To each his/her own, but am I the only one that finds it incredibly short-sighted to get a tattoo? I'm referring less to the appearance of them, than to their permanency.  It's common to hear stories of people attempting to have their tattoos removed a few months or years after getting them.  Did they think they would forever feel the same for the person or thing that prompted the tattoo?  I don't know if someone has already invented it, but you could probably make a fortune if you could patent an ink that would fade natureally in several months or several years.
Is this just another generation gap deal?  We'll never understand the motivations of the generations that follow ours?  True, I don't find them attractive, just as I don't find certain natural physical characteristics of people attractive, and the fact that tattoos are a catagory in the Provider Profiles leads me to believe that I'm not alone in this.  Body art?  No thanks. IMHO a beautiful body shouldn't be adulterated by graffiti.

"The only difference between tattooed people ans non tattooed people is that non tattooed people are really concerned with what tattooed people put on their body". I don't remember where, but i read that once someplace and it always stuck with me.

I got my first tattoo about a year ago. It was the culmination of literally 5 years of deciding what i wanted. Something that would be exactley what i wanted. Since it is of a patriotic nature, if anyone here ever hears me bitch that i don't want it anymore, take me out and send me away, because i don't belong in this country anymore.

As for the generation gap, i don't know what you are referring to in terms of tattoos. I know/see people of all ages with them. Tattoos seem to cross all lines of sex, race, age, religion and so forth. Body art isn't really for me, but hey, it's that persons body to do with as they please. I suppose that there was once a time, eons ago, when tattoos where the recent thing, like body piercing may be now.

I do agree to a point that a person has to realize getting a tattoo is for all practicle purposes a permanent fixture and alot of thought should go into it. But other then that, i think the stigma that goes with it is really off base. Some of the nicest,most stand up people i've ever met had tattoos, but it didn't change who they were inside.






-- Modified on 9/5/2003 9:27:41 PM

You know, I starting getting inked about 8 years ago.

At first, I started with body piercings until it became a fad. (I am not into fads.)

At first I started slow getting 1 a year. Making a decision, like anything else, to make sure I won't regret it. I HAVEN'T.

WHAT I REGRET, is biased people like you. WHO judge people with tattoos. I get it all the time. The stares, the snickers.
- Tattoos are a form of self expression.

You are entitled to your opinions. I don't mind that.

As to do I regret them, hell NO. Do I want to remove any of them, NEVER (even the ones I can't believe I picked.)

It is becoming a fad, yes. But I am a not into fads. I am working on some serious pieces.

Oh, and I think the reason why they have the category on here for body jewelry and tattoos is so you know the truth about each woman.

As to your idea for faded ink, try henna.

Tattooing is a part of me, as well as a biker, and an accountant.

Just my thoughts...Shaye

I'd have to disagree with that on a personal level. Alot of times, sure- people going in to get whatever's most "popular", just to make a fashion statement. However, I put alot of thought into mine. It wasn't a spur-of-the-moment decision. It took me years to decide what I wanted, because I wanted something with meaning, personal meaning. I didn't want to be one of those people, as you mentioned, who desired to have their tattoo removed later in life. It's been almost two years since I got my tat, and not once have I regretted the decision, nor do I believe I ever will.

And as for "graffiti"... graffiti (or anything else, for that matter) IS art, with the right perspective

-- Modified on 9/6/2003 11:13:42 AM

-- Modified on 9/6/2003 11:13:26 AM

"The only difference between tattooed people ans non tattooed people is that non tattooed people are really concerned with what tattooed people put on their body".

That's a pretty funny quote. But that's not the only difference. I have often thought I'd like to get a tattoo, but I've not been able to satisfy myself that I would not be irritated by the ink. I have very sensitive skin and, although I understand that some inks can be hypo-allergenic and all that, I'm still too worried about it to make a permanent choice.

