I have been asked for references.  Why would a competing "business" give a reference.  Most ladies travel and may actually be in the area.  I like to switch up sometimes.  Some I review and some request not to be reviewed.  What if the ladies do not want to be used like that ?

Some may even get offended.  I am sure.  Maybe, this is a ramble, but seriously why ?

1. Reciprocity
Any woman who expects references could reasonably infer from her own expectation that she should GIVE references too.

2. Part of what is being sold is variety
While there are certainly some guys out there who only see one provider; most hobbyists see quite a few. Part of the "value" of the provider to a great many hobbyists is that she is someone he hasn't seen before. So encouraging this overall can be beneficial. The provider who gives a reference today for you to see someone else is the provider who will be receiving three references tomorrow to serve as the next guys' "variety."

3. A provider who won't give references will eventually find other providers hesitant about giving her references. Ultimately, she hurts herself.

4. References are about safety, not transfer of business.

the value added is some assurance of safety and risk reduction. many providers help each other out with references in order to reduce risks.

some providers see that as incurring other risks and prefer to screen clients independently of exchanging references.

your reason for not giving a reference, "it helps the competition", is very short term profit oriented. most of the well established ladies in the business, whether they participate in exchanging references or not, are too good at business to think that way.

Bazinga! Unlike Sheldon..I say that word as  positive affirmation.

What comes around goes around. A professinal escort doesn't have a problem as previous posts have mentioned,they understand many of us want the variety of seeing different providers.  And sometimes a provider will even tell you about another escort you might enjoy.

Who can say why a provider does or does not provide references?  

I'm sure there's some aspect of self delusional safety going on, but by and large it's about commerce.

I've had more issues over this "reference" business than anything else.  Providers who don't respond and providers who wonder why I'm not seeing them instead of someone else.  I've given up even attempting the reference dance.  

This has been discussed ad nauseum and I just don't buy all the fodder about safety.

i give references for one reason only, and that is because i wish to please my clients.

however, references are not a part of my screening process, and in fact it is a huge negative if a gentleman contacts me for the first time providing references from other providers. i take this as a sign that he is not the type of client for me. i do not want those clients (who likely represent the majority in the hobby world) who are simply out for variety and NSA fun. i want those clients who are missing some emotional as well as physical connection in their lives. who will actually NEED what i have to offer, as opposed to just wanting my body.

this means that while i will not hesitate to provide a reference when requested, i will also take a reference request as a sign that i have made an error somewhere along the way in judging this man's needs and desires. it would mean that any sexual relationship we had once shared would be over.

some ladies prefer to stay pretty UTR and simply don't want to be that connected to the community at large. they see risks in relying on the reference system for their safety.

references are a system for safety, etc. but no system is perfect. _every_ system has an exploitable weakness.

consider a scenario where a lady gets in some sort of relatively big trouble. she may be coerced to provide references for someone who is not legit.

i am sure it's rare, but for some ladys's situations, it is an unacceptable risk.

there is just no one way to do this that fits everyone and every situation.

I don't see many providers. Locally, I might "interview" a couple before settling on one; but once I do, I'll see her occasionally for a long time. (I switch if the lady leaves the business, becomes seriously unreliable due to personal issues, goes to jail for terrorism, etc.)

Because I am still hoping that at some point I'll be able to abandon the hobby and have my needs met at home; I don't want to have any heavy duty bonding. Friendship? Sure. But I'm simply not comfortable with having physiological bonding to a woman I PAY, and furthermore will need to stop seeing sexually when things improve elsewhere.

The easiest way to interrupt that is by interspersing other sexual partners, which I do about 3x annually. Usually, these are ladies I have seen before as well.

So, in practice, I am insufficiently promiscuous to be able to provide "3 current references."

One reference? Sure. Two references? Maybe. Depending. Three references? Almost impossible.

I think it is interesting, lilli, because I'm not sure some providers understand the full repercussions, but when they have rigid requirements for 3 (or sometimes more!) current references; they are automatically establishing a promiscuity threshhold that says: "I will not see a man unless he more sex partners in a year than the average man has in a lifetime."

