TER General Board

Re: Does P4P really affect the usual M/F power balance?
trex44 9 Reviews 202 reads
posted

Since I'm the one paying for the woman's time, *I* get to make the choice -- and, like any other consumer-based experience, I vote with my wallet. I'll use my last week's "shopping" as an illustration, as I wanted to have some mid-afternoon Friday fun with a provider in the Phoenix/Scottsdale area and was looking in the $$-$$$ range.

I called 5 women on Mon, Tues & Wed to set-up an appt. for Friday; if I got their voicemail, I would leave my name, contact phone and DateCheck handle for them to use as screening. Two of the women's voicemail boxes were full, so no message was left and they never called back to check the call. Two voicemails were left; one was never answered and one woman I called on Tues. called back Fri. morning, apologizing for her tardiness (by then, my window for that afternoon had closed).

The last woman I called actually answered her phone and stated that she was feeling a bit sick with a mild cold, so she wouldn't be able to see me this week. However, we did agree to talk on Monday and see how she's feeling, with an eye to getting together that afternoon.

If she's feeling up to it, we'll have a pleasant afternoon's diversion and I will have made my choice.

It's like any other business -- if you don't take care of your customer, somebody else will. So I don't view this as a power struggle between male vs. female, but more as shopping for a service with someone who appreciates my business -- kind of like any other professional service.

I'll give my dollars to the dentist, tax preparer, etc., who does the best job and appreciates my initial and return business.

DownBoy1057 reads

The assertion has been made that the exchange of remuneration equalizes the usual power balance between men and women; that the dynamic of women requiring anything from their partner is eliminated. Or that the relationship starts in a position of equality.

I'm not so sure; I'm interested in other opinions, as I know there is greater wisdom out there.

Seems to me that mens' erotic drive outweighs any other drive, maybe except for power, and certainly is greater than the drive for money on the part of providers.  In addition, it seems to me that since the provider is in the position to expand or limit what they do, whether it's in terms of specific acts or the intensity of which they perform, the provider is in the power position.  The man is doing the seeking and the provider is the limited resource.  So, the power balance stays with the woman.  In other words, whomever seeks with more intensity is in the lower position than those who provide.  The seeker wants the service more than the provider wants the date (and the money), especially if she is in demand.

The other angle is that probably for most of us, we are older and less attractive than the ladies.  [Yeah, right, a really hot 28 year old wants to fuck a 50ish fat guy...just for fun.) This makes the man a little self-conscious.

Do we ever get over the feeling we had when we were 16 and tongue-tied in front of a gorgeous girl?  It's that power dynamic that never changes.

Does this make sense?

Maybe it's me, but it seems to me that the case of the really confident guy who can not be affected by the presence of a beautiful woman is rare, especially if he hasn't been well-laid in weeks.  That creature is a media creation--the smooth talker who can handle the ladies, etc.  I don't see it much in real life.

In my case, the implication is that I am reluctant to ask too much for fear that a) I'll be labeled needy or too demanding or something with the attendant attitude that comes with that, or b) I won't get anything close to what I want and I'll be disappointed, thus diminishing the date.  

Can this change?  Dunno.  That's what I'm trying to figure out.

I know this is saying something about me, but I also think that I'm fairly representative of many men. So, please don't start throwing out all the 'grow a pair' grumblings.  It's a legit question to consider in ones evolution and growth.

But much of it boils down to this: I need a certain quality experience (intensity and connection), and I'm not getting it.  And it's fucking with my head (not the little one). So, I'm trying to figure out how to manage it.

All that said, I do have to say that, I do have to admire most ladies who are considerate and offer themselves up to guys like me, even though it's for a price.  If it weren't for that at least, I'd be really nuts.

that women offer or withhold sex to get what they want from men - and of course this changes with cultural paradigm, but generally equates to security.

In my opinion and experience, this is much "worse" and a hell of a lot more of an annoyance in the context of a "real" relationship, where sexual availability becomes conditioned upon relationship dynamics / expectations / dramas.

P4P is so straightforward, so liberating. For the most part it is just as liberating for women as it is for men.  I have met many women in the biz who state that it was very self actualizing for them to become providers.  I've known providers who were in relationships, and opined that they wished they could just get a good shag at home without the relationship dramas as well lol.

And of course, for even men like myself who are gorgeous even though aging (lol), it is a pleasure to be able to enjoy the company of an attractive 20 or 30 something with a straight up understanding of where the date is "going" and of the quid pro quo.

