The following was posted on a thread that is further on down the line here, and I moved it up to the top, because this pompous jerk NEEDS some feedback.  I have bunches to say about this, but you people have a go at it first.........

The following was posted by "Zorro" at the bottom of the thread "Are we a bunch of losers????"  Are you ready for this!!!!!  Read on.......
_____________________________________

Maybe I am delusional, but I believe most of these women would be lucky to have me in the real world. ÊI don't think that I could necessarily go around banging them all at the same time, but as far as on an individual basis, I have met very few providers that I think would be out of my league.

Admittedly, for the most part, I am not seeing the high end provider that claims that she has a Masters degree, has travelled the world, etc.

Regardless of whether they will admit it or not, most providers are in their occupation because they just are not capable of thriving in a more accepted line of work. ÊThere are the exceptions.

The only time I do not enjoy myself hobbying is when I am with a provider that I, personally, feel is not nearly at my level, yet she treats me indifferently. ÊAt that point I ask myself, "Why am I paying HER???"

I guess what I am paying for is the freedom to have sex with a great variety of women while still enjoying the comforts and stability of being married to a mostly great woman that I completely click with except in the sex department lately.

If a man has the means for hobbying and it is not going to negatively impact other parts of his life, I say that he is a fool NOT to engage in the hobby to further enrich his life.
---zorro
____________________________

This guy, in my book, is the definitive "loser".......and I'll get into why I think so after you guys have a go at this.

Comments.........????????

-- Modified on 5/17/2003 9:01:03 PM

You know, a year ago when I had the energy for anger, I would have jumped all over this. Now all one can do is appreciate a good source of entertainment.

By the way, he is an MP "King".

-- Modified on 5/17/2003 10:25:04 PM

Zorro does have a way about him that pisses people off.  He often comes off as arrogant, opinionated and most certainly politically incorrect.  On the other hand, he cheerfully shares information and speaks up for himself, often baring his soul and giving us a glimpse inside that few others here would dare to.  For all his faults, Zorro is a colorful contributor to TER and I make it a point to read his posts, not to get myself worked up, but because his posts are usually interesting and/or entertaining.

Hey zorro
Let's take your post apart one by one:

"I believe most of these women would be lucky to have me in the real world."--zorro
Why in the world would ANY provider want you in the real world other than for your money?  Why?  Because you're well educated, well traveled and rich?  Would it EVER occur to you that there just may be some other positive, with more important traits that she may be looking for, traits such as empathy, compassion, integrity and honesty just to name a few?

"I have met very few providers that I think would be out of my league."--zorro
Who, prey tell, would want to be in your league???

"Admittedly, for the most part, I am not seeing the high end provider that claims that she has a Masters degree, has travelled the world"--zorro
Do you honestly think that if a provider has a Masters and has traveled the world, that, THAT is what makes her a high end provider????

"most providers are in their occupation because they just are not capable of thriving in a more accepted line of work. There are the exceptions."--zorro
Two issues here.
One: There are many providers that are capable of thriving in a more accepted line of work, and they are NOT the exceptions.  I guess you need to define, thriving.  I know of very few professions where ladies can eat at the finest restaurants, stay in the finest hotels, and travel while they are getting paid the kind of money that these ladies are capable of making.
Two: Concerning those ladies who ARE in this occupation because they are not capable of thriving in a more accepted line of work, who are you to say that if you didn't have the same life experiences that they had in their youth, what would have become of you?????

...."when I am with a provider that I, personally, feel is not nearly at my level...."zorro
And what "level" is that zorro, for it is surly a level that I don't aspire to.

I could go on and on here, but I'm going to stop.  Apparently zorro has some followers  here.  He has posted 21 reviews, and there may be providers here who he has seen as clients that will not step forward and state their feelings regarding these issues because of  a conflict of interests, which I can understand.  I have no such conflicts, and in my opinion, zorro would be more appropriately named "zero".

Over......and out.....


-- Modified on 5/17/2003 10:16:28 PM

-- Modified on 5/17/2003 10:33:07 PM

What makes zorro a colorful contributor IS because, he IS, as you say, arrogant, opinionated and politically incorrect.  You may want to add a few more adjectives like pretentious,
obnoxious, egotistical, etc, etc, etc.

I too would continue to read his posts because they are interesting and getting pissed off does have a certain entertainment value.

