Ok, I should know this by now, I've been at it for over two years... but the independent thing is sorta new to me. I started for an agency and only in July quit that and went on my own.
I market a fantasy. We all know this. I enjoy my *job*, but like a lot of Providers I have someone to go home to at the end of the day.
My question is mainly posed to other providers cause I'm sure most of you have been in this position (shh, no jokes), BUT of course the gents' perspectives would be very much appreciated too.
One of my first overnights started nicely enough, I'd been emailing and chatting via phone with a client for a week before we met. Very nice guy. Over dinner and some wine, though, he got a lot more touchy (in public, at a restaurant) than I was comfortable with... even with my RL BF. Later that evening in private he seemed to be growing even more attached in an unhealthily emotional way.
All part of the fantasy right? But aren't there matters of decency to be considered? I've no intention of being vulgar here or in public, but do you routinely expect tonsil hockey in a busy restaurant? It made me very uncomfortable, so much so that after about seven hours I had to leave prematurely. The plan had been to sleep a bit, have an early breakfast, and part company in the morning. The rate paid was more than reasonable for seven hours' waking company, and very intensive company it was. However, I would like your opinions. I feel like maybe somewhere I made a mistake and he felt cheated.
Being indie is very different than agency business, and I'd really appreciate any advice you can muster. I always want to leave a client sated (but still wanting more, of course), but sometimes it seems like the line between business and personal is waaaaay too fuzzy for me.
Please, give me some good advice on how to deal with this kind of thing in the future. I don't feel like I gave poor *service* at all, just that maybe one of us had unreasonable expectations... if it was me please tell me! You won't hurt my feelings!
You had every right to end the session early if he made you uncomfortable. You should always think first about your own safety above all else.
On a side note, most providers do not do overnighters with clients that they have just met. Next time, perhaps it is a good idea to schedule 2 or 3 sessions with a client first, before doing an overnighter with him. That way you both are comfortable with each other, and aren't afraid to set the boundaries up front.
As long as you treated him fairly. Since he made you very uncomfortable, you have the right to leave. But if you had refund him fair share of the donation for the remaining hour, I don't think that he should have anything to complain about. It was his fault anyway. So don't worry about it.
The thing is that if you do, things like this can and will occur. I remember my first overnight which was with someone I had not previously met. Just like you I had several discussions with the gentleman prior and thought we would get along fabulously but we didn't. It was very uncomfortable for both of us.
It's a typical mistake that many ladies make when first starting out on their own. No need to feel bad, we all make mistakes and we all have our comfort zones on both sides. You just didn't click and as long as he didn't compensate you for the full evening and he had a good time. I don't think he would feel mistreated.
Tiffany
however the only time I did have an over night with someone I had a not met before we actually coresponded for 2 mths and this made us both very confortable by the time we met it seemed like we were old lovers.
kisses & licks.......
mara
I can't imagine sharing the same bed with someone I did not know well. The only overnighter's I've done are with a lady I've been with previously on multi-hour dates. You really need to develop a sense of trust prior to doing overnighters.
...just a guys opinion
Well, what's done is done.
"rate paid was more than reasonable..." sounds like you walked without a refund so I bet he is upset whether you think he got his money's worth or not.
Doing an overnight without meeting the client first for a shorter time must be hard but I have actually done it twice before. Both times the agenda was absolutely clear before the dates were started and I had a great time, and hope they did too. I actually repeated with the 2nd lady until I met my ATF and became insane LOL. The only issue for her is I snore and she didn't really like to cuddle. I am also doing an overnight with a lady I met at a group night out but have not actually datedon my own.
I don't really like too much public display of affection so "tonsil hockey" in a public place wouldn't turn me on. but some guys are like that. Seems like you waited 7 hours to object to it though. Some providers on this very board have mentioned things they have done with clients under the table cloth so I guess there is an expectation for some people that would be available. You don't really state what happened back in the room so I am guessing he wanted stuff which was't on the menu. I don't question your decision to walk since you are the only one in a position to protect yourself.
Overnights are alway about something else than the sex. They are about companionship and the fantasy is the person wants to be you and is willing to acknowledge they are with you. Some sort of PDA is expected (holding hands, kissing). My ATF holds my hand, light kisses, we may hug on occassion. She has our picture taken everywhere we go. She acknowledges and makes clear to the public she is with me and is not available. That is really all I need in the way of PDA.
Some guys are a lot more aggressive in public. I am not one of them but I am sure there are plenty out there.
You might want to rethink whether you want to do overnights or not. As part of an overnight, you are expected to fill the guys fantasy of what he wants his girlfriend to be like. I wouldn't expect my girlfriend to down on me in public, that is not my fantasy but must be some guys out there that do.
Be safe out there, you are the only one who knows what you are ocmfortable with. Don't get caught in positions you feel you need to bail out of.
I think your very reasonable. Although providing a service your not a dam puppet. Even though his attraction and interests were apparent and he was enthusiastic. It seems that humping you on the dinner table most certainly would not be the best choice.
When someone is coming to see you from out of town. Even though their peers may not be present what they should consider yours could be. How would they feel if you were all over them in a public arena and someone they knew walked over. At least if this were to happen and there was no touchie touchie you could be "explained " as an associate. Its happened to me. Unfortunatley, when his tongue is down your throat thats not an option.