There is a saying in this sport - it is a bit of a crudity but it has merit - to the effect that a part of what the gent is donating for is for the lady to "go away" without attachments or expectations until / unless her presence is desired again.....

And of course, the bit about being desired in the future has a lot to do with service quality. I recognize that P4P is a business and that I am doing a disservice to the provider not to tell her what I want, like, expect, hope for. I am not shy about it. This is important inforamtion for her in first assessing if she wants to bother with me LOL and second in focusing her efforts toward achieving a level of satisfaction that will likely presage my return visit.

If there is *anyplace* where communication should be straightforward in terms of sexual and pseudo-relationship dynamics, THIS is that place....

Man, you why do you feel so depressed. That idea you have that girls don't need the money less is just plain crazy. It's not like they ultra rich and doing it for fun, who's gonna pay they rent and groceries lol. And guys don't NEED sex, sure it feels good at a time, but just watch porn or whatever, doesn't make a big difference, really.

And what power do the girls have anyways? Whever civie or pro, they just sit and wait for guy to approach trying not to look too dumb or boring. YOU make the approach, YOU decide what to say and how to say it and who to talk and when to walk out and when to walk in. Who cares what any one girl says or wherever she likes you or not. You make the choice of how many girls to approach, so the only thing that stands in the way of your success is YOU.

You are making way to many assumptions in trying to compare P4P-a business relationship, with real world relationships and who has the "power".  

I'm a fat guy in his 50's and, honestly, hot escorts in their 20's and 30's do not make me nervous, never have never will. I'm not comparing myself to the younger men that these ladies might be attracted to outside of the P4P realm-that's a pointless exercise. In fact, other than being sure you can AFFORD to hobby and that you are doing it safely there is no need for any undue angst when it comes to pay dates. It's supposed to be fun.

Power?  The customer has the power to see who he wants to see, the lady also has the power to see who she wants to see and limit her activities to those that she feels comfortable with. I've been at this for well over 20 years and I've never seen a reason to make it any more complicated than that.

Priapus53226 reads

to put it concisely, in the selection process ( if he's not emotionally needy ), the hobbyist has the power to pick & choose during the screening process if he doesn't like the responses he's getting from a provider.

In a LTR, I think the provider has the balance of power for reasons too myriad to list here.

expect that if you show up with the green you see the pink.

All the same stuff plays out, but much of the psycho drama BS from "real life" is removed, so it looks and feels different.

BTW... the erotic drive IS about power... study sexuality from an anthropology perspective and you'll get what I'm talking about.

Men work to provide and want to know that women are faithful so that they don't provide for another guys genetics.

Women want to obscure the genetics of the offspring to ensure as many males are providing for her and her offspring as possible.

Since I'm the one paying for the woman's time, *I* get to make the choice -- and, like any other consumer-based experience, I vote with my wallet. I'll use my last week's "shopping" as an illustration, as I wanted to have some mid-afternoon Friday fun with a provider in the Phoenix/Scottsdale area and was looking in the $$-$$$ range.

I called 5 women on Mon, Tues & Wed to set-up an appt. for Friday; if I got their voicemail, I would leave my name, contact phone and DateCheck handle for them to use as screening. Two of the women's voicemail boxes were full, so no message was left and they never called back to check the call. Two voicemails were left; one was never answered and one woman I called on Tues. called back Fri. morning, apologizing for her tardiness (by then, my window for that afternoon had closed).

The last woman I called actually answered her phone and stated that she was feeling a bit sick with a mild cold, so she wouldn't be able to see me this week. However, we did agree to talk on Monday and see how she's feeling, with an eye to getting together that afternoon.

If she's feeling up to it, we'll have a pleasant afternoon's diversion and I will have made my choice.

It's like any other business -- if you don't take care of your customer, somebody else will. So I don't view this as a power struggle between male vs. female, but more as shopping for a service with someone who appreciates my business -- kind of like any other professional service.

I'll give my dollars to the dentist, tax preparer, etc., who does the best job and appreciates my initial and return business.

It only changes the playing field, and I think it is a better playing field for all concerned because it is more honest and not filled with line minds as the civie world is.

As for who has the power, that depends on the individuals, and how they approach things.

I have always been a big fan of the Zen way of viewing things:

The best way to get what you want is to want what you have.

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