But I don't mind other people having tattoos, as long as it's well within the social norms of the society in which they wish to operate. An investment banker with a giant spider across his face won't do well, probably (or maybe the exotic factor will get him extra clients?); a lawyer with "I fuck hot chicks" on his bicep might be able to hide it, or might find he is not promoted as quickly as he would have wished.

I often find that tattooed people seem to think their visual appearance is their business only. That's incorrect -- other humans assess you on your visual appearance all the time, and if you wish for positive feedback from those humans, you need to give them positive input. So, there's a type of tattoo vigilante out there who simply doesn't "get" what it means to live in civilized society. Most tattooed people aren't like that, but I think many untattooed people tend to assume they are.

I don't mind a discreet or sexy tattoo on a provider, preferably a non-representative one. I find the dolphins, roses with thorns, butterflies, and hello-kitties to be obvious, uncreative, and largely indicative of lower social class and education. Very large amounts of skin covered with ink, prevent me from subconsciously assessing whether or not her skin is appealing to me -- something all males do automatically. Lustrous clear skin is a marker of heatlh and youth, and consequently is an idicator of beauty. But some tattoo that's a relatively small, attractive "tribal" pattern, perhaps on the back of a shoulder or on the lower back, can be a turn-on for me, like Cindy Crawford's mole or some other beauty mark. It's just another target for my lips ... ...

I just know that the tattoo'd ones will come up with clever sayings and defence mechanisms for thier having chosen something so permanent.

It's a fad.  Society loves these things.  Why are so many people buying SUV's?  It's nothing more than my neighbor has one I think I better get one..except for the few who  really go over  terrain other than the cement block at the end of the parking space at the super market.  In the 60's long hair for men became a poke in the eye to the older generation.  But you could cut it off and blend right in.  

Tattooing is a bolder statement from those who lack the self esteem to not go with the flow.  I know, I know, they are saying right now that going with the flow is NOT having a tattoo.  But that is not the circle they want to flow in.  This is like smoking is to a teen.  It's exciting, it's IN in my crowd, it separates me from my parents/establishment....then later, oh sh*t now what do I do.  Few admit that they want to quit and can't.  Similarly few tattoo'd folk will admit to the foolish mistake and say they want it off.  So they make up defensive statements about how long and hard they thought about it and how it's THEM, how it reflects their soul and on and on.

Just look at the stupid celebrity types like Angelina Jolie who tattoo the man of the moment on their arm (and lord knows where else) declare he's their love for ever and ever...until next year...  The public follows the clebs like sheep.

So Tat's are everywhere, and so permenant that they will be everywhere in 20 years...but by then the younger folks will have found some other way to separate themselves from the main stream (and thus be going with the flow of their era) and todays tattoo types will be on the outs.  Those who chose not to tattoo will still have options.

Yep, it's grafitti.  It isn't really beautiful (I know, yours is and you just love it...we've been over that).  What it is is amusing. Yeh, yeh, it's an art form and who can judge art...

Picasso was art.  Pollack was art.  Warhol was art.  Clearly not every one liked them.  They were copied.  And typically those who copy do a half ass job of it.  My point is the leaders invent the technique; they are the trend setters.  Tattoo WAS art, but the tattoo's on the arm of the masses are just hopeless half assed ripoffs.  How many flaming eyeballs and primal symbols can be original? (I know, yours is)  And I wonder how many Asian characters really say something completely different from what the wearer thinks it says?

Sorry if you've chosen to do this to yourselves.  Guess you'll have to pass on that CEO position.  Now go chop off a finger or two, it's coming into vogue, you know.

[SOM] = Start Of Message

the kewlest tattoo i ever saw was on a girl who was a friend thrice-removed and a somewhat nerdly but still sexy flat-chested brunette ... through a tattoo "artiste" here in Boston (or wherever it is i live) she had designed and inked a cyber "jack-plug" on the back of her neck (a la The Matrix) ... in both size and style it was not too ostentatious hence rather tasteful IMHO/T (T = taste)

but then again maybe this person never existed and i'm making all this stuff up ... regardless, i have a feeling that since i've put this up on chat boards around the net, by the time the next (last?) sequel comes out you'll see hordes of nerdly Gen-Y'ers flaunting said tattoo -- by which point it will cease to be the kewlest tattoo IMHO/M (M = memory)

Yes..So????????

