Gay marriage is finally recognized throughout the US.  When will sex work be legal?  We all know the arguments about sex traffic of the unwilling. That is like saying that since slaves were used to farm cotton, all cotton farming should be banned. I know the TV stories of sad providers who are sorry they ever got involved.  I can line up more physicians than you realize who are depressed and wish they had gone to dental school instead of medical school, or lawyers who just can't wait until they can afford to retire from work they now find hateful.  
There is something about sex (gay or for pay or filmed and sold as pornography) that makes people in public life a little crazy.

and signed it with them. Trafficking is a hoax they want the general public to believe.

Finally, gays will now know what real marriage is all about. For example: they will now fight like real married couples, after a few years of marriage they will not know what sex is anymore. The biggest one of them all is if they ever decide to go their separate ways, they would have to spend a boat load in attorney's fee and fight it out in court as to who gets what ( at least that is the case in NY ). So why should the straights have all the fun...

think they have something to do with it?

do you really think so????

Hahhaa just kidding.  

curious.........we are all entitled to our opinion.  Have been a hobbyist for quite a long time.  Can not say I have ever been with a provider who was genuinely under duress.  Yet.......living in Las Vegas.........I know there is an underworld........and most of their enterprises are gambling, drugs, and...........

points!  You have illustrated just how different the "hobbyist cause" is.  How many of us could afford to "come out of the shadows" and take up our cause?  In most cases, we must remain discreet or risk fracturing relationships.........families.........professions and much more.

It is the same service to them which they are needed. Xo

Politicians have never been known for having a spine.  In fact, those two things seem to be mutually exclusive.  A job that is entirely dependent on holding to "popular" opinion by its very nature doesn't encourage out of the box or controversial thinking.  Which is a shame, as our country was founded by a bunch of radical, anti-establishment, free thinkers.  We seem to have lost sight of that along the way.

So, why not legalized sex for pay?  It's hardly on the radar.

I did some grass roots fundraising and saw the change here in Cali 2 years ago. I have joked with both my gay & straight friends that we all deserve the right to be miserable in lousy marriages....and now we all can!  
But in all seriousness- what a great step for equality. We should all celebrate with a cold beer, a hot broad, and then maybe a nap (It's tiring fighting the good fight!)

I've gotten to know a few gals who at some point or another in their lives were trafficked in some way, however they were not that upset over it because the place they were coming from was even worse, and the trafficking experience gave them the tools and wherewithal to go on and do better.

genetic dispositions for all kinds of addictive behaviors including sexual addictions, which for the sake of argument I'll freely admit to.

legalizing such things in your coutry just make it decetralized, which defeats all perpose of state.

what about the fact.........that if our hobby was legal............wouldn't it fall under some type of regulation/governmental control.

Mr. Fisher - as usual you make a good point.

I have even gone so far as to call out every hooker and john here to either "put up, or shut up"

ecriminalization would be, IMO, a better way to go

It's a "gateway drug".  Haven't you been reading the propaganda.  LOL
Everything is such a slippery slope these days.
Because human beings have apparently lost the ability to reason.

My guess is it may be easy to condone prostitution, but not cheaters. Our society frowns on guys who cheat on their wives or loved ones. Again, just a guess a large percentage of the patrons are cheaters. Not trying to pass judgement, but as long as patrons are viewed so negatively and women as victims it will not be legal.  

but how about all the single guys, or the hookers themselves.  

Sorry, but I don't find the fact that it is "clandestine" to add anything add all to the experience. Quite the contrary, I find all this cloak and dagger shit to be a PITA.

Prostitution is not completely accepted even in the many, many countries where it is completely legal, but almost everybody uses their real name in many of those countries where it is legal.

and yes, I have most definitely had DFK and BBBJ in brothels, just not brothels here in the US.

...it is nice to have the option if I want. I've always said at least give me the chance to say no thanks lol. And now it's so ordered in all of our 50 states as well.  
I'm not looking forward to marrying a woman OR man anytime soon tho haha.

Is the question , I believe you should be asking. Again, I don't want to judge married guys, I contemplated marriage myself.  

