I hate to break it to you guys but....... a lot of you are pretty stupid thinking that these women are into the sex they are having with you . I can guarantee that 99% of the providers cringe while they are even touching you and are focusing on how they are going to spend your money to distract themselves from the fact that they are having sex with an unattractive out of shape 40 something married man. I would know because I was a provider for many years. As a matter of fact one of the things that made me so popular was the fact that I was a Real GFE- I had you all so fooled. I read my reviews and guys would say things like - she really loves her work,  she is so horny for you , or she cums so hard- for real ! Never once was I horny for you ( except the time I had the gorgeous 30 year old athlete- he was the only exception), never once did I cum- I can fake it and never in my life did I enjoy my work. I was young and stupid , enjoying the money I made and felt as though I didn't have any other choices.Now the thought of what I made myself endure makes me sick- athough I am a much stronger and wiser woman. I feel bad for all the providers who are still out there selling themselves. What a terrible feeling when you feel as though you don't have ownership of your own body, and anyone can have a piece of you for a price. Ladies-I know many of you are going to protest that what I am saying is all bull- and of course I would have claimed this was all bull as well- it goes with the act of being a good provider- after all - we don't just get paid to fuck- we get paid to stroke your insecure little ego, make you feel like a man. I feel sorry for your wives- maybe you should use all the money you are spending on providers and use it for marriage counceling to find what is so wrong in your marriage that you have to stray ? Are your little cocks really more important than the love of your beautiful wife and childeren that you claim to love so dearly? Is it really worth jeapordizing their feelings and lives forever ?
Now don't get me all wrong- I am not against money for sex, as long as it is between two consenting adults and no ones feelings are at stake. But really, even then, the women are damaging their own well being and etching away another small peice of their heart, dignity and soul. Ladies, you are obviously intellgent enough to manipulate these men and make money in this game, therefore you are intellegent enough to do something that makes you smile and feel good when you look in the mirror. Once you make that step you will realize it was so much easier than you thought. If you need any help or advice, you can email me at [email protected]. I am here for you if you need someone to talk to . I know how it feels to be you , and I know how great it feels to find a new legit and proud life. You can do it too. Guys- treat these women with respect and remember they have a heart and feelings . They aren't just a piece of meat to fuck.

"...we don't just get paid to fuck- we get paid to stroke your insecure little ego, make you feel like a man."

Honestly, it's not about my ego. It's just about the f*cking.  I'm in it for the pleasure as you were in it for the money.

As to my married life -- it's pretty pathetic.  But I'll be separated in a few months and divorced in a year or two, and while depressed and frustrated, I'm not bitter.

I don't know what makes you so bitter, but I do hope only the best for you in your future endeavors, and that life treats you to whatever epiphany it takes to remove your demons.

A great deal of what you say maybe true. I especially believe most providers never get off & a lot of their performance is just that. Unfortunately, you come off as some OLD whore who not only couldn't get anyone to pay for your services. But probably couldn't get this 40+ guy to do you for free either!

Some of what you say is correct...and some of it is just your personal feelings expanded to include everyone, and I have always found that wide sweeping genralizations are not the product of clear thinking and always serve to justify and validate ersonal feelings. The fact is that we are not always really hot for the gents we meet nor to we always orgasm when we appear to. Also not so many of our clients are married and taking away from their children as you potray. Yes some of them are and sometimes they are even addicted and the amount that they spend on the hobby has made me feel bad being a part of that. Often, however a client is an overworked single guy that is so busy and stressed he simply has no time to seek a relationship or to even date. Sometimes he is even unable to achieve the affections of another as he has a specific roblem that prevents it either physically or mentally. People need affection to be healthy. They need to be touched and caressed and made to feel special once in a while and alot of times their wives are not willing to do that for them. The down side of it is that every time we engage in a physical act with a client and give of ourselves we lose some of our energy. Yogis call it chi, and in order for us to stay emotionally healthy we must seek to replace it in some manner through fulfilling and energizing activities. For some of us this business allows us to pursue endeavors that are very fulfilling for us but unfortunately do not pay the bills so well...espeically if one is a single mother which so many of us are. For example those who are pursuing careers in the arts. If you are an artist then you must create to be fulfilled and that creative process can take up an amount of time that simply is not afforded when one is working most legit jobs. As far as cringing when we touch a client well if that was the way they made you feel then getting out of the business was the right thing for you to do. I am a very sexual person, maternal and caring by nature and I am single so I have enjoyed alot of the physical side of my job even with men who were not physically beautiful. I did however find them to be beautiful people and good lovers. It sounds to me like you have done well for yourself and that is good, you should not however judge everyone elses experience by that of your own and the things that you CHOSE to put upon it and how you CHOSE to be affected by it. I have found that when something in this business causes me emotional distress it is simply mirroring another issue that I already had within me.
 In conclusion though I do agree that we should all be looking for another means of employment as it is a business that mainly focuses on greed and avarice and does little past a certain point to improve our lives and ourselves which all of us should seek to do.
It sounds as if you need to work on letting go of some of the negative energy you accumulated while being in this biz and I think that posting here was an attempt to do that. It would serve you better however if you sought out another means such as Yoga or counseling.

Namaste

I read sara's post and could feel it : This is a post full of pain - and anger.It's also one that shows someone working very hard to change - and grow.

For the record Sara, I'm not a hobbyist. Not a saint, but...

You raise some tough issues, Sara. Some I'm probably not qualified to respond to - some which I am by fact I'm just a human being. I will say this much:

The anger I feel in your post is aimed at the hobbyist - and the sympathy for providers.But, aren't these adults that do what they want because of free-will? No one is forcing them to do anything, are they?

