Occasionally we read about hobbyists that seem to be in a position where the hobby has created significant problems in their lives such as  financial ruin, marital strife, professional failure, etc.

Certainly addiction to anything such as drugs, gambling, pornography, etc. can lead to these significant life problems.  The hobby seems to be the kind of activity that can lead to the same addiction and therefore the same life problems.

Is there a way for the readers of TER to recognize that they're addicted and would benefit from seeking professional intervention?

Hmmm, Addicted2Lust,

This is rapidly becoming the topic du jour, almost replacing the "Help-I've-Fallen-In-Love-With-A-Provider-and-Can't-Get-Up" disorder. I wonder if it has to do with the media and the addiction-mongering among pseudo-professionals who like to make an unscrupulous buck from people who are anything but "addicted." But here goes:

I am of the school of thought that there is no such thing as "sex addiction." There is compulsive behavior, but sexual activity is hardly one of them. In terms of self-diagnosing compulsivity and deeming yourself ready for professional help, feeling discomfort rather than pleasure from the behavior is a start. Generally, people begin to feel discomfort from their actions when there are some consequences, such as no money for other things; relations between the individual and close family members or friends are impaired; or work performance suffers.

If you're just having lots of sex and are extremely happy about it, I fail to see what the problem is. If you're having lots of sex, are extremely happy about it AND lie to your spouse/SO/girlfriend, then you're not sex addicted, you're just a liar who likes to have his cake and eat it too.

As to "professional intervention" offered by those who specialize in "sex addiction," I really, really caution against it.  Most "sex addiction professionals" operate from some kind of abstinence model that fails in the long run, mainly because telling someone not to have sex at all - not even with a wife or SO for a period of time, while being shamed and urged to think of his/her behavior as some kind of "moral failure" - is useless and JUST DOESN'T WORK.

In my worldwide sex therapy practice, I deal with clients who have previously been diagnosed as "sex addicts." During the course of our collaborative work together, we often uncover reasons for the behavior that are so far away from "addiction" that the mere term is a complete misnomer and shouldn't even be used in this context. These individuals cannot come forth here for obvious reasons, but if they could, they would substantiate my statements.

If it feels compulsive and not so great afterwards, it generally is,
The Love Goddess


-- Modified on 7/1/2011 6:25:58 PM

I'm no clinician; but, the LG is spot on.  Man up and take responsibility for your own actions.

If conducting hobbying activities causes you upset in your life (E.g. you spend your rent money on providers, etc.), then you have an addiction.

If on the other hand hobbying does not cause you any upset in your life, and in fact allows you to enjoy life even more, then it should be considered a positive, not a negative, even if you find it very difficult to stop.  (Think along the lines of an activity like jogging, golf, bridge, etc.)

I agree with LG, however, the term addiction as it relates to chemical dependency is misapplied here.

Sex addiction and prostitutes are the favorite subjects for the TV ratings sweeps months.  I don't want to diminish the seriousness of the question, I'm just responding to your comment about the timing.

Yes, emphasis on sex related issues does run in cycles driven by the media.  They roll out the stories about sex, prostitutes and addiction like clockwork and it's all part of a predictable ratings strategy.  

The true whores and sex addicts are the ones holding the microphones.

my website and plough yourself through a commentary I had to a seminar I attended, held by none other than Mr. Rob Weiss of the Sexual Recovery Institute. Mr Weiss, in my not so humble opinion, has made a career out of shaming and humiliating people who really don't need it.

A technical piece, but well worth reading if you're interested,
The Love Goddess

How odd, I would swear my post below was right on topic.  I agree witih all those who deny the nonsense of sex addiction.  Frankly, having been "diagnosed" with other, more traditional "addictions," I think it's all just selfish behavior for which one must take responsibility.  So, do I lie?  Of course, can't get away with hobbying without doing that.  Have I gone through a great deal of money I should never have touched?  Unfortunately, yes.  Whether I call myself an "addict," I sure can't claim that this behavior is sensible or makes me a better person.

The proposed draft revisions for the DSM5 will make this problem even worse, because we can now anticipate people with a bogus so-called "sex addiction" being diagnosed with the new category of "Behavioral addiction - Not otherwise specified (NOS)".

I agree with many of the views of Allen Francis, who headed the effort that created the DSM4, on this topic. The DSM4 was certainly very flawed when it came to sexuality, but it is looking like the DSM5 will be a step backward.

Some of the respondents thought I was posing the question because I'm concerned about myself.  That's not the case.  My hobbying is minimal and I do feel that it is a completely controlled and worthwhile activity for me.

I posed the question because I have read on a number of occasions about men that hobby to the point of financial problems, being discovered by their wives, shirking professional responsibilities, etc.  It occurred to me that they might benefit from some insight by LG.  That's why I asked.

it's the consequence of having been discovered, through snooping by my wife and insufficient caution by me.  The result: embarrassment and guilt on my part for having caused hurt to someone I love, and anger and endless recrimination by my wife.  To ease her own denial of declining interest in a full menu of lovemaking, in something other than her semi-Victorian concept of it, she suggests I am addicted, preying on young women, and genetically "selfish."  Her antidote for me:  give up the hobby, take up positive activities, and give her an occasional antiseptic loving, with no guarantee of reciprocity for me.  My antidote:  occasional forays of joy and friendship with grown up providers, and good times with friends, family and my still attractive wife, who no longer turns me on sexually but is otherwise terrific.  So far, the two prescriptions don't mesh.  Predictions? I'd really welcome insightful answers from LG and others.

each other's insufficiencies, all goes on as usual. From an intensely personal perspective, I can only say that I will never understand women who are not into their partners enough to take the initiative and bone them aggressively. If I didn't find my husband hot and sexy, I wouldn't screw him...and sooner or later, I'd dump him. I don't need a meal ticket and I can do just fine without him from a material standpoint. To paraphrase Erich Fromm: I need him because I love him - I don't love him because I need him.


