As a married man, I just do not see how I can continue. I have had some success, but the more ladies I communicate with and encounter from the site, the more it seems to me that relying on 20-year old struggling hotties with loose morals for discretion just seems more and more like a bad idea. It only takes one BSC girl to blackmail or out you if she feels slighted or rejected. The risk seems exponentially higher than with professionals.
Am I overreacting? How are the other married SDs dealing with this reality?I’ve had “arrangements” before, but they all end up becoming too time consuming for me. I was scheduled to meet up with a beautiful young POT SB tomorrow night. I just cancelled it, and set up an outcall to my hotel with a well reviewed escort that I’ve seen before. Bottom line is I just want room service sex lol. I don’t want to dress up and go to dinner with a POT SB. It sounded like a great idea at first, but I’ve got a hectic day and I much prefer to stay in and enjoy some bcd with a known lady that will disappear when I’m thru. No driving, no restaurants, no texts, no phone calls, no emergencies etc. While I’m intrigued and fantasize about dating a SB, escorts seem to be a better fit for me at this time.
Maybe I’ll try this when I retire and have more time to invest in the sugar bowl.
I had several SBs when single but got married and have stayed in the professional world since then -- it is anonymous.
IMHO, SB world is too unstable for married guys -- you can be seen together, she can tell her friends or if she gets angry or is out to blackmail in the first place, it is just not worth it.
Plus, frankly, I dont have time for SBs anymore. the one hour date is now all I can afford, time wise.
One exception -- if you are *continuing* with a long-term SB that might be different as the level of trust may already be high.
You have come to see the fundamental difference between sugar dating and hookers.
Sugar Dating is DATING. Dating means some level of emotional attachment, some level of ongoing meetings, and some level of time spent outside the bedroom. Hiring a pro means none of that. It means she or you show up on schedule, you get busy and you go your separate way. You may repeat in the future if YOU decide you want to, or you may forget she exists with no worries about hurt feelings, BSC's showing up at your door on Christmas, or 3 am texts begging for help when she crashes her car.
If you are married, or in a monogamous (i.e.: not "open") relationship, dating another women is problematic at best. At worst, it's a potential cause for serious drama, divorce, fights, personal injury, destruction or loss of personal property and assets, and more. It matters not that the nature of dates in the Sugar Bowl involves structured allowance. I suggest that you would have the same potential for frustration and grief if you were dating/having an affair with a woman you met at work, a gym, a bar, a party, your neighborhood, etc.
Sadly, I see far too many want-to-be Daddies here who fail to understand this. They think that a Sugar Baby is just an UTR hooker and can be "booked" for an hour or for some menu of sexual acts. These gents tend to be the ones who post here that they are frustrated with the process, the time required to get to BCD, the scammers that show up, the inarticulate message that gets them banned, and lack of clarity about how (or IF) they get laid. That is what hookers are for. To cite the old joke:
You don't pay a hooker for sex, you pay her to LEAVE.
So, no. You are not overreacting. You are realizing that given your personal situation, you will get more value from your money by hiring a pro than you will by dating another woman.
No judgements here. It's all about consenting adults. For myself, when I have been in a monogamous relationship I haven't "cheated" - except that one time in college. :p But since college, I have left monogamous relationships, or declined to enter one, when I knew I wanted to have sex with other people. That means for the last 30 years, I've been able to have sex with multiple hookers, Sugar Babies and "regular" women without ever worrying about lying to a SO or feeling guilty for getting away with cheating. And that's allowed me to fuck literally hundreds of women, across 29 countries, and without fearing repercussions if the "old ball and chain" found out. (Not as many a GaGa, but he's got a decade on me and admittedly better game.)
Life is good
The Cat
Yes to all this, but it's especially true that many believe they can get a "discount" on hot young SBs from high end escort prices. While that may be true in many instances, there are other "costs," as you adroitly point out.