The average man only has SIX sex partners in his life. (And we all know men tend to exaggerate this number!) In order to have three reliable references from the past year; the man must see at least six different women during that time.

So providers indirectly set "minimum promiscuity thresholds" that some of us can't cross.

I am not at all convinced that limiting their client base to men that cross that promiscuity threshold makes them one iota safer.

I have to confess that it is only one in a hundred providers that I comply with a reference request. Many providers do ask for them, but most are willing to accept other forms of screening, those that are unyielding in their screening techniques usually get a pass from me anyhow, mainly because that attitude usually carries into other areas of their pesonality.

Every once in a while a provider will come along that insists upon a provider referenence that I want to see so badly I will comply. There has never been a provider (nor will there every be) that I want to see so badly that I will fill out one of thoses stupid screening forms. Not going to happen, not today, not ever

I ask and give references so as to help ladies play safe.  It is not all about LE but also to stay away from the guys who are jerks, who rob you, beat you, rape you and more.  

YES it does happen.  So I want to help other ladies stay safe so I am always happy to give a reference on a guy.

I find that most men are in this hobby for VARIETY, so I am just helping them get what they want.  And because they know I help them, they tend to come back and see me often.

There are some ladies who are not reference friendly but I truly believe in karma so I know in the long run their business will suffer.

EVERYONE has to be safe and many women will give references even if they are busy. This is a business, I don't own the men I see. Switching it up is totally normal and if a girl gets offended, that's just too bad!

I don't think a guy's piggishness can be purely measure by the number of sex partners. I think it is better measured by how he treats them.

I strongly suspect that even at 6 a day, you treat your sex partners quite well.

not pieces of meat to be used,(well maybe sometimes), not goddesses to be worshipped, just human beings with pussies. lmao(oh and tits, can't forget about tits) rofl

Yes, all kidding aside, I have never mistreated a woman in my life, nor do I intend to.

References ALWAYS!!
I don't see anyone without a reference period!

Why you ask? For my safety in many ways.

I too have a lot to lose, family, kids and yes even a career..

I assume that you have played before.. I am never offended to give or get a reference..

It makes me feel MUCH safer to chat with a lady who tells me that you are indeed a sweet heart and that you are indeed not some crazy person or worse someone who is not who he presents himself to be..

I have no desire to end up in a newspaper or wrapped in a news paper for any reason..

For the ladies that don't check references. This business is risky as it is and they take more chances then they really need too.. Even when a gentlman gives me a reference, if I know a lady he has used does not check references I am a bit hesitant to see him. It makes me ask. what type of people is he playing with?

Is there Jealousy? seldom if ever, and the ones that do usually have other issues as well...

Because that's what we do to keep each other safe.  There is plenty of biz to go around.  There's no need to be jealous and possessive.  That's the beauty of the hobby and doing what we do.  

Egads, some of us even socialize and host get togethers.  Hey we have a lot in common and we can talk to each other about things we can't talk to our civie friends and family about.  

We're making a list and checking it twice, gonna find out who's naughty and nice!  LOL

Because we can, that's why!

I've never read such bullshit in all my days.  You can't see a provider without a reference and you can't get a reference without seeing a provider.

This has nothing to do with safety!!  You can shout it from the mountain tops and it doesn't make it any make it factual.

A thousand times it has been said, you don't need references to get good pussy.  I really wish you all would stop with the bullshit.  I've seen providers who proclaim from the mount that they won't see you without a reference.  It's all bullshit.  Now can we stop with this crap?!?!

I think it does more harm than good. IMHO.

"I am not at all convinced that limiting their client base to men that cross that promiscuity threshold makes them one iota safer."

excellent point, John. what other providers may view as a symbol of security, i view as not just total incompatibility, but high risk. a man able to provide a grocery list of providers he has seen is a man who is likely to objectify females (and not in the sexy way!), not interested in forming emotional attachments, and not risk averse enough for my own personal comfort level.

there are many other, and imho, far more accurate and comprehensive ways of gauging someone's character, personality and behavior.

Who exactly are you trying to convince? You are one loud voice on here screaming about NO REFERENCES...my gentle advice to you is keep seeing those many ladies you have spoken about you have seen that require zip and leave the rest alone.

