What do you think will happen?  They have taken down all posts relating to this matter on all TBD boards.

-- Modified on 6/18/2002 6:04:10 PM

-- Modified on 6/18/2002 6:09:52 PM

A post like this was up here a few minutes ago and then disappeared.  TBD didnt even have explicit reviews up there...makes me a little nervous, here folks.  

Anyway, supposedly someone had complained back in 2000 ... guess it only takes ONE.



-- Modified on 6/18/2002 5:36:44 PM

because they may be cooperating with the authorities to bring in hobbyists and get charges reduced.
Names are in the Sheriff's press release, and pics are on the videoclip from TY10 news that is around here somewhere.
Tampa hobbyists are asked to help.
It is all over the news anyhow so there's no point in pretending it will go away.

Suppose you had an appointment with such a provider tonight?
This is a paste from the sheriff's press release, which probably was sent to every sheriff in the US and all Dunkin Donut franchises:

List of Suspect Names
Charles Stuart Kelly, DOB 08-20-50
8739 Ashworth Dr.
Tampa, Fl
Racketeering/Conspiracy to Racketeer
Deriving support from Prostitution (16 counts)
Purchasing the Services of a Prostitute
Aiding and Promoting Prostitution (21 counts)
Obstructing an Investigation
Tampering with Evidence

Steven E. Lipson, DOB 08-20-62
21510 Halstead Dr.
Boca Raton, Fl
Racketeering/Conspiracy to Racketeer
Deriving support from Prostitution (16 counts)
Aiding and Promoting Prostitution (21 counts)
Obstructing an Investigation
Tampering with Evidence

Darcy A. Piotrowski
14142 Trouville Dr
Tampa, Fl
Conspiracy to Racketeer
Committing Prostitution (5 counts)
Operating a place for Prostitution (5 counts)

Melanie M. Theile, DOB 04-09-80
4510 Whitworth Lane
Tampa, Fl
Conspiracy to Racketeer
Committing Prostitution (2 counts)

Karen M. Henry, DOB 05-26-78
14044 Citrus Pointe Dr.
Tampa, Fl
Conspiracy to Racketeer
Committing Prostitution (3 counts)
Operating a Place for the Purpose of Prostitution

List of suspect names- page two

Connie S. Tomlinson, DOB 11-27-67
Conspiracy to Racketeer
Committing Prostitution (3 counts)

Kimberly B. Larabee DOB 04-12-71
21031 Little Lake Thomas Rd
Land O’ Lakes, Fl
Conspiracy to Racketeer
Committing Prostitution (4 counts)
Operating a place for Prostitution (3 counts)

Lisa M. Rosser DOB 10-23-77
2333 Feathersound Ct., Apt. C708
Clearwater, Fl
Conspiracy to Racketeer
Committing Prostitution (3 counts)

Gulnara F. Imacva, DOB 03-05-72
2065 N. Highland Ave., A-206
Clearwater, Fl
Conspiracy to Racketeer
Committing Prostitution (2 counts)

Lyn M. Moreno, DOB 10-26-63
21227 U.S. 19
Clearwater, Fl
Conspiracy to Racketeer
Committing Prostitution (3 counts)

Heather Schrum, DOB 12-04-73
122-145th St. North
Largo, Fl
Conspiracy to Racketeer
Prostitution
Operating a Place for Prostitution
Obstructing an Investigation

List of suspect names - page three

Donni Dilorenzo, DOB 03-27-63
6212 Ashland Ave.
Leesburg, Fl
Committing Prostitution (summons issued)

Angela P. Guinn, DOB 11-22-72
2901 N. Dale Mabry Highway
Tampa, Fl
Committing Prostitution (summons issued)

Michele Corcoran, DOB 08-05-69
125- 73rd Ave. North, #28
St. Petersburg, Fl
Offering to Commit Prostitution

Maria Ruebusch, DOB 12-17-68
3520 Willow Tree Dr., #101
Tampa, Fl
Offering to Commit Prostitution

Cathlene O’Neal DOB 08-15-76
1495- 61st Ave. N.
St. Petersburg, Fl
Offering to Commit Prostitution
Possession of Cocaine

Mary C. McDevett, DOB 09-09-59
3669 Southern Rd
Richfield, OH
Offering to Commit Prostitution

