to everyone's satisfaction.  The ladies need the safety, and the guys are afraid of being outed.

The safety issues cannot be denied.  Women are killed, raped, assaulted, and robbed in this lifestyle, so ANYTHING that will help their safety is not only a good thing, but necessary.  Discussion of recent tragedies demonstrates the necessity for screening, but we should all take note that the necessity has always existed.  It's just now in the forefront for the duration of our attention spans.

The fairly recent agency busts and provider flipping fuel the fires of the guys who cannot afford to be outed.  When discussions of those topics were taking place on the boards and elsewhere in the hobby, there was the resulting backlash about screening.  With client lists, email retention on providers' computers, and downright LE cooperation by providers, it doesn't take much imagination to understand where a lot of guys come from when they don't want to trust someone with the information that can ruin their lives.

As in all Dichotomies, the pendulum swings.  In the balance of things, preventing a life lost is more important than preventing secrets from being revealed.  Most of us understand that, and it is obviously up to each of us to decide where the line that we will or will not cross is drawn.  It gets down to each person's personal barometer of how much information is enough to get the job done.  Ultimately though, it is the individual provider's barometer that decides.  

It's as simple as that.  If the level of information a guy is willing to give is not acceptable to the provider, then he should STFU and move on.  If the screening method is too arduous to survive the market, either the provider will fail in her business or adapt (hopefully in small enough increments to maintain safety).

Because let's face it.  This may be the most intimate of businesses, but it IS still a transactional business.  Which means that it is up to each provider to accept or reject the offer to engage her service for whatever reason she chooses.

This is such a basic principal of the hobby that it is a wonder that it becomes such a strong point of debate.  IMHO, I think the reason is that it conflicts with another core principal of the hobby - that if you have the money, you can basically see any provider you want.  This is a conceptual core principal that, again IMHO, actually attracts the vast majority of guys to this hobby.  "If I can afford that hot chick, I can have her."  I would surmise that most guys on TER truly believe that they can be with any woman on this site if they just have the cash.

Anyone with half a brain and any experience in the hobby knows that it's a qualified principal.  See the threads on ethnic preference and disqualification as evidence of this.  However, if most guys hold onto this, then a number of them will be upset when they CAN'T have the provider they want.  Hence, the rants about not being able to see the provider due to whatever reason.

Why make this post?  Well, sooner rather than later, the recent tragedies will fade to be replaced by the next information letting scandal.  At that time, the "level of screening" topic will rear it's ugly head and the lady killed in Boston will become just one more example used in retort.  Hopefully, if we fully explore this dichotomy now, we can gain enough understanding of both positions to truly know where each is coming from and why.

So guys, if the provider wants more information than you can give, move on.  She doesn't need grief for making a safety decision. Don't fixate on one provider - there's plenty of them available.  The ladies here don't need to be put into the position of justifying anything to anyone regarding this.

Ladies, if the guy is insistent and you need the money, DON'T compromise your safety - there are more clients than providers and you will get the business if you provide the service.  Patience can save your life.  Similarly, don't get your knickers in a twist because some guy won't give you enough info.  Just don't seem him and move on.

The bottom line is that we are all in this to have fun, not fuck with each other.

Sex is life, let's live a little.

I agree 100%.

Safety is #1.
Screen,Screen,Screen ladies.

Make screening the standard rather than the exception and and all hobbyists will do it with out the constant bitching about it.

First let me say that I recognize that the provider's vulnerabilities are much greater than mine. If I'm outed, that's not a good thing, but I'm still alive and well and can move on.

That being said, the amount of info I am willing to give a provider will vary on a case by case basis. And I am not offended if the lady does not want to see me because I will not provide what she wants. I recognize her right to make these decisions....

If a provider is very well established, highly reviewed, and I really want to see her, I will provider her with anything I can. I *can't* provider her with work info because I am covered by a confidentiality agreement. If she will not see me because I don't provide work info I accept that. I can and do provide my real name and area of residence, my preferred411 and date check handles, my TER handle which currently links to 32 reviews and 4 white listsings.

On the occasion that I see a lady who advertises on CL, or a fairly new or otherwise not well established provider, I tend to offer the minimum screening info necessary to make the date, which will in no case include my real name and location. And I realize that both the lady *and I* are a bit more at risk because she does not screen well. I accept that risk.

I would wish that all providers would screen well, even if it meant that I had to forego a date with some over the employment issue. There would be far fewer incidents and busts in the hobby.

But the fact is that many many very well reviewed providers have "screened" me based on nothing more than my TER handle and hobby email address.....

Lastly - agencies. Usually my TER handle and either date-check or in the case of Asian agencies P411 are all they require. They are not going to get my real name.....

So - this is always a balance, and one that is negotiated in every instance of a provider - potential client interaction. At the end of the day, I do reserve the right to restrict information with some providers on a case by case basis. I respect her right to see me or not based on what I offer. And I wish that all providers would take a lesson and take actions to make themselves and their clients less vulnerable....

i've been having a bit of a struggle over some screening requirements (e-mail from work) lately. i've resolved them and will move forward.

i would never try to pressure anyone into compromising their protocols for the sake of my business. nor would i haggle. both are deeply disrespectful.

PS i am posting this under an 'alias' because i rank too highly in number of posts and i want to drive the number down.

Nobody forces any client to hobby, I hobby  because I enjoy it. Screening is part of the process that brings me that enjoyment, so I deal with it.

You are so right!  I truly enjoyed reading this, and the last two full paragraphs are right on.  It still makes me wonder when a hobbyist is rude about information sharing.  Thank you for taking the time to write this and share your extremely valid opinions!