I try to explain to my clients that sex is the glue that keeps a marriage humming on many cylinders. Oftentimes (and also on this board, might I add), I am met with rationalizations such as "marriage isn't all about sex, there are other more important things, etc." Sorry, but I disagree. What's the point of being married if you're not hot for your partner? Why hang on? Why not part as friends with your respect intact and move on?

I also don't buy the "we stay together for the kids' sake" argument, mainly because children are not stupid and they pick up discord, even if only sexual, between their parents like hypersensitive antennas.  To me, rationalizations are defense mechanisms that don't lead to constructive solutions. Now, I realize that hammering out an agreement - particularly a sex-based one - is extremely difficult for people. It takes loads of differentiation and individuation, meaning that the individual himself/herself has to remain strong and secure and stand by his/her convictions while still able to compromise. [Of course I'm a Bowenian family systems therapist, so my colors are showing here.]  But in the case of discrepant desire, I really believe that both parties should come to the table as extremely mature individuals and figure out something that will work for everyone. And if that includes escorts, so be it.  A woman can't expect her male partner to exist in a sexless union, and a man can't expect his female partner to have a matching sex drive.

If you love someone, set him/her free,
The Love Goddess

LG, you said, " But in the case of discrepant desire, I really believe that both parties should come to the table as extremely mature individuals and figure out something that will work for everyone. And if that includes escorts, so be it.  A woman can't expect her male partner to exist in a sexless union, and a man can't expect his female partner to have a matching sex drive."

It's sensible in theory but let's say there are small kids involved and the marriage is good in all ways except in the sexual desire area.  If extra-marital sex is desired by the husband as a solution to the discrepant desire problem then the wife can feel betrayed and the marriage can be threatened which may have damaging effects on the kids; even more damaging than the damage that might occur due to their being sensitive to the sexual discord.

As we all know, marriage requires compromise by both spouses and not everything can be worked out.  Many times much less damage is done by NOT discussing the desire for escorts or other types of extra-marital sexual relationships and just partaking of them.  How many times have we heard that men do that and also maintain their marriages because they no longer feel resentment and anger toward their wives for the desire discrepancy? This board is full of stories like that (mine included).

As much as it would be ideal to do as you describe, it is not always feasible and many factors and variables exist (as you well know).

My point, Addicted2Lust,
Is that if the husband "desires" extramarital relations, then he maybe he shouldn't be married. The extramarital relations are there to be used as a remedy, not as a first option. And if the wife doesn't agree with the remedy, then maybe there shouldn't be a marriage, no matter how good it is on other levels. People can be divorced and have a great family - I've seen it all around.

I'm not a fan of lies in a marriage, period. I'm a fan of honesty, even if the truth hurts. If you think your method is better, then watch carnage as your lies are found out. Lying to your spouse takes a lot of work - ask my clients how much better they feel once they stop putting on one charade after another.

And that's that for me,
The Love Goddess

I agree.  

I don't want to end my marriage because of the sexual desire discrepancy and my wife would never condone any dalliances so that leaves me lying and sneaking around.  Although I do that much less than I did years back.  

As I age, my sexual desire is slowly coming into accord with my wife's after being married for over 20 years.  I'm fortunate that I never got caught sneaking around and that I have maintained a loving relationship with her.

Yes, lying and charades are a poor choice among many better ones but every choice has its consequences, even the best ones.  There's a price to pay for every decision one makes in life.

Children are not adults. A child cannot be "undone" in the way that a marriage can.

I've been very busy and wanted to give myself sufficient time to read this, and I'm glad I did.

Let me just say that we are VERY fortunate to have you on our side.  Posters to this site should read this to appreciate the depth of knowledge you share with us daily, especially in light of the frequently mundane questions you're asked on this board.

I'm guessing Mr. Weiss represents a more mainstream view of the subject than you do, and based on your experience, I can see why you felt compelled to write such a detailed counterpoint to his assumptions and conclusions  As I was reading it, even I as a layman didn't think that the impulse control disorder referred to as  sex addiction had its roots in a narcissistic personality.  That goes against my experience as well as others I've known.  So I enjoyed watching you pop his balloon, even if I had to go to the dictionary three different times.  I'm no expert, but I don't think Mr. Weiss will be inviting you to any dinner parties anytime soon.

OK, now here's something I wasn't expecting- what are the chances that a layperson would come across the works of Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi twice in one lifetime.  Believe it or not, back in the 90's when I was the head of product planning and market strategy for a major car company, we were actually studying his concept of flow for the purpose of trying to better understand, and even create, a flow state when people drove our vehicles.  We wanted to know what we could do to make our cars more conducive to creating that response in a driver.  It didn't really pan out the way we had hoped, but it was an interesting intellectual exercise that caused us to think about some things differently.  

Now the people that really experience flow states are people who ride sports motorcycles, as I do.  We talk about it all the time, even though we don't understand the lingo.  But those of us who have the skills know what it feels like to be "in the zone."  People used to joke about being "one with the machine," but it's absolutely true.  Kobe Bryant does it on the basketball court, race drivers do it on the track, and skilled motorcyclists also can access this heightened level of perception that transcends the step of thinking about what you're doing and just melding with the machine.  And that, BTW, is just as addictive as any sexual behavior.

Anyway, excellent job and thanks for posting that.  But I must admit, after that much heavy thinking, a little "self-soothing" is sounding pretty good right now.