who never got it and never will. we can all be quite content not to be living inside his empty empty shell.
glad to hear the rest of your day was better.
You know, I try really hard to be a good provider.
I have excellent reviews and an honest presentation.
Today a client I have met before called and basically picked his own price, complaining about having previously met me on a two hour special and reminding me that he only wanted an hour.
Being accommodating and feeling uncomfortable with the entire conversation, I gave in like a wimp.
But you know what? Instead of rationalizing it with "well, some is better than none" and "he's not dangerous and he's easy" and "I'm spoiled by good clients who overpay me so what's one who underpays"
Fuck it.
He haggled and he's going to get what he paid for.
Its going to be a good appointment and I am going to do everything he wants and expects but I am going to push him out at the 45 minute mark or I'm just going to be done after the first round.
I will just choose to give him what he paid for instead of going above and beyond like I usually do.
It's not the money, its the attitude behind the haggling.
I know its a "buyers market" but I refuse to let my business get trampled on because some clients resent paying providers in the first place and devalue the service so much that they have no issue begging or berating the down until they get what they want.
As much as clients hate the idea of providers being ungrateful and looking down on them, guess what? We feel the same.
Honesty may not be, but mutual respect is a must in this business.
Thanks for letting me rant.
Some people probably wouldn't understand that you're just venting. I do have to admit I is hard for me as a man to understand how a woman can give her all to someone she is not only not attracted to, but doesn't even like. Your's is not an easy occupation, I hope you feel better after getting it off your chest.
Just remember all the "good clients" who spoil you, and I hope your day gets better.
Or kind of out loud lol.
Attraction wise, he's clean and fit and not difficult physically.
I just hated the attitude that he called me with.
Especially after how good I was to him during our first meeting.
Thanks for understanding the message.
Quit apologizing and give his monies worth...the haggled down price. You had it right the first time so now because you "said" it out loud and will no doubt get flack,don't go back on your word. If you do, quit complaining and deal with being taken advantage of. If you stick to your word and do as you say...well done!!!!! Not being an ass but my attempt at tough love.
be treated this way. PERIOD! My advice would be to backchannel other ladies so that no one else gets treated this badly.
Good luck to you.
Especially if he was a pain in the ass the first time. If someone thinks I am not worth the rates Iisted, then they are not worth spending anytime with. Plain and Simple.
If you are not comfortable with receiving the amount that you will be receiving, then you should not have accepted the date. You should have merely said something like "I am sorry, but I do not wish to lower my rates. Thank you."
I have said this many times, but it bears repeating..
- A women is free to set whatever rates she wants
- A man is free to pay that rate or not.
I would seriously cancel the date since you obviously are not going to have a good time, and it could affect you beyond this date. It would be better to simply not see him.
I'm sorry for your conflicted view and saddened by your situation- but it makes absolutely no sense (to me) that you agreed to the meeting.
It is clear that it is costing (mentally, emotionally.) so you much more in the interim and then to justify your decision by implying to give under par service could also backfire on you.
Set your boundary and be true to yourself.
Not all money is good money...
Cheers,
Frederique
I hope you can pull it off, just this once, and leave it behind you. I could image, no matter what goes down, it will be hard for you to ever see him again. And, beware! Rewarding bad behavior increases it.
How so in this case IF she sticks to her guns? He haggled and she is only giving him what he will pay for and not what he thinks he's getting. That's not rewarding his bad behavior. It would be if she went above and beyond and gave him extras....then yes it makes sense that there is reward.
Ya know what ...after reading the few posts below the OP's it might be wiser to cancel and be done with it. He could mad and hurt you...he could be a vindictive a$$ and give you a bad review....just cancel.
I agree. I think it is wiser, safer and more prudent to cancel. And, yes, if she sticks to her guns, that's fine, but the issue is one of perception. If he perceives her as capitulating, he is likely to do it again, because it worked, and may even be emboldened to try and cross other boundaries.
Yes you're right...cancel!
Doing anything less then your best, no matter how you justify it, only hurts YOU.
I understand not wanting to turn money away, but when I have had clients I know call me and try and haggle, and politely tell them that I would rather they wait until they had the time and money in their budget to have a geniuine experience then try and compromise anything for either party.
