I'm the kinda person who believes...

everything happens for a reason...and You shouldn't feel guilty...I personally think guilt is a worthless emotion...You either feel good or You feel bad...it is what it is...he knows You do this for the money...so I would think before You moved to be closer to him...the two of You would talk about finances...and what I would do if I were in your situation is change it to a Sugardaddy/girlfriend relationship...I wish You nothing but the Best/Happiness in your life

Unfortunately, you've been seduced by the money and you're living a lifestyle you really are going to find difficult to walk away from. However, you can't look to the past or the future for your identity. Does what you do define all that you are? If the answer is yes, then keep taking the envelope. If no and you want a relationship, you should consider quitting the business and he's gotta to stop shopping if you expect to make it work. Take love out of the equation for now, what is this really all about you must ask?  Do you want to walk away from providing? Does he want you there because he's just as committed to making this what you want? Or is it really about having his ATF next door? Will he help you adjust financially until you can get a civilian life together? Human experience tells us like any relationship you have a 50-50 chance of all of this working out. Personally, if you can't move there on your own accord, don't do it. If you can't walk away from your life leaving it all behind in the time it takes to take a bath, dress, do make-up and make a sandwich, you better go back to the drawing board.

Great, you have a cool friend with whom you love spending time with, both outside of the bcd arrangement as well as bcd.

I would not rush to move...he could find a new flavor of the month and then you're in a strange city, albeit still being able to work but nonetheless, out of your comfort zone.

You can like a client and still keep it P4P..what's wrong with that. I have a super regular who I adore but still collect the envelope from.

Be careful of the gent in question wanting a closer relationship minus the envelope under the guise of "I really like you, maybe we could hook up". Not saying this is what is happening..shoot I know either of you and am getting your side of the situation.

My advice for what it's worth...keep it P4P, and maintain certain boundaries that won't hurt either him or you.

Again, no problem with the two of you really liking each other...it is up to you both as to whether you take it from P4P to civvie relationship..therefore negating the envelope.

As a person who is often (though in my opinion erroneously) labeled a "mangina," I applaud the fact that, albeit aliased, you have at least reached the conclusion that strong friendships are possible between hobbyists and providers. As someone who has had such friendships (of a non-romantic nature, thankfully) -- this is something I knew all along.

What? Just because you are a provider you are somehow automatically unworthy? Just because the man is a hobbyist he is somehow automatically unworthy? Pshaw!

Now, the bad news.

1. You will not be able to re-establish boundaries while keeping your new friend. Because he has grown attached to you, something that would ordinarily give him just a little twinge will become emotionally painful and confusing for him. If you try re-establishing the old boundaries once they are down -- he's gone, both as a friend and client.

The "good news" is that after that, he will come to believe as you did: that relationships with providers are impossible, that providers are emotionally unreliable women, etc. So you will have created a "fuck her once and go" hobbyist who believes providers incapable of sincerity or actual honest emotions.

IF you are going to do this, I think the absolute minimum damage can be done by letting him know you can't see him any more; and that it is because of your concerns about becoming attached. This way you don't leave him cynical for the next girl.

You posited two solutions -- end the friendship or re-establish the old boundaries. Both end up in the same place -- with you being out a client. The only real question with these is if you use a little finesse or a lot of finesse to minimize damage.

HOWEVER -- your two possible solutions are NOT the only solutions. It is a false choice.

2. You MAY be able to establish MODIFIED boundaries. This is what I have with one of my provider friends. Sex is always paid, but "friends" stuff is off the clock with neither of us charging the other. This has worked well for a long time. BUT -- it only works because neither of us has any actual romantic interest in the other and I refuse to accept her discount offers for the sex part. You hint that you may have romantic feelings for the guy and vice versa. So what I describe may not be viable. If you are developing romantic feelings, the more time you spend together, the more these will grow.

I AM aware of one case (doesn't involve me) where the provider spoke directly and honestly with the client; expressed the mutuality of feelings, but informed him of her ongoing financial need. They were able to reach a "modified boundaries" accomodation that worked for both -- and maintained both income and friendship.


3. Do not share your feelings if you plan to end things or re-establish boundaries! One thing that will most assuredly induce a man to feel more comfortable with allowing himself to be more bonded and emotionally dependent on a woman is the sense of safety he gets from her expression of mutuality of feelings.

This will only increase the hurt felt later. Yes, it IS leading him on. Don't do it.

IF, on the other hand, you think there is an actual possibility of this growing into a real romantic relationship; then express yourself fully but also convey your financial needs. You may be surprised to discover that some men are truly generous when it comes to a woman who is an object of their affection; and he will gladly supply funding in addition to working together to build something. It is not an either/or situation.