The man has not only demeaned the profession of providers, he has demeaned women as a whole, and I have a problem with that.

He is one of those guys who I am sure refers to his wife as "the little lady" while having huge delusions of grandeur.

As interesting as he may be, he is still a jerk, IMHO...........

I kinda new here so forgive me but what does MP "King" mean?????

It seems that most of his reivews if not all are all from MP'S.

Nothing wrong with that. Isn't it interesting that we as escorts which are the "subject" of discussion something this character doesn't have much experience with???

Yes, he does share a rather interesting perspective!

eom

Stop being so self-righteous.

I guess its just me but this is pretty funny to me.  Hi lwein, i'm the dummy of the community here.  Why are you putting zorro down like that?  Zorro has posted quite a lot and his posts are quite entertaining.  I have learned that a lot of the people here are not exactly what they portray.  By way of chatting to some and also from what providers have talked about.  This  guy is probably using this persona to secretly live out some funky fantasy life.  That post was I guess could be called demeaning (sp)to some ladies, that is if they feel it pertains to them.
Like brooke, she just laughs about it cause she knows that its all just someones opinion may it be stupid or not.
As for me I still haven't found a provider with my level of intellect cause then she would be a dummy as well, LOL. Some of your posts have been getting a lot of feedback so please lets not start a whole war of name calling and the attacking of people.  Lets just kick back, have a beer then go out and have some fun.  Oh well, Its just my opinion.  
Oh, for those of you who don't drink beer, drink what ever the  
f(&k you want.  Buh bye, Buh bye.

                              Thank you

                               jammers

Lwien, I think that your post reveals who the real loser is.  It seems that you feel it is necessary for you to attack Zorro in order to be liked by providers.  Providers are for the most part smart women, and I think they can see right through your bullshit.

......but regardless if you feel that I am self-righteous, he did say some pretty outrageous things, wouldn't you say?????

-- Modified on 5/18/2003 7:34:18 AM

The only post I have ever read from zorro was this one, and it didn't sit too well............still's not sitting well.........

Ok........feeling better now.........moving on.............

cya...........

He also is a big fan of the ladies south of the border, so I put little stake in someone who knows very little about the quality providers that are here in the states and has said on a number of occasions, that he is much more into quantity. I'm sure I'm not the only one who is glad he leaves the local Providers alone. Maybe that's why some of the other hobbyists are supporting him, since he leaves more for them...LOL Just another thought, maybe he deals with MP's and Tj's, because the good SP's here, want nothing to do with him. Come to think of it, I wouldn't want a Provider, that would see someone that speaks the way he does about women.IMO,I look for women, with brains as well as beauty...

"Admittedly, for the most part, I am not seeing the high end provider that claims that she has a Masters degree, has travelled the world, etc."

Nope, you're not seeing that provider who has a master's degree or has traveled the world. As a young lady who has a master's degree and who has traveled the world, your condescending and patronizing ways are laughable. The entire reason you wouldn't see a young lady like myself is because you're threatened by independent women who are successful, bright, and have their shit together. Women like myself may actually have more to offer you than sex. That bothers you, doesn't it? It bothers you that I have no kids or terrible boyfriend making me escort , that I can make unlimited money for doing little work, and most of all, that you in fact, are no better than the whore you're fucking.

What did he DO?  He just wrote a post that you disagreed with.  He has a right to say what he did - you have a right to disagree.  OK, on to the next subject, because this one has become painfully boring!

If you have a Master's degree and have traveled the world, why are you bothering to answer Zorro's post?  If you are independent, bright, successful and have your shit together, don't you have better things to do than get all riled up by someone's deliberately antagonistic post?  I'm sure you DO have more to offer than sex.  Why degrade yourself by tooting your horn?  Just a thought.

made the quote.  Thanks.

in LA and General boards while zorro has continued to present himself in TER with this controversial persona.

I am not an acute observer of all zorro’s travails since his presence here preceded mine for a couple of years.  My guess is that overtime, quite a number of long time members treated many of his messages as an entertaining act – like a bad guy in a movie, not to be taken seriously at face value.  Some members’ reactions to your earnest denouncement of zorro’s view are akin to audience watching a bystander not knowing a movie is being made fighting an actor in a villain role during a location shoot.

Many long time or prolific posters in TER boards have consciously or unconsciously created certain roles in TER boards.  There are many reasons why someone chose to spend the time writing a message or responding to others’ comments.