List of suspect names – page four

Lisa D. Darnell, DOB 02-18-73
411 Hunter Cir
Kissimmee, Fl
Prostitution (2 counts)

Michelle Ann Eavey, DOB 03-31-68
P. O. Box 1805
Apopka, Fl
Prostitution (8 counts)

Jennifer L. Gosney DOB, 04-11-81
8813 Latrec Ave., Apt. 206
Orlando, Fl
Prostitution (4 counts)

Leslie Thompson, DOB 12-21-45
P. O. Box 941423
Maitland, Fl
Prostitution (8 counts)

Melissa Howe, DOB 05-31-68
518 Tiberon Cove Dr.
Longwood, Fl
Prostitution (12 counts)

Amanda Young, DOB 08-30-78
3601 Kennedy Blvd., Apt. B
Tampa, Fl.
Prostitution (2 counts)



-- Modified on 6/18/2002 5:51:50 PM

http://www.hcso.tampa.fl.us/pub/default.asp?/Online/qdisp/bn=02034695

Yes, the TBD Board does have a section with detailed reviews.

sheriff press releases, etc.
This is pure factual public domain information that hobbyists and providers need more than anyone else. Every hobbyist or provider who has ever been to Tampa or Orlando since mid-2000 is in jeopardy and needs to know what is happening to protect him or herself. The sheriff there arrested a number of hobbyists and is using them and providers to testify against TBD and other hobbyists. Notice that certain providers started disappearing form Tampa Eros about a year ago. Those are surely involved. Nine were arrested. LE are looking for other folks, unknown to us.

Yet, TBD is censoring everything on his sites to deprive TBD-ers of information, even the press release from the sheriff that every donut shop in America now has pasted to its wall.
It's not on TBD!!

A provider once told me that TBD was the kind of guy who would turn over all of his records to save his own [rather obese] self.
He kept extensive records on all posters and lurkers. The sheriff's office penetrated the membership and also has the records of posters, even lurkers. That is easy with minimal LE technology, and now they have all of his equipment, servers, computers, files, receipts, records, e-mails, you name it, they've got it.

TBD is probably trying to figure out how he can get a suspended sentence by screwing everybody else with his data! The LE folks have frozen his  bank accounts and confiscated his equipment, so he must be running the show from a jail cell with deputy sheriff oversight. That is scary. Guys are seeing providers in Tampa tonight with no idea that the former providers are now essentially LE informants.

The charges against TBD could not possibly be made against TER.
TBD ran a dirty operation. Read the press release. Talk to a few providers who actually have seen him. Providers all over boycotted TBD personally for reasons they prefer not to divulge, but which are far from free speech.

We have tonight entered a new era.
I just hope that Ashcroft does not come in, take over, and make this nationwide. Hopefully he is out singing hymns tonight.

This is the worst thing that has happened since Anthony Comstock was born, dickless I imagine.



-- Modified on 6/18/2002 7:30:11 PM

First, the reason that Charles (TBD) was busted was because TBD inc. was HQed in Tampa. So Tampa LE is the arresting agency. Most of the charges against TBD are in conjunction with local ladies from the Tampa and Orlando areas. But there are some RICO related charges which are generally associated with racketeering. Any lawyers out there feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

Charles was very high profile on the site, having TBD members parties (Vegas and Atlantic City)and actively posting on the boards and talking in chat. But the DA is going to have to prove to a jury that TBD knowingly took money for ads, by ladies that he knew were actively involved in selling s$x. That case may be difficult to make.

I would imagine that there is some federal(FBI) involvement since RICO is involved, but I did not see mention of the FBI in the press release. Mi dos centavos. MfSD.

I doubt that the LE is controlling TBD... because they already got their big-guy in getting TBD!  I could be wrong, and I'm not a lawyer, nor do I know about this stuff... but its my gut feeling.

We need to hear from one of TBD moderators to hear what's up.

The big danger here is TBD himself offering up everyone in the hobby to save himself. You have a different gut feeling and knowledge base when you've been a litigator for a few decades.
TBD was in way over his head, is drowning now, and wants to pull YOU down to save himself! I never speculate re the genome project, but you probably know more about that than the realities of RICO prosecutions in west central Florida.
It's not funny any longer.

A quote from the AP article on the bust ..

"Detectives said there was nothing illegal about the discussions, and in order to arrest anyone they had to catch either the escorts or their customers in the act of committing prostitution. That was difficult."

