Hey ladies,
I'm new to the hobby, and I'm having problems.  I contacted a provider in L.A. and set up an appointment.  She seemed eager to meet me on the phone.  But when I got to her place she called it off.  Do you think it's because I'm a black man?  Is it hard to find a provider who's willing to see black men?

I have several very lovely black clients ...  (and I'm a Caucasian) in L.A.

It should be a personal decision from person to person.

Interesting though,  I  have also  heard from a couple of sisters that LA men dont favor ebony ladies, although I know some who do, maybe there just aren't many.








-- Modified on 5/6/2002 7:33:04 AM

I myself have several black clients and I am in Los Angeles. Sorry to hear that this problem exisits for you.  If the provider screens, I see no reason to discriminate.

Unfortunately, many girls in LA have been attacked and robbed by a pair of black men.  Many providers in LA are currently not seeing black men because of these two guys.  Sorry.

-- Staff

This is a subject that rears it's head from time to time. Bottomline, clients and Service Providers are a section of our society at large. Therefore, one should expect to find the same beliefs, preferences, and predjudices that reside in society at large. However, one must be careful to paint "all" with the same broad brush. I don't think any of us like to be categorized based on what a few may say, think, or do. In my experience, there are many fine ladies that are willing to see clients regardless of there race, age, size, and etc. Their only requirement is that the client is a gentleman, respectful, honest,and good hygiene. Whether we like it or not, it is the ladies perogative to decide on who she will see. Just like it's the client's choice to decide who he will see. Fortunately, all black men aren't thieves and rapist, no more then any other race are segment. However, every group has their share of socio-paths and criminals. I for one would hope that the ladies are cautious with all potential clients.

I am not black but I can see how difficult it must be to be painted with the broad brush of race. I wonder if LA providers would stop seeing all white clients if there were two wacko white men that were preying on providers?

I don't have the answers, just the question.

Well it has been white wackos, but that didn't close any women's shop, because of it. It's just another excuse. I'm mixed with blk. but at times women can't tell, but when i share that with
them that fact some get distant, but hey some like it - a guy who has blk. features, but doesn't look blk. Even girls I seen told me if i do review them that say they eroctic mix and not blk., cause white guys won't call them - hehehe- that like guys how go see TV's because they look like females , but know they are really males.  My two or three cents on the matter.

Board.)  (eom.)

BTW would have preferrd to fit it all into the header so you wouldn't have to click on.  (Not that nobody does, anymore:  "Oh it is poor old Socrates, babbling on about ethics."  Well, if they had listened to me then, there would have been a lot fewer dead Athenians and Spartans.

If the girls were being attacked and robbed by a pair of white men, would the providers stop seeing white men?

There is no replacement for screening.  I have seen black men, asian men, hispanic men and a few Martians to boot but ALL had to pass my screening process.

If there was certain physical characteristic that you have NEVER in your life been  attracted to, for whatever reason,to the point where you knew you couldnt enjoy yourself with that person,whether it be race, body type, hair color etc.and you knew in advance a potential client had this characteristic...would you still see him, even though you knew it was going to be a blah,faked experiance from your side? If yes, then do you feel guilty taking money from someone when you had to fake enjoyment in a session? And you knew this was going to happen beforehand.
 Curious to know its all about the money, or if you take in to account what YOU want and what YOUR taste are..thanks in advance for responding ladies

Do you have to be overwhelmingly physically attracted to someone for them to be a client? If so, how? Do you require photos before you see clients? I was unaware of this phenomenon. I thought escorts were equal opportunity types. The elderly, the homely, the obese and the dark-skinned guys have money that's just as green as your average cute young white guy.

Anyway, it's been my experience that if the guy is pleasant, fun to be with and treats me well, he becomes more and more attractive every minute that passes by. EVERY guy (and every girl for that matter) has *something* attractive about them. Maybe just a nice smile, good teeth, thick hair, they smell good, a nice phone voice - SOMETHING.

How can you say that you would never find anything attractive about any black man, ever? Or are you one of those people who maintain that all black people "look the same"?!? If so, that sounds a bit prejudicial to me.