I recognized from the very beginning that being a Sugar Daddy, attempting to be a Sugar Daddy, or even considering a Sugar Daddy arrangement are not right for me, not only due to any primary relationship(s) I have, but also due to not wanting nor seeking anything permanent with some woman. I have come to terms with the reality that I'm not going to "dock my ship in one single port and be satisfied with it". I have far too many interests, attractions and desires toward women in general, so sticking to one woman or sticking with one woman is only a temporary thing with me, thereby defeating the purpose of me even getting into any "monogamous" or "expectedly monogamous" situation in the first place. I prefer and/or would prefer not to tell lies and sneak around in order to get laid, and I neither want nor need the mountain of drama associated with an exclusive relationship with a woman.
The best option for me is the "hit it and quit it" approach. Juggling a Sugar Baby or multiple Sugar Babies seems like a balancing act between the provider option and the relationship option. One foot is in each of the two worlds, yet it's difficult to stand up or stand still or move in any good direction. Additionally, I don't want the responsibility of "raising" a baby. I have little patience to listen to the sob stories, especially when my number 1 goal is to get laid, and I'm not going to hold her hand and guide her through life. There seems to be an intentional and accepted bait-and-switch aspect built into SB/SD play, just like in civvie dating, wherein the man jumps through hoops just to see if he can impress her enough that they'll eventually end up naked and sweaty together. Of course, his wallet is on an I.V. drip while she makes her decision, and maybe some guy's don't mind that, but I certainly would.
I don't have a problem with anyone playing in the Sugar Bowl, it's none of my businees and it doesn't move my life in any direction one way or another. If you've taken a look at it and decided it's not for you, pull the ripcord. I don't think there's any "wrong" decision here.
even though I've talked about this before. Whether you are married or not, you can simply choose to be open and honest with the women in your life about your desire for sexual variety. My awesome wife and I are deeply in love, and have been married for a very long time. We communicate freely about our sexual desires and we both have other intimate relationships. Zero drama, jealousy or deceit. I'm good friends with her last BF. She's friends with my SBs. The SBs I date are all very comfortable knowing I'm married and NOT cheating or deceiving my wife. Many have met her and admire the marriage we have and have told me they hope to have that level of love and trust some day. 2 days from now I have another date scheduled with my incredibly beautiful 23yo SB. She's coming to my home. My wife will be home, discreetly keeping to herself in the other end of the house so that my SB and I can have some privacy. There is simply no need for the sort of "discretion" or "juggling" I read about in other posts here if you are simply honest with all your lovers. For any of you who may seriously be interested in this sort of lifestyle, it's called polyamory and I recommend reading "The Ethical Slut" a great intro to how it works. I'm happy to discuss this with anyone on this board, either publicly or privately.
PaPa Sweet,
Thanks for taking a deeper look at the poly lifestyle. This is exactly what I alluded to when I mentioned an "open" relationship, though I stopped short of naming it as Poly. I've dated an SB's who considered herself poly, as her parents are "poly" and her father is active in the "Black & Poly" advocacy groups online and that meet in various locations (pre-COVID) internationally. As you mention, it takes a lot of open communication and even more trust. I'd also suggest looking up the definition of the word "compersion" at the link attached...
My suggestion to the OP, and anyone else who posted here or reads this thread, is that each of us needs to first understand the differences between the monger and sugar worlds, then decide what, if any balance they want to maintain between the two, as well as any other sexual activities they embrace like, swinging, random pick ups, "affairs," etc. No judgement, of course. Do what works for you. For me, I prefer to spend most of my efforts and resources in the sugar bowl, balancing 2 to 3 current SB's, plus 3-5 "occasional" SB's, and with the occasional pro session (lately it's been KGirls) every 6 to 8 weeks as well.
Life is good
The Cat
It is not that simple and your situation is incredibly unique. We are all jealous and trust me, the best I can from my wife is her looking away and me being discreet...our version of "Don't ask don't tell".
