TER General Board

Question regarding monthly allowance for Sugar Baby
cashmereWright 2875 reads
posted
1 / 42

I've been on the "Seeking Arrangements" website now for a couple months.  

I have recently been on 3 dinner dates with one woman that I am attracted to, and we just had the discussion about taking it to the next level (ie, a mutually beneficial relationship).

Here are the general terms, conditions, assumptions:

*  Her monthly cash allowance is in the $1,800 range, to be paid on a bi-weekly basis.
*  We meet up for dinner dates or other outings like concerts, etc about 4 times / month.  I will, of course pay for these meals and incidentals expenses.
*  We have "intimacy" 2 or 3 times per month.  We will only meet at upscale hotels for these dates that include intimacy.
*  We discussed an arrangement that lasts about 3 or 4 months (basically for the entire summer while she is in town during her summer vacation from college).

Just curious to hear people's opinions on the terms of the arrangement described above?

Thank

FoxyNC See my TER Reviews 1537 reads
posted
2 / 42

It was seemed to me like you would want to take her out for a test ride before you invest such a large sum.
Just my two¢…

GaGambler 1850 reads
posted
3 / 42

and it's not like it's an enforceable "employment contract", if it doesn't work out, either party is free to cancel without notice.

I don't see anything wrong with it personally. it sounds very affordable for you, very beneficial to her, my only gripe would be I would want more fucking, excuse me "intimacy:" lol But this isn't about me, it's about the OP and if he is happy and she is happy, I don't see any red flags that jump out at me.

FoxyNC See my TER Reviews 1395 reads
posted
4 / 42

Yes, as usual GaGambler, your reasoning & logic are impeccable as ever.  No one can contest that.
However, he did not actually elude to the fact that he Actually has 'tested the waters'...
I am sure that most men test drive the car before they even lease it.

 
After all, business is business.

Jacque_Jenesais See my TER Reviews 1609 reads
posted
5 / 42

It's a different situation here, but really I think he's getting a lot for his money if he's truly attracted.

looks like a lot of clockless nights, which cost $3,000 in a lot of cases - on the mid tier end.

cashmereWright 1452 reads
posted
6 / 42

Thank you for the replay, Ms FoxyNC,

I have seen some discussion on the Seeking Arrangement blog about guys who want a "test drive".  I am not 100% clear what they mean, but my interpretation is that they want to have a roll in the hay before they decided whether they want to pay any financial assistance?   In my opinion, that's dishonest dealing on guy's part and it's not something I would ever try to pull.

I gave her $900 up front and we agreed to meet up later this week for the first date that will include "intimacy".  I guess there's a risk she might flake out on me, but I put that risk at less than 10%, so I am comfortable with it.

I guess, the gist of my question is this:  Do this the financial assistance and the terms / expectations that I've presented seem "reasonable"?

 

 
Posted By: FoxyNC
 
 It was seemed to me like you would want to take her out for a test ride before you invest such a large sum.  
 Just my two¢…

AnotherDonJohn 1640 reads
posted
7 / 42

...Gag was prob comparing it to other SA/SD/SB arrangements.

Maybe you are negotiating differently which is good for you.

But it is not priced relative to an overnight with a hooker. It's still a good point of reference I'll grant.
Posted By: OpenMindedGFE
It's a different situation here, but really I think he's getting a lot for his money if he's truly attracted.  
   
 looks like a lot of clockless nights, which cost $3,000 in a lot of cases - on the mid tier end.
-- Modified on 5/25/2014 10:06:06 AM

mrfisher 111 Reviews 1251 reads
posted
8 / 42

but nothing about those times being overnights.

If they are, and there are MSOGs each time, then I'd say this is a pretty good deal, even if only twice a month.

On the other hand, if those "times" is a one shot and we're done, then, not so much.

And who is paying for the hotel?

It also seems odd to go out on a date with your paramour and not have some "intimacy"; just sayin'.

The devil is in the details, so to speak.

cashmereWright 1428 reads
posted
9 / 42

Hello Mr. Fisher, thanks for the reply.

I will pay for the hotel, and do not expect her stay overnight.  I do expect 2 or 3 hours of intimacy for each hotel date.  