To paraphrase Charlie Kaufman in Adaptation – you are what you do, not what others perceive you.

Please continue to express your opinion and don’t let others reaction discourage you.  I have come to the conclusion a while back that there is no point for me to response to most of zorro’s messages.

Have peace.


-- Modified on 5/18/2003 7:24:12 AM

I have only been on these boards for a few weeks now.  I am opinionated, which is the ONLY thing that I believe I have in common with zorro, and I like to post subjects that are thought-provoking.  The two prior posts, one questions how certain providers advertise, and the other having to do with how we feel about ourselves indulging in this hobby, became quite long, for they sparked controversy and differences of opinions.  I think that, that is a good thing.  It's good to talk about the things that may make us feel uncomfortable.

Some of you have suggested that that this is old news and not worthy of discussion, that I was self-righteous,that I should get a life, that zorros post was "just funny",  that I should just deal with it, and that I am annoying. Sorry ladies and gents.  I can't keep my mouth shut on this, for if I did, I would either be indicating that I agree with zorro's perception of providers and women in general, or, that what he said was nothing more than amusing.  I think neither.

I don't know zorro for as long as many of you.  I have never read any of his other posts, and if this post was just way out of character for him, than I am in error, although from what many of you have said, this is not the case.

In my two prior posts, the common thread seemed to be that "respect" was the thing that providers desired and it was "respect" that hobbyists wanted to give to the providers, and yet when someone states that he disrespects providers, which he in fact did , you say I shouldn't say anything.  I find that odd, unless of course, some of you agree with him.  I guess that some of you here do, or that the subject of respecting providers is just not important enough to discuss.  



-- Modified on 5/18/2003 7:36:49 AM

perfect response! Well said & so true! Thank you Interesting Woman!

Iwien, are you a VIP member, so you can read your TER mail?

-- Modified on 5/18/2003 7:50:15 AM

I'm also arrogant, opinionated, and politically incorrect.  I'm sure many people think I'm a jerk, an asshole, a pig, and so on.  So I feel fairly qualified to speak on zorro's behalf regarding your opinion of him.  
Tough shit.  Your opinion of me matters as much as that of the panhandler standing outside the subway.  
To steal from your writing style, you said:
"The man has not only demeaned the profession of providers, he has demeaned women as a whole, and I have a problem with that."
The majority in our democratic nation would say that anyone, including you, who pays for sex is demeaning women.  It's only in our little community where statements such as yours wouldn't be attacked at hypocritical.
I didn't respond to the original "Losers" posts, because I don't care what people I don't know think about me.  I only care how I and those I love feel about me.  From reading your past posts, you come across as more egotistical and deluded than Zorro ever thought to be.  Maybe Zorro is a jerk.  Maybe you're a jerk.  Maybe I'm a bigger jerk than the two of you combined.  It has nothing to do with the topic.  Your response to his post is nothing more than a personal attack, as are quite a few of your responses to other posts.  His message was posted as opinion.  There is nothing in it you can refute.  It is opinion, not fact.  Reply to his post and say "That was a pretty jerky thing to say".  That's fine.  To cut apart his post interspersed with your own snide comments and post it as a new thread only serves to make you look like a jerk, IM(not so)HO.  Flame away.

So I guess if history repeats itself, you want Zorrito in your mouth???

Lwien...get a life, bro.

To the providers that have spoken up...yes, it's true that I mostly see MP girls and girls in TJ.  The few times that I have seen GFE incalls, I found the service to be good, but the screening process to be undesirable and the prices to be highly inflated.  Quite honestly, as stated before, I have also found most incall providers to be past 30 years old, usually the same age or older than myself!  I am not paying $$$+ per hour to talk.  If I wanted that I would go find myself a very hot therapist and talk for hours for $/hour, instead of $$$+/hour.

Ciao.

"Maybe Zorro is a jerk.  Maybe you're a jerk.  Maybe I'm a bigger jerk than the two of you combined."

Wow- you don't see that argument every day...

No, mine's smaller.
No, mine's smaller.

;^)

I'm not gonna flame ya.  There's nothing in your post that would cause me to do that.  But I find it interesting that you call zorro's statements nothing more than opinions and you call mine snide comments.

Of course zorro's statements were just his opinions.  But it served as a great catalyst to discuss the diverse feelings we have about providers.