How many providers have you tried?  I would be surprised if it were the prevailing attitude amongst providers.  If you are being discriminated against because of some jerk who's robbing providers then that's unfortunate.  I would think you could over come that fear with providers by being extra accomdating when they are veryfying your identification. (Maybe volunteer to show your license etc.  Or tell them that you know there's some idiot robbing providers and that you will provide whatever ID they want to put them at ease.)  By the way ID verification varies a lot from provider to provider, so don't assume it's your race, it's more likely they ask the same of all potential clients. Though I don't enthusiastically give out my information my feeling is that if a provider is willing to trust me with her safety then I have to be prepared to trust them with my real name and information.  I want them to feel safe so they can enjoy their time with me.

By the way, I've seen very few providers to begin with, but half have been black, and they have been the most beautiful and nicest to date.

Sure there have been PEOPLE in my life I have not been attracted to. There has never been an entire race that is distasteful or I would not be attracted to. A certain person, of course. We all have. I am not a psychic and don't know what to expect from each and every client. I never pass judgement on someone I don't know either. That's all I really feel I need to answer.

Reoesn't make sense

BRAVO!!!!

I'm not trying to start anything but why should I as a black man have to go the extra mile to prove that I am a "safe" potential client while my white counter parts do not? I know where you are coming from. The bottom line is, the lady has to be comfortable with the situation to begin with. A big red flag goes off in my mind though if I have to go that extra mile for the lady's comfort when I know white guys do not. That automatically lets me know that even if she does argee to see me, that its going to be a strained uncomfortable session at best.

Its an experience that many white people never experience, and that is the having to go the extra mile for comparable service. It so subtle in today's society, such as cabs not stopping for you for fear you may ask them to drive you to a "black neighborhood", to being followed around in a store because the owner thinks you are going to shop lift. Trust me, when the clerk asks you 20 times in 5 minutes "can I help you", its not because they are great at customer service especially when the store is full.

My suggestion to the new black hobbyist is to read carefully a lady's web site. Some ladys are stragiht forward about only seeing white clients or, which is more common, clients in a certain age group. If a lady explicitly indicates she does not see clients of color, don't waste either's time.

Also some lady's will have on their appointment forms, for you to indicated what your ethnic background is. If you see this, it may be another red flag. The sad part is, I see this more on ebony provider's web page appointment forms than white lady's. But that's a different topic for another time.

Another thing to watch out for is if during a phone conversation, if the lady asks if you are black or what your racial background is. I've had some lady's be so rude as to hang up at that point, while other's will just say they only see white clients and then hang up. But my favorite is "my boyfriend doesn't want me to see black guys". In either situation, the lady has done you a favor. Spend your money where it and you are appreciated. Just know you WILL run into this more than our white counter parts. I doubt very seriously if a white client has ever been denied service on the basis of him being white, so it is kind of hard for them to truly relate to what you went through.

Just to touch on another point real quick. I too have heard from black women that they have a very hard time attracting clients if they indicate that they are black, but the phone jumps off the hook if they say they are mixed, or exotic looking. A friend of mine made this subtle change on her EROS ad per my suggestion and the phone went crazy. I've even known some who have had to lighten their pictures on their sites so as to not come across as dark. I only bring that up because this mind set also affects the lady's to a degree as well. Do an informal poll at black lady's ads or sites and count how many indicate that they are of mixed heritage. "I'm part French, Indian, Spanish etc." Yeah right LOL.

Hell, this is America! We ALL are mixed with something, but when I'm driving through certain neighborhoods in the early morning, and the police pull me over, TRUST ME, I'm black at that point.

I'm Out!

Now Hit My Music!

-- Modified on 5/6/2002 10:13:56 PM

-- Modified on 5/7/2002 6:21:33 AM

>"prove that I am a "safe" potential client while my white
> counter parts do not?"

Hey, you shouldn't have to, but that's the world we live in.  Then again unless you know someone who has seen the same provider as you, how do you know she's requesting something of you that she isn't asking everyone?

That said, about 5 years ago I was catching a cab in Washington, D.C. and a black man was waiting in front of me patiently.  Being from LA, and almost never taking a cab, I was shocked when a taxi went right past him and even a few feet past me and then quickly motioned for ME to get in the cab.  I pointed to the gentleman waiting in front of me and as that man went for the cab the driver waved him off and drove away.  I was really outraged, and I had know idea that was (is?) a fairly common practice. I felt really bad for the man waiting for the cab. (Incidentally the driver was black, I'm guessing Jamaican or something)  Anyway, back in LA I heard the same thing being discussed on the radio and, at least according to the cabbies being interviewed, they wouldn't pick up black men for fear of being robbed.  In their case this was, again according to them, based on their experience being robbed in the past by black men.  I'm sure plenty of white men have committed robbery before, but it's hard to argue with a cab driver who's been robbed a gun point by a black man and tell him he's a racist when they're afraid for their life.