"The only difference between tattooed people ans non tattooed people is that non tattooed people are really concerned with what tattooed people put on their body".

Sounds clever, but does it really mean anything? Perhaps that non-tattooed people are more intolerant? It's a broad generalization at best,  made by someone, oddly enough, with a tattoo. Do you think a tattooed member of the Aryan Nation is more tolerant than the average person?

It's just human nature for one person to wonder why another would deliberately mark his or her body when the first person would never consider doing that to himself. I happen to find tattoos unattractive. But at the same time I realize that they are only one part (hopefully !) of that person's physical appearance, and appearance is only a small part (again, hopefully)of the person's identity.

And as for the notion that tattoos are only the concern of the one with the tattoo, I have to ask why people get tattoos on the back of the neck or the small of the back, where they can't see them? I remember George Carlin explaining why he had his ear pierced. He said "I just wanted people to deal with me." It certainly wasn't as some sort of reminder to himself.

"WHO judge people with tattoos. I get it all the time. The stares, the snickers."

Well that's what you bought.  It was there all along, you just didn't see it.

Shaye, you have been a sweetheart to know on the boards.   I only wish we could see you...  YOU not those.  You AREN'T those.  

I suppose I am biased.  But those who put them on are subjecting themselves to the bias and hardly have a leg to stand on if they say they didn't know.  The thing is this isn't a prejudice like raceism, homophobia, etc.  The tattooed person made the decision.  Now you must deal with the likes of me.  And the more you get the more limited you acceptance circle becomes.

.....which is fine. It seems as someone hit a personal nerve with this thread for you. You bring up some good points about what is considered to be art. Had it not been for the tone of your post, i would have said it was well writen considering your POV. But the question i guess i have is.....If you met someone, got to know them, liked them, and then found out they had a tattoo would you ignore them from that point on because of it? That is part of what i take from your post.

Cardinal said it well in his post, so i'll copy a small portion of it here(the royalty check is in the mail cardinal).....
"I happen to find tattoos unattractive. But at the same time I realize that they are only one part (hopefully !) of that person's physical appearance, and appearance is only a small part (again, hopefully)of the person's identity."

Book_guy also touched on this well, and both are right. We are judged by the way we look everyday, by everyone we see(in many more ways then just tattooes), but that is no tell of who we really are.

Personally, i don't care for the use of an alias. I like to know who i'm taking to. But that doesn't mean your opinion is less because you choose to use one. I think you may be having a knee-jerk reaction and attempting to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Have a good weekend everyone! Be safe.
Sb



-- Modified on 9/6/2003 3:56:56 PM

when people stare?  Wasn't the reason to get them to attract attention?  I would think you would want people to stare.  And why get upset if people have different tastes than yours.  Tattoos aren't much different than wearing a funny hat; you're going to get a lot of attention, some positive, some negative, but are the people who don't like the hat dispicable?                           But I was really commenting (I thought it was pretty clear) about the fact that the tattoos are going to be there till you die, absent extreme measures, and what if you change your tastes in art?  Most of us went through a rebellious stage in our lives, when we wanted to make a statement about our individuality and rejection of the straight and narrow, but most of us eventually join conventional society.  Someone who at 19 or 20 gets a big, visible tattoo - beautiful or not - has placed serious limitations on their future options.  That's why I said I thought it was short-sighted.  Who knows at 19 what their going to be doing at 30 or 40?            The other point was that IMHO tattoos detract, not enhance, the already perfect female form.  When I look at a beautiful woman I don't want to be distracted from her natural beauty. But I admit that's a completely personal matter.

on my shoulder blade. It's about 2 1/2 inches maybe in diameter, and is covered most of the time by regular clothes.  And yet, I see that people clearly do not fancy it - have asked me about it. And that's ONE, and COVERED.