It’s been twelve years since the Supreme Court struck down the Texas sodomy laws in Lawrence v Texas, which many saw as a critical step toward legal prostitution.

Still for every one story like that, there are a thousand of a girl being beaten, killed, chained to a bed raped repeatedly, or sold to a guy making her live in a closet.  

I also know many doctors who can't wait to retire, or have already retired.   And it is almost always because of government interference, regulations, proposals, penalties, and imposed directives that they really know very little about.   That is sad and it will soon be unfortunate for all of us.

He took the old saw about saying nothing while the state hauled away first the Jews, then the Catholics, etc. -- but he changed the end.  Instead of saying "when they came for me, there was no one to speak up", he said, "When they came for me, I could say nothing, because I was just as bad as they were."  That seems like a powerful admission from a black man in the 1950s and 1960s who really was harassed by the authorities.

. . . gay marriage and legalization of pot mattered to people (for different reasons, obviously).  But prostitution is disdained.  It's going to be quite a while before "prostitute" becomes a politically incorrect word, and we are asked to understand why some men and women want P4P.  The truth is, the adjectives most people come up with to describe what we do are entirely unflattering.

Gays were not "understood" for decades, stoners were put in PRISON, not just jail for simply toking up. Either you admit that gays and stoners had more guts than hookers and johns, or prove to me that stoners and gays faced less adversity than we do.

I agree with most of what you say. Lol

You need to get on SenatorBlurtsky's bandwagon. He is running for President on legalizing the hobby. He is against trafficking the unwilling and abused, but he is fighting for those of us who love what we do and are of free will. I think he is trying to bring back the death penalty for the pimps.

What I am saying here really is pretty hard to disagree with.

Pretty much. I am sure not "coming out" and to be honest, I am not so sure how I feel about it being legalized. I can only figure it may drop the rates? At that point I'd go use my college degrees and leave the hobby. Don't worry, I will still come on here to bother you all bwahaha. (Coming out as an escort, I am already "out" as bisexual since I was a teenager)

Not once did I ever do this for anyone but myself.

Posted By: electr0nsrealm

It's a "gateway drug".  Haven't you been reading the propaganda.  LOL  
 Everything is such a slippery slope these days.  
 Because human beings have apparently lost the ability to reason.  
   
 Oh, and in case you missed the memo - all sex workers are being trafficked.  
 We must stamp out this evil sex thing right away.  
   
 Then we'll move onto our lesser problems like poverty, hunger, and war...  
   
   

Posted By: RRO2610

Posted By: mrfisher

 
       
   Yet, we seem mired in the legal process.    
       
   Could it be we are the reason for this?  Do we actually like the fact that our activities are clandestine?  Does that add some spice to the overall experience?    
       
   Something to ponder.    
   

 
     
  Cannabis has been proven time and again NOT physically addicting. It is virtually IMPOSSIBLE to overdose on it. And a user can NOT get uncontrollably intoxicated by it (as they easily, often and historically have with alcohol).    
     
  SO WHY THIS VEHEMENT AND ONGOING PROHIBITION and stigmatization?  
     
     
     
 

and I have found that price is more a factor of cost of living and what a  "real" job pays a lot more than whether or not it's legal.

....be they gender or sexual orientation based. Even in my multiple P4P hobbies I have had to fight for acceptance & recognition. No good has ever come from silence. And nothing worth fighting for ever comes easy. There will always be some kind of price to be paid. Is it worth it? That's for each person to decide for themselves. Don't know where any of this can or will go, GG.....but I'm ready to do my part.

IMHO, since I am "happily divorced" and not cheating on anyone, if I choose to live this part of my life in the shadows, what does that really say about me?

Or at least those willing to stand up and be counted.

Posted By: GaGambler

IMHO, since I am "happily divorced" and not cheating on anyone, if I choose to live this part of my life in the shadows, what does that really say about me?  
   
 Either it means I am secretly ashamed of what I am doing, which means I should seriously reconsider my behavior, which fortunately is most definitely NOT the case. Or I suppose it means that I am going to allow society to judge me, and that I somehow NEED the approval of others and knowing I won't get it, I am willing to slink around like a thief in the night hoping to avoid the disapproval of others. Well, FUCK THAT. I am a grown ass man, not hurting a soul and I will be damned if I am going to go slinking around like some guilt ridden coward with enough self pride to stand up for himself.  
   