Whatever your opinion of TBD, I hardly think that EVERY SINGLE moderator would be engaged in a conspiracy to delude TBD readers and posters.  To what end?

More likely LE is trying to keep the boards alive.  While they can't arrest you for posting, they can try to keep the sting running.

BTW .. also in the rampant paranoia department ... there's been some posts on a couple of other boards suggesting TER is suppressing posts as well.

While I certainly won't be playing in Tampa anytime soon, I'm not so sure the sky's going to fall elsewhere.

Let's all be careful out there ...

I usually agree with most of Schlong's posts, but must address a few things he has said.
While TBD may be in way over his head, he was the guy they were after and independents, and hobbyists shouldn't get too stressed about all of this. While none of this is a laughing matter, THE target of this local county sting was TBD himself. They charged him on local charges --not interstate and no federal charges (at least so far).
Schlong --as a lawyer, you should know that after three years building a case, they went after the big fish.

For the sake of discussion, tell us, what could he possibly trade to lower his potential sentence? Except that he knows the names of many of the people who run the major escort agencies in the country, does he really have much to offer? Serious question, love your insights.    


And as to the speculation that he is running the site from jail, his bond is $159,000. Most of his site (like that of TER and others) runs itself once its established. But (my speculation here), I doubt it will be up for much longer).

Could anybody here give a definitive answer as to whether TER could be considered to violate the same rules as bigdoggie?  And if so, what should people do to protect themselves from prosecution?

Regards

Rest assured, there is much more to the story then is being let out to the media. What goes on "behind the scenes" at TBD is entirely different than TER.  Information is still flowing in and I feel it is improper for us (TER) to comment on the TBD Owners arrest.  We extend our deepest condolences to our competitor.

If you have any information, please email me at [email protected]

-- Staff

Thank you Staff. It's so easy for us to become fearful, reactive and impute motives.  Thanks for stating TER's stance.  I agree with you; there must be more than we are being told.  I am a provider who is listed on TBD's top lists, so if I choose to buy into fear, well I could.  Better to stay cool and think with a clear head, as rick 2 points out.  

-- Modified on 6/18/2002 10:58:14 PM

but after further thought beyond my initial reaction, as Staff has stated, I'm sure there is far more to this story than the majority of us are aware. I seriously doubt that we really have much to worry about beyond that which our normal everyday precautions are meant to help us avoid.

thanks to everyone who keeps reminding us to not let our paranoia and fear run away with us, as under these circumstances, it would be far too easy to do!

Regarding screening.

You have adamantly stated on posts that you refuse to be screened.  

Aside from the fact that these ladies' name and pics have been made public, how do you propose to screen providers, other than carrying around their pix and names with you and then demanding their id when you see them?  Of course you suspect them to be LE.  

We in turn assume a hobbyist to be LE unless we KNOW otherwise. You have our pictures and reviews, WE have nothing, but we are supposed to see you because you are a nice guy, but not screen you?

Help me out.  I must be missing a piece of the puzzle, but I would really like to understand how this works.


-- Modified on 6/19/2002 6:52:26 AM

I think it would be naive to believe that if LE were so inclined they couldn't come up with a reason to subpoena the records of TER on the same grounds.  Legally TER may be in the clear, but I doubt if the records could be shielded entirely from LE if they came up with some half-ass excuse.  I that could be used to cause a lot of grief for all of us.  Just be careful...

First of all, just as many (if not more) ladies have boycotted TER for reasons of their own. Guess what honey? In a medium like this one, you're always going to piss someone off, somehow!  Instead of posting personal gripes with him (I cannot believe the comment about his weight... are we going THERE now too?), I think it'd be a far better thing for this ENTIRE COMMUNITY to stop the petty CRAP and realize the implications that this may have for EVERY escort related website out there. They've gotten TBD, yes, and this is a groundbreaking case which is part of the reason for the extensive coverage... do you REALLY believe that bigdoggie will be the last site they target???? Don't be ridiculous!!!!!

"The charges against TBD could not possibly be made against TER."

Profiting from prostitution? Living from proceeds of prostitution??? Honey if they can say it about TBD, they can surely say it about ANY escort directory (eros), review site, or whatever.  Please, be realistic, drop the petty BS that has no place in a discussion of this level, and get down to the nitty gritty... this is indeed a terrifying concept for the country in terms of what it means to the first amendment, our freedom, and the legislation of morality.

