This turned into a great thread. The provider (feminine) perspective makes for provocative discussion, thanks Haley, Victoria and Betty, I'd love to meet each of you but geography still a barrier. Showing affection and caring at all points in a relationship is what fosters love and not so coincidently great love making. Ladybird Johnson once said something like, "The key to a good relationship is giving 75% of the time and taking 25% of the time" When you give to someone you love you get so much from making her/him happy that there is far more than a 100% to receive.
Been months in the making... It is frustrating that she has time for 1000 other things but none for us. Honestly, if it was happening at home, I'd not be paying for playing.
I have a pretty good O out of it... but I know our timing is just off & she's not getting what she used to out of it. This is disappointing to me because I wanbt to be a good lover with whomever I am with. I blame the bad timing on lack of practice, pure & simple. At this point it's a vicious circle. I don't know why she doesn't get it. She rebuffs my attempts to talk about it.
in a relationship. It's hard to read your partners mind and frustrating not to get feedback. Do you still take time to date and do fun things together ? How long have you been married ?
I use to have this saying touch me in the morning make love to me in the evening. Foreplay should last all day in little ways that lead to making love. For some it may be once a week or as often as is comfortable but It's a lot of little things that lead to making love. Do you kiss good-bye and still hold hands. Is there a way to start flirting. The spark can come back but both need to work at it. Take a good look at your daily interaction with your wife and see how you can make her notice you more.
Kisses Haley
wow great topic I have been watching my younger brother 54 and the greatest husband a woman could ask for and he is attractive and a kind man he has done every thing right but the wife just does not want him that way and it breaks my heart its not him its her and yet he still loves her and would never leave her every night for tha last yr we have talked trying to give him advice on how to win her love back I just want him happy again but honestly I do not feel there is anything he can do .....the hobby is not an option .....when a woman decides she is done game over.......I wish he would leave her and find someone that would love him but he keeps hoping she will come around ..... she has something so special that most women would die for a devoted faithful husband and he gets nothing not even a good friend why is it so hared for him to leave no sex this yr nothing I want so much for him to be happy
azvictoria, that sounds like the old me... I was "all in" with my ex... turns out I was a solution to her financial problems. I tried everything to make her love me back. She always treated me badly & got worse after the cash ran out. She acted out until I could not take it anymore, ending the 5 year disaster & bankrupsie.
My (present) wife & I began on the wrong foot. I played second fiddle to her children until they left the house... maybe still am... grandchildren among her many interests. I am over 60 & we've been married over 20 years. She does not like touching of any kind. Claims everything tickles & jumps away. I do miss the contact. She changes in the bathoom or walk in closet. Does not own a bra with cups? We've never had sex except late at night when we are both exhausted.
Her chilrden were around 8 when we married. The girl announced that she could hear everything we said or did in our bedroom & proceeded to stay up until after we were asleep. We never had sex with the children at home after that.
I think she has a very low sex drive... I did not understand the information I had access to. She did not have sex or masterbate during the several years after her first husband passed tragically. She seems to enjoy sex when we do... but would never think of it on her own.
I have medical issues... which will in all likelihood eventually take my ability to function sexually. About 5 years ago, I realized that the menu was shrinking & there were things I had never experienced & I wanted to... and the only way I would is if I went outside. So I did.
I have been trying to increase intimacy... (besides sex) Not very successful but something is better than nothing. I am not going to stop trying. During the period of my occasional hobbying, once a month or so, I feel our intimacy has continued to decrease. Unintended, if predictable, consequences? or just a continuation of what was already happening?
Women, other than providers, do not understand a man's sexual needs... or choose to ignore them... and then the guys are dogs. I know some guys just like the variety... but not all. No, women... nor men... can not turn back the clock & make themselves 21 again... but being available would go a long way for a lot of guys. My Fav ladies are not "young things" but they accept me as I am... and as one said to me when I described my issues in a moment of honesty, "will do what ever it takes" & "will not quit".
H
and that is it takes practice to have sex good sex with someone, even a spouse. You can lose sexual compatibility even with someone you've been married to for decades if you neglect sex for too long.
I went through this with my wife, even though we'd been dating or married for a total of 15 years. After nearly a year with no sex, when she wanted to have sex again it felt awkward and uncomfortable, even though we'd had sex thousands of times before. The flame had gone out and it couldn't be restarted- too much time had gone by with us just being platonic friends sharing a bed.