This whole SB/SD arrangement is new to both of us, and I just wanted to try it out to see if it might work.  

The devil is in the details, though, and then there's also the uncertainty about whether there will even be any chemistry or if she's good in bed.

I hope it works out, but it's more tricky than what I had imagined when I decided to dip my toe in to the Sugar Bowl.
Posted By: mrfisher
but nothing about those times being overnights.

If they are, and there are MSOGs each time, then I'd say this is a pretty good deal, even if only twice a month.

On the other hand, if those "times" is a one shot and we're done, then, not so much.

And who is paying for the hotel?

It also seems odd to go out on a date with your paramour and not have some "intimacy"; just sayin'.

The devil is in the details, so to speak.

hiddenhills 143 Reviews 2197 reads
posted
10 / 42

If it works for both you, and it appears it does, what do you care what the rest of us think.  Everyone plays differently, someone mentioned it'd like cbj or bbbj. Whatever floats your boat.  

Posted By: cashmereWright
Thank you for the replay, Ms FoxyNC,  
   
 I have seen some discussion on the Seeking Arrangement blog about guys who want a "test drive".  I am not 100% clear what they mean, but my interpretation is that they want to have a roll in the hay before they decided whether they want to pay any financial assistance?   In my opinion, that's dishonest dealing on guy's part and it's not something I would ever try to pull.  
   
 I gave her $900 up front and we agreed to meet up later this week for the first date that will include "intimacy".  I guess there's a risk she might flake out on me, but I put that risk at less than 10%, so I am comfortable with it.  
   
 I guess, the gist of my question is this:  Do this the financial assistance and the terms / expectations that I've presented seem "reasonable"?  
   
   
   
   
   
Posted By: FoxyNC
 
  It was seemed to me like you would want to take her out for a test ride before you invest such a large sum.  
  Just my two¢…

dukkar 289 Reviews 1301 reads
posted
11 / 42

The only concern is  your paying upfront.  If she flakes  on the intimacy visits, or  dinner dates then your screwed.  Take in consideration things do come up and she has to cancels a particular date.    What assurance to do have that your getting what you expect.   You  could agree to pay her  for each intimate  visit; bear  in mind if you cancel then you should  still honor the agreed amount.

cashmereWright 1364 reads
posted
12 / 42

Yeah, well, I paid the $900 upfront.  I understand the risk that she may flake out, but it do think it is a small risk.  But if it happens, then lesson learned.

As far as "assurances", I mean, there are very few things that are certain in life.  The tricky part is that I do think that the first time we are intimate, she may be a little nervous, which is understandable.  I mean, she's new to this. But then, if she were to continue to have issues with the intimacy part of the arrangement, then I would have to let her know that I am no longer interested.  
Posted By: dukkar
The only concern is  your paying upfront.  If she flakes  on the intimacy visits, or  dinner dates then your screwed.  Take in consideration things do come up and she has to cancels a particular date.    What assurance to do have that your getting what you expect.   You  could agree to pay her  for each intimate  visit; bear  in mind if you cancel then you should  still honor the agreed amount.

FoxyNC See my TER Reviews 1258 reads
posted
13 / 42

Comparing apples to oranges in the sex worker industry…

Comparing a provider to a sugar baby is similarly a poor comparison.
And I'm sure that a lot of providers who are charging $400 an hour may be offended by such a price, and I'm sure the ones who are charging even more, would assure you that you're getting the better end of this deal.  
However…
There are girls in this industry who charge by far less, I'm not sure exactly what your location is like, a metropolitan areas of course rates are going to be higher, whereas rural areas of course the price will be significantly less.
The price that any provider would charge for overnight does not directly correlated with the value of a sugar baby and an overnight visit or multiple meetings.  I do not think that a sugar baby has the exact mind frame that a provider has…
I'm not arguing that her time is not as valuable, however, not to make the equivalent statement of:  
That a sugar baby equals the services provided by a provider…  Which is not true.
The method of both: performance and payment- not merely being in the same classification…
I'm sure that average sugar baby isn't going to feel the need to perform as much as a provider...  So in terms of value, honestly is at your own personal opinion to determine if the value is right to you.
Are you having some kinds of feelings of guilt?  Why is there a need to ask for a general consensus?  Really in the end, it is only her opinion and your opinion that are of any consequence.
The only thing I meant by the test drive was…  Was to make sure that the drive would be worth it before you handed over the whole lump sum, which you already have avoided by claiming to have a biweekly payment plan.

