Sorry folks that's the way I feel. I never cheated and never will.

Oddly enough, I concur OSP.

Yes, I realize I'm engaging in some very slippery rationalizations, but I have always felt there is an enourmous difference between physicaly infidelity, and emotional infidelity. Maybe I just need to believe that so that I don't have to feel guilty myself. I had always held to the code that you don't touch what belongs to another woman. As a civvie, I never once fooled around iwth a married man, even though there were a few times when I was sorely tempted.

What you are talking about, even with the NSA catchphrase thrown in, is emotional cheating, complete with all its downfalls and complications. My advice, stick with the truest form of NSA encounters, a provider who truly gets it that there are no expectations, obligations, or strings involved. Merely an enveloped, and the exchange of time.

Well OK, that may be a stretch, but given that his choices were a civvie or a provider, I think that your perspective is misplaced.

There are pros and cons to either alternative.  I try to be extremely upfront about my objective, and therefore I'd have a difficult time seeing the civvie without it being crystal clear what I hoped would transpire on a short and long term basis.  (Example, fuck like dogs in heat and then go away never to see each other again).  With a provider, the rules are a little clearer...well sometimes, but that's another story entirely.

That doesn't always work. I get calls and texts in the middle of the night. Then I return them. LOL

I don't know of NSA s*x with civies.  Maybe it is possible...  to have an annual 'fling'.  It could be fun...  if you can keep it under control.  I've never been in that position.  
I guess you'll never know unless you try.  But the cost should not be why you do or don't.  
skb

remember the rule of: this, that and the other.*

You like her and she likes you, that's the "this".

You will probably both enjoy having sex, that's the "that".

But like anything else in this world, it takes three points to support something.  That last point:  "the other" has to be an emotional involvement (i.e. string) or $.

In five thousand years of recorded history, there has been no other way.

*Reference Seinfeld episode from season three where Jerry and Elaine get back together for sex.

I know there is no such thing as a true civilian NSA relationship. However, I think I may have found one that comes close. Next week I have a "date" with a civilian who I have known for 2 years. We work in the same industry and have seen each other at trade shows twice a year. We have had dinner, drinks, lots of laughs but no hanky panky as yet. We have met on nuetral teritroy not in either of our home cities. She has an SO and I am married.

We e-mail perhaps once or twice a month to keep in touch. Her recent e-mails indicate that she is more than ready to go under the covers, or on top of the covers which ever you prefer. We are meting at a seminar in a city well known for quality providers. Do I take the plunge and save myself at least 2 grand for an overnight romp or pay the piper and stick with a well reviewed provider and avoid the so called NSA civilian encounters at all cost. What would you do, also advise from the ladies please as well.

I'd do both if your schedule allows. Sounds like you two may be hanging out quite a bit, but have your backup plan. I have an NSA arrangement where we see each other every 3-four months. She's married and lives about 6 hour drive. The distance keeps us honest. She knows I see providers too, but asks that I not schedule them when she's in town. Our only problem is she has relatives here and make us have to watch where we go. Have fun.

you are on the young website bud.........

really good and You have a Great time...let the Fun begin and keep on going....if it's OK...then get a provider to finish the job....lol...what do You have to lose...maybe a friendship???? so just make sure You use both heads in this case

Stick with the pro's.

I've been going through this roughly every two weeks for the last 4 months.

A certain, incredibly hot russian acquaintance of mine who knows my situ has been putting it on every time I run into her.

She happens to hang frequently at my favorite nightclub, owned by a friend of 18 years.

It's a testament to the AMAZING chemistry I have with my ATF that I can severely flirt with this scrumptuously beautiful young woman 10 years my junior and NOT succumb to her feminine wiles.

It's keeping me out of trouble and will do the same for you.



-- Modified on 8/17/2010 6:11:34 PM

NSA sex doesn't exist.  There is always a string somewhere and I don't mean the one on the lady's tampon.

Maybe it will hit me as soon as I hit the submit button, but what is NSA?

Non-serious a... ?
Non-sexual alliance ?
National Security Agency ?

