I am having a problem. I had a rather bad experience with a provider (can happen). I think it is not completely my fault.
1. she was really GRUMPY.
2. not in the MOOD.
3. she promised HEAVEN (BBBJNQWS & GREEK with raincoat etc.) but delivered NOTHING.
4. she had needle marks in the back of her knee. She said she was a diabetic but I am also and the knees are not usual and I do not look like DOPE is my midle name.

QUESTION can I make a review with the above mentioned knowledge and also mention point 4. In short she is a goodlooking redhead with some cats and a total rip off.

SOME ADVISE WOULD BE NICE

I'm confused.  She was a "total rip off", and you "think" it is not completely your fault??

Did she really deliver NOTHING and take your money?
Or, did you just not get the HEAVEN you were promised cuz she wasn't in the mood?
If she took money and gave nothing then it's a total ripoff.
Otherwise, give a low score, and/or consider your role in it.
I would leave out number 4 since you're not absolutely sure.

Guys, let's be clear... having sex with a grumpy provider is not a "total rip-off"!
My ATF is occasionally grumpy, so I give her a caring massage, kisses, and some TLC.
I always get it back eventually in spades.
These girls are human.

-- Modified on 4/14/2003 9:15:36 AM

The most important issue is to create an honest review. Far too many reviews are inflated or deflated and do not give a fair representation of the session. Simply state the facts and it will become clear where the fault lies. Do not embelesh or include information that you are not 100% sure of. A good approach is to wright a draft of the review from a third party positiont. Pretend you were a fly on the wall reporting on the event.

Link, I think you are one of the sharpest posters here.  With all due respect, I believe observation of needle marks either from diabetis or drug use should be mentioned in the review.  Please make sure, pb, to add that you are not sure.  If it is confirmed by later reviews then it's a fact.  Let her fans decide how much chance they want to take.  The reviews are supposed to provide facts to keep us away from disappointments or surprise.  

EPlati

First I agree, disregard # 4, has no real bearing since your not sure ... But there is alot of difference in an ATF and a provider .. With an ATF like you mentioned you get it back in spades ... with a provider maybe not .... I would post and be honest and let us (hobbiest) dedcide ... since $$'s were exchanged she should have been up front and open about here mood before hand ... I don't think I'd cut her too much slack ... MHO hobby safe hobby well hobby all you can be .....

I agree Spinner, but we don't know yet how upfront she was and what his reaction was.  Since he wasn't sure about his fault, I'd like to hear more about his own behavior and how it might have affected the session.  Then, as you said, let the reader decide.

It's true an ATF and a first time provider are a lot different, but I still would try to be nice to the girl and see what happens.  For all we know so far, he came in demanding all the things she promised and got pissed off when she didn't snap to it.

I hope the original poster will give us more info.

I had a similar situation where I wrote a bad review on someone.  Only problem was, TER originally didn't approve of it because they said it was inconsistent. Inconsistent to them because all her other reviews were good, so how could I be writing something bad?  Given the fact it was a strange experience made me think they didn't believe what I wrote.  But, I stand by what I said was true and will take it to my grave.  After telling them they were wrong to think I have to write something good when I should be writing what happened to me and only me, exclusive of what happened with other guys, they reconsidered and approved my review.  Only problem now is, my review has been in approved status since last Thursday, but still hasn't been posted.

So, if you are going to go against the grain for what has been said about this provider, just be aware of the backlash that may occur.

that including description of drunkenness and speculation about drug use could be subjected to rejection or dismissal.  I have noticed several reviews pulled because of that alone.  Point 1 to 3 are still valid in a review and that should be enough to warn off others.

Linkmeister's advice about giving her a low rating is very sensible.

Good luck next time.

She might have been going through one or none of those things, but base the review on the facts.

It can't hurt.

