The number one thing I hear as a provider, from married men that I see, is that their wives are no longer interested in sex.  I always feel badly for BOTH parties, that they are missing out on one of the most wonderful aspects of life!  I've always wondered if in these relationships........was there once good sex?  Or has it always been more of a one way street?

As a side note.........I have been on both sides of the subject.  I had been married for many years and during those years was totally disinterested in sex.  I denied my hubby for very long periods of time.  Somewhere along the line I had an "awakening" (thank god!) and now I LOVE sex!  I always say that I've lived my life backwards.......but that is not a bad thing at all!

In my case, there's still good sex with the wife. I hobby to experience a different facet of life. When I check out, I don't want to be saying, "Man! I wish I'd...."

been married 4 times; 3 of the four lost interest in passionate sex fast.  I can't figure it. LG - what's the reason?

I think you're right, Turkana,

It may also be that you are helplessly attracted to women who lose interest in ANY man they have sex with beyond the first 1-1.5 years of fullblown passion. From personal and from professional experience with therapy clients, it appears to be a pattern more so ruled by biology than anything else - barring abuse and wanting out of the relationship altogether.

Many times, it seems to me that women truly WANT to be turned on by the person they're married to, but their brains simply will not cooperate. Men have an easier time getting aroused over and over by the same person for a longer period of time, what with all the testosterone they are endowed with. With women, it seems Mother Nature has played a cruel trick on us. We seem to go along with the sexual program for just about enough time it takes to get pregnant...a few months to max two years. And the sad thing is, that even if a pregnancy doesn't occur, the lust can go away regardless.

And of course, it becomes a chore trying to get sexed up. And so, after some time, most women give up. The whole issue ceases to be important, much to the consternation and frustration of an uncomprehending hubby or partner.

If it were as easy as just dosing up yer wifey with some extra T, that would be one thing. But studies have shown that providing women with testosterone gel or patches doesn't necessarily increase desire to copulate. Actually, I can disclose that I tried some compounded testosterone gel myself. Can't say it worked, in the sense that I didn't notice wanting to jump every cute guy just because I shmeared some extra T-gel down there. And I went right to the source! I did get some juicy zits on my chin though, which wasn't too attractive. Same with DHEA, that's been touted as a sexual stimulant hormone for women. I can attest to the fact that looking blemish-free and good is a much bigger sexual aid for women than most things that come in a pill.

With women, it has to happen in the brain before it happens anywhere else. And again, I don't believe any one particular hormone or substance is the answer. That's why Pfizer stopped their Viagra-for-women trials - they didn't lead to any satisfactory overall results.

So I guess we're back to that "rekindling old magic" syndrome again. For some men, going through the motions with flowers, vacations, bubble bath, couples massages, etc. to spark some uxorious interest may be worth the trouble. Others just accept the status quo and suffer in silence. And then there are the TER guys...anyone in the room we recognize?

Take care, Turkana and see you on these hallowed boards,
the Love Goddess

I can attest to the pattern that LG has described here.  I've tried everything and then tried again and again.  The caring and love (platonic) is strong in my marriage.  The sex is almost totally gone.

The hobby is the answer to my sanity and to saving an otherwise strong marriage with kids to protect and nurture.  Its not the perfect situation but I accept it because I love my wife and kids and would not want to destroy my home life.  Besides, there is no guarantee that if I left home that I'd not end up with the same situation down the line with some other S.O. who would eventually lose her sexual interest.  Then where am I?

The hobby is a workable solution for me.

-- Modified on 3/25/2007 5:24:35 AM

there are as many reasons for hobbying as there are guys, I'm sure. In my case, it's been a long marriage that started nova hot, got hotter, then cooled to Arctic conditions. The wife is still insterested in sex, but it became very boring. It was the same thing over and over. additionally, as we grew older, she started turning into her mother, and I couldn't stand it. Then, came the revelation, Hey, this life is going to be over before i know it, and I'm wasting time. So, I started out with definite objectives to try things I had never done, and did not expect to. Like Menage a trois. I want to go with no regrets

God just wanted to make sure that the gene pool was sufficently randomized.

To see what happens when it isn't, just take a gander at the British royal family.

It seem pretty universal around here, for obvious reasons, that the hobby is about the best solution to a sexless marriage.   It also seems that hobbiests in general are a bit more open minded than the general population. Since we have found a way to handle our frustrations, it would be reasonable to assume that we're happier than most others.    Unfortunately, we live in a society that absolutely worships rules and regulations. How many times have you heard it...Rule by law....we are a nation of laws....and so on.    Each time I come away from an illegal session with a provider, I lose a little more respect for those in power.   "The law is for your own good"....Really??   Seems that personal experience proves otherwise. How about you? Too bad religous fanatics and other assorted zealots can't understand the value of true freedom.   I realize a certain amount of regulation is indeed necessary, but we're so far over the top that we're about to implode upon ourselves.     Ok, I'll get off my soapbox now. lol.

