The past few days have been highly frustrating to say the least.  Before I start on my bitching rant I'd like to give a little history on my past hobbying.  Around 4 years ago I would troll backpage and do some research and almost get lucky every time with little effort.  I saw only around 6 or so providers and found my ATF which I saw a few times before leaving the state I lived in.  For the past 3 years I have taken a break and not seen any providers.  After moving back to the same state I thought I'd do things right this time and join TER and P411 so life could be hassle free and I could live happily ever after.  

After joining P411, I soon found out that with no OKs you are in a worse boat than someone who is new to the hobby tossing the dice on backpage   The first "newbie friendly" provider that I contacted corresponded, with me via email a few times and it seemed to be going well.  She then asked me to call her so we could chat for a bit.  I called and we talked about a bunch of stuff and I answered her questions 100% honestly (obviously a big mistake).  She asked if I was interested in any other P411 girls and I said yes but most are not newbie friendly and that my goal is to get at 3 OKs ASAP and am looking for 1-3 that I like spending time with.  She said she has no problem with any of that.  She also asked my preference on age young/older I said I like both but tried to stay away from those that look very young (she is most likely in her 40s).  Before we hung up I told her that my schedule was completely open over the next few days and she asked if she could call the next morning and set something up within 2-3 hours of her call.  I said sure.  She gave me her address and phone number (neither are listed anywhere) and said we will definitely connect in the next day or two.  Now it's important to note that the phone call was 30 minutes!  An interview for a job which lasts 30+ minutes is usually a good sign.  It was 1-2PM the next day and I wanted to go out for a bit and sent her a text asking how it was looking for that day.  I only asked because if I went out, I knew I'd be out for a while and wanted to plan out my day better.  She texted back saying she has been busy but she was planning on working a bit during the weekend.  I texted back "sure no rush"  The very next day I get an email saying, "I don't really want to be a 'stepping stone' on your way to another."  Dumbfounded, I shrugged it off while thinking to myself, "Well that will be 30 minutes of my life that I will never get back."  Well it turns out that 30 minutes was nothing compared to today's hassle...

After getting blown off I figured I'd contact a provider that was on my wish list but I knew would require a bit of time due to most of her reviews.  I knew right from the start that I would have to be patient and that she would almost surely run late.  We chatted via email and text and I even sent a picture at her request.  I had no problem doing that because I've never had a problem with my looks.   She eventually asked me for references and I said I only have one but I cant get in contact with her.  We had an appointment for 2:30 which she eventually texted to tell me she was running late for (totally expected).  I was running late myself anyway so I didn't mind.  To make a long story short I finally was asked if I could go to a starbucks at a specific location and grab her some food and a frapachino.  I thought it was odd but I figured why not.  I figured she had someone in there watching me to see if I was creepy etc.  I have a sneaky suspicion that it was the hot blond in front of me with a model's body.  I texted her as requested to to let her know I was ready for her address.  She sent her address and I was on my way.  I finally got to her location and parked as requested and she said she'd be right out.  She said, "hang on a sec".  I got out of the car in 95 degree weather and waited...and waited... and waited.  She told me that she couldn't find her glasses but assured me that I was at the right place.  She said screw it if she didn't find her glasses in a few more mins she come out without them.  Me being the gentleman that I am I asked her what side of the building is best to park on because I didn't want her walking too far without her glasses.  Finally she asked me if I wanted her to bring me water.  After being in the hot sun for 30 minutes I thought it was a good idea to crack a bad joke.  I responded with, "Only if you plan on leaving me here".  Well that's when I get ghosted.  I asked if she was there but no response.  Then I said, I will be leaving if she doesn't respond in a couple of minutes.  After which I left, frapachino and sammich in hand.  It's important to point out her that it is 6PM already and we started chatting at 8AM.

For those of you which made it this far, you are a better man/woman than me.  I have some questions for you fine folks before throwing in the towel.
-Is my experience out of the ordinary or did I just have some really bad semi-beginners luck?
-What in the hell am I doing wrong?
Any other thoughts or comments would be appreciated.  


-- Modified on 5/1/2015 2:08:31 AM

Help me to understand to your rational about guys in their 40s being so challenging to deal with.

and no offense intended:

There's a bit of stridency that comes through in your tale, a characteristic that might have been picked up on by the two gals you describe, and that could be a cause of their melt down on you.

There's a saying that we make our own luck.  I'd look into this.

read all of your rant. And even though "dadadada" only skimmed it, she pretty much nailed you to the wall.  You sound like a nice but lonely guy who likes to chat, text, and have prolonged exchanges with call girls.  It's pretty clear that these providers were toying with you, then eventually discarded you as a timewaster.  

 It's hard to imagine having an ongoing communication with a provider I've never met from 8 am to 4 pm.  I don't spend that much time chatting with my SO or best friend.  