And for a guy who touts his gentlemanly side...I'm not so sure or your facade is slipping. You just seem mad at ladies who are providing in a way that does agree with your personal set of rules.

Its all a part of keeping a good working relationship with the other providers.  We don't have a lot of resources to keep each safe. Some gentlmen like variety and giving them a reference helps out another provider and increases the chance that the gentleman will come back to visit me in the future.  I have also warned other girls about a guy and they have warned me in checking references.  There are some providers I will not except reference from, I don't see them as careful or professional or I can't verify them as established providers.  

In my personal experience, having references makes my screening process easier for the both of us.  I will see gentlmen without references but I very carefully screen them in other ways.

Being competitors does not mean we're enemies.  I don't even see the hobby as a competition.  If you look in the business world, references are checked quite often with competitors.  

If a girl refuses to cooperate with references, she is putting her own safety at risk and possibly other provider's safety.  She is limiting her resources to stay safe and other providers will not see her as professional or trustworthy.  It just makes good business and common sense.

Hi lilli...damn lady I like the way you think.

that is what my Husband would say anyhow, lol.



much respect to you chickadee.

..."You just seem mad at ladies who are providing in a way that does not agree with your personal set of rules."...

Good Lord, live and let live and move on to those who roll the way you do.

If the truth be known, there are a few things I disagree with but trying to convince people on here to change their minds/views/etc is a total waste of my time. I just provide the way I do and see the guys I want to see and leave the rest to other ladies.

And it's fine that you don't agree with certain screening methods or email contact or anything else we ladies do. Ignore us and vote with your $$$$ to the ladies that fit your bill.

"... there are many other, and imho, far more accurate and comprehensive ways of gauging someone's character, personality and behavior."

I agree. And, because I aim to see a provider over an extended period of time, I consider character and personality to be of primary importance.

And just as references aren't the best way to assess these things, neither are reviews.

Usually, my assessment of these things is not obvious enough for the provider to realize; but they are certainly assessed.

Gosh, it does sound angry, doesn't it.  Didn't mean to and I apologise.  

All I'm trying to say is that the banter back and forth about references is like watching sharks pretend to be protecting each other.  There are posters on this thread and others who proclaim that they require references when I know for a fact that they don't.  It's just an interesting phenomenon.

I apologise for interrupting the fantasy and I'll say no more.

PS.  I really am a gentleman...just not naive.

Do you get references from your references ?

Do you actually trust what another lady, you know nothing about, says ?

She may even have the best reviews.  How do you know if she is feeling a certain way that particular day ?  And is like fuck it. I dont want to see him no way.  So she sends you her trash.

No need to apologize. You just have a sore spot with this and I understand..sort of.

Please help me out here. If you will not provide references, what will you give a lady? And I am being very sincere as I am trying to understand where you are coming from with regard to your aversion to the word "safety" which is used in conjunction with references during past posts.

Yes it's not completely free but we assume we get back more than it costs us.

It might occasionally cost someone a session, but that is a small price to most providers compaired to significant improvement in safety, both from LE and from wackos.  Nothing is 100%, but a world without references would be more risk for the ladies and more personal info (therefore risk) for the guys.

I don't use 'references' method.  I've been in biz for 10 plus years. never one problem.
I get to know my clients.  Really simple.

If a lady wants to use the references method... good for her.  

Personally I feel it is indiscrete and ineffective.
 

Privacy is paramount to me.
People who believe 'references' keep them  safe are deluding themselves IMHO.

I won't deny that it is entirely possible to screen for safety without use of a single reference.

2/3rds of the ladies I have seen have screened me just fine without needing one.

Gentleman have TER for their references. They get to read reviews and see if us ladies are worth seeing. Providers don't have a review board we can turn to (that I know of) where we can browse reviews on gents to make sure they play nice. Beyond all the important safety reasons mentioned previously, I provide references to other ladies because there is no review board (that I know of) for us to peruse and it is our version of TER- without all the dirty details I am always happy to  provide references and will only see gents with references. I am not a jealous person and I wish everyone to have lots of fun- with anyone they want. I think we all want to stay safe- ladies and gents alike. And references provide a way for me to be able to be comfortable and have fun.