If you start justifying lesser service for one, it is easier to justify it in other situations also... If you don't want to see someone or don't like the price they are offering, it is better to not take the date then harbor the resentment and possibly get a less then stellar review because of doing less then your regular level of service.
Be consistant, set your boundaries, and don't take it personal if someone tries to get a discount. Asking for a discount is not really about YOU, it's about THEM...either seriously hoping to see someone they like, but not having the $$...or trying to see what they can get away with...but none of that is not about YOU.
Much love,
xoM
I think that is probably what I needed to hear.
I'm going to do this this once because he's already traveling to me.
He just called and I felt myself being kind of edgy even though I said I would be nice.
I don't like the way its making me feel and I don't want to react to clients this way.
Thank you everyone for your comments, I don't want to compromise my service to appease or appeal to everyone and your messages are quickly helping to remind me of that.
It's easy to get frustrated, and have our frustrations cloud our judgement. We all need a little feedback and support from time to time to help keep things in perspective. Ultimately we all have our own path to walk, and having a sounding board for ideas like we have here can help us stay focused on the path we want to walk.
My best to you in all that you do!
xoM
I understand and agree immensely, last night a returning client of mine called and basically did the same, i have this and i want this amount of time with you! demanding that i give in and assuming i would. I was shocked and didnt know how to respond, i told him i was being reasonable with the amount he was bringing, and i wasnt sure if i could extend his time, business is business, this is how i live, i tried not to take his rudeness personal, and i do enjoy the time with him ( nice guy) maybe just a bad day. needless to say i politely declined his offer and wished him a good night.
Ive come to realize with some returning clients of mine, the more they see me, the more they expect and some of them for less. Maybe its the quality of gents i see or the hard economic times people are having, nevertheless; i still need to eat,sleep,and...shop! I may have an understanding and arrange something but there is always a way of asking and not demanding or expecting it.
When I enter a session, I hate B&S, ROBs, up selling and all the other little things that drive me nuts. I want the envelop to contain the correct funds. I want the lady to be the one in the ad, and most of all, I want the fantasy. ANYTHING that I do to jeopardize the fantasy is ON ME. That means making sure that I agree to what is advertised. On a few occasions I have seen ladies who are NOT GFE, and I have tried to get a GFE experience from them. They (on occasion) refuse, but that is what it is, and I do not complain. On the other hand when a GFE is advertised and it is not provided, well that's another story.
With respect to haggling about price or time or whatever, I feel that once a lady sets her price, it is up to me to determine if she is worth the price. If not, I move on. Do I worry about her ability to pay the rent? nope... as she does not worry about my ability to pay my rent.... it is what we pay for.
You Said:
"Honesty may not be, but mutual respect is a must in this business."
Mutual respect is not mutually exclusive with negotiation. Every single business transaction is negotiable. But I guess what turned you off in this case was the tone of the "haggling".
But one question. Was the price he wanted to pay some price he previously paid, or did he make up his own price that was nowhere near anything previously paid? If it was a previous price, then he does have some leg to stand on. If it was not a previous price, then he obviously has no basis in reality.
But either way, you have the right to refuse the date, and should have.
So help me understand. Why are you angry?
Is it because he offered such a low previously un-heard of price?
Was it because he offered a previous price, and you no longer wanted to receive that amount?
Was it that he even asked to pay something else rather than your current rates?
Was it because he asked more than once?
Did he even ask more than once, or was it simply a single request to pay a lower price?
If it was a single request, a simple response of "Sorry, I do not discount" would have nipped it in the bud. If you did not say that, why?
But remember, you are not worth what you charge. Every single woman is priceless. What you charge or receive is merely what you receive for that time period. Nothing more, Nothing less!
You are correct, what turned me off was the fact that he scoffed at my rate and reminded me of having previously met me on an advertised special.
No, the price isn't unheard of and it is a price that I have put on my service before.
The problem was the attitude that he brought with it. He literally spat it at me and reminded me that he was a return client.
He didn't ask about the rate he just sort of said this is what its going to be today. I do run specials and I do have rates specifically for return clients but my clients are usually very respectful and observe my listed rates unless I remind them that I have a relationship with them and would like them to return at a specific price.
I had a problem with the attitude but he blindsided me, I do not like confrontation with my clients and I just accepted it.