 Not sure if being in your 40s has anything to do with this (as 'da' suggests).  But that's when a lot of middle-aged men start the hobby, so 'da' may be on to something there as well.  I suggest you read her post again.  But instead of throwing in the towel,  try to adopt a concise "polite but business-like" approach in P4P communications.  Providers usually respect that.  Good luck.  --

I advise you keep going but next time around approach providers with in the back of your mind that there are multiple providers with your desired profile.

As a newbie don't expect to score 100% of the time from down town. With that in mind you are much less likely to be disappointed at the next rejection. Contact multiple providers who meet your profile and invest a little more time in those who give you the most positive response. Don't fix all of your expectations on one provider so you will avoid being badly let down when that appointment does not work out. In addition, when the appointment does work out, you have avoided loading sky high expectations on the short time with her killing any chance for her to meet your expectations. Your date will be better!

Lastly, respect yourself and your own time more. When a first time provider asks you to be home delivery for you, gracefully decline.

Are you trying to see a lady with NO screening information provided, I wonder?  There are TONS of reputable newbie-friendly ladies who have ZERO interest in speaking to you on the phone, making you go on a Starbucks run, etc.  Just find a reputable lady with a booking form on her website, fill it out with your identity and employment information, schedule a date as normal, and go see her!

Most of the best ladies in the industry either PREFER identity/employment screening over references or at least offer it as an option.  If the lady you're trying to see thinks a 30 minute phone call, text chats, photo of you, or a Starbucks run counts as a form of screening, there's your problem right there.  She is not truly concerned about her safety or the long-term success of her business.  Your experience with her WILL be more like AMATEUR dating than a professional appointment.

If you want to see a true professional, find a lady who presents herself as one and follow her PROFESSIONAL procedure, which shouldn't involve any of the ridiculousness you listed above.  If a lady wants to talk on the phone for a long time or text back and forth forever, she's got way too much time on her hands and poor boundaries.  Not a good sign.  Of course if you're attracted to that, there's your problem.

You said that you could tell that the 2nd provider was unreliable from her reviews.  It also sounds like she has poor boundaries.  Like she wasn't really sure about you the whole time (I'm guessing she didn't actually screen you in any way at all since you never mentioned being screened by her), so she strung you along to try to decide whether you were OK or not.  At some point she decided you were not OK and instead of telling you that, she just kept stringing you along to avoid having to meet you.

If you're nervous about giving out your legal identity, just pick a few ladies who seem very professional who you've researched VERY well.  Read each lady's website thoroughly, note her screening requirements, cancellation policy, and preferred booking contact method.  Make sure you contact her respectfully with 100% of the info she requires in your initial email.  DON'T say that you want to see her to build references.  Focus on the things about her that you are attracted to if you say anything at all about why you want to see her (which is honestly superfluous).  If she's not exactly your type and you're really only using her to build references- then don't review her, as that's not fair to her.  Just follow her PROFESSIONAL procedure, give her your identity and employment details, see her, use her as a reference.  If you pick your initial provider wisely enough (ie., if she is very reputable and respected in the provider community), even she alone might be enough to get you into other providers' beds without providing any further personal information to another person.  Just choose a reputable lady or two who have a long-standing history here and have way too much to lose to misuse your information.  You'll be fine as long as you respect those providers and their booking/cancellation policies.

You reap what you sow, my friend.  If you're MAKING this more difficult than dating by choosing less-than-professional ladies and engaging in long, drawn-out, time-wasting conversations via phone/text instead of going through a proper professional screening process, you are going to continue to have these kinds of experiences.  Don't choose ladies who you can already tell are very unprofessional based on their reviews.  Maybe later, but as a newbie you want to see a few true professionals.  You will reap what you sow.  Choose wisely.  

Tip: keep your communications brief and upbeat. She's encountered enough pain-in-the-asses that she's going to be on guard for any signs of prickliness/neediness in your communications. This is part of how providers screen out undesirable clients.  

I've never experienced the run around that you describe (even when starting out), and I would jump ship if it started to head in that direction.

It fits her delusional, incomprehensible, judgmental babblings.
Hint: it isn't just 40-year-old men who make her crazy.  It starts with BSC and goes from there.

Do some folk buy an extra subscription just for an extra handle that does not appear as an alias? Or is it simpler than that? Been some intriguing coincidences lately.

I'm not a computer or Internet guru.  I like to keep things simple and just post under my same old handle. Anyone who doesn't like what I say (and there are several) can shove it.  I almost never use my alias, let alone needing another handle.
As TER knows, I have created other handles but only when I was banned or lost my posting privileges. They did not like that, but we made up.  Sort of.

Many people have "brown envelopes" that serve more like an alias than does an actual alias.

For the record, I an WAY too lazy to ever do this, I am also too lazy to even have an alias, and I have not had an alias since we were limited to one alias.

Thanks everyone for all the replies and advice.  I'd like to clarify to some which didn't quite understand my situation.  I'm far from lonely and in fact hate talking that much.  I was giving these 2 providers what I thought they wanted.  If I wanted anything else but a hassle-free booty call with no strings, I'd be on match dot com.   I guess what I'll do here is do the reputable provider with employment verification route once I get established at the new gig.