Shaye

Some of you people posting here have got to be nuts.  How could you suggest that he "leave out point 4" given that it is such an important life-saving point?  If she has numerous needle marks, then a great risk exists that she could be a heroin addict, which puts all of us at greater risk of HIV.  If the reviewer asked, and she said it was diabetes, then he should write that in the review and then let the rest of us draw our own conclusions and take our own risks with our eyes OPEN.  Lately, I have noticed a trend by TER of protecting providers at all costs.  The whole idea of reviewing providers is to reduce the level of risk to all hobbyists and providers, including the risks of being busted, getting STD, or getting ripped off. I don't understand why a review that warns of credible risks based on the poster's observations is less beneficial to the rest of us than a lousy review due to poor service.  The latter saves people from getting ripped off...the former may save someone's life. Stop this madness!

I'm sorry and I may very well be slammed.  Oh well.  
Were her claims of being diabetic backed up in any way?  Did she show you her insulin shot medication?  Did you ask?  C'mon gentlemen...this is your life and the lives of those you are "with" afterwards.  ASK! If I saw needle marks all over you and you claimed the same, call me rude but I'd ask immediately to see some kind of proof and ohhhh my my things would go so much smoothly from there on.  If she was indeed a diabetic, chances are she doesn't go anywhere without her medication.  Otherwise, some comments are right on.  What was your behavior on her "bad day"?  Did you show any compassion at all or did you want to get right to it?  And if you wanted to get "right to it" did you really expect a GFE?  Before analyzing her crappy behavior, see what kind of behavior you had yourself and is a bad review really warranted or just anger at not getting what you were hoping for and expecting based on what her reviews/claims state on a really good night.  Just think about both sides first is all.  

Right on the money link...  

-- Staff

Actually, it was originally approved. The provider contested the review and we teporarily pulled it.  Upon looking at your emails, I tended to believe your side of the story.  I re-approved the review.

It did not show up because I hit the wrong button  Sorry.  I fixed that now.

-- Staff

Sometimes you guys need to consider the power of reviews.  For you it is a bad date, for the providers, it could be their ability to feed their kids.  The only ones who know the real story of what happened are the two of you.

We have to weigh out what "most likely" happened in this situation.  We base it on the history of the provider and the history of the member.  It is not an easy job.

If you think we are "protecting providers at all costs" then why do we approve so many bad reviews?

-- Staff

On the one hand, it is unfair to write something that can be so damaging to a provider without adequate proof.  As a Libertarian, I believe she should have the freedom to earn a living in any way she sees fit.  I also believe she should have the freedom to treat her body in any way she sees fit.  If she likes Heroin and can handle it, it's not my place to deny her that choice.  Life is nothing without free will.  Personally, I always drew the line at needles.  It's not the fact that it goes directly to the bloodstream.  It's the fact that once you get fucked up you might not bother to pick up a clean needle.
This brings me to the flip side.  Only by the grace of God did I live through my teens and twenties.  To have made it through disease free is an even greater miracle.  Now I'm down to only one vice, and we all know what that is.  The point is there is an undeniable level of risk to this hobby.  If a provider is using intraveneous(siq) drugs, that is a huge unnecessary risk that can affect a large number of people in the community with just one mistake.  
Nobody likes condoms, but there's a reason we use them.  We all have to balance our own wants and desires with our willingness to take a risk.  I love a BBBJTC, but if I see a review that says anything like "she took every drop like a champ" then I'll pass.  There is a provider in my area who until recently actually preferred to do everything uncovered.  She's kind of sexy in a slutty way, and she gets 9 and 10 reviews consistently.  I'll never see her.  That's too much risk for me and so are tracks.
In the end, I'm still torn on this subject even after this lengthy exploration on my part.  I might not notice the marks on the back of her knee or between her toes like you did.  I certainly wouldn't see a provider who I knew was shooting up, but to say definitively that she is a heroin baby without proof is slander.  I would like to know you saw and she acknowleged track marks, and her claim of diabetes.  You should definitely leave out the "DOPE is my middle name" comment.  I guess to make a long story short (too late) I would say to include point 4 only if you are reasonably sure of the cause of those marks, but make it clear that you have no real evidence.  Let TER decide if the comments can stay in the review when they approve or disapprove your review.  Let TER weigh the right of the provider to earn a living against the safety of the community on a case-by-case basis and err on the side of caution.

p.s.  On a totally unrelated topic, I still would love to know where I can find that babe in the EscortsUSA.com banner.  And sorry for being so wordy.