Sincerely,
Nicole

The posts on TBD *are* now staying up... and, regardless of the why's and wherefore's, one poster there had a great point in that this sting is probably *over* now. They got the big guys (which is what they want, those big money busts, c'mon honey!), and the little guys they got on the way to get there are already over with... it's unlikely that they're going to keep it going. It's like going after a big mafia guy... once they get the BIG guy, they stop harassing the little ones at the bottom. Regardless this is definitely a time for caution!

Hugs*
Nicole

Even if you DID get arrested on some false charge of prostitution (silliest thing I've ever heard in my LIFE!), it's a misdemeanor...from a realistic perspective, how many man hours do you think they are going to devote to that when they have much more serious charges already lodged against their two *big fish*????

Hugs*
Nicole

I'm pretty sure there are members here that are LE
and they have copies of most if not all the postings, reveiws and web links, etc.  That information is not difficult to get.
The info. that they want is the provider's database where they
chat with each other and share info. on clients.  These information is more incriminating and may do some damage if they come after you.  However, I seriously doubt that they will do it on a small scale.  LE like everybody else like to have " celebrity" status and like to go after the big fish.  It makes their bust newsworthy and may scare away potential hobbyists and providers which is what they want.
However, if you are Bill Gates and you are a member here and a hobbyist, well, then you're fucked.   They definitely come after you.    

1) The press releases are posted on several of the TBD board and have not been deteted.
2) The average poster and provider has no need to be concerned. LE has better thing to do beside chase down the little fish.
3) The notion that this could not happen to TER is a false since of security.
4) This LE operation is confined to the state of Florida - for the moment.
5) Charges against TBD will likely be reduced.
6) The TBD board will likely be shut down.

You won't have to worry about TBD giving up any info on anyone..believe me LE already has it from the hard drives they grabed..

Just think, even Yahoo can be looked at, many the classified adds are providers, and they know it..

Getting the names of all the hobbiests on TBD is going to give LE plenty of leverage on OTHER cases, if the names match.. They'er going to scare the shit out of alot of married men, and these guys are going to the damage to save their own asses, and marrages..

TBD is far from the largest fish in that investigation.
LE probably considers him a lowly cyber pimp, a way to get to hobbyists who are major Democrats, celebrities, business leaders. The Sheriff has big political aspirations. Look for a TV trial starting 45 days before the upcoming November elections.

As the Orlando Sentinel says, Operation Flea Collar goes on, and more arrests are to be expected. The arrest records are put online in due course, so we can find out the working names under aliases, and know if those providers are familiar to any of us individual hobyists. Think about providers who dropped off the radar in the past eight months.  

You are indeed sexy, Ms Curves, but incorrect in more than one respect. Almost all of the charges against the nine provider defendants are felonies such as State RICO, conspiracy, obstruction of justice, destroying evidence, etc. Sorry to confuse you, but read the Sheriff's detailed press release that is posted everywhere. The devil is in the details.

The worst scenario I've heard is that charges can be added for TBD's coercion of providers to have sex in exchange for advertising. That is called involuntary sex, e g, r-a-p-e.
Even in our little DC world, I've heard that rumor for a long time. Imagine several providers testifying to that effect.

This is in Florida. The trial will be televised. A dozen providers who claim coercion will be called to testify.
Any politicians, celebrities, or high profile biz men hobbyists will be given immunity and called to testify.

In an earlier life form, I defended several high profile cases in Central Florida, Ms Curves, and I'm no alarmist at all, so don't bash or flame me. There are inside stories to what went on and what will happen over the next year. I could give you several reasons why TER is in a very different and safe category, but if you're not even reading the charges or official information releases, why bother.

That LE is going to waste time chasing down gazillions of hobbyists over silly little misdemeanor charges?? I think they're going after the big fish only, personally... I cannot imagine that giving out glorified parking tickets would be worth it... then again I think they should be after the damned terrorists in Florida instead of all over this, so I could be wrong!

Hugs*
Nicole

I know this may cause a stir -- NOT my intent.  But, I am wondering if all of these LE crack downs are politically motivated.  

This election year is going to be critical for both the Republicans, as well as the Democrats.  If either wins a few more seats, they have control of the House.