As for communication with spouses, I think I'm pretty typical of most men when I say I've told escorts, GFs, and everyone on TER, things I could never tell my wife about sex. I regret that in retrospect, but a marriage is always a balancing act, and no guy wants his wife to run out of the room thinking he's a pervert if he suggests they try anal sex, for example. So to avoid having that conversation at the breakfast table the next morning, most husbands and wives never express their deepest desires, which is really a shame. They live in a middle-of-the-road world of vanilla, and eventually that gets boring. In my case, I never realized my wife wanted to try bondage until after we were separated. I think she gave me some hints, but I only saw them in retrospect.
So the irony of marriage is you often shield the person you're closest to from your true feelings and desires for fear of their reaction to your honesty.
Sure, it is a lot of work getting things going again but saving a marriage and family is worth it to most. I love to cuddle and kiss and most women would to if given the chance but they get out of practice. Bring back communication and sex is not to far behind.
Many women have fantasies that are never spoken for the same reason a husband never expresses desire for something different. Talk during sex for some is non-existent. Talking about or telling your partner just little snippets of how good he/she is making them feel can lead to more open sexual communication. Dirty talk doesn't have to be nasty with four letter words but simple little things like "I like the way you touch me" or "you can do more of that" or even "that feels so good". Sex should be fun
Kisses Haley
sex is the most fun you can have without laughing....and sometimes you laugh too
I guess it's a little late for me to be involved with that board but looks like there's 5 good years of reading to do. I noticed many members from this board posted there. This will give me a better chance of knowing my new friends.
Thanks again
Kisses Haley
When I would bring up the fact that I wanted to try more things in the bedroom besides "Wham bam thankyou Ma'am"... he became extremely defensive. And NO I did not say it this way. I said it as nicely as I could while walking on the egg shells I had grown accustomed to tip toeing on over the years.
I know that women get blamed for the lack of sex in a relationship much more often than men do. That being said, from my own personal experience, he was the one who was not open to trying new things in the bedroom. I know my experience does not reflect others. But it may sound familiar to some.
The main piece of advice I can give any man is similar to what Haley already posted. I just say it differently..."If you want to love me in the bedroom, you need to love me out of it first." Definition: If you want to have sex with me, try kissing me, flriting with me, stroking my back or anything to let me know that you love me. Then I will want to have sex with you! Or course this goes both ways. Also if the man I am with shows me how horny he is for me all the time, it turns me on like crazy. Knowing someone desires you is very powerful.
When I was married, my ex pushed me away almost every single time I tried to kiss him. He did not like to kiss...he did not like to hold hands...he did not like to touch...he did not give me oral EVER. Not ever...not even one time. But he loved to watch porn, get a BJ and fuck. Never caring whether I came or not. So most times I did not cum while having sex with him. I took care of that myself afterwards or another time when I was alone. It was a very lonely time for me.
The MANY times I brought it up how unhappy I was with our sex life, his comment was always the same.... You knew who I was and how I am when you married me. I am who I am. If you don't like it, leave. Consequently, after being told this numerous times, I finally did leave. He begged for me to come back. But once I was out, I was FREE! I had the best time of my life! I am still having it! Being a provider allows me to sew all the wild oats I was never able to sew before. I have experienced almost every single sexual fantasy I ever had! And now I am coming up with new ones!
Enough about my story. I only shared a part of it here to give you an understanding of where I am coming from. Because my past strongly dictates my opinions regarding sex while married. I think men need more than one partner. I know they do. It is an inherent instinct for men to "Divide and Conquer!" I say this in a silly way. But I truly believe it. I think men can love one woman and be loyal to her. Loyal to their love. That being said, on the flip side, I think being faithful to one woman is too much to ask. Men need variety. That is my opinion. So regardless of the sex life a man has at home, his natural instincts will make him want other women. Wanting other women does not make men bad. They are men. This is how it is. IMHO
In my opinon we are all guilty of becoming complacent in our relationships after spending long periods of time together. It's not her fault. It's not his fault. We just get bored. I think spicing things up by trying new sexual positions and toys is one good way to rekindle that spark. Another way is to role play. Another way is to have sex outdoors. Like in a tent where you may be heard. My favorite way to spice things up is to bring another lady into the mix! Most women fantasize about being with another woman. I know I did. If you gradually enter this idea into conversations over and over again you might be surprised to find that your wife is open to try it with you. You can say it jokingly at first to see what she says. Just feel her out. Pay close attention to her reaction. Get some porn that shows people having threesomes. You never know until you try. Most importantly make it about her and you. It must not be about you. Sorry...that's the truth of it. If you make it about her and your relationship with her she will trust it more.