I think that you have received some real good advice in the previous responses.  I agree with Tatoogirl that the best course is to stick to the facts in this review without bringing in a lot of emotionally charged personal opinion.  The dry facts should help us understand why you gave the lady a poor rating.  Also by taking this approach it should make it easier for staff to approve your review.

I think your approach to point number 4 should also be factual.  Apparently you are a diabetic who would recognize needle marks on yourself or someone else.  Apparently you noticed needle marks behind her knees and when asked she said that she was a diabetic who requires insulin shots.  That is the end of what you factually know and that is where I would stop.  The rest of us should draw our own conclusions based upon factual information you provide.  

Personally I would be interested in any input from diabetic female providers.  I have heard that it is common for drug addicts to shoot up between the toes and behind the knees to hide the needle marks.  Is it common for a female diabetic to inject the insulin behind the knees in order to hide the needle marks???

No she did not show her insulin shot medication I asked for it as a confirmation and perhaps she had nicer stuff as I have.

I have not had pbl's problem, but I am becoming increasingly uncomfortable with the review system myself for a variety of reasons.  I am considering writing no further reviews as a result of these problems:

1) I have heard from some of the providers that I have seen that their reviews are inaccurate re many "a la carte" issues - e.g. greek, etc

2) I have noted that the rating system seems to reward providers more on the "number of touchdowns scored in different endzones" than on what I really value - the overall quality of the experience.  Frankly I would rate some providers a "10" based on the their conversation and foreplay!

3) At least one provider I have seen became very upset and now refuses to see me again because I rated her a 7.  I followed the TER guidelines re scoring and thought I had scored "accurately" - but I didn't realize that a 7 (no DFK which I thought was a pre-requisite to a higher score) is not regarded favorably by providers. (or at least this one provider)

4) Another provider I know and respect became extremely upset over a single bad review (not my review!) and that single bad review pretty much ruined her week.  

5) I forgot to ask permission to publish a review of a provider and discovered to my dismay that I had violated her privacy by publishing her phone number in my review which she did not want published.

6) And then there is the issue raised by pbl: how much sensitive & potentially damaging information that cannot be verified should be published in a review?  Should we err in favor of the provider whose livelihood may depend upon our review and who may be defamed by a incorrect or inappropriate review?  Or do we err on the side of the hobbiest who might chose (for reasons of personal choice or safety) not to see some one with needle marks on their legs, for example!

I understand the value of reviews to the providers and to some degree also to the hobbiests, but a clearer set of ground rules to posting reviews would be helpful along with more options, perhaps, to accurately describe a really good (or really bad) encounter.

Just my $0.02

...especially considering she had several reviews from guys who had posted several reviews of providers with several reviews (my own personal BS tester....at least three reviews from guys with at least 3 reviews of other girls with at least 3 reviews...and it goes without saying that said girls can't all be from the same agency).

I feel for ya...I can imagine your frustration and anger. At least you weren't out of any major coin...just your time (which of course cannot be replaced).

To Clamlick:  You're so right.  We really need to be less PC.  It's one thing to be malicious, it's entirely another to be honest.  I did a review recently that I felt was being honest, a "YMMV" thing, but somethin I just wanted fellow hobbiests to be aware of.  Wow, did I get reamed, and was asked by the provider to remove the "subjectiveness" from the review.  So, to make peace, I removed the entire review.  And will not likely review again.