Excellent post Nic.  They have what they wanted the top Big Dog's.  But still a bit of caution is in order and screening is a MUST!

We have some terrific mutual friends, so it's not an issue.
I have lots of references and posted reviews for screening in general.

LE have undercover identities so your screening is worthless. That is the point providers cannot seem to understand, the missing piece of the puzzle, the total denial of the undercover LE reality.

I screen providers by seeing only recommended ultravixens or individuals who have excellent reviews. I never suspect they are LE. We don't have an LE problem in DC, unlike OC and SD.
I would be very cautious myself in Tampa, OC, SD, Chicago, the Carolinas, etc. I would never see a provider in Virginia or Maryland, unless I knew her fairly well already.

In this thread, I'm trying to figure out who all were arrested, so hobbyists can know and not be set up, or not worry too much.
So far only a few of the arrest records have been posted, and the TV pics of the suspects were not much help when viewed through Windows Media Player, but I'll look some more.

Montgomery County Maryland LE are telephoning gents of late whose home or biz numbers were in a suspected providers little book or computer. That's a real good reason to avoid being screened.

One of the providers arrested in Tampa had a very stringent screening process. She met for drinks, checked ID, the whole works. Now she is charged with pros, conspiracy, abetting racketeering, the works. Those charges include seizure and possible forfeiture of assets, cars, homes, so she has an incentive to turn on high profile hobbyists. A lot of good the screening did her.
Choosing where to LIVE is much more important.

You said:

In an earlier life form, I defended several high profile cases in Central Florida, Ms Curves, and I'm no alarmist at all, so don't bash or flame me. There are inside stories to what went on and what will happen over the next year. I could give you several reasons why TER is in a very different and safe category, but if you're not even reading the charges or official information releases, why bother

My request:

PLEASE BOTHER...some of us REALLY want to hear/read the rest of what you have to say.


-- Modified on 6/19/2002 8:10:27 AM

out the escorts.  LE set up a sting on TBD that caught several clients, but none were charged in exchanged for cooperating accorting to Tampa news reports.  They probably agreed to finger certain escorts who advertised on TBD so LE could link TBD to known prostitution.

One of the differences is that some providers offered TBD paid members discounts for services.

Reading from the TBD upgrade membership page... "Bigdoggie.net Members Receive Discounts From Participating Providers". Hence he has getting memberships in return certain providers gave discount to the members - he profited from it.

I'm not trying to trash bigdoggies, I'm pointing out what the prosecution will try to convict him on.

-- Modified on 6/19/2002 8:24:37 AM

I don't know of any sucessful prosecution of any "client" that was from a "John's list", discussion board, or database. They have to prove that money was exchanged for sexual acts. Even reviews can't be used as proof. I could easily say that it was only a story from the figment of my masterbation...errr imagination.

First is the Sheriff's Press Release, a must-read-first:

http://www.hcso.tampa.fl.us/Press_Releases/Press_Releases/2002/02-270.html.

1/ That is Tampa. TER is in LA, different climate. Not so many fundamentalists pushing their hypocritical morality on the politicians. Maybe TBD is hosted from Fairfax, Virginia, which is worse than Tampa.

2/ The TBD charges include destruction of evidence, and something akin to resisting arrest, and other items unrelated to free speech.
We'll know more when the State releases copies of the actual charges, but clearly Tampa LE is going after much more than free speech, a much more active involvement in prostitution.

3/ I suppose that the biggest fish in LA are the descendents of Heidi Fleiss, i e, Nicisgirls.com and LA-Exotics. TER is low key and well down the food chain where it is safer. LA LE has higher priorities than consensual adult behavior. Tampa and Hillsborough County do not. There are more than 300 Baptist churches in Orlando, which also has a large piece of this prosecution, and a bad history of harassing adult gents' clubs.

4/ TER is almost entirely free speech and press. The charges say that TBD was more "hands on," beyond the line of pure information. Even much tobacco advertising is "commercial speech" protected by the First Amendment although cigs are highly dangerous in ways that bbjs are not. TER is not inciting anybody to do anything, just passing along info, same as when guys exchange e-mails about providers

5/ TBD was heavily into advertising and making money, a factor that detracts from the speech side of his defense enormously. Ads and pics over there started disappearing fast yesterday, leaving little xx's behind. TBD also owns part of TBDXCiteMe.net or something, an escort ad board, plus. The Sheriff hasn't mentioned that specifically, but it has a Florida component.