Being that I strongly disagree with his opinions doesn't make mine any less valid or not worthy of discussion.

You asked for peoples feelings and opinions of themselves as pertains to this hobby in a previous post.  Zorro gave his honest OPINION, and these were some (not all) of your responses:

1. Why in the world would ANY provider want you in the real world other than for your money?
2. Who, prey tell, would want to be in your league???
3. zorro would be more appropriately named "zero".
4. This guy, in my book, is the definitive "loser".......

Numbers 1 and 2 fall directly into the category of snide comment.  3 and 4 are just insults.

....and went on a personal attack.  Maybe I shouldn't have done that, but the problem that I had was that I asked the question if people felt that they were loser's for seeing a provider.  Zorro's response was that he didn't feel that he was a loser because most of the providers are below his level, inferring that they are losers.............and I have a problem with that kind of logic.

So I agree with you.  I did make some snide comments, but I also countered with my own opinions on this, with just as much validity......

He ticked me off recently on the LA board with some comments on "over-priced and unsafe" LA escorts as compared to South African escorts.

I didn't realize he's been around this long with such a long history of being "colorful/controversial/politically incorrect."

So, he's the sorta the board's equivalent of the guy who tells the racial jokes--some people laugh at them, others condemn them, others shake their heads but move on because they know they cannot change him.

Thank you and the above LA'ers (like papercup) who filled the rest of us in.

My thoughts are"zorro" is a figment of his imagination.  In other words he has created this fictitious character...big cars, beachfront property in Cape Town. My belief is he probably works at Taco Bell (nothing wrong with that, I
eat there all the time), probably has a small dick, very insecure person who sits at his computer and becomes "ZORRO", rich, big man Zorro.  His name is probably Ed (nothing wrong with that either, got lots of friends called Ed), and he probably lives with his mother and a houseful of cats in, lets say, Pacoima (nothing wrong with Pacoima...just not for Zorro, though). Kind of sad, but hey, if it boosts his ego..poor guy. Oh yeah, and he goes to massage parlors, I guess "high end" girls intimidate him.

Someone else here also eluded that there are many who take on false characters.  Do you think that, that is pretty typical or a rare occurance?  I may be naive, but I usually take people's posts at face value and assume that they are who they say they are......

But THAT could be a topic of a whole other thread....

Hey AngelStar.........you gotta take this spoon outa my hand.  It just keeps going from pot to pot.........!!!!!(lol)

-- Modified on 5/18/2003 10:26:26 AM

That and "The Lost Schlong" ::shudder:: - but HE seems to have disappeared the last six months or so. Thankfully.

However, there are hundreds of people here who DON'T nauseate me one bit. Some very nice people actually. In a group this big there's bound to be a few assholes. I just try to click through their posts quickly and move on.

-- Modified on 5/18/2003 2:47:07 PM

And all you have to say for yourself is:

"you want Zorrito in your mouth???"

and

Get a life..........bro?


You sound like one of my sons when they were 15.....

Now I feel REALLY stupid for getting upset with you in the first place.........

I have nothing more to say.......

Zorro, I gotta hand it  to you.....you have left me speechless.......

Re:I don't fit on this long thread - check my screen name out! EOM

EOM

I was away (dining!) (daty by the way), I come back to this!!!

Very entertaining too!!  No, we don't give the time and day for the likes of "Zorro".  By the way, "Zorro", put your cloak up to your eyes and cover up good.  Just because some plump-faced latin guy wears a mask, doesn't make him Alain Delon or Anthony Banderos.  NOT even close!  Also, as I recall:  you were in your late 30s years ago.  So Don't slam the LA incalls being over 30.  We all age.  

Sorry, can't help.  I know I'm wasting time here.

THANK YOU for the best laugh all day...!!!!!LOL (tears streaming down my face)...I believe you know mister Zorro only too well..!!  As for the statement about over 30 providers, obviously, Real Women, with brains, that speak English, are not his "Cup O'Tea", but Thank God there are Hobbyists who can appreciate the qualities that make my business so lucritive. As far as talking...after his snide remarks in another post about my speaking Greek, Mr. Zorro and I would have nothing to say to one another.  The support of this type of person by many of these guys, tells me volumes about them as well.  Peace, Robyn

I was simply wondering why such an intelligent, educated and worldly woman would bother getting bent out of shape by Zorro's post.  Call it whatever you like.

is the prevalent stereotyping that so many people have of ladies within this forum.  The sad little waifs with addictions, horribly abusive backgrounds, low self esteem and little brains to go with our reched lives; it isn't any wonder we have turned to this life, for we are to dumb to do anything more productive in our lives.  Although it is true that there are ladies with those very problems, it doesn't mean that is true for all and those same problems can be found of anyone in any other professional field and/or walk of life.  