I'll play nice today and won't let him or anyone else do it to me again. I'll be sure to just enforce the rates on my website or advertised specials and if it isn't special time I still won't let a return client take advantage of my nature.
Make an excuse and cancel the appointment. I can tell this is bothering you. Just think, if it is bothering you now, how are you going to feel during, and after the session?
The other thing to keep in mind, if you are unable to conceal your feelings you are also likely to receive a bad review which might make the session an actual money loser for you. somehow I don't see any good coming out of this session.
I really believe from your words here that going through with the session will "cheapen" you in your own eyes. Do yourself a favor, cancel the appointment and put him on your "must miss" list.
I said yes, he arranged his plans and I'm just going to make the best of it and try to relax and be good.
I hate having my time wasted when I make plans and I'm not going to do it to him.
Thanks guys.
Since you have already committed .....Do your best.
XOXO
Sexy
I understand it was his attitude that made you angry. That is very understandable, and I fully understand why you are not happy about the whole situation. As has been said, you should have politely declined.
If he had been more respectful of you, and asked if the special he has used before was still available, and could he still pay that price, what would you have said?
But I would like to point out to some of the other women posting in this thread, that you are not "worth" what you charge. What you charge is merely what you choose to receive for a period of time at that time.
It bothers me when when women say that they cannot simply "perform" for anything less than the amount of money that they are supposed to receive. It really tells me that it is "all about the money". There are thousands of other women who receive less than you do for their services, and there are women who receive more for their services also.
This is a business. Nothing more, nothing less. Us men as the buyers have the right to try and get the service for a low price if we want to, and you women have the right to sell it to us for that price if you want. If either party decides that the price, attitude or anything else is not satisfactory, then either party can terminate the sale.
To think of it any differently is putting too much thought into it.
In this current economic situation we are in, there are many people who are taking significant pay cuts for exactly the same amount of work that was performed before. 15% pay cuts are common, and some companies are cutting even more. But remember that the employee can choose to quit the company if they can get something else somewhere else. Remember that ladies when you do not get the income that you previously received.
It bothers me when when women say that they cannot simply "perform" for anything less than the amount of money that they are supposed to receive. It really tells me that it is "all about the money".
Sorry to have to break it to you but it is about the money( you said it yourself ...it's a business and people are in business to make money), or all of us would be giving it away for free. Doesn't mean we hate what we do but we do it for the money...and yes what I charge is what I think my time is worth.
Any man can haggle with me and I have three choices...see him and be OK with it or see him and reduce my services or time and last not see him. And plenty of us are getting the income we have always got...the recession has done nothing to mine. If a man wants to see me he will without me discounting in fear and feeling uncomfortable about it.
It is a business, nothing more.
You as the seller have the total right to sell to him or not to sell to him.
That is exactly what I have been saying.
The fact that you are receiving your previous income level shows that you are a successful businessperson.
...and that is what this "hobby" is all about.
To be very honest, again, it wasn't the money.
I mean seriously, $25 or $50 off doesn't put a dent in my day at all.
It wasn't about the rate itself. It was the pushiness and the disrespect that came with it.
I've had plenty of guys explain themselves, their wants and their needs and if it has fit into my schedule I have very happily agreed to their suggested rate.
It was his sense of entitlement and his badgering me with my previous special rates which turned me off.
And yes, it is "about the money", otherwise providers wouldn't charge so there is no reason to get turned off when women say they can't perform for less than X amount of dollars.
You say that a provider shouldn't have her ego tied into her rate...yet it bothers you that a provider would remind you that this is a business?
That is a bit hypocritical in my opinion.
Anyway, alls well that ends well and he got his session and I'm okay and smarter at the end of the day.
First, I fully understand his attitude is what made you distressed about the whole thing. Pretty much everyone would have the same feelings.
Secondly, this is a business, and there are sellers, and buyers. Like any business, there is a price that is asked, and there is a price that is offered. The seller has the right to accept the offered price, or refuse to sell the item for that price.
It is the same thing with women. Women have the right to accept a lower price if they want to (for any reason whatever), or they have the right to only accept their full rates if they want.