On final thing....during my divorce my ex and I sat with a mediator. It was the best money we spent on the entire divorce. A part of me feels if we would have done that first, maybe there would have been some way of saving our marriage. It was the first time we spoke honestly and plainly to one another in a long time. If you cannot speak openly and honestly with your wife, I highly recommend seeing a marriage counselor. There is no shame in it. You both may be surprised at how close it brings you back to one another.
I have gone on long enough. I am certain not everyone will agree with my opinion. But that's why we're all here...to share our opinions and learn from others.
Love and Hugs, Betty xoxo
I got the best early Christmas present this morning my brother called and after a long unhappy year of rejection and pain she and he had a break through I think she finally saw that she was killing him slowly and their love ......they taked it through and best thing ever he got laid ...I asked him did you feel she was just doing it for you? and he said no we made LOVE....he told her this morning I feel like a man again ! He was so happy its has been a very long stressful time for him I pray this is a turning point in their lives but to see him so full of joy agian is the best gift anyone could of given me for Christmas I prayed for this and God answered my prayers this was a very tough case so it shows me their is hope for everyone going through is ......now let's see if they can make it last ......Merry christmas everyone the only thing I wanted I got ! There is a Santa Claus
Dear Victoria:
Although you discuss how you brother is still viral and interested sexually in his wife, what exactly are the issues that inhibit his wife? I was wondering what types of conversations you had if any and could it be just lack of interest or could if be that she hasn't had any energy? Obviously there has to be an attributing factor that has led to her withdrawal. Although she is starting to be more receptive to his advances and certainly starting to do a lot of the things Stevie Wonder alludes to in his songs, are you bold enough to ask here is the excitement of love really there for her anymore? I am also wondering if it is harmonal or has she just lost interest. This is what makes the contrast interesting because we are on a board where most of the women can get enough of sex and intimacy such as yourself and yet and still there are woman who in some ways are nearly closer to nuns than we realize for various reasons. I am sure that you talk to your brother all of the time but the next question is when did he see her romantic and libidinal withdrawal manifest itself. Also he was active but for the new year let see how committed she is by the way she dresses and the way that she acts. Then you know psychologically,romantically and sexually she really would have returned from the nadir of her sexual life.
all valid questions regarding her she had 4 children loved being a mom more than a wife she was never very sexual but the biggest problem is she was {is} a beautiful woman that is aging quickly and has always been vain about her looks but time has not been her friend her looks are going quickly and they do not have the money to spend on upkeep as some of us women do he loves her no matter what...... she has the problem and was pushing him away ....I hope she now knows it would be a huge loss to lose someone that loves her no matter what I will keep you all posted as the new year comes around it will be interesting to see if she can love again and learn to treat him the way he deserves to be treated
Yes, sex takes practice... & open mindedness. We even attended an intimacy seminar for those with this spinal cord injury. Hosted at a resturant with very red-faced wait staff, I might add. They suggested to consider anything sexual... petting, kissing, touching, stroking, BJ, intercourse... all give sexual pleasure... consider them all as "sex".
I was a selfish lover as a younger man but I left that behind long ago. I will please my partner any way I can. I can get lost in pleasing a partner. For instance: 1) I had a FBSM lady's breast in my mouth, playing with my tonge (sorry, I'm not going to give away all my trade secrets) & she came with me. 2) I went down on a Fav lady... I do not "give her an O" or "make her O". I am the motor & she is the driver... When she came back down, she exclaimed "If you do that again, I'll have to pay You!" 3) I went down on another Fav lady, honestly her eyes rolled back & she gripped my head with her thighs like jaws... I love pleassing a partner.
I do not hold back with any partner, even the wife. She is rather like a cold fish, just laying there (letting me do whatever, not initiating or directing at all)... or a sponge... soaking up everything I give, enjoying it but putting little effort into it.
I read recently that guys & gals are wired differently... guys are wired so the show love through sex (outside of providers). Gals are wired to permit sex because of love. Frankly, I'm not feeling much loved...
I finially got the wife to not jump up & bolt for the bathroom post sex, had to get her to lie with me for even 60 seconds, with my hand on her chest, over her heart. (It's interesting to feel the heartbeats adjust to coincide.)
H
On the subject of counciling... I insisted in couciling with my ex (wife#1)... I was all in, emotionally, financially... I did not have the money and went low budget. Horrible mistake & a total waste of time. All the meetingswere joint. She was not truthful then as she had never been with me. The marriage was her solution to her money problems... until my partners decided to sell the business & I was 1.4 (million) short to buy them out. We burned through my payout in 18 months. Then she had no reason to pretend any more.