Posts such as Zorro's tell alot about that individual.  I believe that those that try and bring others down do so in order to make them feel better about themselves.  Those with the least bit of intelligence can see through that.  I also believe that posters are more bold on the message board than they tend to be in person.  There isn't a computer to hide behind, are quite different face to face and treat the ladies as a true gentleman.  Of course there are exceptions to the rule.

I tend to take those statements with a grain of salt, ignore them for the most part and don't let them bother me.  As I go about my personal life, I know the opposite to be true.  I don't need to attack him, for in living the way I live gives me more satisfaction than anything I could ever say to refute his ideology.

Lauren

-- Modified on 5/19/2003 7:58:50 AM

I don't know and I don't care.

I also know from personal experience that it is easy to post or email something I have later regretted and with I could retract.

I prefer to read the posts of both the hobbyists and providers on other issues that (IMHO) more clearly demonstrate their intelligence and sensitivity.  This is not a criticism of anyone's posts - just my feeling on the subject.

Lauren, you are just one example of the many quality providers that this Hobby has to offer. I totally agree with the majority of your posts. The great thing about being a strong woman with our shit together in this business, is we can pick and choose our clients, those that have drug problems, pimps, multiple children, or low self esteme, don't have that luxury. But the biggest bonus of all is, guys like Zorro and his supporters aren't interested in us...We intimidate them, they can't manipulate us, disrespect or dominate us, so we don't have to deal with them as clients...Thank God..!! So by speaking our minds against their kind,IMHO, we aren't losing potential clients, but rather weeding out the undesirables...  I agree, also, with your statement about your life...in fact, I have something printed on my checks, you may find interesting, "If any man speaks badly of you, live your life so that no one will believe it", that, along with the "Golden Rule" are the creeds I choose to live by...they've served me well.

millions of other guys.  In fact, he may be far more typical of the average male than many of the rest of us that frequently post on TER.  Just because you find his opinions disagreeable because they differ from your own is no reason to start a new thread to single him out for abuse.

We've known Zorro for a long time on the LA Board and he's nothing if not consistent.  He may rub many the wrong way, and I've been amongst that group frequently in the past three or four years myself, but his opinion is no less valid that the rest of ours.  Attempting to shout him down or flame him off the board until he complies with the way the majority of us view the hobby doesn't help the board, it only diminishes it.  

Zorro may evolve his attitudes over time as he matures, or he may never change.  In either case, he's entitled to express his opinion as long as it's not violating TER's policies.  While I too have been turned-off by some of his posts in the past, I can also tell you that he's helped a lot of guys looking for information on MP's and TJ and has posted extensively on the subject.  Whether that's your thing or not, he's really the LA authority on those two subjects and will share his knowledge with anybody who asks for information.  

If we can make one general statement about TER it's that it accomodates people of many different tastes and interests.  Sex is, after all, the great equalizer among people.  As a result, there should be plenty of room for all of us here.

What distinguishes ourselves from others??  Why does he post here??  The broad spectrum of women here proves that..we are a melting pot..I am unable to  spend the time necessary to explain, but nonetheless...I remain, as many of us do...opinion remains opinion...philoshophy..the greatest question of all....

Sexy Sofia

Lwien is a guy that really likes to hear himself talk....he makes 10 posts to to each thread.  

I have enjoyed Zorro's posts about TJ, though I don't know if I will ever put them to use.  And I have not found him to be annoying so far, unlike

.

I didn't actually find your original post that big a deal. Poorly worded, perhaps, but I know that the stereotypes about this industry exist because there are people who fulfill them. Assuming that everyone is like that, is the mistake, however with this comment, I just have to chime in and say...

I don't HAVE to have sex with strangers.
I LOVE having sex with strangers.
I make the choice to do what I do vs. sit cooped up in a horrible office with a powermad boss groping my ass every day.

Now I'm off to the salon to get a pedicure and manicure and facial... ah what a terrible life I lead, how *can* I do this to myself!