Here's a unpleasant fact of life: A psychologist/sex therapist told me once that a women "needs" a man three days out of the month. In a perfect world, a man would work the same way. Problem is, nature designed men to be ready, willing and able to procreate virtually anytime. In short - it's a hormonal mismatch.

But, I digress. You seem proud to have made a new life for yourself, and if it's made you a happier person - then I'm happy for you.
But part of what you are today is based on what you were yesterday Sara. That's not a "bad" thing...it's just what it was...and what you are now.

You will not find true peace, however, my dear Sara, till you deal with the anger still so strong inside. I am not a psychologist, so I certainly have no suggestions - except possibly this one: be kind to yourself. Try to let the anger go. It serves nothing good - and it just holds you back. I know - anger was a trademark of mine until recently...and it never did me a bit of good in the long run.

May you continue to find the peace and happiness that you seek.

Dear Namaste,
I agree that there is some truth to some of your words. I a not a man hater by any means , and I still hold dear a few friendships with my "clients" that I developed while I was working in the industry. I know there are many single men out there who are very busy and are lonely and simply need a caring touch from a woman. Maybe I did sound a bit harsh when I said I cringe just by being touched by these men, that was not every single time, but honestly,it was true the majority of the time. Honestly, think about how difficult it is to have sex with a man who you really aren't attracted to - not just physically , but personally too. Someone who you are now obligated to have sex with because he just handed you the cash.You can turn him down, but really how many providers do that? Usually you just grin and bear it and show him a good time to the best of your ability. You can't say that allowing yourself to do this isn't damaging ? and doing this over and over again ?
As far as my feelings applying to every provider in the industry, I know that is not realistic, but I can say it does apply in one sense or another to the majority of the providers.I know this because countless have shared their feelings with me.
The truth of the matter is, you begin to shut off emotionally to protect yourself. You are intimate with countless men over and over again. You are doing damage to yourself. You are giving too much of yourself too often and begin to feel jaded.
My goal here is not just to let go of negative energy, as I have been in counseling to do that, I do yoga and I MYSELF am a counselor with my focus being on women and men in the sex industry (one of the reasons I can say that I do know that my feelings are not alone ). My goal is to make people aware and give a second thought to what they are doing.
Also one last thing, I must say that although I don't know personally how difficult it is to be a single mother, I can say that a child would rather have a mother that works hard and has little money than a mother who gets arrested , hurt, or worse. Remember all the dangers of being a provider. If you work hard you can make enough money to support a child by waiting on tables or even stripping in a club. I know its not $500 an hour, but it can be $600 a week or more (welcome to the real world- it takes a lot of adjusting, but it can be done). I know many people that make ends meet on that kind of money. You may be on a tight budget, but isn't peace of mind and pride worth it ?

I doubt you 'hate to break it to us guys' as you claim.  To the contrary, even though there may be some element of truth in some of what you've said, your entire post reeks with a certain vindictiveness.

You obviously have had certain experiences in your life that have left you quite bitter toward men in general.  Sorry for that, but it's your problem to deal with..not mine.  However, I doubt that painting all men with the same broad brush is any sort of answer.  And while you try to sound sympathetic toward the providers, you're really doing the same thing with them by virtue of your generalizations.

I don't know how others feel, but I personally resent the charterization that I (you gave every indication you mean ALL men) am some pathetic damn fool who is so gullible that I believe everything any provider has ever said to stroke my ego & cause me to think my little cock takes precedent over everything else that I may have in my life.  Get a grip lady!  You've got a long way to go before you are in a postion to presume to know so much that you can dish out advise to others on their personal lives!!

First you say this:

"I can guarantee that 99% of the providers cringe while they are even touching you"

Then you say this:

"Guys- treat these women with respect and remember they have a heart and feelings. They aren't just a piece of meat to fuck."

Repect is a two-way street.  It's OK to bash on the feelings of most "hobbyists", but I guess it isn't OK to do the same thing for providers.  I bet you are a dyke.

I think some of you guys are being tough on Sara.  However, that being said, I do agree that she is very angry and really should try very hard to let that go.
Sara-It can be very hard to get rid af all the anger from your past.  I know because I speak from experience.

But Guys, most of what she says is completely true.  I have not been in this hobby long, but I have always had a problem connecting with the providers for exactly that reason.  Yes, the good ones put on a great act, but lets face it guys, we are not getting laid on our own because we can't.  Sure, there are a percentage of you out there that are very good looking and probably did well with the ladies and now you are just looking for some discreet action.  But, for the most part, these girls are absolutely NOT at all attracted to us and are most likely completely grosed out.  Sara - it was not some huge news flash that you wrote.  We know.

Anyway, the bottom line is, I do see providers that are good at making me feel attractive.  But, I am also turned off when they go too far.  I know who I am and what I am doing and I am comfortable with that.  However, I will always know that at least 95% of these girls would rather be doing something else than me.

You refer to clients as "unattractive out of shape 40 something married" men.  You further state the only time you enjoyed what you were doing was when you were with a "gorgeous 30 year old athlete."

Now we know why you hated being a provider.  Your clients weren't good looking enough!  They weren't all gorgeous 30 year old athletes!  Lady, you've got to be the most shallow and petty person I've seen post on this board, male or female.

You say you were a provider for "many years."  What's the matter.  Did nature catch up to you like it does to all of us?  No longer have that youthful body that gorgeous 30 year old athletes, or even unattractive out of shape 40 something married men, will pay to touch?

Go cry in your beer someplace else.  If you want to recruit a sisterhood of bitter ex-providers, start your own web site.

PS: I bet that "gorgeous 30 year old athlete" didn't give a rat's behind whether you were having fun or not.  I'm sure all he cared about was if he was having fun.