Also, what does everyone think of zabasearch.com for identifying people?

i guess there will be no hiding the fact i am a board slut after all.....

but this then implies that if we use an alias to protect information about ourselves or a provider it may not be absolutely secure. that is food for thought....

Nicely put.  There's a fine line we all walk in the hobby; trying to balance the need for safety vs. the need for anonymity can be tough.  When we remember that we mostly all want the same thing , there's a better chance we can find a way that works for both parties.

I always screen because not necessarily for my protection but for the protection of the ladies who is somebody daughter, sister, mother or wife.  A few years back, a co-worker was fired and turned to the hobby, she was caught and subsequently killed herself.  She failed to screen as undercover agents arrested her in a sting.  Although I hobbied and never personally saw her, I knew she was in the biz.  At her memorial, because of the circumstances no one from now my old job showed, because of the news coverage.  Bottom line, it our responsiblity to prove that we are safe because the brunt is not brought on us but the ladies who sacrifice to keep us happy - for a price of course

There are a number of women I passed on because they required real name information via website forms. I've even been leary of real names via email.

I have noticed when I've gone back to a couple I passed over at the end of 2008 is that some now have on their site that they are willing to take information over the phone. It's a win-win in that they get my real info, and there is no electronic record that LE could use against her or me. This also works real well if the provider, after having seen a man, destroys the information. A good cross-cut shredder isn't expensive.

LE getting a hold of your personal information is not what you need to be concerned about. What you need to worry about is identity theft. I wonder how many times screening data has found it's way into the hands of criminals who use the personal data to obtain credit cards, loans, purchase cars, etc. Identity theft is one of the fastest growing crimes in America.  Most personal information used by identity thieves is capture on the Internet.

other ideas that I'll ask the ladys to think about.   First an explanation.  I'm in Silicon Valley and have, for almost 30 years worked in entrepreneurial situations.  And I've been involved with military "expeditions" where out-of-the-ordinary" situations call for different, let's call them "fixes."   So...ladys

You have your own Providers Only site...why not discuss:

1)  A BIG deal I think is how a new provider breaks into this business.  One of my reviews in Las Vegas showed why a newbie needs a mentor.   So if any lady wants to really help the biz, take a new person under your wing.  Do it for nothing or do it for a small incentive, whatever.

2)  Team up in side by side rooms for incalls.  Make sure the man knows that somebody is next door for "safety sake."   I used to see a lady who let me know this and it didn't bother me at all.  She has since retired.

3)  Some hotels are TOO quiet and private.  Especially some resort type luxury rooms.  I saw a lady that I know very well last year and I actually commented on that.  It was so secluded that if she got into trouble...nobody would hear her.  I know she got the message - although her client list is a lot of regulars.    

4)  Incall's to a ladys home I think is a two edged sword.  She might have a safer environment but she also exposes herself in after hours.   Frankly I think providing in your own place is just too risky.    One provider I see just now and then rented a 3 bedroom apartment and shares it with 2 other ladys.  Always one other is there - so this is a combination of not being alone and not being in your real home.

There might be other methods to cut the risk and these may be full of you know what.  But DCs excellent post spurred me to think entrepreneurially.

If I was a provider I would.....well....scratch that thought.  I'm too damn ugly!

Ladys:  BE CAREFUL!

Even after the events of last week in Boston there is a provider who HAD THE MURDERER IN HER HOME and is still advertising on CL and not screening her clients.

I made this comment on the Boston board but it bears repeating.  There are two reasons why women get into escorting. Some do it to earn a living and some do it out of desperation.  The desperate ones will never take the dangers seriously. The smart ladies who want to earn a good living will.

By the same token there will always be men who will provide the information that a screening provider wants and there will always be men who won't.  

The thing about our hobby is that every one of the factions I mentioned will always be able to find takers who are willing to participate at whatever level both sides are comfortable with.  Sadly, this means that some men will get ripped off but even more tragically some women will get robbed, beaten or worse.  We are all ultimately responsible for our own safety and security once we decide to participate in the hobby. The best we can hope for is mutual respect for each others wishes.

provider safety.

Please come up with ONE example of this?

I don't know of any ladies who ask for your SSN or banking passwords.  Knowing who you are is not enough information to steal your identity.

Isn't it funny that a male who is respected (like yourself) brings out the reality of the situation for both sides and everyone agrees with him? While, on the other hand, providers have also said the same thing over and over again on this board, but some guys still pipe in and rant about the Whiteknights who agree with us, etc. Fortunately, the realistic, nice guys outweigh the negative hobbyists on this board.

Thank you for posting this, DC. I have always respected your viewpoints on the boards.  We, as providers, know why men are afraid of giving their real names, etc. I wouldn't enjoy it either, but I am not a hobbyist. If you are afraid, then seek a street walker, or someone who doesn't screen or simply don't hobby. It's scary but it's not brain surgery. We tell hobbyists all the time, "If you don't like our screening, then go to someone else instead of complaining to us via email or on the boards."

Also, men who are extremely afraid to give out sensitive information should only seek out reliable, well-reviewed ladies whom have a good reputation. Most of us would never divulge a hobbyist's information unless he was dangerous, and most of us do not share personal things about a hobbyist with another person (and we expect the same from them).  There will always be someone who pisses and moans and there's nothing we can do about it. However, it is so vital to our community for gentlemen -- like you -- to continue to post guidelines for others and to maintain some safety and civility between the two genders.

Wuv you,
Ciara

I was surprised to read your suggestions, 1) and 2), and what wonderful ideas they are!  I have posted almost verbatim, seeking a mentor to take me under their wing, incall rooms side by side, offered to compensate said person for their time, even for just someone to double check my screening process of my first client.

I have come up completely empty handed on all counts.  Zilch, notta, nothing.