I never said to rip the girl off.  Not paying anything upfront of course is a very bad idea.
Then again shelling out $900 and not receiving anything is also a pretty bad idea too.  Please let us know with an update…  I'm curious to see if this works out or she makes off with the dough

munchinmuffin 75 Reviews 1822 reads
posted
14 / 42

Interesting arrangement.  I think if I were in your shoes, I'd try to firm up some of the conditions.  For instance, when you go out on a date, what is the minimum and max time for the date?  On the intimate evenings, same thing....and whether it will be full service, will protection be used etc.  

If you go through with it, it would be great to hear some periodic reports as to how the arrangement has worked out...did she keep up with her side of the bargain and did you.  Were there any conflicts or did it all go smoothly.  Does she want to re-up the arrangement the following summer?  And of course, how was she in the sack overall (very satisfying, just ok, substandard, etc)

hotplants 1158 reads
posted
15 / 42

ou: I made this arrangement with a SB and now she’s screwing me. We agreed to 4 social outings a month + 2 or 3 nights at a hotel for sex. I’m paying for her time 6 to 7 nights a month and now she’s avoiding me.  

 
Her: I made this arrangement with a SD and now he’s all pissed-off because he thinks I’m not spending enough time with him. We agreed to 4 social meetings a month, 2 or 3 of which would include sex at a hotel. Now he expects me to be available 6 or 7 times a month and sometimes spend all day and night with him.

TER gallery: Burn her!!!  Burn her!!!!! You’re taking advantage!!! She’s a greedy bitch!!!! You’re an idiot!!! blah, blah and etcetera……lol…

How long will these 4 social outings last? is it 2 nights of intimacy, or 3? For how long each time? 2 hours, or 3 hours? all day? all day + all night?  

If she goes on a social date with you 4 times a month, that’s at least 12 hours of her time (probably more). Then she spends 3 hours, 3 times a month at a hotel. Now she’s spending 21 hours a month with you for $1800. That’s about $85 bucks an hour.  

 
Now, of course, it’s not your fault if she initially agrees to something like the above. $85 hr beats the crap out of waiting tables. And it's a great $ deal for you. But seems it would be beneficial for both of you to tighten-up expectations before signing on the dotted line

mrfisher 111 Reviews 1295 reads
posted
16 / 42

even after having several dates, then that does not bode well.

For me, I have a good sense of the chemistry on the first date.  I've seldom been wrong about it, and those I have good chemistry with are the ones I see for years and years.

I think you should back off of this offer and see the gal on a one date at a time basis so you can keep yourself open to setting up a SD relationship with someone that you really click with.

MarkusKetterman 150 Reviews 2083 reads
posted
17 / 42

you don't even know what service level to expect?   and "two or three" ?  that sounds pretty uncertain...    

if you're lonely get a girlfriend  or go on a dating site and date someone(s) for fun -  and if you want performance keep it separate clean and simple and see highly reviewed providers -  it would be less drama,  most likely higher performance and happier in the long run I'd wager....

dantananot 12 Reviews 1059 reads
posted
18 / 42
hammerhead896 50 Reviews 1211 reads
posted
22 / 42

I get it breaks down into a good hourly rate I guess but for me I would rather be with a highly reviewed provider who I hopefully get along with well for the social aspect of things on her hourly. Also as far as variety I still have the option of switching things up with seeing other girls and again for me it's all about the quality of service most civie girls do not give head or service you quite like a provider can and will just sayin!

hotplants 1103 reads
posted
23 / 42

3-4 months of seeing each other 1-2-3 times a week (or, whatever the # is they’ve not explicitly agreed upon) allows a lot more time for one, or both of them to start feeling resentful over unclear expectations.  

Then again, instead of clarifying expectations, he can just start throwing $1800 a month at her and hope for the best. And if he starts to feel like she’s not showing-up as often, or as long as he expected, and she starts to feel like he’s taking advantage, they can enjoy a genuine BF/GF experience trying to work it out. Sounds fun.  

