...from one of the greatest SF writers of all time, Robert Heinlein, which stands for "There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch."
There may be no payment for the "free" stuff, but you pay for it eventually. If you really want that kind of involvement, then you can have it in the civvie world and not have to worry about the cloak & dagger aspects of hobby involvement.
I have to disagree...I've had clients offer to take me out to dinner, or on another public date without pay. They also start to send me long lengthy love e-mails and ask me to consider being their gf and spend extra(unpaid) time with them. I always make up funny witty excuse as to why I like to stay single and politely decline.
I've had this happen NUMEROUS times. As I offer GFE in my services some guys do confuse this...And since I do cater to newbies they sometimes don't understand.
I also hate when a guy wants to be "Exclusive" with me. I saw a guy when I first started about 7months back.It was more a sugardaddy arrangment(or it was SUPPOSE to be...if he would have contributed more money than his cheap ass did) Long story short he thought he was "in love with me" even though I was only 4years older than his eldest daughter. He would talk about "our life together" etc etc. He wanted to be exclusive and....rather than tell him no I said we were going to be. I lied and it bit me on the butt(he MET me as an escort on craig's list initially)he found some recent reviews and went crazy a few times. Also when he wife found out he wanted to chose me over her,I of course set him straight(family first). Now flash-forward to 7months later and I am STILL getting hate mail and "you're a whore and I hope god saves your soul" e-mail from his wife. She even poses as him in the e-mail to try to lure me to meet him again. But of course it's my selfish fault why he cheated in the first place....not his.(and certainly not hers!) *sarcasm*
LIFE LESSON LEARNED-Be upfront when replying to questions and comments about being exclusive or being their girlfriend. Some guys are fragile about this and may chose to not see you anymore if you decline...which is not bad in the least bit, it will save you drama!
Posted By: texcat
it would be unsafe to generalize. i'm sure many of us would never ever get it into our head to not pay unless an invitation to not pay was made.
I've never asked to hang out for free with a provider unless she made the invitation first and put it out as OK. I would never ask for "free service". Several of my favorites have been generous with their time and I have reciprocated with gifts and real life favors. I am most comfortable with clear boundaries and clear communication styles. So I commend your decision to be clear.
There has been some considerable liking, friendship, mutual help, advice between myself and several favorites. I'm not going to entertain thoughts of being any lady's BF or SO unless it's spectacularly good AND she makes an invitation to consider that.
had you done this in the first place there would be no drama. I would never ask for anything for free. Ladies have offered it up for free. The lines can blur from both sides.
One guy on here stated something he called the rule of three. He never sees a girl more than three times. As I have been in this as a hobbiest for 2 years, I can see the sense of this.
It's easy for some people to get lost in the hyper-reality fantasy world of emotionally unavailable peoples. They need to give themselves a reality check and realize it's just a fantasy. It's not the real thing. (Billy Joel popped into my head). But, sometimes, it's hard to avoid the getting sucked down into the whirlpool of self-delusion. It can be hard to walk away as a result. But, you're chances of being hit by lightening multiple times is probably greater than two parties getting involved in this world. If you feel something coming on, then it's best to move on. But, can be hard if it creeps up on you.
Also, when you get involved, you still end up paying in all kinds of other ways. And, it can be way more expensive then.
A man with a brain about this hobby. I sometimes wonder about what is expected and half the time...no more than half the time, we are damned if we do and damned if we don't.
The problem with some guys is that after the clock runs out they don't leave well enough behind and realize that an illusion is not reality. If they wanted the absolute truth, stay home and ask your wife/civvie GF.
I would prefer the truth put forth politely but understand this business is as much about stroking the mans ego as it is about stroking his cock. I know I am in a minority in this. You are right, with some men you are damned if you don't stroke his ego because he will not have as good of time and he probably not repeat but you are damned if you do because he may not "leave well enough behind and realize that an illusion is not reality" after the session. Best any provider can do is compassionately set the man strait if he starts to get confused between the illusion and the reality of the relationship and maybe end it if he does not come out of his confusion. I always take anything said during a session as part of the illusion unless the lady makes it clear otherwise. It is not just the men that can get confused though, a provider friend of mine has fallen for one of her clients and is trying to turn him into her boyfriend for real. Everyone in this hobby must keep there emotions in check, if they can not they should leave the hobby behind for there own well being.
