I've been reading about SA quite a bit recently.  The fact that it flies so far under LE's radar that it's practically in a mine shaft makes it very appealing.  Plus, I heard that it could even be legal, despite being almost identical to hobbying.  But at the same time, it's far more expensive than the hobby, from what I read.  I generally see providers once every few months, plus I attend M&G's (both for fun and safety, since the providers I meet there are definitely not LE).  It's what my budget allows.

So just how wealthy do you have to be to maintain a SB for short term?  Also, I don't want too much of an age disparity with her; I'd feel like I'm taking advantage of her.  (Which I don't feel when I visit young providers.)  Is SA even sustainable at all, with a rank-and-file office job?  Do older SB's have lower allowances?  Or should I just stick to classic hobbying, at least until I get a good promotion?

What about SA'ing hobby-style?  That is, arranging to meet with a SB for, say, 3 hours of dinner and private time.  Has that been done?

-- Modified on 8/12/2016 10:39:17 AM

If you see different providers once a week, than SA will save some money as it seems most guys pay something like $250 and get to go on a date of 3-4 hours whereas that would cost up to 4 times that with most escorts.

On the other hand, it seems like there's only one pop allowed, and you have to pony up for at least a dinner and maybe a movie.  You also don't get the variety.

I am over simplifying and I'm sure there is a lot of variation, but that is more or less the basic outline.

There are as many different ways to have a sugar baby as there are sugar babies to choose from.

I have no idea where you get your information from regarding the "rules" of the sugar bowl, but they most definitely are not so cut and dried. I do a LOT of overnight dates with three or more "pops" involved for the same price as most hourly rates by providers. Only once can I remember a multi hour date with an SB where she limited me to only a single pop. Now that doesn't mean I haven't had a lot of one pop dates as I am pretty much a one and done kind of guy on a date that isn't several hours.

My advice to the OP is to yes indeed look for women closer to his own age, pick women who aren't beauty queens, but are still attractive enough for him to be interested in. Avoid the women that act like Prima Donnas and look for the "wholesome type" whose profiles mention things that you'd think were more suited to Match.com Some/many of these women are really just looking for that "nice guy" and you would be surprised just how little actual cash they want, especially if you are a single or divorced guy who can give her companionship and a bit of emotional support in addition to some cash.

Please don't assume there is only ONE way to do this, I have several different SB's at any one time and my "arrangement" with every one of them is different, from the 19 year old single mother who comes over three to four times a week and fucks me for a hundred bucks a throw, to a couple of girls who might actually turn into a GF and not a sugar baby, to the "normal" SB's that I see every week or so for somewhere between $300-500 a date ranging from a few hours to all night.  

One last thing, I know for a FACT there are several women I have met that I just wasn't that attracted to physically that I could have easily had without ever paying them a nickel. If your standards aren't unrealistic and you actually want a relationship with a 45 year old woman with teenaged kids and a bit of baggage, you should be able to find one in the sugar bowl for little or no money.

Is it possible to make an arrangement to meet once or twice for whatever allowance is agreed upon?  Basically, do SA hobby-style.  Or does it have to be ongoing for a length of time to count as an arrangement?  Because I've read the SA site, and they make it look like you have to be Bill Gates to join them as a SD.  Do rank-and-file office guys stand a chance at all?  Or should I treat it as an incentive to work and/or brown-nose my way into a promotion?

While it'd be nice and safe, nothing stops the SB from giving me just a conversation and a hug in exchange for my allowance, considering that it's an arrangement for a relationship and nothing else.  Of course, nothing *technically* stops a provider from doing that, either; after all, it's just "time and companionship".  But the hobby has checks and balances that SA doesn't.

-- Modified on 8/12/2016 7:00:20 PM

Lots of one timers on sugar land. But thats not good!

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 ILE:  There's nothing wrong with what you stated above.  And I don't want this board to turn into an exclusive ghetto like the K-Girl board.  So I'll try to respond to your previous post below:    Based on your statements above, I think you'll waste time & money in the sugar bowl.  A top-tier SB wants an arrangement with a regular allowance.  If she wanted to be a call girl, she could easily do that.    

     It has been done & guys on this board will love to tell you all about it.   But what you're calling an SB in this context will most likely be a hooker or a quasi hooker.   The type of girl you could have easily booked on TER/P411/BackPage.  There are definitely girls who use a sugar site as an escort site.  But there's a common fallacy at work here, it goes like this:

 1. There are SBs in the sugar bowl.
 2.  There are hookers in the sugar bowl.  
 3.  All SBs are hookers.  
 
 I've had quick hookups in the sugar bowl (see my thread "Sugar Mongering in Memphis")  But I don't kid myself into thinking that I've gotten something that I couldn't get from P411.  --

I'll respond to what you said.

1. I don't read the K-Girl board, let alone visit K-girls in real life.  One, I don't like the seemingly mechanical nature of the services they provide.  Most probably don't DFK, and an appointment without it feels almost like medical procedure to me.  Two, out of all types of providers, K-girls have higher odds of being trafficked.  And that's something I want no part of.