Yeah, the nature of the "transaction".  Is it all about lies and greed, or is there some element of human warmth buried in there?  Let's try an analogy that can be expanded somewhat to help get a handle on the issue.  Sara mentioned that "stripping" could be a way to make an "honest" living.  I've logged quite a few hours in the local topless place since my wife filed for divorce, so I think I know how it works.  A woman flirts with a man, asks if he wants a dance, then strips and does whatever is allowed in that establishment to arouse him.  When the music stops, he gives her some money.  Some of the women I have spent this kind of time with were genuinely friendly, comfortable, more or less extroverts who seemed to enjoy the attention.  Then there were the cold fish, women who looked right through you.  Sometimes they were the best looking ones.  So, was there any real feeling coming from the friendly ones?  And if that is an "honest" way to make a living, how much of a stretch is it to imagine one of those women prolonging the dance until the man is naked and she gives him an orgasm somehow, who cares how?  The point is, the touching and smiling and appearing to be involved are all on a scale of 0 to 100.  As long as the woman is never forced, and never forces herself because she can't easily say "no", then where is the damage done?  And as for the business model that requires a man to plunk down money upon arrival at a woman's room, I'd like to know who tought that up?  Why can't somebody figure out that both parties could be more picky if the encounter started in a neutral situation like a couple of drinks or coffee.  The woman could opt out just as readily as the man, right?  Is there some rulebook on how this gets played?  Speaking of women feeling pressured, I am quite sure there are zillions of married couples in counselling right now, trying to help the wife get over the feeling that she is "obligated" to have sex with her husband because he wants it more than she does.  It's the same old story, but from within a marriage.  Women who think they are being used or cheated will feel resentful and will blame the man, whether he is a john or a husband, or a boyfriend.  As for Sara's revelation that sex for money is a sham, all I can say is, "wow, thank god someone smarter than me pointed it out so I wouldn't be misled."  Seems the world is chock full of people ready and willing to point out how misguided and wrongheaded the rest of us are.  But the vast majority of us go on buying shit we don't need, falling for salespitches that are a lot of hot air, succumbing to the urge to try to buy status or peace, or knowledge, and worst of all, electing self righteous, intensely pious assholes to positions of immense power like Attorney General (yes, I know he's appointed) or President.  OK, I'm done for now.  Somebody else take over.....

Man, I haven't read such controversial stuff since I started posting on TER 2 years ago. This stuff is great. Man, I love this site.

A thoughtful post. Again, there is some truth to this and in a way you are really off base. If we like you and we want you there, trust me, you'll know. If we don't, well then, we don't take the appointment nor your gift. That's the difference between a REAL honest provider and a businesswoman.

I was flamed when I came into a while ago for turning people away at the gates but better to not take an asswhole than put myself through an hour of misery. When you see a web site that says that a girl is "selective", it does not mean she sees rich men, it means that how a gentleman conducts himself on the phone and the first 10 minutes through the door, will determine whether a lady will take the appointment and perhaps what she do.

The lady who will royally kiss your ass for an hour when you know it's probably all bullshit....is the same one who doesn't get any flack. She's ALL bullshit. And some guys don't mind. Afterall, it's a fantasy. She's an actress. The lady who is enjoying herself is likely to be more low key unless of course she thinks you are wonderful, then she's just being honest. It takes a while to get to know someone and click with someone, just as in dating. There are some guys that flock to providers that will stoke their egos. There are some guys that can see through all that and say "oh man, that one's all bullshit so what CAN I believe?" Some providers tell it like it is, are a gradual opening and take the time to get to know you to make any summations or complements. In my opinion, that's the real GFE. When a guy tells me after several times together or after a lot of research/homework, that he chooses to see me for a specific reason, I'm more apt to feel it heartfully. When a stranger that I don't know at all complements me, I appreciate it, but I don't feel it as deeply.

I think it's pretty obvious which providers are in it for what reasons and I think those reasons change over time. Sometimes, it's pure animal stuff. Othertimes, a girl might be lonely and in the mood for some company. Still other times, if someone is pretty darn fascinating on the phone, she really might want to meet him. If she wants to see him for the rent, she'll be pushing him out the door as soon as possible. If she wants to appreciate what he has to offer in "other" ways, she won't LET him reach mecca until she's had her fill. How can you fake that? If a lady is timing things just so....that she is prolonging the quest or asking the man to hold off on lighting the cake for 45 min to 2 hours so she can have fun, then how can it be about $.

That's why some girls only do 2-3 hour appointments. So ladies  are using you for your bodies and your money. That is so friggin' hot I think I'm going to touch myself!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

HB

Most of us can actually see the forest from the trees.  I don't know whether or not my provider buddies achieve orgasm when we're together.  Frankly, I don't really care.  And I don't know if they think I'm gross.  Again, that's not my concern.  I'm also well aware that many providers have some deep-seated issues concerning men and sexuality.  That's not my business.  That's their problem, not mine.  So long as they play their role in my fantasy, I'm happy.  With respect to the "ownership of their bodies" stuff..well, I didn't put a gun to anyone's head and force anyone to become a prostitute.  We all make decisions in our lives, and we all have to live with those decisions.  When  visit a lady, I check my feelings at the door and focus on the physical.  That's why I'm there.  I'm a client, not a father/confessor.

Well, it's nice to know you care. We love you too.