I would prefer the truth put forth politely but understand this business is as much about stroking the mans ego as it is about stroking his cock. I know I am in a minority in this. You are right, with some men you are damned if you don't stroke his ego because he will not have as good of time and he probably not repeat but you are damned if you do because he may not "leave well enough behind and realize that an illusion is not reality" after the session. Best any provider can do is compassionately set the man strait if he starts to get confused between the illusion and the reality of the relationship and maybe end it if he does not come out of his confusion. I always take anything said during a session as part of the illusion unless the lady makes it clear otherwise. It is not just the men that can get confused though, a provider friend of mine has fallen for one of her clients and is trying to turn him into her boyfriend for real. Everyone in this hobby must keep there emotions in check, if they can not they should leave the hobby behind for there own well being.
you would be better off being damned if you dont. There is nothing wrong with losing a client here or there. I have never understood the ATF and "regular" thing in this business. hell if either of you want that, stay home and ask your spouse or civvie SO.
dont be so surprised when a guy falls for you. Most SP have these encounters hundreds of times per year. Most men have these rencounters once or twice per month. They are more meaningful at many levels.
I still remember the first time I saw a provider who was able to fully engage me physically, intellectually and emotionally.
That was a very educational experience. First, because I didn't think it was possible. Second, because all of the implications of the fact it was possible were pretty scary.
There are things I will sometimes do off the clock with certain providers if it is mutually beneficial. And sometimes I'll accept a discount within reason if I understand where the strings are or how the lady benefits.
But no way, no how will I allow a woman that damned skilled in so many ways to have unfettered access to my person unless she is properly CONSTRAINED by a payment and LIMITED as to time. Those who have seen me know that I generally watch the clock more closely than they do.
Offers of free sex are really cool and sweet, but never accepted.
I am not romantically available, and not looking for a girlfriend. I am only available for limited engagements or friendship and if sex is involved there will be compensation or it isn't happening. It can be discounted in some cases, but it can't be free.
I know the price of "free" with highly skilled women; and I'm not paying it.
the one that could have been a provider if she inclined that way? wild and fantastically skilled, gorgeous and very very bright? it was a good run too, double digit years...... the experiences i have had with my favorite ~3-4 reviewed providers have been better, but not hugely so.
so my weakness, in comparison with you, is that having been spoiled that badly for so long i am under the impression (delusion?) that i could manage. so i am not quite so absolute about it being off the table as a possibility. but the initiative would have to come from the other side and with some very clear understandings. my exes all "had to" propose the relationship since i prefer solitude.
i am a happy camper with things as they are. my ideal companion is much as you describe. my almost ideal SO has a separate residence. my ideal SO, like most ideals, does not exist. no worries.
Let's just say that in civie life, once upon a time, I hooked up with a lady who was as gorgeous as the moon, as bright as the sun; and whose heart was as black as the infinite ether. It made me very cautious.
I, too, require solitude.
If I were to ever contemplate any civie relationships again, we would keep separate houses.
unless her heart has gotten considerably darker. one of the things that got to her about me was the solitude bit. she thought that after 8 years i might change. but i was still retreating to my office for a day or two after obnoxious business travel. when i'm tired of other people... it just won't do though.
that's the wonderful thing about my lady friends in the hobby. when i say i'm not fit company, it's respected.
yes, it's the separate domicile requirement that inevitably makes civy relationships impossible. this works. being "moved in on" just seems too damned risky.
Many of the ladies that I have seen have left me with a feeling that is incredible. Having found a couple of ladies in particular that I find myself spending much longer dates with I can certainly understand how lines can become blurred. However, that is why payment for your time is so critical in my thinking. I am paying for you to leave and me to move on with other things and not be involved in any drama. I am sure there are a percentage of guys who are not able to understand that this is a fantasy and that the ride comes to an end after an hour(s). There have been numerous reports on here of the "I've fallen and......". Once money is off the table, then drama builds and both the lady and the guy have issues that I, for one, have no interest in being involved with.
...from one of the greatest SF writers of all time, Robert Heinlein, which stands for "There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch."
There may be no payment for the "free" stuff, but you pay for it eventually. If you really want that kind of involvement, then you can have it in the civvie world and not have to worry about the cloak & dagger aspects of hobby involvement.
You are good at what you do obviously. I admit, I do not have a lot of mercy, but my take on this type of situation is for you to go the 'free' route and don't forget to mention, "...oh, by the way my love, I am short on rent this month. You don't mind paying for it do you...?" It's a win-win IMO. You get a steady customer. He eventually learns life's lessons, albeit he learns the hard way. Seriously, if he is "in love", next time enjoy the financial ride. Eventually his friends will clue him in if he has level headed friends, and if not, hopefully he logs onto this discussion board, and he will be comprehensively raked over with wisdom.
If it was a good session I might repeat but I keep my feeling in check and I do not plan to have relationship with providers....Frankly, I do not feel right that a guy buy himself a girlfriend this way. Vanica stand your ground and always decline such offer s.....
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