But if such a relationship is something that just plain cannot be (for example, you or he are already married); grin and bear it. Don't share because it creates false expectations unless you simultaneously let him know that there will NEVER be a real romantic relationship there.

4. He's everything you'd ever want in a man. How often does THAT come along? If he is available, and you are amenable, I think you should strongly consider his offer to move and perhaps negotiate a marriage down the road assuming conditions permit it.

Good luck.

in love with you!  No doubt he is.  This is what they search for in the hobby.  By all means, tell him you love him, tell him he is the wimp of your dreams, tell him thank you for the walmart bag full of candles and other worthless gifts!  He must know, so he will not see any other provider...not that he sees any anyway!
Do NOT worry about taking his money, it's another thing he lives for.  If you two got married, he'd still insist on paying your rate!
But ask yourself this: Can I continue to see him for these long dates and never have sex with him? Why doesn't he even ask?  How long can I talk to him when he uses words I don't even understand, and speaks in metaphors?
Yep!  Looks like you're the big winner (?) here today!  Try this to test his love>>> raise your rates.  If he (as he probably will) agrees to pay them and not ask to be grandfathered, YOU are in, Baby!  Tell him, Tell him NOW!  Don't let him get away!  You'll enjoy a lifetime of conversation, full envelopes, and romantic nights, under the moonlight, dunking oreos in milk together!  You're one lucky lady!!!!!

Deep friendship and P4P can coexist quite well. In fact, it's *better* with the envelope......

because the obligatory side of things does not have to be dealt with nearly as much. Boundaries are there and remain, but can bend or move if you (primarily) and he consent to it. Don't be afraid - this can be a good thing.

Just make sure that both of you remember that the sex bit is a business. You have to keep your business interests in mind including your obligations to other clients, your desire to stay profitable.

So don't plan to move unless this guy is going to guarantee you enough business to make the transition financially worthwhile for you. It takes time and effort to establish in a new area.

Probably the physical distance is a good thing for you both right now. It takes time to feel your way though a situation like this.

I have no problem at all with being an escorts persoanl friend and donating when there is going to be sex. Not at all. It's better that way.

When it gets scary is when the envelope comes out of the picture.....

Forget moving and don't tell him that you've got feelings for him if "I will still require an envelope if things progress"!  Sure, you could like him and have a friendship, but that's as far as it could go while you still require the envelope. Don't rush anything - as suggested before, give it a month or so and then if you're really falling in love, make your decision then.  But you can't have it both ways.  You'll have to make a decision on what is more important for you - love or an envelope.

You need to expore the options with great care...  while considering your income  requirements.  It's not impossble, but you needd to put the pensil to the paper, not think with your heart.

Is he willing to support you?

Are you expected to become exclusive?

Will play be covered or tested & approved & exclusive?

Is he married?

You need to hold your boundaries until you know what the proposal is.
skb

Good discussion. Food for thought

Think about the possitive side of things...Theres no lies (specialy) when we meet here.

Key words to go by: Respect, communication and the same level/appetite for sex.

***REMINDER***We all have different whats and needs.
Ask yourself what they are and what you can't live without.

I rather have a Loyal man- verses a Player. A man with Integrity, verses one with low core values.
We all have bills-and some of us- appreciate nice things. Yet, survival isn't a Joke these days. I understand your point on that...

You mentioned you "Like him" Very diferent from Being in LOVE! So take your time, enjoy it while you can. Get to know this man- before you give your heart away. Or make a choice that will have ugly conciquenses. People show their true colors in time. Don't rush!

I don't know about other Ladies here---REAL LOVe doesn't come by that easy... Yet, when we know what we want-and the older we get, we appreciate other sides to men. I know I do!

???Will you???? be ok- with cutting down on $$$ if you get with him? Out of respect for a healthier relationship??? ok,ok---some don't care about this---while others may.


Take your time---Get to know where you stand...if you both see eye to eye! More power to you both.
Good Luck!

~I wish eveyone in this world to be honest about what we seek, and need. Not fair when people play games and one gets hurt. Or females think that the V- is gold...It's not! A Real man will get tired of those games.Its a person's character that speaks louder.

Yet, we date who we are. Look around at the Happy couples- Most of them look alike.
"We Give what we have."

The law of attraction is something else.

Good Luck!




-- Modified on 5/5/2010 6:53:21 PM

You've given me a lot to think about.

Thank you.

I have no way to reach you directly, but please write to me at [email protected]