After I was out of the house, I went to a high priced psychologist... the plan was for a few individual meetings with each of us before a joint meeting. Thankfully she went to her meeting... at the very first, she stated that she no longer wanted to me married to me... & gave the psychologist permission to tell me exactly that. My next session was very short!
In retrospect, the marriage should not have taken place. If she had been truthful, it would not have. She gave up just enough sex (ave once a month) to lead me on... until the money ran out.
In my opinion, the budget approach to marriage conciling just extended the pain. A skilled professional got to the heart of the matter & I paid for the sessions though it took me a while to do so. Worth every penny.
I do not feel that it is inevitable for all guys to cheat. I think for far too many wives, sex is a tool to get what they want. Have sex to get hook the guy to get married. Have sex to get their babies. Other than that, they don't want it. I think the way to keep your man at home is to have sex... often. different activities. different positions. There may be reasons as we age, some positions may not work. Keep trying, find others. I read the ivillage (cosmo) & can find new positions that work. I love CG (wife did a couple of times a couple of years ago, refused since), I want to try a chair... a Fav lady recently started in her shower, finished on her bed but I throughly enjoyed it. (There are suction cup grab handles available that really work. Mommy's Helper Safer Grip" 11.5" #40524 from Amazon.com for $11.73... even cheaper at WalMart Pharmacy section. I've not been able to dislodge the one in my shower in 6 months but detaches easily when desired. I bought 2 more for my travel kit!)
H
It's called Kosher Adultery and its written by a Rabbi named Shmuley Boteach. Amazing - despite its title and the background of the author it is a book that I think those of us, women as well as men, of any religion can learn from and benefit from. The basic premise is to create the emotions within your marriage to have an affair ..... with your spouse. Quite a read. My wife partner of 41 years and I are still working on it and it isn't easy to rebuild what was once there. In the meantime, I ...... (no, that's for a different topic)
Ladies and gents on this post - what great, insightful and practical comments. Victoria - I AM HAPPY FOR YOU!
Hopefully we will all be inspired by the source of your joy. 
This turned into a great thread. The provider (feminine) perspective makes for provocative discussion, thanks Haley, Victoria and Betty, I'd love to meet each of you but geography still a barrier. Showing affection and caring at all points in a relationship is what fosters love and not so coincidently great love making. Ladybird Johnson once said something like, "The key to a good relationship is giving 75% of the time and taking 25% of the time" When you give to someone you love you get so much from making her/him happy that there is far more than a 100% to receive.
my sexual abilities but also my ability to move around independantly. The way things are progressing the second may happen sooner than the first.
I will have... for better or for worse... a life after my time as a hobbiest. I am not passing up any opportunity to increase intimacy.
H
I am sorry to hear of your illness. You are a brave man, although I am sure this was forced upon you. I hope the progression of your illness is a slow one and that you have infinite number of opportunities to enjoy intimacy in the New Year and beyond.
I wanted to jump in on the thread because there is great info in the topic for everyone. My wife until the last couple of years was big time into sex-positions-places-instigate-etc... and at age 60 - after a late menopaus-began to experience a severely dry vagina-lubrication, therapy, exercises, pills, etc...provided no relief and it has gotten to the point that no insertion is possible-even her Dr. has trouble performing a normal examination. It has been emotionally difficult for her-I am very empathetic and we enjoy fulfilment on my part from the wide variety of things a woman can do to a man-she is so sensitive that she can barely stand cunnilingus-very gently performed and only at certain times of the month-my point is that I think this may bother women more than men who suffer from ED-there are corrective measures for all but the most severe ED issues-but a woman who is still beautiful, thin, sexy in appearance who has been highly sexually active for years I think struggles more-coupled with all the other emotional stuff women typically have to deal with-so I simply wanted to bring this up from a personal experience stand point-I still like to have regular intercourse-I would never throw this up to my wife-but we are what we are and it is what it is!! So I who have hobbied forever continue to do so even more carefully in an effort to avoid being caught!
Thanks! You have PM-Merry Christmas !
Too late to get it into her stocking... I'll look into it, she does use tube or bottle lube. If I'm lucky she does not use so much that there's NO FRICTION!
H
HarborView.
Sounds like you and I are on the same track only for different health reasons. I would like to discuss our situations with you offline. If you want to, you can contact me at:
Huggy(dot)Bear1200@gmail(dot)com