6/ TER is NOT run by a high profile guy who goes around the country supposedly seeing lots of escorts, supposedly exchanging ad rate reductions for sex. That seems to be a big part of the case according to the Sheriff and Florida news. The Tampa Tribune and Orlando Sentinel are both online, incidentally, and good to check with daily for a while.

7/ Most importantly TER is simply NOT actively promoting prostitution in the "in your face" hands on manner of which TBD is accused, or at all. TER has never set any guy up to see any provider.

8/ I get the feeling that TBD had many enemies and few friends. There's a real reaction of "It could not have happened to a more deserving guy." TER is quite different in that regard.
Escorts who are enemies will help the prosecution in exchange for immunity or just to vent.

9/ TER is surely more sophisticated legally than TBD. Who knows what private statements TBD has made that will be used against him as admissions against penal interest. The press release quotes some, and there are nine providers as defendants too who'll sing. LE will fan out and interview all 100 escorts on the TBD Top List for the SE, most of whom are in Florida and can be forced to testify under grants of immunity. That is where the testimony on sex for advertising favors may come in.
The posts and reviews in TBD are all business records and may be fully admissible in court for some purposes. I taught federal evidence at one time. This trial will break new ground in the evidence field in many ways.

Most of those are pragmatic differences, only some are legal ones. As Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr said, the life of the law has been experience, not logic, or something like that.
The details of statutory elements, evidence, defenses, and the like will keep the lawyers very busy, but the practical overall Gestalt is more important to a jury.

This TBD prosecution will have a huge chilling effect on the hobby. It is another 9/11 to hobbyists and providers alike.
There is a danger that prosecutors all over the US, state & federal, will use the Tampa pattern. The Florida prosecutors will be speakers at all kinds of LE meetings, conventions, and donut tasting festivities. June 18 was "Dog Day" in many ways.
This will certainly get the attention of Ashcroft, and he will want his piece of the pie, a higher profile similar prosecution, somewhere else, such as Atlanta or LA. There are so many bad apples in LA that I cannot imagine a good apple as being the target.

I'm tempted to write a little book on this case, to follow it closely, maybe a screenplay too. It has everything. Charlie Sheen could play himself! Bill Clinton could make his film debut, surfing for bbjs from the Oval Office.

I hope that answers your concerns. This is only the beginning.
TLS

-- Modified on 6/19/2002 9:55:25 AM

None of us were forced to buy memberships nor were we ever asked to give discounts to TBD members.  I do not see how that would be profitting from pros.

I have watched and endured several raids in my long life.  The folks in LE win just by the act of raiding and ruining the financial and personal lives of the folks raided.  Once I got my servers back six months later in boxes.

I think that it would be a worthwhile exercise for somebody to review the procedures at TER to make sure that everything has been done to reduce the chances of a raid (conviction not being nearly as relevant) and that names and any other info which points to any person involved through TER site is off any local server...and hopefully not on any server at all anywhere.  

I for one would be much more comfortable if I knew for sure that the data which LE wanted was in some hard to get to foreign country... sure, it might take 2 milliseconds longer to post... but it is a vast difference with the physical evidence in another country... Probably there are many other things which can and should be done now that we have had a 9/11 type incident.

Maybe you or somebody in the know could give us some cold comfort.  LA is not Tampa.. but it is still LA and that is where I was raided years ago.  Cops are cops and if somebody gets a hard on to crush some on the edge business I pity the principals or anybody else in the way.  Lets try to keep TER folks and also customers (like me) out of harms way.

Thanks for the thoughtful comments.

BBM

Hat's off to TheLost Sclong.  Thanks for sharing the TBD bust, as well for providing your legal perspective.  

Personally, I found it most useful, and informative.

Staff, stop it, PULEEZE!!!! You're killing me!!!!

And I appreciate the honest and thoughtful response, vs. so much of the vitriolic paranoid nonsense that is going around!

Hugs*
Nicole

At least now you're talking about some logical points instead of just sounding like a pissed off schoolboy... so THANKS Schlong! I posted asking you to elaborate but apparently it didn't get "approved." =:O Dunno what I said that was wrong, but oh well!