What I have an issue with though is women who say that accepting anything less than their arbitrarily determined rates will result in them not being able to perform. If the overriding concern when you are in a session is the money in the envelope, then it is "all about the money".
OTOH if a woman says that she offers one guy a lower rate for whatever reason he does, but the session is still great, then I fully understand that, and appreciate that women for what she really is.. A great business person!
If the overriding concern when you are in a session is the money in the envelope, then it is "all about the money".
Again...none of the ladies would be here if it weren't "all about the money" And yes the over-riding concern is the envelope...why do you think we ladies get annoyed when shorted?
Even the ladies that accept the envelope after the deed, still expect there to be what they charge in that envelope and nothing less. I will freely admit the ONLY reason I do this is for the money.
It's not for the sex or validation or anything BUT the money. I get the other requirements from my SO and that's the way I want it. That line of thinking in no way prevents me from giving my clients exactly what they pay for. I am a good business woman and can say that I have never felt uncomfortable around any of my clients because I breached my business ethics.
Her words were: "feeling uncomfortable." And, that is the tone I heard in her post. Your words: "So help me understand. Why are you angry?" I did not hear that from her post.
Her first post...in my opinion she sounded angry.
What she planned to do ....sounded like she was angry. Her spiel about ending it at 45 mins...etc.
In her second post I can tell she has cooled off a bit.
These are my opinions.
I don't think it is a good idea for her to have an appt with this gentleman.
I think writing this post is the best way to get this off her chest.
I think you will be fine.
This community can be so supportive. I hope to think..we helped you!! 
Put a smile on your face
Love
Sexy
You're screwing him one way. Might as well screw him the other!
The most valuable thing (at least for me) that hobbyist pay for is the good feelings that come from a joyfull session.
Why ruin it for the sake of a few measly buck?
I would never haggle with a provider - period. I feel it is demeaning to the provider and to the client as well. It is a sign of disrespect to the lady and it certainly does not motivate her to give her best. My experience in the hobby is limited but in my experience, providers are intelligent and motivated by more then money.
Haggling is a put down. Don't do it!
I am not the hobbyist.
But just someone who has been in the biz for a while.
I can only say if you begin to haggle over your rate. You realy do not have a rate.
As Bizzaro stated He does not care weather you pay your rent. nor do you care if he pays his.
That is why every girl knows their financial obligations . We set our rates accordingly.
I do run paid ads I can't afford to go low. I did lower my rates this past quarted because I do care to still see the guys whom lost their asses in the markets.
But to set a feeling of anger over the haggle. thing. It is up to you to take responsibility. I do not haggle. It is disrespectful to me.
If He can't afford my time. There are many other hot chicas who He can...And He will have just as much of a good time I am sure.
And You won't be pissed during a session of uncomfortable atmosphere now.
It is still true money makes me smile. A big O makes me glleful. So this biz gives me both...
If you love what you do. It will show. We must take the bad with the good. we still have better jobs then most. And are rewarded many times over.
because my appreciation of the ladies in question has not diminished with my portfolio.... because I want the ladies to know they are valued..... and because they appreciate this, and express that appreciation as well..... I may be in relationships of a sort with these ladies for a while... why damage this by allowing any tinge of disrespect into the interaction? And even if not, I am a believer in Karma...
I agree with GTM and Mrfisher.
When a friend of mine went independent (I knew how much the agency took) When she contacted me to inform me she was on her own we didn't discuss $ but when I saw her, I still gave her the agency rate which was I little high for me at the time. After a few sessions she cut her rate at her suggestion, unfortunately though she has retired for now.
That said there are some guys who will try to get a deal no matter what rate you charge and others who are more respectful of your worth. Myself, if I enjoyed you so much that I want return engagements and the rate was a little high I'd rather see you less often than ask you to lower your rate. Anything a hobbyist does that will even possibly detract from a providers interest in seeing him is stupid and if he gets a less inspired performance it's his own fault.
You sound like an absolute doll, but don't let ANYONE take advantage of you. I think it's rude and just plain stupid of anyone to try lowering your donation.
Mutual respect IS important and if he can't respect you, don't go on a date with him. I'm sure there are many other guys who would treat you great and love to spend time with you.
-Anya
Make it a really shitty one. Complain the whole time about having bad allergies or whatever random annoyance you can think of.