 I may not be able to change the world, but I will damn sure stand up and be counted, and quite frankly I don't understand why almost nobody else around here is willing to do the same.  
   
 Count this as just one more reason I like and respect you You've got a thousand times more courage and guts than any of these so called he-men who brag in their reviews about how many O's they give their paid companions.

but I suppose that is a topic for another thread

I will continue to lurk in the shadows for all the reasons I stated. I'm just not complaining. Lol

and for the record THAT post I agree with 100%.

You are obviously out of the closet as a lesbian, but I don't think you are out of the closet as a hobbyist. You yourself have said that you hide this part of your life from your wife and others. Can you really stand up and be counted here?

Which was "yes we agree completely" lol

I'm also not cheating on a wife.  I don't work. And I've been outed, as have you.  I also don't really give a damn that what I do is illegal.  I'm not really worried about getting caught because I'm careful and, beyond that, the consequences of getting caught would not harm me much at all.
Still, I recognize that if we stormed the courthouse with placards, almost no one would follow us because most of these guys are cheaters with too much to lose.  As for the gays who came out and marched, they have my admiration because the stigma of being gay in this country (especially in the Stonewall days) was (and still is) much worse than the stigma of being a whoremonger.
They deserve the equal protection under the law they have finally gotten.

We need to separate decriminalization from legalization with the possibility of regulation (no religious tinged fetishes; strict dress code; no alcohol to be consumed without a special license,etc). I'm for the first but not the second.

Great post! Everyone in this country should have equal rights!

-- Modified on 6/27/2015 5:19:15 PM

and yes, gays do deserve what they have worked so hard to achieve . Now will they feel the same way in a few years as they learn the pain of divorce is the next burning question? lol

And while I don't disrespect cheating tricks (there are some good reasons to stray), I have a lot more respect for hookers because it takes brass balls to do what they do.
Personally, I'm enough of a renegade to actually like living outside the law as part of a group shady characters, lol

Yes you are correct in that I do have a wife, and she is unaware of my various hobbies. Standing up for what you believe in has many risks. "Coming out" in support of our beloved hobby would probably cost me my marriage. I have lost things and people that I loved during different stages of my life due to my strong beliefs and my willingness to voice them. It sucks but sometimes there is no other way. Maybe that's selfish, or maybe that's selfless. It depends on your viewpoint, I guess.

I don't have an SO, so no problem there. But as addicted as I am to our wonderful life, I am as addicted to my work (work o Holic). While I am very confident that my job is not in any jeopardy getting arrested for a misdemeanor, bringing direct illumination and focus on myself by getting on a soap box would likely prove to be professional suicide. This would also be true for two professional committe's that I'm party to.  

I have heard from insiders you are the at the top of the list for Vice President.  

Posted By: AlexandraMilw

You need to get on SenatorBlurtsky's bandwagon. He is running for President on legalizing the hobby. He is against trafficking the unwilling and abused, but he is fighting for those of us who love what we do and are of free will. I think he is trying to bring back the death penalty for the pimps.  
   
 Anyways, his linemaker, Gambler, is trying to shake things around... bend the polls in our favor. Not great odds yet, but with your contribution of 2 million to his campaign manager Inicky, I am sure you could shake the future presidents hand! Please don't worry about the current investigations about the Senator using his campaign funds on jetsetting and escorts. It helps him think of better ways to run our great country!!!  
   
   
   
   
   

Posted By: Dr. joe

Gay marriage is finally recognized throughout the US.  When will sex work be legal?  We all know the arguments about sex traffic of the unwilling. That is like saying that since slaves were used to farm cotton, all cotton farming should be banned. I know the TV stories of sad providers who are sorry they ever got involved.  I can line up more physicians than you realize who are depressed and wish they had gone to dental school instead of medical school, or lawyers who just can't wait until they can afford to retire from work they now find hateful.    
  There is something about sex (gay or for pay or filmed and sold as pornography) that makes people in public life a little crazy.