*SMOOOOOOOOOOCH* to you Zorro, you obviously need it!

Nicole

fucking strangers for free, zorro.  You did say in your original post that you haven't been clicking in the sex department lately.  

She can't be too intelligent.... eom

-- Modified on 5/20/2003 9:14:03 AM

Well, NOSC, "To each his own", I myself choose not to support someone that has such an obvious disregard for what we do. I don't think of my clients as strangers, just play-mates, I have yet to meet, *wink*

I too have yet to meet "just someone"...

honey, give me a call, I am in LA right now!

702-499-8208

I totally agree that zorro has a right to be here and express his opinions, and I'm the one that started this thread.

All I was doing was offering a counter to his opinions and then proceeded to state my own opinions about zorro.

We all have our feelings about what is right and what is wrong.  Thank God we live in a society where we can express these differences freely.  

I, for one, would not want zorro to go away.  Yings without yangs, or yangs without yings would make for a very boring place to visit, let alone the fact that it would really piss off the Chinese  

boards.  Let's vagorously argue the idea and not the person.

of someone whose views many of us disagree with stifles the free expression that should always remain part of this board.

A case could be made that zorro was publically tarring and feathering the majority of escorts on this forum.

All I did was offer counter opinions to what zorro was saying and then offered my opinion on zorro.

It was not my intention to stifle anything.  I encourage zorro to state his views as he understand them.  

And I do agree with you that free expression should always remain part of this board, including mine.

It's just that I'm pretty new here, and that was the first post of his I ever read.  For me, it wasn't old news.......it was just crass, insensitive, arrogant news that kinda got under my skin......

Hope I didn't do too much damage, but it seems that everytime I start a thread, it gets almost a whole page long.

Hope I don't get too bad of a reputation here.....

Larry

Zorro is my brother. As far as I can tell he is one of the only other Latin guys around these parts. So I have a bit of an idea of  where he is coming from. Having said that, there is no doubt that Zorro is an asshole or at least enjoys the image of coming off like one.

But you have to take into the account that in the culture we were raised in there are two weird idiosyncaracies:

One is that, all things being considered, Latin wives are MUCH more likely to be tolerant of hobby-type activity. Which is not to say they won't absolutely go ape-shit on you when they catch you... but at the end of the day they will forgive because deep down they know THEY are the ones that have instilled us with the desire and the courage to stray.

Secondly, please understand that sexual humiliation in Latin culture is a two-way street. There is no doubt in my mind that in Zorro's world he is often treated with the same contempt and demeaning tone of the kind with which he speaks of the ladies he sees. It is also no surprise that he seems to have no interest in meeting the sophisticated couretsan types that might actually be so bold as to engage him on a more complex level. To him they are nothing but vaginas because he himself is nothing more than a penis (...and a paycheck). Z does seem to have a preoccupation with financial status...or am I the only one to have noticed that?

But having said all that, Zorro also has the balls to say everything he actually feels and not sugar-coat it with so much PC bullshit. Zorro is strait up. You may not like him but you harbor no illusions about who he is. And THAT you have to respect.

Peace out Z ... don't take it personal.

From your original post:

"this pompous jerk NEEDS some feedback.  I have bunches to say about this, but you people have a go at it first........."

Zorro's post said nothing like this, so I don't think that much of a case could be made that he was publicly tarring and feathering escorts.

I take what you say about encouraging free expression as being true for you.  You're a sincere guy, and that's a good thing.
Keep participating.

and Booyaashaka or something to that effect.  If you haven't seen Ali G on HBO, you is missing out.

Regarding my view of providers...I treat the providers I see very well, whether they are the $$$+ "high end" (white, 30+, GFE--unsafe sex--) providers or the 18 year old little hotties in TJ or Cape Town.  However, in the end, they are just sex and while it is nice if they have a personality and a brain, in the end, I want a girl who will just fuck the shit out of me and leave me with my head spinning at the end of the session.

I don't know how much of my view of women has to do with my being latin, because to most latins, I am as whitewashed as they come.  I grew up with friends that were of every ethnicity and honestly I am pretty tame compared to a couple of my friends that I grew up with in my view of women.  I don't think anything that I have said about providers has been misogynistic but I don't put them up on the same type of pedestal as many hobbyists around here have.