Ok, a few things... I think the above post about the TBD discount is a verrrrry good point.  You are also right in that the TER staff is not high profile (altho sometimes I'd feel more comfy if I had a clue who they are LOL).  I don't really understand the diff between TER, TBD or any other escort site on point number 4.  And on number 5, well jeeze guys, ANYone who puts this much time and effort into a website is going to be concerned about making money, and most of that will come via memberships or advertising. Are you saying the difference is that individual ladies don't usually advertise here? 'Cuz I'm looking at a banner rotator above that goes thru several agencies and directory sites.

As far as #7 goes, TBD never made any appt's for me, and I can only speak for myself... but I'm not sure I'm seeing the "in your face" difference you speak of. If anything, the reviews here are far more explicit... and are required to be more explicit to be posted, so it must be some other point you mean that I'm missing.

"8/ I get the feeling that TBD had many enemies and few friends."

Obviously! I'll keep my personal feelings on that one, personal... but I feel like anyone who is on the web long enough is going to find themselves with enemies, it's the way of the world. TBD has been around longest of all the escort related sites, from what I understand... correct me if I'm wrong... so it stands to reason that he's built up lots of enemies. Probably lots of those enemies wound up going out on their own and starting their own sites!

How is TER more sophisticated legally? I'd love to start a site for ladies... since lord knows if TBD's will be around for long! So I really would love to hear what you have to say... not rant, like before, but SAY like you did this time. Well done!

Hugs*
Nicole

prostitution (except the Church....child molestation..OK, prostitution..bad). Sir Schlong, have ripped you in the past when I thought you were wrong, but have to hand it to you on this one, you're ALMOST right....just kidding; good job. Thanks for the info.

Because TBD benefitted from girls who offered members' discounts and it was TBD who enacted this program.

I predicted well over a year ago that he would be arrested and I was scoffed.  All I can say is Told You So!

-- Modified on 6/19/2002 3:39:14 PM

Schlong,

Girls have a right to feel safe from other than just LE so stop playing dumb...you are just being manipulative.   Seeing an anonymous stranger is a lot riskier for safety sake and not just to avoid LE, than knowing who you are dealing with.  I would suffice to say a person planning on raping and robbing a girl is not going to let her call him at work.


And stop putting yourself in the center of the universe.   Since being a "high-profile hobbyist" is not a felony, LE is not interested in the clients.  They want The Big Pimp and they have him.  The girls will be squeezed to turn witness against him in exchange for charges being dropped or lessened.


Those girls get what they deserve by not standing up to him and telling him to Fuck Off a long time ago.  I have no sympathy for girls who supported his game.


Wonder if his GF Miss Sasha of NYC was arrested too?   Any word?


-- Modified on 6/19/2002 3:45:45 PM

Re Charges against TBD will likely be reduced...
Maybe.  But the IRS has not been heard from yet.  And you can be sure they will look at income and whether taxes were paid.

you mention Atlanta... i'm in atlanta and with no new reviews posted, god i must be 4 or 5 pages back... i am getting a lot of new inquiries, inquiries in the volume of 'hey, somebody must have posted a review!'
and reading, and reading, and reading you seem to be a good one to ask.
i'm pretty comfortable with how i screen and select a client. pretty comfortable with how i conduct myself on the date and pretty comfortable with how i conduct what comes after...
BUT...
should i have my radar on higher alert than usual? what makes you mention Atlanta specifically?
i dont wanna go to jail, i'm just here to get a freaking masters degree (and they'll really want to let me into the school of education with a pros. arrest)
respond here, or PM
is all fine with me.
Thanks,
Nicole

-- Modified on 6/19/2002 3:34:37 PM

then the answer is YES YES YES.

xxx

I always thought the infamous list would be the cause of some trouble.  I even posted as such on there prior to getting banned.  TBD lists, in rank order, the top escorts around the country.  It has long been held that TBD received free sessions, among other things, in exchange for getting on this list.  One of the charges filed alleges he provided advertising and protection for sex.  By putting up the list of these providers isn't the site vouching and promoting these ladies? Doesn't this result in TBD benefiting financially?  These points relate to some of the other charges which were filed.  It will be interesting to see what happens.

Its so funny to hear all these girls swear they didn't get offered placement on his list in exchange for sex but he was legally charged with doing just that!

I guess the posters claiming that was what was really going on have been proven right!