It would be very interesting to know if this same gent goes to the grocery store and asks for last week's special ...
He won't get it cuz the special is over and if he needs the product, he will pay the price or go to another store.
I have shared this with gents in the past and they have nothing to say back cuz they know I am right!
I hope your session went well under the circumstances.
Sunshine Smiles ~
Lacie O
@->--
"Your SoCal Sweetheart"
The Original Poster stated that the returning client had seen her before on a multi hour special and then "demanded" a lesser time at the same special discounted rate.
MY take is she agreed to the service for that donation. She can & should if at all possible fulfill her agreement.
If she feels she can not (because the whole business has turned her off) provide this service for the stated donation, she should cancel. Politely.
Sure, these are hard times. I've had to take a break (had to pay the heating bills.) So I took several months off. I did not try to get my prefered ladies to reduce their rates!
I predict that this guy will be back & again expect the discounted rate. The OP will have to:
A) agree again (which I hope she won't do.)
B) tell him that only aplies IF she has a special advertized
C) tell him that only applies for multi-hours
Best of Luck,
skb
I never been in sales but when I worked as a during college, rude customers recieved the "cooks" special menu.
I think it a sign of being cheap. I do not even see ATF's on specials for that same reason. Now I do indulge "new" providers specials who I can't otherwise afford.
I think I'll be eating De Gerno's for awhile.
Well here is my two cents... I am in sales and used to be inclined to reduce my prices without getting anything for it.. I have found that it most cases people will pay the price without the need to discount.. there are always a few exceptions.. but why should someone that is just being cheap get a deal.. if this is a regular customer who commits and actually does a lot of repeat business then maybe a discount is okay. I would stick to your price..
I tried to be a good sport, I really did.
Same attentiveness, accommodating nature etc.
But he reminded me constantly of what transpired on the phone by asking me several times how business was, scoffing when I said it was fine even though I acknowledged that it was slower than say April of last year and picking on me about my rates and special offerings.
At the end he asked me to finish greek and I said no which visibly irritated him and he said "WHY? You did it last time" and instead of saying "I'm not having greek, a premium service, for $200 off" I just said that I wasn't physically prepared to neutralize the situation.
Bottom line, standard GFE that left me feeling cold and not myself and we ended up just making it a half hour.
Instead of letting me be gracious and adjust the donation he hopped out of bed and snapped up the cash off of my desk.
In the end, it was just about a quick nut and short cash for him and that is fine, but that isn't what I provide.
I hadn't felt so dirty since I worked for a house in which we were required to "hustle" and upsell in the bedroom. I didn't even feel this way working for a high volume agency.
I will never see him again, but today was my fault. I shouldn't have let him bum rush me into agreeing.
A special rate is a special rate and if it isn't advertised I don't have to honor it.
The rest of my appointments today were lovely and I feel lucky that my clients were able to help me recover quickly by just being themselves.
Lesson learned.
We've all learned or relearned lessons the hard way. And, some people, when feeling the pinch, have to share the pain with everyone around them. I'm certain he's got some pretty bad karma coming his way.
Glad you could keep it from ruining the rest of your day. Peace!
So sorry to hear that happened...Your not the firs chick he has done it to I am sure of that!!!!
Now he will use the money He snached to get a second chance at another girl too .
But fellas now ya know why money up front rules apply. there are more then a million of these out there. Not everyone are like the guys here posting on this post.
Shit happens and it all rolls downhill.
Be kind to the ladies fellas and We will be kind to you.
who never got it and never will. we can all be quite content not to be living inside his empty empty shell.
glad to hear the rest of your day was better.
Call him back and give him an excuse why you can't make the appointment. Family issues, monthly visitor, etc, etc...
And then never answer his calls again. He'll move on and be replaced by someone nicer and you will feel better about yourself. The market forces work both ways and women should never give in to haggling discussions. If more men lose their pussy privileges over this they will quit asking. Or at least quit asking you. I will never understand the small mindedness of some idiots that would piss off a girl before you want them to suck your dick.
Yep some men get it and others don't...thanks to the few that do.
Personally I'd love to know who he is....hang on I'm in no danger of him ever booking with me but young lady...please let the others know of who he is so they can have a choice whether to be treated the way you were or not.