original poster in particular.  Personally, this is the one issue that has caused problems for me in the hobby...DUI checkpoints.  This is a far higher priority in the eyes of LE, and this needs to be taken into account when playing this game!  So often I hear about guys insisting about bringing the wine...do you realize that this may be the main risk???

Crazy Diamond, Although I haven't been to a legal brothel in Nevada in about 10 years I did go 5 or so times back in the 90's. The most I've ever paid is $140 & most of the time it was $100. Now I'm sure it's gone up since I've been there, but my secret was to go in the middle of the night {around 4 or 5 am} on a weekday {M-Th}. They wake the 'girls' up for the 'line-up' & once there awake I guess they figure anything is better than nothing. Only once did a lady refuse my Max offer of $140 {she wanted $350 for 50/50 but said $175 for one or the other}. I refussed & she went & got one of her friends for me. Now were not talking spending much time with these ladies but still I think 3 times the 'escort rate' is way high. Oh & if you pick a lady that's already up & 'on duty' in the bar it can be inexpensive. I always went to the one's in Pharump, Nevada.... Everyone should try this at least once.  Bill