Or perhaps the girls will say it is part of a vast right-wing conspiracy and simply not true!  haha  Heck, whose going to admit to screwing TBD in exchange for placement on his list anyway?  How embarassing!

-- Modified on 6/19/2002 4:52:40 PM

DO YOU REALLY THINK THOSE WHO YOURE CALLING LIARS LIKE FELICA FOX, NICOLE OF SOUTHERN CALI, AND JAQUELINE REALLY NEED TBD'S ENDORSEMENT SO MUCH THAT THEY WOULD SCREW HIM TO BE ON A LIST THAT ISN'T EVEN A BIG DEAL HERE IN CALI? HELL NO! WHY? BECAUSE, UNLIKE YOU, THEY HAVE GREAT REVIEWS ON TER AS WELL AS TBD. I DONT KNOW WHAT HAPPENS IN FLORIDA. BUT HERE TER IS WHERE THE CLIENTS COME FROM. COULD IT BE THAT THESE PROVIDERS JUST HAVE GREAT SERVICE? SOMETHING THAT FROM YOUR REVIEWS YOU OBVIOUSLY DONT KNOW MUCH ABOUT. IF PROVIDERS IN FLORIDA WERE COERCED OR MADE TO FEEL THEIR BUSINESS DEPENDED ON BEING ON THIS LIST AND TO BE ON IT THEY HAD TO DO FAVORS THEN THAT IS A TERRIBLE THING. BUT FOR US HERE IN CALI WHO KNOW TER IS CALI'S MAIN RESOURCE BEING ON THE LIST DOESNT DO MUCH FOR US. YOU SURE DO COMPLAIN ALOT AND MAKE ALOT OF ACCUSATIONS TALISA. MAYBE IF YOU PUT LESS EFFORT INTO BITCHING AND MORE EFFORT INTO MAKING YOUR CLIENTS HAPPIER THEN THEY WOULD GIVE YOU BETTER REVIEWS. THEN YOUD KNOW WHERE PROVIDERS LIKE FELICIA AND NICOLE AND JACQULINE ARE COMING FROM. OR ARE YOU PLANNING ON MAKING ACCUSATIONS THAT PROVIDERS WHO HAVE GOOD REVIEWS ON TER SOMEHOW PAID FOR THEM TOO? YOU DONT KNOW WHAT REALLY HAPPENED WITH THIS TBD SITUATION ANY MORE THAN ANYONE ELSE. EVER THINK ABOUT STOPPING YOUR FINGER POINTING AND WORKING ON YOUR SERVICE QUALITY INSTEAD? AND YES I KNOW I AM TYPING IN ALL CAPS BECAUSE I AM SHOUTING. I THINK THAT RIPPING ON THESE PROVIDERS WITH GREAT REVIEWS AND ACCUSING THEM OF DOING THIS IS SILLY AND OUT OF YOUR OWN JEALOUSY.

The TBD moderators are nothing more than the average Joe who has nothing better to do with his life than spend time on the boards reading every word ever posted.  They are nobodys and know just as much about what is going on than you.  I wouldn't rely on them for any info.

It would have nothing to do with national politics.
Some local politician or DA might do it to enhance his credentials, and neither Democrats nor Republicans shy away from that.

Isn't it comforting to know that for two years, law enforcement in Florida was carrying out the "largest of its kind" operation to take down a web site catering to escorts and their customers, while at the same time, in the same state, terrorists were living there and learning to fly planes?

Go, Jeb, go!

TOUCHE!!

You may not like what Talisa said, but to come here to judge and scrutinize a providers reviews and how you think she should improve is pretty weak.  Especially, at the same time you go hide behind an alias.  
Sorry, but that totally takes away from any legitimacy of your post.

ps. COULD YOU STOP TYPING IN ALL CAPS

-- Modified on 6/20/2002 2:08:46 PM

LE in every state should be more concern about terrorists and other other freaks!!!!!!!

Garfield would love you and never stop.
And to think you are just across the water way from here. Hmmm.
What would Kasparov do?

I seldom respond to any posts that appear to have political overtones of any kind, therefore although I'm making an excetion it this case, I will make it very brief.

While I have no idea where you are from, as long as you infer that J. Bush was somehow responsible for the the fanatics in Florida---How exactly is it that you feel about California's own Gray Davis?  The last time I looked there was more of a 9/11 connection in CA than anywhere else.  Hmmmm???