A message to the fellow hobbyists...I don't see the providers putting you guys up on the same pedestal and you guys are the customer.  In any other industry, this type of treatment would not be tolerated.  

For me to be slammed for seeing MP girls, TJ Girls, European South African girls, etc., is a big fucking joke.  Sure, I may not be spending as much per session, but I guarantee you all that I am hobbying much more frequently than the guy that only sees a $$$+ provider twice a month.  I get a big kick out of it when some paint an image of me as this poor Mexican when I have in the last 15 months will have visited Patagonia (Chile and Argentina), South Africa twice, Zimbabwe, Zambia twice, as well as the usual stupid little getaways to SF, LV, San Diego, etc.) all while staying in only the very best places (and while on safari that means paying $1,500+ per night).  

In addition, this poor Mexican has probably banged about 40-50 different girls in that same time period, has run three marathons, a dozen half marathons, hit 140+ in the Zorromobile on Southland freeways a few times, been face to face with a fucking leopard and not much further away from a pissed off elephant, canoed down the hippo/crocodile Zambezi River, been in the middle of an angry fucking mob in Zimbabwe with no fewer than 500 Africans armed with sticks, spears, clubs, etc., been in a cessna that I was sure was going to crash into the fucking Drakensburg Mountains in South Africa, all in that time period.

In short, this motherfucker, Zorro, knows how to live!  And if that offends little twit newbies to this board or any of the existing TER members, hobbyists and providers alike, fuck 'em.
Good or bad, I only live my life for myself, and, at least for the time being, I am content to go on living my life as such.

Peace out, motherfuckers!!!

I was just being a lot more direct.  His "tar and feathering" was buried amongst his opinions.

Anyway, thanks for the encouragement......I think I'll stick around for awhile........Hope I don't piss off too many people, but I do like to stir the pot every once in awhile.  

It makes for interesting conversation.

"they will forgive because deep down they know THEY are the ones that have instilled us with the desire and the courage to stray."
--shotdsherriff

Do all Latin women really do that?   Because if they do, I think they are really misguided.  

We are ultimaly responsible for our own actions.  It very could be that a man may wake up in the morning and see his wifes streatch marks from having babies and says to himself, "I want better than that.  I'm going out to find me some young stuff".  Ok, that's just one example, but for that, she should forgive because it was her fault????
Maybe she's not attracted to him anymore because he has let himself go and gained 30 lbs and doesn't realize that he has to clip the hair out of his nose and ears.  So she's not turned on by him and not as passionate as she once was.  Is that her fault?  Could be her fault if she didn't tell him to shape up.

Like I said, I believe we all have to be responsible for our own actions.  Now here's where I'm gonna touch on a real touchy subject.  And believe me, I'm not taking the moral high ground here.  Just stating how I feel.  

I am single now, and enjoy this hobby, but I never cheated on my wife or any lady that I was with.  One has to lie and decieve and give up his integerity and honesty to do that.  My feeling is that if you don't believe in a monogamous relationships, than don't enter into one and make believe that your monogamous.    

You gotta ask yourself, if the situation were reversed and you found out that your wife was cheating on you, would you forgive her because you felt that you were the one that instilled the desire.  More than likely, you'd be pissed and either leave or start seeing other women yourself.

Plus it would take just too damn much work to keep the deception going.  Gotta be worried about phone calls, emails, what excuse are you gonna use tonight, can she smell the perfume,  am I gonna get caught, what happens if I do get caught,  what about the kids, etc, etc, etc.    And on top of that, you have to deal with the guilt.  

Wayyyyyy too much effort, IMHO.............Much better just to leave and enjoy the hobby to your hearts content.  Takes a lot less effort but requires a lot of balls.............

(hmmmmm.....this post should keep this thread going for at least another two pages, ya think?)

and regarding other comments of yours, I doubt that you are just going to be able to turn it on and off with your hobbying once you hook up with another woman outside the hobby.

And another thing, as much as a nice guy that you think you are, in the end, providers look at you no differently than they look at me...as just a big walking phallic dollar.  Do yourself a favor and find something more interesting to do with your time than to bash me.

Peace.

have to fuck, as Zorro so eliquently puts it.  And that in a nutshell explains everything about Zorro.  The idea that a lady within this forum actually wanting, enjoying and willing to participate in this community is something he doesn't understand.  But I also must clarify this ideology, for some of us in this forum do not fuck for money.  That would after all be breaking the law.