Ah! "No strings attached".  

Submitted, just in case someone else is scratching their head.

I agree. While I am married and I do see providers, my situation is a little strange to say the leased. My wife actually encourages me to see providers. She has her reasons that I will not go into. If she did encourage me to do so I would stay home. Never do anything that will hurt your wife if discovered. You word should mean something and if you will betray your wife who won't you betray?

Go with the pro, less headaches and more compliments.

I've done the so-called NSA sex thing (with other interested married women) and the professional provider thing.  There are pluses and minuses of each method of extra marital sex.  (BTW, I am rather shocked at the guys here who say that seeing escorts is not cheating on their wives.  Of course, if one has express permission, it's not cheating, but that situation is exceedingly rare, IMO.)  I am currently doing neither.

True NO strings attached sex is rare as hens' teeth, but it is possible to maintain a sexual relationship outside of marriage which is relatively string-free and understood by both parties to be subordinate to each others' primary relationships.  The key is to make sure you and the lady in question are completely on the same page on what the relationship is and would be after sex.  If your expectations are similar, it can be a wonderful thing, better than an escort because you can be relatively sure of her affection toward you and of her sexual responses compared to an escort.  You have a built-in excuse for getting together a couple of times a year and could (with some careful precautions) easily keep it from getting back to your W.  If you have time, do some reading the forum at philanderersdotcom.  I'm not a full member here but I am there under the same handle, so if you want to discuss it with me via PM you can there.

When I was younger and struggling I had a serious cases of the hots for a coworker. I met a man at a social event who I found out was successful during a prolonged conversation after the event. He provided two pearls of wisdom that I have remained true to. His first was on business. His advice was even if I could take advantage unfairly of a contract to not. His insight on business was that an unjustly gained shortterm windfall would come back to haunt me. His second was on the coworker that I had hots for. He looked me right in the eyes and said, son I see you care a lot for that woman but never eat where you shit. He had to explain to me what he meant, but when he finished explaining I understood why a romance that was easy and obvious was not good for me.

Some men who have a free hand don't take it. I am single but realize that if I was married and my wife gave me free reign to hobby, I would take advantage only if the marriage was childless. If children were involved, I would have time and emotional obligations to them that would prevent or severely limit my hobbying.

Even before sexual harassment litigation there were hazards in sleeping with a co-worker, so your advisor's thoughts on the subject are sound.  But the scenario presented is not a co-worker, just someone who is in the same industry.

Others have cautioned that you may be getting phone calls at inappropriate times, etc. from the civvy but there is the distinct danger that you may not be able to keep your emotional distance, as well, because of the absence of clear boundaries.

The fact that you keep in touch via e-mail, and have had dinner together (alone?) at previous shows, tells me that this is an affair waiting to happen.  If you already have a "date" set with her, you are already at the edge of the precipice.   If you can contain this to being companions when at these trade shows, why not?  If she is looking for more, stick with providers.   Problem is, you won't know for sure until you take the next step, and who knows what the potential collateral damage will be...

I can only tell you that if I were in your position, I would probably play this by ear, and see what happens next week.   Since you are asking this question, it sounds like that is what you are planning on doing at this point.  Be careful, dude!  

There is a lot more in play than my wife giving me more than free reign to hobby. She really wants me to hobby, for reasons I will not disclose. I will say this things in my marriage are really screwed up. I would give up anything except my family to have a normal monogamous marriage. I will never understand why some people throw away what I really want, and hurt the person they promised to protect and cherish just to have a bit of fun. I know the fact that I hobby and I am married makes me a bit of a hypocrite when I say this but it is how I feel. I feel the promise made at ones marriage is the most sacred promise that a person can make. I do not mean any of this as attack on anyone's choices,   because everyone's situation is different. It is just my opinion.  I feel guilty every time I hobby despite my wife's blessing. I would never hobby at the expense of my son or my wife. I could not live with my self if I did that. If my wife even gave the any indication that she did not want me to hobby I would quit the hobby and not look back.