Yes I do think that anytime you give of yourself physically when you are not in a two way emotionally healthy relationship you loose some of yourself...if you do not replace it you will be damaged. There are however a multitudes of things one can do to nourish their souls so that that does not happen. I am not speaking of damaged done by guilt as I don't do guilt. It is unproductive and I am not ashamed. I am talking about your life energy. The same energy that is sapped when a person spends a great deal of time caring for others and not theirself or working to hard at an unfulfilling job that creates a great deal of stress. One of those jobs inparticular is stripping. It is not only physically exhausting but it is full of all kinds of dysfunctional people who have drug, alcohol and emotional problems with which you have no choice but to have to deal with. It is also a job that gets little respect AND is difficult to hide from those that judge. As far as my son and my being safe. Well he is too young to know or be affected by my job and screening well can make you safe from all but the most serious of psychopaths with no regard for getting caught as if they have gotten through my screening they will get caught. I do admit that most women do not employ some of the basic things that I do to ensure my safety. There are also alot of dangers in other jobs and injuries sustained during them that can be just as threatening...i do not feel that when done properly this job is any more dangerous than most. like I said in my original post we should all be looking to do something else eventually but we shouldn't feel guilty about what we are doing and beat ourselves up about it. Face it you are lashing out because you have unresolved issues and your argument is not well thought out and is lacking in it's very one sided point of view. Yes there are lenty of women in this business that shouldn't be and there are even more that subject themselves to things everyday that they shouldn't in other areas of their lives for all kinds of dysfunctional and unhealthy reasons. It is not the act of having sex with a stranger or someone you wouldn't otherwise that is damaging it is how you feel about yourself before you entered the room that creates the damage and how you deal with it afterwards that decides if it is permanent.

To the real truth – lady you are pathetic. I am a provider. I see you say you are out of the business but you are still involved, why?  You say you were young when you became a provider and were in it for the money, (that is understandable). But if it was so vile why did you stay? And, Why are you hear now?

This business isn’t for everyone. You new it was not for you, and you chose to do it any way.

This starts with money on both sides, but it is more then just money. And if you are not getting something else out of your job besides money, then you are in the wrong business no matter what kind of business you are in.

It is obvious that you did things that you didn’t want to do, in the name of money.

And that line about not having ownership of your own body, what kind of trash is that. If you feel you gave bits and pieces of yourself away you have no one to blame but you.  No one made you do anything.  YOU chose to do it.  

And there are a lot of woman that do not like to have intimate relations with the men in their lives because they don’t like sex.  And they’re not in the business.

You’re not against money for sex. You’re against sex on any level. It is very apparent that you hate sex and men.

I feel sorry for you. Look what you have turned yourself into.  Your bitter, lonely, and do not know what to do with your life.  You can’t love because you are filled with hate.

Find yourself a good shrink and work through your hatred.  Find out who you really are. And get out of the business and off the boards. The boards are a way for you to stay involved.

Your are the last person I would want to take to about my personal life.
                                    Get help!!!

                         Scarlet Rose

I do not feel that I am in any postion to attack anyone, I can
only judge myself and control myself, and dear sara the same
holds true for anyone else such as you. You got into something
that tears at your very being, and ya know what it is the same
for me! and now is as good as any time to say good bye to this
community and to wish you all the best! And to offer some hope
to all in saying that I have grown so much emotionally in the
past few years and now I feel the need to put this kind of life
into my past and to move forward, And from the bottom of my
heart I want to offer an apology to any provider that I have
seen, that if I hurt them or took away a part of there self
esstem or left them hating or bitter, then sorry! and for those
providers who used me and left me feeling empty I will say that
I forgive you for using me and stealing away my self respect.
cause after all I let you do what you did to me and only I
could stop you. You see Sara this is where I have grown the
most, it is called accounting for ones own actions, taking
responsibilty for ones choices made in life. I take full
responsibilty for my actions, no forced me to do as I did.
and I got tried of hating myself for the deeds that were less
than worthy to my fellow human beings, As I said at the start
of this post, I am a very loving and caring person! I am a good
person, it was never my intention to hurt any one else let alone
myself. and to anyone who may care to look in the mirror I can
say don't hold judgement over me until you have fully accounted
for your own actions! and Sara this includes you! I would like
for you to stand in the mirror and take a good long look at
your self and ask yourself if you ever bought any harm to
your fellow sisters and brothers? and once you have done so
and accounted for actions and seeked out those whom you have
done wrong and offered a sincere apology from your heart then
you may stand and judge me! but not before you have accounted
for your actions!  thank you to all of you wonderful folks
who have allowed me to use this as a soap box. and to all of
you I wish for your God whom ever it may be to bless each and
every day of you life! so long and HEY take care of YOURSELFS!
                          THE TROOPER

is a greeting and not her name. In Sanskrit "Namas" means, bow,  obeisance, reverential salutation." It comes from the root Nam, which carries meanings of bending, bowing, humbly submitting and becoming silent. "Te" means "to you."  Thus "namaste" means "I bow to you." Just a little tidbit for you.

Anyhow, I wanted to comment on your post. I am not your typical provider, I am working on my second bachelor's degree and have a family and a very full and satisfying life. My part time work as a domme and a massage provider helps me make enough income to make me happy and brings me perhaps a handful of clients a week, many of them regulars. However, I do what I do not only for the money but because I enjoy it. I chose to have the limits I do because that is what is right for me. I stick to being a domme and an fbsm girl because know that I would make a very poor escort. I know that I would feel violated, much like you did. As it is now, I feel comfortable and happy "taking care" of my clients. Just as I enjoy taking care of my sick and injured clients at the hospital, I also I enjoy tending to their needs of healthy and happy clients in a way that is relatively inexpensive simple, basic, safe and enjoyable for both of us.

I think that you made a lot of good points but you went about it all wrong by calling hobbyists "stupid" in the first line. What could have been a very helpful and informative exchange between the two groups has now deteriorated into namecalling and defensiveness.