 
How many levels of Lawful Evil Wizardess are there, BTW

HeathersLuv4u See my TER Reviews 1878 reads
posted
24 / 42

...comfy with.  
What's too little and too much for each of y'all.
Will you set your next play while you're together/prior to parting ways during/after a date?
Are you looking to communicate with her outside of what's necessary to make arrangements.?
Would this be via email/text/ph?  
Or  
Are you looking to communicate outside of the 3-4 dates per month?
If so, how often and how?  
Example:
1-2 times per week/2-3 text?
3-4 times per week/1-2 text?
1 call and 2 text per week/biweekly?
2 emails/4 text/1 phone call?
7 text, 5 calls, 12 emails?
Or
24/7 access via phone/text/email (outside of pooping but she return call/text/blabla when finished)  

Above is just an example....do why works for both of y'all.
Just make sure that part is very clearly defined. It's the number or reason SB (been there) terminates the SD arrangement

Jacque_Jenesais See my TER Reviews 1611 reads
posted
25 / 42

say that to every girl he wants to and have continual sex with a bunch of young hot chicks. I never liked that idea. So I started doing this lol.

skarphedin 1068 reads
posted
27 / 42
AnotherDonJohn 1016 reads
posted
28 / 42

Women put words in our mouths...
I don't think the OP was comparing apples to oranges...he only wants to knows what the oranges should cost... As there is less guidance out there on the orange market.

I can tell from the tone of responses and the rumors which guys here have done the SD/SB thing. 10 years ago, there was a push here to move that discussion elsewhere, prob to focus on the traditional hobbying model. SDing is really a harder thing to navigate and I have avoided such overtures from veteran providers here to "test drive" because I think their expectations will be off.  

Hidden hills had the best advice to the OP. If they reached agreement then who cares what everyone thinks. Only thing I could tell him is whether he is high/low/neutral to the market bids ... But I would need to know the girl's features and the formal agreement on the frequency of visits... And know his "features" (not just his wallet size either)...having advised a provider friend on her pricing, i can say that it's also partly an audition on the guy... As long as his range of support allows her to live her lifestyle comfortably and avoid hooking with many more guys then she's more likely to price a "good" guy less than an onerous one.  
Posted By: FoxyNC
Comparing apples to oranges in the sex worker industry…  
   
 Comparing a provider to a sugar baby is similarly a poor comparison.  
 And I'm sure that a lot of providers who are charging $400 an hour may be offended by such a price, and I'm sure the ones who are charging even more, would assure you that you're getting the better end of this deal.  
 However…  
 There are girls in this industry who charge by far less, I'm not sure exactly what your location is like, a metropolitan areas of course rates are going to be higher, whereas rural areas of course the price will be significantly less.  
 The price that any provider would charge for overnight does not directly correlated with the value of a sugar baby and an overnight visit or multiple meetings.  I do not think that a sugar baby has the exact mind frame that a provider has…  
 I'm not arguing that her time is not as valuable, however, not to make the equivalent statement of:  
 That a sugar baby equals the services provided by a provider…  Which is not true.  
 The method of both: performance and payment- not merely being in the same classification…  
 I'm sure that average sugar baby isn't going to feel the need to perform as much as a provider...  So in terms of value, honestly is at your own personal opinion to determine if the value is right to you.  
 Are you having some kinds of feelings of guilt?  Why is there a need to ask for a general consensus?  Really in the end, it is only her opinion and your opinion that are of any consequence.  
 The only thing I meant by the test drive was…  Was to make sure that the drive would be worth it before you handed over the whole lump sum, which you already have avoided by claiming to have a biweekly payment plan.  
   
 I never said to rip the girl off.  Not paying anything upfront of course is a very bad idea.  
 Then again shelling out $900 and not receiving anything is also a pretty bad idea too.  Please let us know with an update…  I'm curious to see if this works out or she makes off with the dough!  
 