I do have some black friends who have described the hurt they feel when they get on an elevator and a white woman hides her purse, or a cop looks at them suspiciously because they happen to run across the street to drop something in the mailbox.  These are professional, well educated, well groomed men.  I have to confess as a white man it just never occurred to me these things happend.

I wish I could suggest some magic solution here.  It really breaks my heart to listen to my friends stories.  On the one hand it's unfortunate that a small segment of the ethnic communities can create a climate of fear for the rest.  On the other hand the white majority has to realize that these crimes are not committed by blacks, hispanics or whatever, they're committed (more likely) by un-educated, poor, drug addicted  kids who would be just as likely to commit the crimes if they were white. (Of course that's just my opinion... I could be wrong.)

Anyway to return to the original point.  You certainly shouldn't have to do anything extra because of you're race.  But he can either stubbornly refuse and not get what he wants, or maybe try to to go the extra mile and maybe have some luck.

Sorry for the long post...

The most insane factor is the perps in question have been operating since early `99, hope LE is reading this! At this
point in time I became outcall only `till I knew you better.
Seeing black men has never been a problem....seeeing a gun will
always be. Some of my best times have been had with clients of other races(I`m caucasian)....HOWEVER I will say I had a very
good friend who helped me a lot in the early days here who was
born and bred in the south who I sometimes changed referals with
the date from hell for me was a white-guy, I talked her into one
black guys and she couldn`t believe how good a time she had....
cie la vie.

To answer your one point

"Then again unless you know someone who has seen the same provider as you, how do you know she's requesting something of you that she isn't asking everyone?"

If you are experienced in dealing with lady's in this business, you can tell when something is excessive. Most lady's have on their website what they require for screening. If extra is asked of you once a discussion of your racial background comes up, then you have to ask yourself, "why am I jumping through these extra hoops when I've already provided all the information requested from her web page.

It doesn't have to be explicit to recognize when you are being discriminated against. Case in point, a few years ago I tried to see a lady. Her screening required a business card and a pay check stub with my name on it. I could tell when she opened the door and her jaw dropped that she was uptight with the fact I wasn't white. She verified my information but then questioned if my business card was authentic. She said it wasn't because my title in the company wasn't on the card even though it had my name, work number, address, e-mail, company logo etc. Because my job title was not on my card, she said that she could not see me.

I did not know other guys who she had seen to compare notes but you tell me if I was not disqualified just because I was black. Body language is all it takes sometimes.

I'm out!

Now Hit My Music!

-- Modified on 5/7/2002 6:20:25 AM

On one of Michael Moore's series (I can't remember which one, but if it is The Real World, part of it is now out on DVD - when I get a chance to hit Tower Records I'll look) had a sequence where the well known actor Yaphet Kotto (black) and a white guy who had been convicted of assault (my memory is shakey on the details and I am rushing 'cause it is lunch and I have to get back to work) both tried to get a cab in Manhattan with Yaphet standing slightly before the white guy on the street.  The results were as you might predict.  Very stupid.

Michael Moore had two series. One was TVNation, that aired on NBC for a season and then Fox (I think), and then The Awful Truth which ran on Bravo. My recollection of that great taxi-cab setup was that it was shown on NBC, the same time that Yaphet Kotto was playing Lieutenant Giardello on Homicide: Life on the Street. God, how I miss both of those series!

It was one of the two and I think TVNation which came first.  (I think.  GOD, I am such a maroon.)

Dear ProGirl,

First off, I support any providers right to refuse service for any reason...even when its based on race.

What I object to is saying its because 2 black men are robbing girls.  If you said its because you don't feel safe or comfortable with blacks or harbored a distrust or did not believe in mixing or races, then fine...those are your feelings and issues and are valid because you feel them.

I see men ALL the time who disgust me.  I had one recently whose breath was so vile, it smelled of rotting flesh and I could smell his breath from a distance everytime he exhaled.  Lucky me, he wanted to "get close" and "look" at me and lie next to me and cuddle.  All the while his bad breath was turning my stomach.  But it is MY job to make him feel good.  I would feel guilty if I took his money and made him feel bad or hurt his feelings.  Sometimes you have to grin and bear it and say to yourself "This Too Shall Pass."