And BTW, I was a stripper too and must take issue with your narrow characterization of it as "honest" work. Yes, the working eight hours sweating your ass off in a club was honest work, I felt I earned every dime. BUT, is it honest work to rub all over those men, lead them on and send them home without any satisfaction every night? If a man is going to strip club purely for entertainment value, such as going to the movies, then it's a fun time. But if a man is going there to get some attention, satisfaction and TLC from a pretty girl (and let's face it that's mostly what they're there for), then the cost/value ratio of what they get is very low. In THAT respect, escorting or fbsm seems to be much more of an "honest" job. There's none of that smoke and mirrors teasing and tormenting and misleading that one has to do as a stripper in order to extract the really big bucks from the client. I wouldn't call that particularly honest work, in fact some nights I felt quite bad about it.

Yes, I really do enjoy my job. In a few short years I'll be an R.N. and I will most likely stop seeing altogether. And believe it or not, I will miss the nice people I've met along the way. But, unlike you I'm not going to feel some sense of superiority that I have passed that stage in my life. It will just be time to move on. For you the time to move on has come and you've done it. Good for you. Everyone else will get there when they get there, and some of us not at all. But that's ok too.

MM

-- Modified on 10/21/2002 8:26:09 PM

for some of you who feel compelled to write these long posts, to break them up in to paragraphs? When the subject changes a bit, please start a new paragraph.

It makes it a lot easier to read, see. MfSD.

So much has already been said here that it's hard to add anything new. The main thing I will say is that the only times I have felt like I was doing something I shouldn't be doing and that the ladies involved were probably in the same frame of mind, is at strip clubs. I have only been a few times, mainly because of the masssive eye candy, but I always felt bad when leaving. Not because of how much I spent or that I didn't get "satisfaction" but because I really felt used and I felt like the ladies doing the work were not into what they were doing at all. The whole scene in these places reeks of greed. I have almost never felt that from escorts I've seen.

I'm sorry that you feel the way you do. Sometimes I wish I could walk away from this "hobby" but I know that right now in my life I can't. I do look forward to a day when I can put this activity behind me but at the same time I have met some wonderful women that I would never have had a chance to meet otherwise. I know they probably don't care about me. But I also feel that maybe I have left something behind besides just the cash that they will be affected by in a positive way.

One last thing, and Heather touched on it already. I have never been turned away by an escort and I was kind of surprised when a lady once told me that she has turned guys away, even after they show up. So there are always choices available.

I too resent implication that all men have such fragile egos that they desperately need to pay someone to tell them what they want to hear.  This hobby makes up a very small portion of my life and does in no way effect my feelings of self worth.

I also agree that her post is far more cathartic than she wishes to admit.  She does have some issues--in fact her issues have issues.

Trooper - I'm not sure if your post was serious or mocking.  If it was mocking - then great job!  Because to apologize to all the providers you saw, whose lives you possibly ruined - is utter sugar coated god fearing BS!  What about the cash you gave them to help them live their lives?!!  The 250 - 500 an hour?!  

Do you also apologize to your lawyer for the same reason - I mean, come on, everyone knows Layers have to do some of the scummiest things on earth.  We should be apologizing to them for paying them and enabling them to stay in that terrible line of work - oh, and how about car salesmen - dispicable job and trash collectors - and maids and plumbers and street cleaners - are you going to stop putting your trash out, buying a used beamer or shitting in your toilet because you don't want to contribute to these people's terrible lives??  

Christ almighty - this is a board devoted to sex for money.  It is the one place to go NOT TO FEEL GUILTY.  There's a reason this gal came on here and dropped this "bomb" - because she misses the attention of her former profession (if she ever was a provider OR a woman for that matter).

It's the same thing when an investor takes a bath on a stock and sells.  All he does afterwards is bad mouth the stock, the company and everyone associated with it.  Nothing new here.

Yup. I feel so bad for giving her hundreds of dollars so I could rub her body for an hour and insert my penis into her vagina. You heard it, guys. Let's all quit the hobby and let the poor miserable providers find REAL jobs just like the rest of us. But wait,who will stroke my fragile ego? Hmmm. Maybe I could buy a puppy.

"The women are damaging their own well being and etching away another small peice of their heart, dignity and soul.  You are obviously intellgent enough to manipulate these men and make money in this game, therefore you are intelligent enough to do something that makes you smile and feel good when you look in the mirror.

1)  I've damaged nothing just the opposite my journey has opened doors that allowed for a period of extreme personal growth and understanding.

2)  I manipulate no one, and I am highly intelligent and I AM DOING SOMETHING THAT MAKES ME SMILE AND FEEL GOOD.  I enjoy every minute of it---and my percentages are reversed of yours.  In all the times I've done this maybe 1% of the time I had an experience that made me cringe.  And those experiences had absolutely nothing to do about the clients appearance it was about what he said that made me uncomfortable.


I have worked since I was 12 at babysitting than on to a waitress job at 16. I have held that golden job that you for the moment are enjoying.  Let's see how you do the first time you get downsized or new technology replaces the job you've always done.

I'm not sure what set you off to make this post.  You would be great for the media--your attitude is the one that always is grapped on to and throw out to the rest of the world that gives this such ugly PR.

I hope you are trying to educate yourself and I suggest you save this post to read after a few academic endeavours are under your belt. Than read what you wrote here today. You will cringe again and it won't be because of some man touching you.  You'll see the rawness of your presentation and how you spoke on behalf of us that didn't ask you too.  You are more wrong than you are right---and your points are about YOU and not the rest of us.  Unless you've polled 1000's of we providers your statements are opinions and should not be presented like they are facts.

The way you described the men and women involved in this hobby was for the most part negative.  In trying to change the minds of the world that this service has a positive good, we just lost ground and fell back in your sad post.  