No .. Tattooing does not equal trash.    But there ARE people like me, who were simply brought up in a time when a tattoo WAS thought to be a sign of a "certain kind" of person and there are many people like that.    It's foolish of someone else to think that just because 'decent' people now get tattoos, that those of us that were brought up in another way of thinking can turn the feeling off, just like a light switch.  You have the Tats, they come with the stares - it's that simple.

I have learned to appreciate a nice tattoo.   MAYBE two.  I can even deal with a piercing or two.   But having said that ... if you're so pierced that you look like you fell down a flight of stairs and head first into a fishing tackle box, you have some severe problems.   Likewise, if you're tattooed like a walking billboard for "Snakes Tattoo Parlor (our motto:  Eagle??? I thought you said BEAGLE!)"  you also have some problems you need to work out.

One or two is self expression.   A dozen of them is a sign that you have problems of self control, self esteem or you're just plain spooky.

but, I keep flip flopping on the issue, that I do admit lol If I do get one, it will be a small heart, on my left buttcheek. But, small enough that you have to get up close to look at it. Again, I have been thinking about this for a long time now, and probably still will lol

Mel

Self-expression is one thing.  I do wonder about the people that get their faced tatooed -- and I don't mean something small -- I mean at least half of their face.  Have been seeing this a bit more frequently in NYC.  I wonder whether they thought out the long term consequences.

-Hoot.

...but if the grafitti is done on public property, it's vandalism.  Thankfully less tolerated in NYC than it used to be.

But there ARE people like me, who were simply brought up in a time when hobbying WAS thought to be a sign of a "certain kind" of person and there are many people like that. It's foolish of someone else to think that just because 'decent' people now hobby, that those of us that were brought up in another way of thinking can turn the feeling off, just like a light switch. And so on...

My reaction is from the gut.  

I do know and associate with several people who have them.  A good male firend, and one of my female employees who I really like... and love to hate...lol.

The guy friend is in his late 40's, an ex Marine, and had a rough life in his early years.  He is bright but lacks formal education.  I think his mind set came from those days.  His tat's have his grand kids names.  He is a great person.

My employee has a SO who is in the rock music world and she comes from a mind set where everybody looks like Tommy Lee.  Now she is out here trying to get along in a world where meeting the public is important she is quite glad to have them in places that don't show.  She is also into her mid 30's and starting to see the the kids in their late teen are looking at her a old.  She used to be child like in her defense of tats, but I can feel the shift in thought process.  Soon she will be an "old lady" to the very crowd she once thought she was part of.

I find tats amusing. Hate to see them on anyone I know.  But I love these people I mentioned.

Hows that Snowblind?

"WHAT I REGRET, is biased people like you. WHO judge people with tattoos. I get it all the time. The stares, the snickers.
- Tattoos are a form of self expression."

Yes, they EXPRESS the fact that you are willing to stand outside traditional social norms. Don't expect people who participate more in the traditional norms, to approve of your rejecting them. All humans judge one another, all the time, often on the basis of visual evidence. They may judge wrongly, in which case they have made a mistake. But you've made on as well -- by deliberately seeking situations in which their flawed judgment might have bearing on your own wellbeing; or, by caring enough about their judgment to allow it to affect your wellbeing negatively.

One of the biggest annoyances I have with my junior high kids, is that they wish to dress like hoodlums, act like hoodlums, talk like hoodlums, but then "not be judged" by other people. Duh ... maybe the other people are wrong. Maybe the other people have made some mistakes of stereotypy. But the junior high students have made many more mistakes, and consistently, by providing the idiots of this world with enough misleading evidence in the first place.

Don't wanna be thought of as a hoodlum by others? Don't appear to be one!

Tattoos important enough to you that you want them regardless of someone else's (perhaps flawed) negative judgment of people who have them? Don't care about somene else's judgment!

Duh ...