...Wow, I'm at a lost for words!  What legal rulings, precedents allow for what I would call an extreme abuse of privacy!  What is the purpose of releasing the client list?  The clients were not caught in the act so what are the legal reasons for releasing the list?!?!

What does the Hobby community do to come up with means to ensure privacy and proper screening?  Would/Can P411 get busted and have to release their client/member lists?

They higlighted several high profile individuals i.e. a former mayor, who are "fucked," pun intended, cause all they did was contract for some pussy between two consenting adults.

It's a little soon to fly off regarding this case. Are you reacting to the end result or the reasons behind it?

Then I must point out you're attributing a local jurisprudential action as if it will become national policy. There are numerous legal actions like this on a monthly basis which don't get past the local news and client lists are not released. In actually, it's the exception statistically not the rule, it's just when it does happen it's more spectacular and the media gets more mileage out it.

As for what the industry will do?  Nothing. Rail as you will, however industry paradigms will continue until met equal and opposite paradigm shift.  

I'm not seeing that here. What I am seeing so far in this case and Fantasys! is watching it closely... is a small  New England town ( Population about 11K out of season) politics combined with the titillation of something juicy to report other than Obama /Romney and the economy.


This too shall pass, watch.

However, let the panic and the raging begin....


Sincerely,

Lee Dreams
comede, bibe, gaude

END OF MESSAGE

If anyone's really THAT scared/worried...then they should be doing other things.

I have no issue with what I do or why I do it.  Things like this -- hobbying, drinking, gambling, etc...if you are that worried about it...maybe it ain't the thing for you.

There is another thread on this page where a hobbyist had complaints about an agency because they were seemingly too strict with their contact rules, which they use as their operating policy out of a sense of caution and paranoia. Doesn't the client reserve the right to be just as paranoid?

Maybe one out 100 busts do the client lists get published, maybe 1 out of 1000. Your opinion would change pretty quickly when you happen to be on that one list. And even though it might blow over in terms of media coverage, do you think your family and friends will ever forget?

I'm sure Monica Lewinski is a lovely person with a good work ethic, but what do you think is on someone's mind if she were to interview for a job? Sometimes a mistake can follow you forever.

Screening is a necessity, I'm not advocating getting rid of the process. And I'm not sure there's a good alternative that keeps both parties safe. If you're going to be in this game, it's probably a good idea to use a hobby phone so at least some of the contact info isn't traceable to you, and prepare your shocked and appalled look for the eventual confrontation.

But this move is total bullshit, it's legal heresay at best (unless you can make out faces in the videos). It's nothing more than a push for ratings and sales, under the guise of justice, backed by religious ideals that attempt to intervene between consenting adults.

-- Modified on 10/17/2012 4:06:40 PM

As a stand alone comment we agree conceptually  on the "ouch" part and it doesn't change the reality it will pass no the less.

Case in point Elliot Spitzer getting his own show on the Al Gore's social progressive cable network Current and Ashley Depree attempt at 12 seconds of fame in the music industry. Then there is  the Washington DC Madam's Deborah Jeane Palfrey, it definitely passed for her ending in her "alleged" suicide.

Now taking your comment in relation to my other key points..... Cute, a non-sequitur wrapped in a reframe.

After 17 plus years, for me this is like sex with a good woman for that long, you come to know her every response to every caress. This whole Zumba Madam thing will barely register as a ripple from an industry prospective. Nothing MEANINGFUL will change.

Watch....

Regardless, I acknowledge your statement and I wasn't being cavalier {shoulder shrug} time will tell wont it ?



Sincerely,

Lee Dreams
comede, bibe, gaude

It's a little disingenuous to claim a right to privacy when engaging in what is a violation of state or local law.  Would a bank robber be immune from arrest or identity disclosure simply because he robbed the bank behind closed doors?

Surely, this is a risk one takes when engaging in the hobby and while I agree that public disclosure is often horrible in its consequences, short term and long term, nobody really has a legitimate argument that he or she should be shielded from public scrutiny if caught at it.

The Declaration of Independence, covers this one rather succinctly:
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

If that makes him happy then by all means have at, besides I tend to follow the philosophy:
"Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they are not out to get you."I'm going to interpret this as you mean me personally? ( If I'm wrong I apologize in advance )
No it would not change, the phrase "been there done that" applies.  All I will say is Operation Flea Collar was a pain in my ass. I wasn't arrested because of the strict procedures and polices we had, but it did take me a few years to completely scrub myself from the net. Contrary to popular belief it can be done over time and with enough juice. The caveat being you're not infamous with a sex tape or taking a nice Friday afternoon drive in June down the I-405 Freeway in California in 1994 with several police cars, news Helicopters trailing behind you.Easy.. I wonder if she swallows... No seriously I do wonder or is it a "negative trigger" for her now?
I do know she still makes interesting handbags via her company The Real Monica Inc. and lives in NYC now.  Yea I know TMI.Didn't think you were. If you did, well hey that's your right.

Hobby phone works best in vouching situations not all actual screening situations there is a quantitative difference between the two methods.. FYI. Yes, well 100 hours of video will do that.OH!! So you've lived in New England have you?
Yea that about sums it up alright.


Sincerely,

Lee Dreams
comede, bibe, gaude




-- Modified on 10/17/2012 5:03:44 PM

The police did not get full names, including middle initials, and full home addresses from the lady's little black book. They sat outside the place and photographed license plates.

Even though you seem to have a more personal experience in this matter, one that I hope I'll never know. Hey I'm an American, it's my trademark to make uninformed decisions based on rash assumptions.

But it's good to hear your honest perspective, gives me some comfort that if I do end up on a list that goes public, maybe it's not as bad as I think. Thanks,

-e

...We see you plastered on the 6 o'clock news for solicitation.  Who knows you may be crying like a bitch as they load you into the squad car.

...does video taping a guy leaving a Zumba studio constitute solicitation?

...does being video taped fucking some girl constitute solicitation?

END OF MESSAGE

Does anyone remember the whole Frederick Black Book situation?


These things can be released or at last made available to those who want to see it.   Just imagine the situation of the agency that asks for part of your SSN ever gets busted.

to an independent or an agency, you are a Fool.  There are alternative methods of screening for safety, or just move on ...   that philosophy has worked well for me, and I sleep soundly at night ...

You should not, and this case is just ONE of many reasons

In the ever raging debate of Agency Vs. Indy that we always see posted every few months, one of the reasoning for Indy was extremely unlikely, they will get busted and leak their client list.

Well, I guess this case kill that reason.

Do not give your info to ANYONE. Usually people that do have no good jobs or reputation.
The escorts that see them are not worth seeing, because they only see ghettos

What is her profile number, or where is a link to her reviews?

But the prostitute apparently kept detailed records of client transactions and services performed. THAT is what enabled police to charge the men with a crime (misdemeanor though it may be), which in turn is what allowed them to release the names of said clients.
They have not released the entire list yet (that's my impression, I could be wrong)
They have released the names of those that have had charges filed, which is standard practice and public record.
Shitty as it may be, they have done nothing out of the ordinary. It's just blown up into such a huge scandal, that it's front page news.  Read the police blotter in the paper sometime, you will see names of everyone arrested, same as these gentlemen. It's just that every fist fight, domestic dispute and petty theft doesn't make for juicy news stories.

If you wanna be mad at someone, be mad at Ms. Wright for being so careless (or her ulterior motives) in keeping detailed records of illegal activity, and videotaping/posting her clients without consent.

-- Modified on 10/20/2012 8:56:26 PM