Man, are you really that hung up on style when the content is so compelling?  Steinbeck didn't give a shit about how long his sentences were.

I asked, and I asked nicely. My eyesight isn't what it used to be, and I have a hard time reading these longer posts, even with glasses. You OK with that? MfSD.

or, have you noticed that the stuff you put out there is the same stuff that keeps coming back atcha ?

If the same patterns in your life repeat like a skipping cd, or
a scratched record as we used to say way back when, that's a fair indicator that you are setting yourself up for failure.

Sounds to me like you got indoctrinated into masochistic life
scripts early on, then you create all these situations that serve to confirm preconceived notions about how life, sex, love
really is.

News you can use. The sexiest thing is free will. What turns me on the most is the knowledge that the woman is free to choose her responses. Neurotic, shut down, and/or caged personality
types aren't a lot of fun to be around. They also tend to bring out less than the best in the people they come in contact with.

You can't assume that all relations between men and women, or I guess between men and men in some circumstances, or women and women, are fatally warped simply because there is a direct financial calculation involved.

You may find this hard to believe, but I have a long term friendship with a person in the biz whom I rarely have the chance to seebecause of lifestle choices, work opportunities, etc... but we communicate between weekly and daily and  it turns out to be a really nice thing between two people that has a lot of mutual support, respect, sly humor and basically its one more reason to live.

I just wanted to point out that I'm amazed at the responses to this thread.  I had expcected that there would be tons of flames after a post like this, but most of the responses are either constructive, or saying "please don't speak for me."

I think that the responses demonstrate that a lot of people in this hobby do not have experiences like Sara's and actually care about each other.

There was a news piece recently on smiling, and why most people can readily discern when someone is faking a smile. The thrust is that a "real" smile involves not only the facial muscles near the mouth which can easily fake a smile, but also those near the eye which can't. With a GFE that is much more complicated to execute than a smile, it would be much more difficult (and exhausting) to fake it. Undergoing something that you obviously detest on a daily basis would be a real strain, and could account for the burn-out and hostility that is apparent in your post.

I would take issue with your arguments that clients are deluding themselves if they think there is any reality in their hobbying experiences with providers. Perhaps it is so that providers detest us. Even if that is true, my reply is so what?

People are masters of illusion - they absolutely revel in it. We go to movies to be entertained, knowing full well that it is all artificial and unreal. We read fictional books for much the same reason. Throughout the day, we use all kinds of symbols (i.e., currency, ledgers, writing etc.) that are so distant from reality that it takes us twenty years to learn how to manipulate them successfully. If our Cro-Magnon ancestors were to visit us for a day, they'd probably be wondering why weren't doing something useful with our time, like going out and bagging babes and mastodons, instead of sitting in front of computer screens.

So, if all you wonderful providers have been scamming me my entire life, making me think that you were enjoying yourselves when I was with you, all I can say is: More power to you. It was real for me, and that's enough.


-- Modified on 10/22/2002 9:19:23 AM

-- Modified on 10/22/2002 9:21:05 AM

MfSD - I started laughing when I read your post. Solid blocks of text, such as the post you were referring to, are indeed difficult to read. Paragraphs are a great invention and should be used where needed.

DAMN! I always find these posts after everyone else has already said what I wanted to say!

Look, I have fun on my dates. Either my providers have fun on my dates or they act the part. Either way, I go home happy and they go home richer. God bless America. Enough said.

A thoughtful response from a lady who would appeal to me.  I seek out ladies that are comfortable with me, and vice versa. The other posters on this thread can't convince me there aren't honest men and women in this hobby.  Thanks for your reminder.

Have got to agree with scotdaman!  

But, don't you ladies realize that some of us are at work trying to get business done, so we can come and see you'al, and we try to read the boards on occasion during the day and then we come across messages like Heathers & NOSC, and NOW HOW ARE WE SUPPOSED TO CONCENTATE))LOL

In the end, it is all about honesty, communication and connecting.  If you connect with someone, at whatever level, you will or may enjoy yourselves.  If not, then it's up to each person, provider or hobbyist, to say so and move on, or go through the motions for the pure physicality of it.  You still have that choice as an individual and must be honest with yourself.

Take Care,

SoCalTroy

p.s.:  With regard to length of private meetings, I don't care who you are, you more than likely will not connect or even get that comfortable with someone when you meet for 1 hour.  Hell, I typically take 10-20 minutes just to relax from the drive over in Los Angeles traffic to wherever we may be meeting, unless I've made the hotel/outcall arrangements (which does have it's advantages and drawbacks).  This is the primary reason why I personally prefer minimums of 2 hours, and why I think more and more providers are going the minimum route as well.  Why rush a fantasy?  Let it develop and take on it's own life. (JMHO)

-- Modified on 10/22/2002 12:45:25 PM

This isn't about love or relationships or anything real or meaningful.  This is about fantasy and adult playtime.  It is a business, remember?  Everything else is hype, sugarcoating, and self-delusion.

What need is there for me to feel guilty? I haven't hurt anyone in this hobby.
 She comes off as such a self rightous wench! I am sorry
that she is so bitter, But to attack me and try to lay guilt at
my feet for her choices, well I don't think so.

I too am happy to see that responses to this thread are for the most part healthy in their outlook and advice to this young lady. There can be a large burnout factor involved in this business but it has everything to do with how a provider feels about love, sex, and herself and all the baggage that she brings into it.

Ideally I think a lady shouldn't get involved in the business untill she is over 21 and if she has no history of self destuctive behavior and abusive relationships. I find myself more and more wanting to get out of the business but it isn't because of the men I meet. They are what keep me in it. It is because health insurance, a regular paycheck and a 401K look better and better in this slower economy.