I am also curious to know why Zorro would have any desire to participate within a community in which he holds so much disdain for and why he would insult his wife's intelligence within it.

Lauren

I can appreciate someone that does speak their mind and prefer it.  That I can give to Zorro.  I agree with the posts that say it is his right, no matter if we agree with his ideology or not.  But in doing so, the door is open for debate and discussion about an individuals views and statements that are posted in discussion forums.  That is in essence what this board is about and do enjoy the lively debates.  

And yes, people do become so enpassioned with the subject matter that they do tend to get carried away by flinging insults.  That also isn't right for those that have done that to Zorro, but it is a two way street and Zorro doesn't have the right to do that either and he has with the statements he made, but has also opened up the forum to discuss the stereotypical views many people have about the ladies that do participate in this forum.  That is a good thing and do think this thread does help in getting the point across in debunking that ideology and pointing out that it is dead wrong.

You state that we have to understand his Latin culture and background.  I can't say that I do, for it makes no sense to me.  There are many cultures in which a wife is tolerant to a husbands extra curicular activities.  But that has nothing to do with the manner in which that gent views a lady within this forum.  If it does anything, it points out the fact that a gent within this type of culture, or at least Zorro, views ladies, no matter what status they have as beneath them, for your statement places the blame of gents activities squarely on the shoulders of their wives, without accountability for himself.  There is something very wrong with the picture you paint IMHO.

Zorro's contemptable views IMHO I don't think has anything to do with his Latino background and is nothing more than an excuse.  This in essence opens the door to discussion about racial views and think that is better left for another thread.  

Attitude has everything to do with it and probably accounts for the reason that he encounters what he does.  One does reap what they sew.  It is a self esteem issue and explains his obsession with fianancial status (yes, I have noticed).  He is not alone, but measures his self worth by the bottom line in his account. He purposely engages with ladies that he is safe to assume is beneath him (financially? hmmm...).  It is also why he avoids sophisticated courtesean types for he fears feeling inferior to them and points out that his sole intentions of visiting with a lady is not about just sex, but an esteem booster.  An underlying factor he may not be aware of himself.  

He looks for more shots of esteem here on the boards and more often that not doesn't get what he is looking for.  It infuriates him and in his frustration lashes out at the whole of the community.  The problem with that is that there is a melting pot of individuals with ideas and views that vary greatly and most respect that and even relish in that fact for there is so much to learn and understand from others.   It is something Zorro sadly misses out on, for he is unwilling to open his mind to any other views.  But still, it does not give him the right to insult others anymore than it gives others the right to insult him.

Enough of my psychological profiling rant.  That was worth 5 cents.  Peanuts Lucy.....The doctor is out.

Lauren

and for that, I apologize.  You're post was the first I read that day, and it got to me.  I should have just stuck with offering counter opinions to yours.  

And believe me, I know that providers just look at me as a paying customer......just as they look at you.  

But we differ on a lot of viewpoints here.  I'm not trying to win any poplularity contest here.  I just started a thread that will probably not sit to well with the providers being that I questioned some ethical issues.

I'm not here to bash ya zorro, and again, what I did was wrong.  But I do enjoy bringing up controversial topics for debate.  It's just something that not only do I find entertaining but very educational as well.

Peace out,
Larry

[sigh]

before this week, i didn't even know who Zorro was but i have to say that from what i've heard so far i'm not leaning eitherway (i have neither the patience nor the inclination to "research" his past posts). there will always be bleeding-heart liberal femmi-nazi providers that will label guys like him as misogynist pigs and these providers' entourage of "feeder-fish" ass-kissing bellboys will stand by them 100% with flowers and love poetry (hoping to score a discount or get some extra attention)

call me a cynic, call me bitter, call me "diseased". but my last word on this hopefully soon-to-be-abandoned topic is this: we're free to disagree, we're free to embellish, we're free to fantasize and we're free to love/fuck who we want!  let's cut the PC-crap and behave like adults. above all, let us not have any delusions about this hobby and the *business* it's ALL about.

frankly, i'd like to see the following quotation from Zorro etched onto a golden plaque and hung over the members entrance to TER!


"A message to the fellow hobbyists...I don't see the providers putting you guys up on the same pedestal and you guys are the customer.  In any other industry, this type of treatment would not be tolerated."  -- Zorro