I could expound on this, but there are too many permutations, and I have neither the time nor inclination to analyze, since it has no effect on me.  My priorities are to make as much money as I can, and to play as hard as I work...

it was thrown out there that I could be the next Monica.

Posted By: balljointnut

 
 I have heard from insiders you are the at the top of the list for Vice President.    
   

Posted By: AlexandraMilw

You need to get on SenatorBlurtsky's bandwagon. He is running for President on legalizing the hobby. He is against trafficking the unwilling and abused, but he is fighting for those of us who love what we do and are of free will. I think he is trying to bring back the death penalty for the pimps.  
     
  Anyways, his linemaker, Gambler, is trying to shake things around... bend the polls in our favor. Not great odds yet, but with your contribution of 2 million to his campaign manager Inicky, I am sure you could shake the future presidents hand! Please don't worry about the current investigations about the Senator using his campaign funds on jetsetting and escorts. It helps him think of better ways to run our great country!!!  
     
   
     
     
     

Posted By: Dr. joe

Gay marriage is finally recognized throughout the US.  When will sex work be legal?  We all know the arguments about sex traffic of the unwilling. That is like saying that since slaves were used to farm cotton, all cotton farming should be banned. I know the TV stories of sad providers who are sorry they ever got involved.  I can line up more physicians than you realize who are depressed and wish they had gone to dental school instead of medical school, or lawyers who just can't wait until they can afford to retire from work they now find hateful.    
   There is something about sex (gay or for pay or filmed and sold as pornography) that makes people in public life a little crazy.

I have even talked to many of my states legislatures about it. It was even worse to be gay than it is for us now not that long ago. But brave gay men and women stood up and was counted despite the personal costs and things changed. If we want the stigma around sex work to end so laws can change the only voice on the topic can't be radical feminists who claim all sex work is rape and religious zealots who think sexual freedom is morally wrong be the only voices willing to be counted.

My family doesn't approve at all. Every few months one or more of them will try to save my and/or my wife's soul. Some of my family will not speak to me any more. I lost friends because I see hookers but even more friends because I let my wife work in a legal brothel. They think I am trafficking her or something. Even here on this very board I have had multiple people insist I don't love my wife because I let her provide. Even a hooker board isn't safe from condemnation. Some of the things I read right here how some johns and sex workers feel about their sex partners is disturbing to say the least. Anyway no matter what there is costs to being out. But someone has to do it or nothing will change.  

She gets gets around $300 to $500 an hour on average. True the brothel keeps half but your figures hold up. Actually she is getting a bit better as I doubt the average wage in the town she works is $30 an hour. I don't think price will drop that much if legal give both supply and demand will go up. SO in short I agree with you GaGambler.

I still agree that it was tougher for gays to come out and demand equal rights.  But as I thought about it there's one thing they've been able to do that we are not: openly congregate in certain areas where they will get public support from like-minded people.  For example, in tolerant places like Greenwich Village, Provincetown, San Francisco and Key West.  I don't think hookers and johns have any places to go like those.  The best we can do is a Meet & Greet.
Still, I'll take what we've got an not complain.

Daffy Duck is in full Bird Brain mode so getting a rational word in edgewise is almost impossible right now.

Have you ever heard of a man being beaten to death for being a john?

But in this case I will simply agree you've made a very good point.  I completely agree.
Now, for the love of dog, go fuck yourself.  Do it today!

Well fuck those people, as long as you love your wife that is all that matters. Everything, everyone else is inconsequential. I wish you the best. I don't know how much more I can say than my heart goes out to you scoed.

The people who left because of my choice to embrace this lifestyle with my wife wasn't really there for me anyway. My family that tries to save my soul and that of my wife do so out of love and concern not hate. Their is a big difference. I can be who I really am and not hide. Being out is liberating. I hated the damn lies of why my wife is gone long stretches of time and home even longer ones. I don't have to worry about getting caught in a hotel with a lady that is not my wife. And I made friends in the hobby that are much better than those I lost. In the end only the fact my wife and I love each other and are content with our chosen life matter. OK I have some issues but they are more to do with me than the hobby its self.