I have to admit I would also like to have another relationship soon and I think having a healthy one while involved in this business is very difficult. It would be nice to have soemone to wake up to in the morning on a regular basis. Or just a regular couch snuggling movie watching buddy. Until then I have my Dog

at even the mention of "401K, health insurance" and benefits on my last post! *wink*

In Regards, to the "faking it" part of whats her names post, Kindly speak for yourself girlie-girl! I LUST sex, orgasms and uninhibited debauchery. And, I don't care WHAT the guy looks like or HOW old he is (as long as hes clean and doesn't have odor issues) I can "ooooooooo" and "awwwwwwwww" all night long. But, when my kitty gets that oh-so-perfect stroke, I am purrrrring like a tiger! Maybe you don't have many orgasms sara. So, it may difficult for you to relate. Hell, I faked orgasms the entire duration of my first marriage! But, now look out. Its all about ME!



oh! one other thing...regarding your comments about men "cheating on their (paraphrase) beautiful wives". It is my honest and adament opinion that men just can't help themselves no matter what. Its a "gender" trait. I'll give you an example. A man driving in a car has a drop-dead-gorgeous lady riding next him. She looks pleasant enough and smiles at his glance. I roll up next to him at a stop light (out of her view) and slide my tongue seductively over my lips, wink at him and mouth the words.."wanna fuck?" For the next 3 stop lights he is desparately trying to figure out a way to get my number for later so he can fuck me. They just can't help themselves! I could be some nasty ol' skank and Brigette Bardot (the younger version) can be seated next to him and its odesn't matter. Hes had her already. Its the quest, hunt, and challenge of another untapped pussy wandering out there aimlessly that men must have.

I don't see this as a character flaw, just a gender propencity. In short, men think with their dicks. So what? Accept it, get over it. If you're the wife or significant other expect the worst and hope for the best  It would make the world alot less catty!...........*meow********
Carol

Thats a good part about not having time to read the boards every day lately. Someone is bound to have already made the point I wanted to make, and I can just ditto them.

"My goal is to make people aware and give a second thought to what they are doing."

Um, who are you to make people aware of what they're doing?  I mean do you really think these grown women don't know what they're doing?  Do you expect us to believe that you didn't know what YOU were doing? OK. So you changed  your mind and decided to do something else.  Goody for you. Why don't  you just leave it at that and take your Holier than thou attitude and put it where the filthy old 40 year olds used to put their peckers. 40. That's funny.  

Another thing, chi doesn't disapate no matter what you've been told. You have an infinite supply not to mention the energy your clients send your way when they cum inside you.  That's why guys go to sleep and women start cleaning the house after sex.

I'm single, rich, and very good looking. I have providers calling me 20 to 30 times a week and I don't think it's just for my few little pennies they'll earn. Some of them...well most in my view...do cum, and they CUM HARD. Faking it and having the client fooled isn't as easy as you make it seem.  But if what you say is true, I'd go broke with all the women that call and say they want to fake it with me again. LOL

Oh...did I mention I'm over 40?  Puh-leeze lady. Give us some semblence of a break.

This is a hobby. We're having fun. I make sure my providers are having fun too.  This didn't get to be the world's oldest profession because we men disgust the providers of the world.  I don't think so.  

Peace 'n all that,
fds

It's not a matter of style dipwad, it's a matter of grammar. Paragraphs were invented for a reason. The hell with Steinbeck and every other jerk that hasn't figured out what the hell a paragraph is. The gentlemen's request is a valid one and you and Steinbeck can go take a hike!!!!




It's not a matter of style dipwad, it's a matter of grammar. Paragraphs were invented for a reason. The hell with Steinbeck and every other jerk that hasn't figured out what the hell a paragraph is. The gentlemen's request is a valid one and you and Steinbeck can go take a hike.It's not a matter of style dipwad, it's a matter of grammar. Paragraphs were invented for a reason. The hell with Steinbeck and every other jerk that hasn't figured out what the hell a paragraph is. The gentlemen's request is a valid one and you and Steinbeck can go take a hike.It's not a matter of style dipwad, it's a matter of grammar. Paragraphs were invented for a reason. The hell with Steinbeck and every other jerk that hasn't figured out what the hell a paragraph is. The gentlemen's request is a valid one and you and Steinbeck can go take a hike.It's not a matter of style dipwad, it's a matter of grammar. Paragraphs were invented for a reason. The hell with Steinbeck and every other jerk that hasn't figured out what the hell a paragraph is. The gentlemen's request is a valid one and you and Steinbeck can go take a hike.It's not a matter of style dipwad, it's a matter of grammar. Paragraphs were invented for a reason. The hell with Steinbeck and every other jerk that hasn't figured out what the hell a paragraph is. The gentlemen's request is a valid one and you and Steinbeck can go take a hike.It's not a matter of style dipwad, it's a matter of grammar. Paragraphs were invented for a reason. The hell with Steinbeck and every other jerk that hasn't figured out what the hell a paragraph is. The gentlemen's request is a valid one and you and Steinbeck can go take a hike.It's not a matter of style dipwad, it's a matter of grammar. Paragraphs were invented for a reason. The hell with Steinbeck and every other jerk that hasn't figured out what the hell a paragraph is. The gentlemen's request is a valid one and you and Steinbeck can go take a hike.It's not a matter of style dipwad, it's a matter of grammar. Paragraphs were invented for a reason. The hell with Steinbeck and every other jerk that hasn't figured out what the hell a paragraph is. The gentlemen's request is a valid one and you and Steinbeck can go take a hike.It's not a matter of style dipwad, it's a matter of grammar. Paragraphs were invented for a reason. The hell with Steinbeck and every other jerk that hasn't figured out what the hell a paragraph is. The gentlemen's request is a valid one and you and Steinbeck can go take a hike.It's not a matter of style dipwad, it's a matter of grammar. Paragraphs were invented for a reason. The hell with Steinbeck and every other jerk that hasn't figured out what the hell a paragraph is. The gentlemen's request is a valid one and you and Steinbeck can go take a hike.  lol

Carol, you have us men nailed. Now if I could just nail you we'd be even - LOL!