Communication is what I suggest. When you feel yourself getting uncomfortable say something. This can be the hardest thing a provider can do . We went to be customer service 100% service with a smile bla bla bla...
bull shit.
I want the night to go well too. If something is not feeling so cool.. your going to know about if nothing else perhaps we can discuss it or I will say no. This will prevent hurt feelings or any level of tension I think a great deal.
xo mo
Old School,
You do not tell us if you two spoke about his actions. It is key for you to let him know that DFK in public are not something that you are comfortable with. However it seems to me that it may be is intimacy that was more of a problem. You mention that he is a very nice guy,is too touchy and that he was growing too attached. The two of you could have stayed at home for breakfast if you were uncomfortable with public displays. Could it be that 7 hours with a guy that was emotionally intimate was getting too close to a civilian relationship? Walking out before your agreed upon time left your client short of his and your original expectation. There should have been some sort of compensation for an incomplete overnight.
First I want to say that I would expect a woman to never do something she was uncomfortable with. I hope that respect is always mutual!
I have never had an overnight and truthfully I may not be participating in this fun much longer, but just in case the opportunity presents itself...
My question is, when I'm traveling and want to have some company on the road. I might have never been to that city and would not have had the chance to have my 2 or 3 meetings before engaging in an over night.
What do I do? Do I schedule it so I pay for two hours up-front and if we don't get along, she leaves with an inconvience tip and we part friends? Do I meet for two hours the first night and then schedule her for an overnight the second? Any suggestions?
Thank you....
As I said, before I met my ATF I had done two overnights without having met the women before.
I went with the first one because she advertised a tyoe of swingers club experience, she looked good, had ok reviews. She initially wanted to do just a one or two hr deal first but I was coming from out of town. Luckily, she was easy, I was easy and we had a great time. Stayed up all night and did everything we wanted to do. Plus I think she met a couple she could do stuff with later.
Second was a PSE experience and neither one of us really knew what to expect but sex aside, we didn't stay inside all day, I took her to Universal Studios Orlando and we had a great time. She ended up giving me her real name, private number and I took her to New Orleans. I signed on for the porn star experience and got much more.
So it can and does work obviously. Both parties need to state what they want, set any boundaries before hand and during if necessary.
I don't think I would book it as a two hour, then try and extend it. First of all if they block out a night they are going to want all th money up front. It is unlikely they could book something else if they wanted to make up for the time lost.
So if you can, book as early as possible, talk to them either via email or directly.
What do I know having never done an overnight.?..but maybe a good tactic is to book for 1-2 hours on the first day or night and then let her know up front that if she is willing, you would like to have an overnight...my 2 cents. The part I don't know is if her schedule would be flexible enough but perhaps it might...you could find this out by email...the major problem would be of course that at the end of your first visit she leaves telling you, not tonight dear, nor even tomorrow night...
I guess this kind of thing needs to be discussed up front - it's not something I would have thought to ask, to be honest though. I don't believe I've done an overnight with someone I didn't already know, but I've done shoots where I stayed in pretty close quarters and worked with people I didn't know for days, almost a week sometimes, and I've certainly had experiences where I was completely turned off by someone's behaviour and was too far away from home to just leave. Nothing abusive, I mean, just didn't click.
It's certainly an occupational hazard, isn't it?
-Anya
"Sometimes it seems like the line between business and personal is waaaaay too fuzzy for me."
Talk to Jerry Falwell, and he might be quite shocked by where most people on this board draw the line. e.g. "You put tab A into slot B, and you're not even married to each other?!" And then there are guys here who are into some stuff that would make some of the rest of us blush.
There are matters of decency to be considered, but some uncertainty regarding WHAT is decent. It sounds like he and you had some pretty different expectations.
You can communicate ahead of time (either by explicit agreement, or implicitly through getting to know each other in previous sessions, or by the guy reading reviews to get some idea what to expect, etc). Or you can not communicate, and just roll the dice, hoping that the two of you happen to agree. I guess this time, you came up snakeeyes.
One reason why I'd never doan overnight with someone I've never seen before, is that I wouldn't do it without discussing all of the particulars of the arrangement. And in general, that conversation cannot happen prior to the lady and the gentleman both being 100% certain that the conversation won't turn up in a court of law. In many cases, I've discussed it at the tail end of a shorter arrangement, after we already know each other. When I do this, I am usually looking for a simulated GFE experience including a night out in public.
My overnight requirements are not TOO demanding, except for one thing, I LIKE, and EXPECT, morning sex. The fact is, if I am going to be with someone for, say 12-14 hours, I'd expect 3 sessions of intimacy: Once at the beginning, then once before going to sleep, after the public part of the evening (could be dinner, theater, etc), and once in the morning. I've been surprised to find that on some ladies programs, the morning session is NOT part of their agenda. I also would like there to be some level of intimate cuddling/foreplay during the night, and some public displays of affection similar to what might be seen between a REAL couple in public. If the lady is not comfortable with the public affection, or the night time cuddling/intimacy, then we are not going to have an overnight that I would enjoy. To me, that's a trust issue. I wouldn't expect to JUST have sex 2/3 times and retire to opposite sides of the bed.
Of course, I would expect to discuss all this prior to arranging such an evening. And I would only be able to have this discussion with someone who was comfortable enough with me to know what they were committing to, and to know that they could have the conversation itself without repercussions. This generally implies someone whom I've seen before, and generally for a longer than a single one-hour session.