I reentered the SUgar world when my wife and I suddenly decided to try something new in our lives while staying married. It started after a ménage-a-trois.
It requires honesty to the intent but not necessarily every detail.
It still requires commitment to the marriage. We have talked divorce for different reasons and come close, completely separate from the recent Crazy Ivan. This change may actually keep us together. We still see each other weekly but we keep separate homes for obvious reasons.
Tactically I’m pretty organized so without the encumbrances of a jealous SO, it works pretty well with my work. Strategy-wise, SBs suit me perfectly because i want the steady pool of needy 20-somethings who are different from a 20-something hooker (been in a “relationship” with one of those). I have always been happier and more productive in a “relationship”, civvie or otherwise, than simply lining up hookers.
I too am considering retiring from the bowl. It comes and goes in spurts although my membership in SA is good until mid March. We will see as this season ends.
The cons are multiple meet and greats to find the diamond in the rough. Potential scammers seem to happen about once or twice a month.
Always use a burner phone # gents. Just had one yesterday who asked for my number. Of course I just don’t give mine first got hers and looked it up on an app I have. Found a man connected to it. She texts me back and forth on my burner # and it gets odd so I block her on SA and the number. She comes back with a different number saying she’s going to contact my wife. How, I have no idea bc DJ only has a burner # for me.
It’s this kinda bullshit that’s making me rethink my values and hang up my spikes.
That kinda scam is very discouraging for sure. Hey, why don't you tell this scammer, ok go ahead and call my wife, here's her number, and give them the number of your local police fraud squad.
That's a wonderful idea! I'm going to try that if/when I need to.
I do use a burner number (Google Voice) but only when I have seen one or more yellow flags. I'm not married and my current "GF" is my #1 SB, so no risk there. But I don't want to enable a scammer to harass me or use my real number to look up more info on me. So far, I've never had to block anyone on my GV number or my real number.
Life is good
The Cat
It gets better. I have an app bc I’m a realtor that allows me to run a phone # and find out who’s it is. It’s about 80 % accurate. I confronted the scammer with his number and was greeted with a ghost. Then a reply from a burner number. Lol.
Think carefully before she calls your wife. My wife came at me with a butcher's knife when she found out that I had a SB who was a younger version her her but was still into sex. My college-aged kid called the cops to separates us. She told me later that she wasn't going to do anything violent, but that she really didn't want me spending too much money on my sugar babies.
-- Modified on 1/15/2021 5:04:00 PM
Since I'm not married, no kids, and not "cheating" on anyone, I'm not worried about defending myself from a kitchen implement.
So if her most serious worry was how much money you spent, maybe there's an opportunity to have a transparent discussion about each of your thoughts on adding sexual partners to the relationship? Unless you think that will result in her grabbing a cleaver for her other hand, of course...
Life is good
The Cat
I tried, but this isn't a conversation that she want to have. Her first preference would be lifelong celibacy for me. Her next preference would seem to be for me to see cheap but disease-free hookers rarely. However, she knows that I am into long-term arrangements, and she is pretty good about guessing which friends of mine (East Asian ancestry, like her) are providing benefits. She doesn't want to know any details. She does check the credit card and bank statements regularly.
Sorry you've had these problems with your wife. A don't ask, don't tell policy is not a bad way to go if she sorta kinda knows but doesn't want to know. The money issue is real though. One way my wife and I make our admittedly unusual situation work is that we've established some agreements on certain behaviors. One of those, obviously, is on when and how much money either of us will spend on our arrangements. With that kind of agreement in place, and assuming you and your wife trust each other to keep it, there should be no reason for her to be checking credit card and bank statements. Best of luck!
Sorry you've had these problems with your wife. A don't ask, don't tell policy is not a bad way to go if she sorta kinda knows but doesn't want to know. The money issue is real though. One way my wife and I make our admittedly unusual situation work is that we've established some agreements on certain behaviors. One of those, obviously, is on when and how much money either of us will spend on our arrangements. With that kind of agreement in place, and assuming you and your wife trust each other to keep it, there should be no reason for her to be checking credit card and bank statements. Best of luck!