GaGambler 1182 reads
posted
30 / 42

so lets say he pays her before their first "intimate date" and it sucks. he's only out nine hundred bucks, no worse off than if he booked a three hour date with an average priced provider, and I don't know of any hookers that allow "test drives" do you??? lol

i am still a bit confused that he plans on having more "non intimate" dates, than dates where he actually has sex, but each to his own I suppose.

hotplants 1496 reads
posted
31 / 42
skarphedin 1167 reads
posted
32 / 42
2labman 26 Reviews 893 reads
posted
34 / 42

The difference between 2 and 3 is 50%.  Is this a one-hour visit, or 4 hours, or overnight?  BIG price spread there.  Can't estimate value for dollar without pinning that stuff down.

I spend that much seeing my regular once a week, but I know exactly what I'll be getting for that much money.

anonymousfun 6 Reviews 1286 reads
posted
35 / 42

monthly rate is very high. How long do you stay for$600 per visit? How many times do you fuck?

Important considerations don’t you think?

Jacque_Jenesais See my TER Reviews 1162 reads
posted
36 / 42

I had a very short (official) SD/SB arrangement, and one of the reasons it didn't work out for me was because the bedroom activities just weren't happening. If I were going to commit to one man, the bedroom activities do have to be pretty good.

DickFitswell 1019 reads
posted
37 / 42
keystonekid 114 Reviews 1017 reads
posted
38 / 42

be making a pretty nice sum to cover her tuition and living expenses while away at college.  Now, if she contuse as a provider during the school year, then she should not have any college loans once she graduates.

AnotherDonJohn 1171 reads
posted
39 / 42

...but it's funny hearing her speculate on the dynamics! Lol.

Posted By: hotplants
 
 You: I made this arrangement with a SB and now she’s screwing me. We agreed to 4 social outings a month + 2 or 3 nights at a hotel for sex. I’m paying for her time 6 to 7 nights a month and now she’s avoiding me.  
   
   
 Her: I made this arrangement with a SD and now he’s all pissed-off because he thinks I’m not spending enough time with him. We agreed to 4 social meetings a month, 2 or 3 of which would include sex at a hotel. Now he expects me to be available 6 or 7 times a month and sometimes spend all day and night with him.  
   
 TER gallery: Burn her!!!  Burn her!!!!! You’re taking advantage!!! She’s a greedy bitch!!!! You’re an idiot!!! blah, blah and etcetera……lol…  
   
 How long will these 4 social outings last? is it 2 nights of intimacy, or 3? For how long each time? 2 hours, or 3 hours? all day? all day + all night?  
   
 If she goes on a social date with you 4 times a month, that’s at least 12 hours of her time (probably more). Then she spends 3 hours, 3 times a month at a hotel. Now she’s spending 21 hours a month with you for $1800. That’s about $85 bucks an hour.  
   
   
 Now, of course, it’s not your fault if she initially agrees to something like the above. $85 hr beats the crap out of waiting tables. And it's a great $ deal for you. But seems it would be beneficial for both of you to tighten-up expectations before signing on the dotted line.  
 
-- Modified on 5/26/2014 9:19:39 AM

AdelleAnderson See my TER Reviews 1547 reads
posted
40 / 42

I think you would be better off just paying for her time by each event. It will keep things on the right track. She may find that you expect more time, on those non-intimate ' evenings then she thinks she should spend. Same thing for the intimate nights.  
I like the pay as you go format. Gives each participant a better understanding of what to expect, less chance of drama. I don't like drama! LOL~ well unless I am out at a show

Luscious_Liv 1223 reads
posted
41 / 42

That is completely degrading... I speak from experience... I am not a car to be taken out on a test run... a frank open conversation about sex and your interests should be enough to know if you are compatible. If there is chemistry you will know before you have sex.  

 
Why not pay for a first romp in the hay that way there is no commitments and there are not hard feelings... Its just like real life easy to get promised or lied to about a whole lot of stuff and then disappear after getting what you want. Lots of guys do this and try games like this and blow smoke up your ass and promise the world and as soon as the cum they do not feel the need to keep them.  

There is a reason we get the money upfront as providers....

Jedmed1234 17 Reviews 821 reads
posted
42 / 42

Sorry for the naive question....What is reasonable in terms MSOG's on an overnight? Of course, this will vary among clients and ladies. But do the ladies mandate a certain number of "hands off" hours so they can sleep?

Register Now!