-- Modified on 3/25/2007 10:38:52 AM

because you're making a lot of sense.  More people need to know about the senselessness of arbitrary rules regarding acts between consenting adults (or among, in the case of a menage a trois), and a lot of other things.  What is truly difficult about hobbying/providing is not acts of sex or touching, but ensuring the health, safety and security of providers and hobbyists, and elminating trafficking, coercion and abuse.  Those are the ugly aspects of the profession and they exist along with the great stuff.

eom

she is less often interested... not so much totally done as implied by no longer interested... I do hobby as a result of that, but have to say, when she is on, she will drain me - and far better at it than when we were both 19 years old... 36 years of marriage does improve some things.

I thought you married guys got laid every night! lol.  Variety is the spice of life.

Probably not in my lifetime.
But younger TER members may live to see it.

"never interested" like mine.
You don't know how lucky you are!

I would echo the same.  I think LG has "nailed it on the head" so to speak.

I must say I think sex for women is mostly procreational - whereas sex for men is probably more recreational.  The fact that women biologically, thru a finite reproductive period, tank their sex drive is completely consistent with that reproductive purpose.  Men on the otherhand, because they can procreate theoretically until their demise are therefore always "geared to get it".

The larger question is why does society put such a taboo on these liasons?  I believe this is primarily a cultural phenom, rather than anything that has a biological basis.

I'm new at this TER gig and also taking part in this "hobby."    At age 60, I've accomplished a lot in my personal life and in business.  I want to address the term "hobby" and also the feelings expressed around "it" and our behaviour as men.

We're all a product of the times we were born and raised in - and certainly how and what our parents taught and exposed us to.   Myself - I was raised in a conservative, loving home.  I went to church every Sunday and even read (gasp!) John Calvin!   Many of us here took vows that said we'd be faithful to our wives.  We didn't take vows that said "I'll be faithful as long as you give me enough pussy!"   Don't get me wrong, I'm not preaching because I recently broke my vows after 25 years of marriage and "that lack of pussy."   If we believed in those vows when we married and now see "providers" - we are cheaters - at least in the terminology we'd use 25 years ago when we married.  "Hobby?"  A very neutral and innocent sounding term applied to what we do....we see women who screw us for money.  We're paying for orgasms...and, of course, the fun we have on the way to getting them.   Is this wrong?  It depends upon that world you come from.  

For me..yes, it's wrong but I've done it anyway.  Why?  I wish there was more of an explanation than "just getting laid."   There isn't.   I have no sex life at home and the feeling of going insane was and is, worse than the feeling of cheating.    But as my Grandfather used to say.."boy, don't call a spade a spade..call it a fucking shovel!"    And our "fucking shovel" is this:  If you're married, and took vows, you're cheating.  A hobby it might be, but it's a hobby of paying another woman for sex.   And I'm doing it.

Thanks for letting me rant and preach.

Naive, I know, but: I don't understand any wife who is NOT interested in sex, would object to her hubby finding it elsewhere. Seriously, where is the logic in that? "I don't want chocolate cake, so you can't have any either--and don't even think about having some when I'm not around!"

I've seen another version of this with couples trying to lose weight: one will be successful at it and then the one that remains overweight will try to get him/her off their diet.

I would like to hear from anyone in a sexless marriage that approached their wife, talked it out and said. "If we are to stay together, I have to have sex--with SOMEONE. I'd prefer you, but I will go elsewhere."

Anyone??

It is a very interesting and complex mixture of thoughts, emotions and desires for me.  Intimacy is linked to sex within my being, and when the sex began to wane it also felt like the relationship, connection and intimacy suffered.  Did I still love my significant other? Yes...was I still dedicated to my financial and emotional committment to her? Yes....however, if I did not fullfill my need for sexual intimacy, with providers, my primary relationship would probably end, as I would take a on a full time lover, non-pro, and that would certainly threaten the existance of my primary relationship.  It's a compromise and I would rather have the sexual intimacy I desire with my significant other, however, it's not there for her, as it is for me.  So, I adapt and keep my Provider existence comparmentalized and seperate.
I have read, studied and meditated on the issues but do not have a simple answer....as Jung stated, sometimes the difficult issues are never resolved, we just learn to live with them, hopefully in a conscious way.  Dear Love Goddess, i adore your wisdom and experience....

Call it rationalization or any other term, but basically, I married a certain person, with certain attributes and traits that I found attractive enough to commit the remainder of my life to. As time went on, some of these traits changed (as did mine), some for the better, some for the worse. In the end, the person I 'cheated on' was not the person I married.            If marriage is viewed as a contract, as most of us see it, then the real question is 'who violated the terms first'?     I find it interesting to note that the couples I know who simply live together without marriage seem consistantly happier than the officially married ones.   Could it be that we, as humans, are simply not designed to be held to a rigid standard?     Oppression breeds comtempt?   Always wrong to cheat?   There isn't enough paper or computer memory to even begin to tackle that one!            To me, it's a very personal choice, guided by an infinite number of variables, no one can make it for me, and I cannot make it for anyone else, nor can I judge them for it.