But I'll reply now. My wife's last serious BF was a guy she met on OK cupid. He was trying to rebuild his finances after a divorce. Great guy, but no extra spending money. So she gladly paid for everything such as hotel stays, travels by train, conference fees, event tickets, meals, and most everything else they did together. It was all done with my blessing since I get to spend just about as much as I want on my SBs.
Well ig she got off on a similar kink as we do!
We don't talk about it very much at all. Still no sex between us, but we still love each other in our older adult ways. Complicated of course, but it is what it is.
There’s no way to trace back to my wife via the burner phone #. But ivv bc appreciate your kind words of wisdom.
Papa Sweet, always a good suggestion on the local PD number. I also keep track of various scammers numbers, etc so I tend to give them the number of another scammer. I view it as just trying to help the scammers network with one another lol.
Back on the topic at hand, I am married but not in an open relationship but have been at the bowl for a number of years now. I agree there are risks, (some of those same risks apply to the occasional BSC pro). I do take extra precautions with who I meet with. I have to travel extensively for my career so I’m fortunate in that all of my SB’s are located in my normal travel cities and I don’t participate in the bowl in my hometown. I’ve been fortunate to have multiple long-term SB’s and don’t see myself moving out of the bowl anytime soon. Yes, dealing with scammers, etc is a pain but I’m cautious enough where my true information isn’t really at risk and when I come across them, I simply say bring it on. I also have access to a service that allows me to reverse lookup a phone number so I usually do my background research before entering into anything. If something doesn’t feel right, I simply cut off and move on. We all have our own individual risk tolerances and it’s up to each one of us to make those decisions. To HC’s point, being an SD is markedly different then hiring a pro and what you are actually looking for goes a long way to determine which route to go. Either way, best wishes to you.
Go with grown-ups. Graduate students or smart and similar mid-20s+ plus ladies often need some extra money (and not for handbags or shoes) and can be smart and discreet. The older I get, the more that I have found that I want longer but fewer relationships with women, but with ladies who will be my friends both before and after.
My problem is that there is a real shortage of escorts where I live. I'm in the northeast, far from any major city. There just aren't (m)any quality escorts. I've visited Montreal regularly before the border closed for lots of fun. By the way, Montreal has a great escort scene. Since the border closed that has not been an option.
Sugar babies are a lot of work and in my experience rarely are in the league of a well reviewed Montreal escort. Some of the SA women are just not good at sex!
I don't mind putting in the work and have a pretty high conversion rate but I still have lots of flakes. My experience is that if I can get them to lunch, I can get them to bed. I'm only available during the day, during the week and am older, so there is my disadvantage. Conversely, I'm willing to spend the same as what I'd spend on an escort, and have some skills and some game.
I really just want a women that will spend a few hours in the hotel room getting down to it. The relationship with escorts is a lot more honest, direct and clear.
I've been out of the bowl for a while but my stable is almost to nothing so it may be time to jump back in. I'm hoping the border opens up soon, but if not, I'm jumping back in to the bowl; just no other alternatives.
Happy hunting.
Erosthesenses
I expect that there are a lot sugar mommies in your area. Even though SA seem to specializes in undergrad or even late teen gals, there are other sites with women who are completely grown up and interested in fully adult sexual relationships. Check them out. There are goddesses out there; maybe including you next -door neighbor.
To the OP, all of the pro's and con's of sugar dating vs. escorts are laid out in this forum for you to make an educated decision. I enjoy SB's (and FWB's) and no longer see escorts because I don't mind the countless M&G's, flakes, and occasional scammers. Money is not an obstacle and my wife just looks away because she'd hates sex, but likes the public persona of being married. For me, prefer the connection with SB's vs the transactional nature of pro's. Also in a target rich environment and as others have stated, take a "my way or the highway" approach with SB's. I call all the shots (where, when and how often) and quick to walk away from any hint of drama.