As far as faking enjoyment...what woman in this world (provider and non-provider alike) has not "faked" enjoyment?   When you go to someone's home for dinner and the food is awful, don't you thank them for a delicious meal?  Haven't you ever feigned interest in some boring topic someone spoke about?  Haven't you ever smiled and said "It was a pleasure meeting you." when you really thought they were a boar and couldn't wait to get away from them?  Haven't you ever lied to a friend who said "Does this dress make me look fat?" and told her it was made her look slender when in fact it made her hips look huge?  

That's life and its called Good Manners.

As far as what I want and my personal taste, I save that for my personal life. I separate work from personal.

I had this same view towards my patients as a nurse...my patients did not choose their illness and I did not choose my patients.  Whether the patient was in for a broken hip, heart surgery, HIV treatment or cancer...I never made my patient feel bad because their illness disgusted me.  Personal feelings had no place in my work.


Also being a nurse has made me a lot more comfortable with physical disabilities than most people would have become.  I do not consider race a physcial disability.  I Do consider nastiness and hatred a mental disability.  )


And yes, we all have limits on what we can tolerate.   But if the problem is based on race, then don't pretend its based on something else.  Its insulting to our intelligence.  We each have boundaries and limitations...we are not perfect.  In the ASP industry, due to its personal intimate nature, a provider should be able to refuse service to anyone for any reason at all.  Just don't lie to yourself about your reasons.

The clients get to choose us based on their preferences and while I wish all my clients looked like Brad Pitt, I realize they won't.  So I do the best I can with what walks in the door.


Brad honey, if you are reading this I am offering a special discount to you only!  


Talisa

Keep looking until he finds the lady who will not give him the extra runaround based on his race.... We do exist, and I'm sure some of us exist even in LA!!!!

Hugssss*
Nicole

For most of us altho I am primarily speaking for myself here, are those related to cleanliness... bad breath, icky teeth, obviously unclean body. And how the heck would we KNOW that ahead of time??? Do you think a guy is going to write to us and say "BTW, I just want you to know that I last brushed my teeth while Reagan was president!"  ==:O !!!! That is the kind of thing we *discover* when we open the door, and I at least, TRY to handle it with some tact. It did, I must say, blow my mind a few weeks ago when I had a client with HORRID breath, refuse my offer of a breath mint. Gentlemen, if a lady offers you a mint, I don't care if you brushed two seconds before you stepped in the door and you know your breath is fresh... just take it anyways! It can't hurt!!!! TAKE THE MINT!  =:O OMG! (I'm now picturing myself with a police type megaphone yelling... "Now, Step TOWARDS the listerine!" ROLFMAO!!!)

Now with someone like that, yeah I did have to fake it when he wanted to kiss me!!!!! I mean COME ON! He did leave with a smile though and overall happy with his experience, and that is my job. I do the best I can to please, and 9 times out of ten, I *do* enjoy myself as much as I *seem* to enjoy myself.  If a gent will work WITH me, I won't HAVE to fake it. Sometimes you DO get out of life what you put into it.

Hugs*
Nicole

would the providers stop seeing white men?"

Excellent point!

Find a group of escorts that work together and at least one of them is black.  Try to see the black one as hre being the same race would probably increase the liklihood of her being willing to see you.  Then she can relate to the others she works with that she saw you and you are an OK guy, so they will be more open-minded and probably willing to see you as well.  It's kind of like having references.  Often the indepedents know eachother and can actually refer you to some others.  I have had providers offer to do this for me.

Oh My...You are SOOOO Funny Nicole!  
The thought you speaking through a police megaphone and saying "Now Stop Towards The Listerine!"  is soooooo hysterical!   So men are so lost without their mummys to tell them to shower and brush their teeth, floss and gargle!

And you said it so well!   They need to work WITH us and we will enjoy ourselves too.  Sometimes I feel like a client has done everything in his power to undermine out time together.  Good Hygiene and a Good Attitude is imperative.

Cannot speak for the black indies here but I have known a lot who won't see black men.  I was under the impression it might be harder for a black man to see a black escort than a white one but I could be wrong.

Any black escorts reading this who see black men? Please post.