-- Modified on 3/31/2007 1:54:55 PM

So you and many others are cheaters, as I was once as well.
I used the word BUT, to open up into the gray area
in that everything is not black and white,

Men get married in part, for access to sex,
Women get married, in part for access to security,
If people were to have been better educated upon
the subject of Love, Vows, commitment, and Law,
"before" marriages were to take place, I have the
feeling that many men, would respond with
Awww " Fuck It" and stay single, and see escorts
instead.
Another reason to chuckle, is that this country
was founded with the idea that each person was
entitled to freedom to believe as they chose,
There was a revolt, and war took place, so that those forefathers and generations to come, could
live in freedom, from unrepresented taxtation, religious
oppression, and many other rules, that were shoved
down the throats of the new world settlers.

Now take a good look at where we are at today,
and tell me that we have religious freedom,
and represented taxation, Gee the Congress, sure
is acting in my best interest, when they shove a new law in my face, that says I cannot screw someone and then because I am a caring person,
assist that woman, by giving her some cash,
But then again, many states say that a woman can
marry a guy, then shut off the sex, and if the
sucker gets caught helping another woman out,
then the wife can take the guy to the cleaners, and take him for everything he's got.

So what it boils down to, is that some fucking
idiots think that marriage is best for families,
and rules such as no cheating apply,
BUT a woman can use the no sex as a weapon, or
use some lame excuse, " she is no longer interested " and there is nothing wrong with her
actions!
But let you go and put your pecker into some other
woman who is interested in having sex with you!
and by gosh! You Sir are a cheating low life
S.O. B.!
Me? well I kicked the wife to the curb, and
got taken to the cleaners, but I am better off for
having had the courage to stand up for my needs,
Be they physical, emotional, or sexual, because
I Love ME! and my take on relationships is like this, if I am not getting what I Need, then I have
evey right to pull out and look elsewhere.
Because I come first, and if I care enough to share, then so too should the other party desire
for the same results, but If she says awww no, I
am not interested, then she can hit the road, as
life is short, and "I" have needs.
So If some hot babe wants to fuck me, because she
has needs, then my wife had better keep in mind,
that "I" am going to go where my needs are met!
Screw the idea of me having to keep up my end of the contract, but the other person can get lazy
or uninterested, and lay down on me, and expect that "I" should have to do without, while she receives the same benefits that are in place no
matter her actions?
I say, Good bye wife! and hello young hottie, who
needs what I have to offer.
Now if the wife can handle me and the young hottie
sharing in mutual pleasure, and not get bent out
of shape, then just maybe I have found a fair and
caring wife to love and cherish after all, in which case, I say Honey! I love you! and I am here
for you as well.
Fair is Fair and equal is balance, and that is
my take on the twists and turns of life.
Thanks for allowing me to share!

Wonder, your post is very well written, in explaining, who you were then, and what your needs
were, and that of your S.O. a well.
For me, it was the same, in that while I was married, and when I cheated, I had some very deep
feelings of guilt, so I bucked it up, and quit cheating, admited to my wrong doing to the S.O.
and faced the music.
Then after many years of not having my needs met,
I found the courage to finally leave the marriage,
because I felt as if she had in fact violated the
contract, and in fact was free loading off of
me.
I realized, that even though I loved her and my
children deeply, it was "I" who was getting cheated out of some of the greater joys of life,
So it became a question of, "just becaue she had
lost interest" does this mean that I should suffer
in silence, and love myself less?
For me the answer became quite clear, It was OK
for me to be selfish, and divorce, after all I am
the one who is responsible for my happiness, and
she is responisble for hers.
There are so many variables, but when one strips
away all of the confusion, it becomes quite clear, to me, I can only make myself happy.
And only I can "love and accept me" and what it is
that I need from life.

OK, to be brief, yes I attempted to go that route,
But first let me say something, she used to say she was not interested, and I would threaten to
go elsewhere, and she would reply, Go right ahead!

Then I did sit and talk it out with her, and she
said, if you do so, then we are over with!
Then it became, Why do you want sex so badly?
Then she had me go to therapy, cause I was a Sex
Addict? then when it was found out that I was not
an a sex pervet (her words). I finally gave up,
and did without sex for 2 years, and you know what?
She then accused me of cheating on her!
So I made an appointment with a lawyer, and filed
for divorce.
Funny thing is, that as we were going thru the
divorce battle, I came to find out that she, who
was not interested in sex, was hiding a year long
affair with another man, LOL, and no doubt that
she has had others before the last one, which
resulted in her getting pregnant. LOL
Had to get married right after our divorce was
final. LOL

eom