I guess I come to this discussion a little late - people have already said most of what I'd say.  I mean, if you hated it that much, then why did you do it at all?  Not all of us providers have issues about ownership of our bodies.

I'd also like to add that I did have a 'real' job, a few of them, in the corporate world for a number of years - dressing for success, kissing ass and stroking egos to get ahead, using my God given talents in the service of the almighty dollar...  Now THAT was prostitution!!

-Anya

The truth for this girl is her reality. So be it. Politicians who have no regrets have no conscience usually. Almost any occupation comes with some issues. Car salesman lie everyday and live with themselves. The only thing that bothered me was your part about cringing when you touched an unattractive guy. The first time that happened you should have quit. Hey, Ron Jeremy is one ugly unattractive MoFo, but I know a guy who is friends with Ron Jeremy and he says Ron has women come up to him in public all the time and offer to do him. His Man meat obviously makes up for the rest of his Warthog Hairy ass. Anyway, trying to come here and tell everyone how horrible all of this is is quite bad. I personally go out of my way to be respectful and fun with the ladies on the phone and especially when we meet to put them at ease. I also enjoy spanking them, pulling their hair, and having my happy ending wherever they will let me. It doesn't mean they cringe, it just means they put on a good show. I've actually gone out on dates a few times for no charge with lasies I have met through this. So continue your healing and honestly, move on.

As a long-suffering editor of scientific prose, may I say both LOL and right-on to your above post. Strunk & White forever!!

Yeah, same with me. I don't automatically take any work that comes my way. If I don't want to work for/with someone, I don't. Money or no money.

Sorry to hear about your misfortune btw. Big hug of condolence.

I am not surprised that some of the ladies develop a strong dislike for their current and former clients.  This is a stressful job.  Some ladies are ill-equipped emotionally or lack of street-smarts to be successful in this business.  Others take advantage of the contacts and the good money they can earn from their clients to save up or advance their personal well beings and careers outside of this business.  There are also a few ladies that truly enjoyed the attention, the clientele, the monetary rewards and the sex they got in this profession.  Every now and then, these ladies gained satisfaction from the pleasure they brought to some of their clients.  All these are nothing new to regular readers of this board.

A close analogy to the escort profession is that of defense attorney.  Quite a few of them have a strong dislike about their jobs and their clients.  A large number of them are indifferent to the various cases they handled and just offered their professional skill to make their clients’ situation better within the law.  A few of them are extremely successful and love the challenge.  There are also the unusual kinds that offer pro-bono or cut-rate services to the disadvantaged defendants that have high likelihood of being innocent.  They got their satisfactions from setting free the wrongly accused.

Quite often the determination of whether someone becomes a burnout are their perceptions of the career they have chosen, the reasons for choosing that career, the efforts they put up versus the rewards they received, their current financial, personal and relational circumstances, and the aspirations they have for themselves.  Usually if the compensation is big enough, that will overshadow the other factors and prolongs the day of reckoning.

I have met a few ladies in the past that have become close friends of mine.  Since sex is no longer involved in these friendships, we are just like buddies and not afraid to tell each other their shortcomings.  I have a good understanding of what ladies have to go through in this business and have some ideas about how they truly felt about a number of their clients.  My friends were fortunate enough not to be burnouts.  One recalled fondly about the sexual prowess of a client and the great business acumens of another.  The other told me about her wild nights of passion and the excitement and adventures she had when she started escorting in Chicago in the mid 80s.

Sarac1 obviously has a huge wound in her psyche.  Many members have responded directly to her remarks and there is no need for me to do so.  I wish her the best.  The teachings of Buddhism work well in pacifying emotional turmoil.  There are lots of beautiful things in life.  It is far more productive to move on and seek new endeavors than remunerate mistakes and sufferings in the past.

Your sense of self, and how strong your sense of self is. If your ego is strong, I don't think there is much that can harm it, honestly. At least that is how I feel. I mean there have been times when something someone said irritated me or bugged me or just PISSED me off... but it does not hurt my SELF in any way.   I think that in most people, there is some redeeming quality... it is very rare that I cannot find something to like, or at least to empathize with, in a person.  And thus it is a very rare occassion indeed when I cannot find the value in giving a little bit of pleasure, comfort, and happiness to someone.  

What I do is 100% about ME.  Thus if it did not fulfill me in SOME way to give pleasure to others, I frankly wouldn't be here.

I can see that this profession was not the right one for YOU, and there are many people for whom it is not right... but to assume for ME that *I* cringe everytime (or most of the times) I am touched by a client is... well, just as asinine as assuming that all of us are drug addicts, uneducated, dirty, and whatever other stereotypes are floating around out there.  

You sound bitter and harmed by your experience in this industry and for that I am sorry for YOU that you did not have the strength to stop it sooner.  I can say that I tried it once before, about six years ago and I was NOT ready for it... and I stopped it at once... I didn't spend years doing it and then try to blame the MEN for my problems! The money did not have value to me if it meant harming my SELF and at that time, my self was not strong enough to handle it. Now it is.  I'm sorry yours wasn't... but whose responsibility is it to make those choices for you? The men? Or YOU?  

Nicole

Heather, after viewing your wonderful site it surprises me not that you would write such an insightful response.

All I can say is: Here! Here!

jm