Good luck in whatever you decide.
Everyone is looking for something a little different in the SB world. If you are going to play this game be prepared to be very discreet and become good at it. I used to travel a lot before Covid and had great results with this on the road, but it’s harder to play this game on the home turf when you have a SO. Obviously you use burner phones, never tell a SB anything about your real life or who you are, and be very picky about who you meet! - all common sense. I need the physical/sexual experience more than the companionship part, so I have a couple regulars that work best for me. Both are different and unique situations. One is a pretty and fun 29 yr old, 3 decades my junior who is fun in bed, very reliable, and very SB/GF like. The other is more of the pro experience, a 40 yr old blonde with a centerfolds body - unreal for her age and just fun to look at with her clothes off. Ok in the rack, but not the total SB relationship/connection we like, Still - she is just too hot to move out of the rotation for now. It’s interesting though, the time spent with the 29 year old is much better to me, not all about hotness - but the connection and complete GFE.
After about 4 years of this off and on, I now try to go with low volume and when I find a couple keepers, stick with them. More true than ever during Covid. I know that higher volume and variety can be a lot more fun, but I am playing it as safe as I can right now given my circumstances. In a non sex relationship - like most couples north of 60 I guess? - but as others have said, long term marriages can be complicated. Not really interested in a divorce at this time, so the SB deal works great for me. And the more experience you get on the site, the better you will understand this world. I was kind of clueless when I started playing on SA - but not anymore! A lot of good info about the game gets shared on this forum, thanks to all on here.
Gentlemen mongers,
I will always enjoy the conversations here, informative discussions and the words of wisdom. I’m retiring.
SA had banned me a few years ago but I was able to get around their security and created a new profile. I let that one expire and I was fine with letting go..... until I wasn’t and I got the urge to look for new SB’s. I created a new profile and within hours they booted me based on their allocations of past transgressions from years ago.
I have a SDM membership with wasn’t very fruitful and now it’s expired. I take these as signs.
Lastly, business isn’t what it was and I’m working on bringing it back up to acceptable levels. I just need to concentrate on betterment of mind, body and business.
I am truly retired. I will miss all the choices and company. Some of my current string have stayed in touch so I can have a few play dates but I won’t be active and in recruitment mode.
This isn’t good bye gents I shall live through you all.
I salute you...there are some normal men on here! LOL
Me, I have nothing against SA...probably had BCD with 20-30 girls.
But has become very unrewarding the past year.
And, although I'm totally engaged (both figuratively and other) with a beautiful lady
Sometimes we have to sharpen up our skills and pursue real women in real life!
Like our ancestors did for a few thousand of years before us.
Gentlemen mongers,
I will always enjoy the conversations here, informative discussions and the words of wisdom. I’m retiring.
SA had banned me a few years ago but I was able to get around their security and created a new profile. I let that one expire and I was fine with letting go..... until I wasn’t and I got the urge to look for new SB’s. I created a new profile and within hours they booted me based on their allocations of past transgressions from years ago.
I have a SDM membership with wasn’t very fruitful and now it’s expired. I take these as signs.
Lastly, business isn’t what it was and I’m working on bringing it back up to acceptable levels. I just need to concentrate on betterment of mind, body and business.
I am truly retired. I will miss all the choices and company. Some of my current string have stayed in touch so I can have a few play dates but I won’t be active and in recruitment mode.
This isn’t good bye gents I shall live through you all.
If you get reported by a POT they can warn it ban you. If the POT asks for determining the allowance and you talk about it. Banned. Definitely do not say “ pay for play “ or “PPM”. Good luck green pea
“Fwb nsa fun dates with allowance” is all I say before going to text.
If you get reported by a POT they can warn it ban you. If the POT asks for determining the allowance and you talk about it. Banned. Definitely do not say “ pay for play “ or “PPM”. Good luck green pea