2. This is where you might be right.  I suppose I can find a SB who's using SA as a safer way of providing, since LE doesn't really go after SA the way it does after the hobby.  That, or an older, lower-tier SB who doesn't have SD's messaging her left and right.  But they would be few and far between, I take it.  Plus, it'd feel like an online dating site, which have become such a clusterf_ck lately, that I want no part of them, either.

3. This is similar to #2.  I'll keep the SA option open, but will most likely stick to hobbying for the foreseeable future.  I don't have enough experience with SA to use it safely.  Heck, it took me a year just to master hobbying, and that was in the days when LE wasn't as aggressive with it.  After all, my name isn't I_like_SBs.  Oh, and do *not* use BP; it's got more stings than a hornet's nest.

-- Modified on 8/13/2016 9:22:51 AM

I am headed to Northern Michigan in a couple of days for some salmon fishing, I'll be staying in an area with virtually ZERO hookers. I took a gander at the SB's in the area and hit a couple up for a "casual dinner date" and got myself a taker in a beautiful young lady who was more than happy to meet me for dinner. It's highly unlikely to end up being anything more than the one date as I live several states away in Texas, but it has every possibility of being fun.

For the record, no sex has been discussed, nor has anything to do with money. At worst I will have a pleasant few hours with a hottie having dinner and drinks, at best I will be buying her breakfast in the morning. I don't have any preset expectations, but I am hopeful that I'll be buying her breakfast in the morning, I really am THAT charming. lol

I bet you there isn't one in fifty K-Girls that doesn't DFK, and the odds of a K-Girl being trafficked are minimal at most. Don't believe the media hype on the subject or you'll also start believing all black girls have pimps.

but after reading your posts, I believe if you've had such a tough time "mastering" hookers, maybe SB's really aren't for you, but not for the reasons you, or Zangari list.

FWIW, I just spent last night with a beautiful SB, it was our third date, every one of them have ended up with multi hour sex, she is roughly half my age and so far the "allowance" I have given her has totaled ZERO dollars and ZERO cents.  

The Sugar Bowl I agree is not for everyone, but the way I look at it "More for me"

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There's no need to be a super rich guy to have great success Sugar Dating. You just have to be persistent and find the girls who want what you want. They are out there! I currently am seeing two lovely young SBs whenever I ask for a date, pay as you go, and no set allowance. Very affordable, no strings, and these are incrdibly sexy open minded young amatuers, not pros in any sense. But in order to keep the sugar flowing, I'm always eschanging messags with several more to set up new playmates, since thes arrangements may not last long. So I get some grade a feminine companionship, great variety, reasonable xpnse and very flexible schedule. What's not to like?

Well, if I'm wrong about K-girls, then I stand corrected.  But since I'm not physically attracted to most Asian women, there is really no real reason for me to see K-girls.  So it's a non-issue.

It's not that I had a tough time mastering providers.  It's that I ended up seeing quite a few "just OK" providers before I learned to pick and choose the really great ones.  That, and ran into truly bad apples, although I was lucky enough to come out unharmed and spend nothing in the process.  Most consisted of unreturned calls/e-mails, NCNS's, and a verbally abusive agency scheduler.  What really helped me in the hobby is attending M&G's, because I could personally talk to providers before scheduling with them.  That, and establish myself in my city's hobby community that way.  Unfortunately, there is no equivalent of those in the SA world.

You know, maybe I'll give SA a chance.  I'll just be mentally prepared for running into crap similar to what I remember from my early hobby days.  And do my research, of course.  Although with me being older, my ability to separate trash from treasure (a.k.a. spidey sense) is much better now, so I don't expect to encounter as many bad apples.

-- Modified on 8/14/2016 12:22:03 AM

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It's doubtful that there ever will be a "TER for Sugar Babies" mainly because SB's don't want to be seen as "whores" and SD's don't want to share like we do here on TER. And considering how much BBFS is going on in the Sugar world, can you really blame the guys for wanting a bit of exclusivity?

Yes, "spidey sense" is a good thing to have, both in the TER world and the Sugar world. I am by no means going to claim the Sugar world doesn't have it's pitfalls, just that looking at it from an overall standpoint, I am thrilled to death to have jumped in feet first.

Just like the world of TER there is no any ONE way to do things. I think mine is a pretty decent template to follow for the single guys wanting something not too "structured", and Zangari has a pretty good set of guidelines for married guys looking to find someone on a regular basis with as little hassle as possible.  

BTW we are both arrogant opinionated pricks and this is as good as the two of us are EVER going to get along, considering our conflicting views on how to do things and our arrogant, obnoxious dispositions where it comes to people we disagree with. Over all, I think we are doing a pretty good job of getting along, all things considered. lol

What does it cost?    The pretty girls sound like they want to hold you up in there ads.
Providers are so much easier to get with it looks like.

but what is SA and where is the site?

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What's not to like? The bullshit: The flakes, the con artists posing as SBs, the time wasters, the heavyset, the unattractive, the heavyset and unattractive, the fees paid out to these SD/SB websites for the low returns and laundry list of bullshit noted above.