 I see.  In regard to these two providers: you *thought they wanted"  an online friend, confidant, & gopher.  As implied earlier, this assumption reveals a lot about you.  Instead of posting a long rant flaming these two providers, your time would've been better spent reflecting on how you got played *twice* and what you learned from it (apparently nothing).  
   
 Try this now: Stop blaming providers, take the 'L', and make a smarter play next time.   --z

is it possible that you misinterpreted their request for extended "interviews" before meeting?

It's been my experience that long winded people "think" that is what other people want when sometimes (a LOT of the time) that is the furthest thing from the truth.

I know you SAY that you hate talking that much, but your "long rant" lends us to believe that perhaps that isn't really the case.

Just saying...

First thing, if a provider I have never met wants me to stop at a coffee shop to get her a frappachino and a sandwich, I'm out.  I might be willing to do that for someone I have met before, but otherwise hell no!  I also would try to avoid ladies that I know are regularly late to appointments.  Although obviously your options are somewhat limited being a newbie, you can still find well reviewed ladies that are willing to see you.  Phone calls are generally not necessary either, especially if the date is gonna be a few hours or less.  

 
Now for the other part.  While you probably didn't have ill intentions by anything you said, I could see how a lady may take some of it the wrong way.  I never tell or allude to the fact that the provider is not my first choice, even if there are 10 or 20 ladies I would rather see.  Some of the ladies do have big egos just like some of us men have big egos.  It may be hard for them to hear that they were not your first choice.  I personally avoid talking about other providers unless asked, I have learned that not all of them get along with each other.    Also unless you are absolutely sure that a joke will be well received, it's probably best to refrain from telling it over text or email.  Sometimes it is difficult to convey a joke when non-verbal cues are not possible to aid the joke.

On a final note, I generally keep communication short and sweet until we actually meet.  I give the provider everything she asks for, but not much more than that.

END OF MESSAGE

I've never had anything near what you describe happen to me. I guess I'm a lucky guy, but we do make our own luck.

This is not to say that I haven't been stood up, I have. I've just not been led on such wild goose chases.

I can speak from experience and suggest that you not fall back to BP girls (unless they are well reviewed in here). I have had a few experiences with BP girls, not one of which was good (again, unless they are well reviewed in here).

Honestly, unless you've left out something, I think you just ran into two of the wrong ladies.. My experience with P411 ladies has been good, but I do my homework and research.

Good luck, happy hobbying.

You say, "escorts are more difficult than dating"??? Huh???

You're totally confused. The problem with you is, you are making this wayyyyy more difficult than it really is. Let me simplify it for you.

1 ) You inquire for a booking
2 ) The lady screens you
3) You both agree on date & time  
4) You meet her showered up and fresh
5) You treat her with respect and be a gentleman
6) You f*ck
7) And then you say goodbye and tell her what a wonderful time you had  

And last but not least!!!!

8) NO STRINGS ATTACHED (NSA)

How hard is that??? Cmon man get with it home slice!

-- Modified on 5/2/2015 9:13:47 AM

I've been in this hobby for decades.... and I'm still under 50, but things sure have changed.  It was much easier for us guys in many ways only 10 or so years ago, not it's gotten a bit tougher.  I have not really played much in the last ten years do to being in committed relationships.  Now as I ponder a return to my the hobby, it does look a bit daunting.  

I used to be a pretty well known, and respected guy in this hobby and now after so many years and most of my gals having left the biz long ago I'm a virtual virgin once more.  

The one constant is that regardless of hobby or relationship men and women are both good and bad, weird, and normal, pissing and kind....  It's a crap shoot.  Roll with it, move on and evolve.

I really have to thank you for your post. I started this day finishing up some paper work that I was not able to get to yesterday. I was feeling a little down and thought I'd peruse the board and see what was happening in the hobby world.  

After reading your tome I feel so much better about the direction my own Saturday is headed. I'm 42 and have never had such an arduous task in finding a young....or older lady in which to engage in activities of a more amorous nature. That said, you might want to contact the guy a few posts over who was talking about "paid guides" because you two seem like ya'll might be switched a birth.

I completely agree with the "paid guide" who told you that it's pretty easy... call, agree, go to ATM, meet, pretend to fuck (because we all know this board is for discussion purposes only), leave and then do whatever you do.  

I think you're doing this all wrong, but care only enough to ask you this. Why, after thirty odd minutes or so in 95 degree heat, didn't you just get back in your car? I'm presuming that you have air conditioning.  

Also, you said we were better than you if we made it that far in your post....since you wrote the post, you actually did make it that far....and a bit further with your concluding comments, and presumably are as good as the rest of us. If that's the case, I really don't want to be as good as you because you just aren't getting laid ( again in that pretend way ) and then I'll really be fucking depressed, not that you aren't, but that I won't be. Best of luck buddy.

END OF MESSAGE